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[jaosobno]

Oh wow. I might actually throw up. This is exactly what me and many others are talking about. This fucking, disgusting generalization.

This is nothing more than Nazi tactics. You pick a group of people based on something they do or the way they were born (in this case, being born white, male and like to play games) and label them as something sub-human.

 

[LegoArmo]

Boogie, as an obese man, was abused and bullied almost his entire life, and still receives disgusting messages daily. The internet and "gamers" gave his life purpose and made him a much happier man. It makes sense that he feels quite invested, and would rather focus on the positives in the community.

Some are more thick skinned than others, I guess.

 

[Stallion Dan]

While this is a case of notallmen in reality, the way Gamergate has been presented from all I've been exposed to is a allmen attitude. So I find Boogies video hits the mark dead on.

 

[GutZ31]

^^^ I know that image, since it gets posted a lot.
Yeah i found those tweets asinine, but where it originated from? And how is it related to this whole debacle?



Charlequin's post explains things a bit.

No evidence whatsoever, so take with a grain of salt, but it is believed to have started with the fem frequency crowd.
I don't want to use twitter, so I wont be confirming this.

 

[Jakoozie89]

Opens with a huge straw man. And he's better than that. He's usually very smart.

I'm baffled that people are still using the "You play Crandy Crush? You're a gamer, and they just insulted you!" line of reasoning. Most of the "anti gamer" stuff clearly has a very specific audience. People like his character of Francis. And I think he knows that. God I hope he does at least. I don't know how someone that owes his career to satirizing the typical fanboy could not.

What are you talking about? This video was spot on in my opinion. It's happening, both on Twitter and gaming sites. People I respect and look up to are saying how much they hate their fans, and that gamers, in general, are assholes. I personally would never harass anyone, and it frankly hurts my feelings to be lumped together with what I'm sure is a vocal, terrible minority. They're making us all look bad!

 

[thepotatoman]

Appealing to "so just #notallmen then?" is a terrible argument. It can be said to any group.

1. Attack them
2. They defend themselves
3. Say "so, #just notallyourgroup"?

It's kind of like the old "the fact that you're denying it so fiercely means it must be true." Uh...maybe. Or maybe it's not true at all.

"Surfers are the worst. Lazy pieces of shit."
"Uh...not really. I'm not lazy."
"Oh, so #notallsurfers?"

It's an argument that always works - it's tautological.

In every single societal issue, there's going to be an example that proves and an example that disproves any statement, but that doesn't mean that trends do not exist. A group of 20 people out of a million don't make a trend, but are we supposed to ignore it if 10% are acting badly? 50%? 99%?

At some point you have to admit a problem, but no matter what, in every situation "not all ____" is going to be true, and so it really is meaningless whether you're on the right side or not. "Not all _____" is never, ever going to convince anyone that their statement is wrong. It's just going to sound patronizing that you think they're that big of an idiot when no one is that dumb.

If someone is promoting a false or destructive generalization then there are other ways to argue against it, like questioning if the claim has substantial evidence behind it, or describing how destructive and counterproductive the generalization is.

 

[unbias]

No evidence whatsoever, so take with a grain of salt, but it is believed to have started with the fem frequency crowd.
I don't want to use twitter, so I wont be confirming this.

It's not hard to search the twitter hashtag of