JohnnyLovesYou
Banned
Absolutely. Game is unplayable if main character doesn't look like me or my people.
OT: Of course not.
Do you actually care what race/sex a main character is?
- Thread starter King of Custard
- Start date
Yeah, but this is not all about *your* experience. I understand you buy game with diverse main characters, but most development cost is put on stuff that feature the same "generic" 30-something white hetero male.
I don't strictly believe in "voting with your wallet", because my choices of what to buy are directly related to what's available and what I specifically want in terms of gameplay for example. There is no reason we shouldn't make it clear to developers we want them to diversify and reevaluate what they consider as "generic" so that we can have better options as gamers.
I don't really tend to make much noise on this issue when it comes up, but I don't see why someone personally not caring about what race/sex they're playing as, has to mean that they don't think those that do care should have more options available to them.
Warm Machine
Member
White guy here.
I don't care who I'm playing as long as the character is well designed and has motivation.
Out of the 3 available in Mercenaries I always played as Chris Jacobs simply because I liked the character and his attitude given the setup to the whole game.
Faith in Mirrors Edge was ideal. An athletic woman was the perfect choice for that game. You need someone strong but lean and agile given the tasks at hand. I loved that about the game. I want more of that.
If it is a character creation based game I'll more often than not just create someone who resembles me. I know that under the hood of the game the look is essentially pointless as male/female will just shake out as effectively the same impact.
In the end it is the developers decision as to the character they want me to play as in so far as they lock it down or give me choice. Given that choice I'll look for the most interesting and game flexible character there is.
I don't care who I'm playing as long as the character is well designed and has motivation.
Out of the 3 available in Mercenaries I always played as Chris Jacobs simply because I liked the character and his attitude given the setup to the whole game.
Faith in Mirrors Edge was ideal. An athletic woman was the perfect choice for that game. You need someone strong but lean and agile given the tasks at hand. I loved that about the game. I want more of that.
If it is a character creation based game I'll more often than not just create someone who resembles me. I know that under the hood of the game the look is essentially pointless as male/female will just shake out as effectively the same impact.
In the end it is the developers decision as to the character they want me to play as in so far as they lock it down or give me choice. Given that choice I'll look for the most interesting and game flexible character there is.
IncandescentPrecept
Banned
2 different groups maybe? I don't care about te race/gender/sexuality of the character and I don't call for better representation of anyone.
Yeah, it's not, but I buy shitloads of games, not just a few (20+ more through the year's end). It's absolutely true that there's been an oversaturation in the past, but recently developers have been a lot better about it. The upcoming games for the rest of the year are also pretty diverse and not "just for me". Maybe you should look at release calendars before making blanket statements.
Lalalandia
Member
I enjoy the choice and if it actually impacts gameplay or story that's even better.
ShinMaruku
Member
Generally no. However more varied well down protagonists are more enjoyable.
Opinionatedfish
Member
Naw.
Unless it's a third person game where the camera is always hanging behind the character....
We meed more sexy butts in games.
Unless it's a third person game where the camera is always hanging behind the character....
We meed more sexy butts in games.
But still. It doesn't matter and I don't really care. Good games are good games. Bad games are bad games.
Just looking over the 2014 release list shows that I'm not the one making blanket statements. You seems to be way to biased towards your anecdotal experience. This is not just in the past, it's still happening, there is still a distinct lack of representation in gaming.
Monocle
Member
It's not a huge concern for me. I'm more interested in whether they're stylish and attractive. Not in a generic way but according to my personal taste in character design.
Examples:
Gears of War meatheads - no, no, and no
God of War Kratos - meh
Mass Effect MaleShep - yeah, he's my bro
Darksiders 2 Death - yes
Metal Gear Rising Raiden - hell yes
Bayonetta - infinite yes
Examples:
Gears of War meatheads - no, no, and no
God of War Kratos - meh
Mass Effect MaleShep - yeah, he's my bro
Darksiders 2 Death - yes
Metal Gear Rising Raiden - hell yes
Bayonetta - infinite yes
Well, in those threads, the "I don't care" posters are banned, so it can give this false impression of a large consensus among gamers when in fact, a large majority doesn't give a fuck about social representation in video games.
I don't know, it just seems to me like there's always a whole army of gamers who suddenly have an opinion when it comes to race/sexuality/gender of characters whenever the topic comes up. See Sarkeesian threads as a prime example, especially the first couple of ones. They were brimmed with overly defensive gamers who couldn't stand that their video games were criticized for their representation of women.
HiredN00bs
Banned
NeoGAF: NO
Unwashed Masses: sometimes
Unwashed Masses: sometimes
fuzzyreactor
Banned
Absolutely, only white males or aliens. Can't relate to anything else
Le_Samourai
Banned
I don't care.
DoktorEvil
Banned
It's because they question her authenticity, not necessarily her arguments.
I'm not a fan of her work or her studies, but no one else has stepped up to prove her wrong and do it in an articulate way, so I respect her efforts.
I've come around to wanting the industry more inclusive, and the study in another thread shows me that there are female gamers, just not too many in the console space. I want those mobile gamers to come to our space and us trying more mobile titles.
The question becomes: how do you include both parties?
OverdriveOtaku
Member
I DO care, but I like being as many different main characters as I can, so it rarely ever bothers me, and even when it does, it's never because of gender or race [or even species for that matter]. I played through all 3 Mass Effect twice as each gender, and each time I made them different ethnicities. Even had different romance partners.
One of the biggest times I've disliked a main character was Tidus from FFX. Had nothing to do with his race or gender, just didn't like him for who he was and what he does.
One of the biggest times I've disliked a main character was Tidus from FFX. Had nothing to do with his race or gender, just didn't like him for who he was and what he does.
I'm not having anything to do with any Sarkeesian threads, lol.
I get what you're saying though. I thought the FarCry 4 stuff was ridiculous for example. I don't think the problem lies with any one game, but the issue definitely becomes larger as it begins to describe most games. Do I care if I can play as an indian female in random online shooter? Not really, I almost certainly wouldn't choose to if the option were there. Do I think the option should be there if someone else wanted to (like say for example an indian female gamer)? Definitely. Why not?
Valkerionseven
Member
I don't care about sex/race of characters in games. I buy mine on appeal of the world, plot, or mechanics they are trying convey.
That said... when I think about it I could use more "normal" women characters ala Aya Brea in Parasite Eve 1 and 2. Playing part 3 at the moment and made me realize how awesome she was in the previous games for being all parts witty, smart, smartass, sexy, cute, a badass, and down right fucking normal (aside from the super powered mitochondria) of a character she was. None of those aspects were overused at all imo.
Same thing for non white protagonists. As a non white male it would be a nice different thing to see but it in no way offends the sense at this point mostly because its a-typical to what I've grown up with in movies and comics.
That said... when I think about it I could use more "normal" women characters ala Aya Brea in Parasite Eve 1 and 2. Playing part 3 at the moment and made me realize how awesome she was in the previous games for being all parts witty, smart, smartass, sexy, cute, a badass, and down right fucking normal (aside from the super powered mitochondria) of a character she was. None of those aspects were overused at all imo.
Same thing for non white protagonists. As a non white male it would be a nice different thing to see but it in no way offends the sense at this point mostly because its a-typical to what I've grown up with in movies and comics.
I play more female characters if given the option unless the male version looks cool as shit. Most character video game stories suck anyway so I'm not too invested with the character. I think it's because I've played male guys way too long so MMOs if I get the option for female I take it. Except Undead Rogue. Fuck female Undead. They look super tacky.
GalacticGravy
Member
Nope. But then again I have never played a game where a female protagonist was particularly "girly." As in, never played a game where her femininity impacted anything. Most female protagonists in that games that I have personally played are just like guys but with slightly different anatomy. Didn't seem to matter that Red was female in Transistor, for example.
That being said, I have no idea if I'd be turned off by an overly feminine protagonist. Maybe? Maybe not. Haven't had a chance to be.
That being said, I have no idea if I'd be turned off by an overly feminine protagonist. Maybe? Maybe not. Haven't had a chance to be.
The way the question is worded probably has something to do with it. Very few people will say yes to this as it implies some sort of racial/gender preference. No one is going to say "Yes, I don't like playing as a white dude," or "Yes, I don't like playing as a black woman." It also implies that race/sex is one of the most important decisions in purchasing a game. Not even the pro-diversity crowd is going to pass up an interesting looking game just because it stars another generic white guy.
If the question had been "Should games have more diversity in them?" then you would probably see more people saying yes. You have even seen people in this thread saying they that they don't care about the race/sex of the MC in a game, but that they support more diversity.
I don't care about it specifically, I just like my character to look cool, or to be well designed. Male, or female, etc. isn't that important, I just want to enjoy *looking* at the character, or have the character represent me.
I was more disappointed in that MaleShep in ME couldn't have longer hair. My hair is passed my shoulders. Just would have been a nice thing to have, didn't ruin the game or anything. Just an "Oh well."
I was more disappointed in that MaleShep in ME couldn't have longer hair. My hair is passed my shoulders. Just would have been a nice thing to have, didn't ruin the game or anything. Just an "Oh well."
Yes and no. I won't not buy a game because the protagonist is a white man (I'm a black woman). I'm playing a lot more games than I used to though and I prefer shooters. Games also have huge plots and stories that I'm supposed to be intrigued by and vested in. When the vast majority of these games only tell the stories from a white man's perspective it gets repetitive for me. I mean, Drake, Joel, Aiden, everyone in CoD, Infamous, Resistance, RDR, etc are just variations of white man saves the world. Can you maybe understand that as a black woman that gets boring and irritating? Or just tiresome.
Lord Thrappleper The 49th
Member
In all honesty, I actually prefer playing as a buff white male. Namely because, as I play as them, I make them do the swagger walk to pick up all the bitches, which makes me laugh at the ridiculousness of it all. So I kinda like them ironically out of a preference that works well with them from my perspective.
Do you honestly see it as a singularity of opinion? You're right, there is an army of outspoken idiots who will rail against any and all criticism because they don't see it the same way you do.
You ask:
But this isn't the same thing as "why is there so much defense of the white standard?" To them, the criticism of the broad swath of white male 25-35 avatars is unjust in both tone and principle. To them, it comes across as "you should have less" or "we don't want to see you" or "you shouldn't have what you want to have" or "your representation is a fault in itself."
To them, the criticism, and let's be fair, it's gone on enough now where there is a segment of vitriol of "fuck cis white males", is seen as a rallying cry to "oppress" them. So while they may not care what avatars they play as, they don't want someone stomping on the representations that do exist.
Basically, to them, they do not think it is valid to criticize what exists, but creating something new that caters to others is fine.
The Sarkesiaan videos are structured to look at the present examples as problems, so they appear to this segment as attacks, on their intelligence (what you like is stupid/wrong/hurtful/etc.) and on what they want. It doesn't help when they get faced with catty side remarks like "Don't worry, you'll still get your shooty shooty bang bangs for retards and mysogynists".
It's tone arguments coming from both sides, but it's scary how ignorant to what each side is actually saying. Scarier is how ignorant the 2nd wave of followers of each side side are on how to argue appropriately for proper education.
For the record, I side on the inclusionary side for proper representation and feel that there is an overwhelming abundance of the "classic" male representation. I just feel my opponents are often misrepresented.
cloudzack117
Banned
I dont care whatsoever what the main character is, and it shouldn't even be an issue. Last i checked, video games are made for entertainment/to make money, not to make political statements.
First of all who are you to say what a video game should be? If someone wants to make a political statement with their game then more power to them.
Secondly, how is underrepresented people asking for representation in their entertainment a political statement?
Gotta love the "I like Michael Bay movies therefore that's what movies are" attitude that some people bring to this discussion.
And by "love" I mean "be incredibly tired of."
Thought Emmett (Emmett Graves is his name) as a future cowboy was a good role for him, and the VA did an excellent job with the portrayal. He did good work on PSABR, too. It's a shame that'll probably be the last game we'll hear the character on.
Winterfang
Banned
Not in the slightest,
DoktorEvil
Banned
*phew*
I'm sure glad you aren't making my video games then. I can't imagine what you'd find fun.
ab.aeterno
Member
I think there's a lot of unintentional irony in anyone that can feel what you describe in the first paragraph as someone in a majority always catered to, included and shown but that can't understand or empathize with minorities wanting to feel included too. And I see it often enough in these threads to shake my head. We already had numerous people say it doesn't matter or who cares, not always in so many words in just this thread.
As to the bolded, what I don't understand is how that's any different than asking for something new that's not straight white male. Asking for more representation is almost always speaking in future terms such as that, yet there's always a contingent (not necessarily the same people) that reacts supremely negatively to even that.
Something I can't help but feel odd about is the lumping that the term white gets as well. White people can have very broad and different cultures as well, but it seems like its very "in" to lump Argentinians and Irish and Italians all together.
Heck, its something that my fiance' and I talk about whenever we get into a discussion about having kids. Myself being a white male, and herself half Khmer and half Puerto Rican, she's a bit miffed that any sort of ethnic Cambodian heritage our children might have had is basically going to get ignored because "zomg they're white, privileged, etc." Whats even funnier is that since she doesn't speak Khmer, but rather PR Spanish, she's heard many of the racist things that other native spanish speakers have said to her or about her solely because she looks nondescript asian and they thought she wouldn't understand.
I don't mind playing as different races and genders in games, but I do admit that I gravitate towards white males, primarily because I tend to at least keep a running list of cosplay opportunities in my head. If I'm playing a heavily characterized game (Uncharted, The Last of Us, Tomb Raider, etc.) I'm more interested in the story than the character. If I'm playing an MMO or something with a character creator I'll usually make my main a white male who tends to have more than a passing resemblance to Solid Snake/Big Boss, and any subsequent characters tend to be female.
Hm.
I never looked at Ellie from the Last of Us and thought of her as just a "female protagonist" - what's important is that the character is well-written and likable, and if those two criteria are filled their race and color makes no difference to me.
With that said, in the context of the industry, I do want more representation. I am a white male and have nothing against protagonists of the same race and gender as myself (in fact I hardly even notice their gender/color until the topic itself is brought up), but variety is fun and interesting, and some of my favorite protagonists in games are female.
I never looked at Ellie from the Last of Us and thought of her as just a "female protagonist" - what's important is that the character is well-written and likable, and if those two criteria are filled their race and color makes no difference to me.
With that said, in the context of the industry, I do want more representation. I am a white male and have nothing against protagonists of the same race and gender as myself (in fact I hardly even notice their gender/color until the topic itself is brought up), but variety is fun and interesting, and some of my favorite protagonists in games are female.
VVV Mars VG
Member
Nope.
I just care if its a good game.
I just care if its a good game.
Rats Off To Ya
Banned
I don't actively dislike playing as a white male, but I appreciate diversity whenever I get it.
littletran22
Member
In character creations I always choose a non-human char its more interesting for me 
striferser
Huge Nickleback Fan
Most of the time, i choose human because of the balanced stat growth or perk. If there's no effect in status just cosmetic changes, i might chose other race for future playthrough.
Reason is, i like roleplaying as badass human.
Phantasmal Repose
Member
I can't say there has ever been a game where I've cared about the race/sex of a character. So, no.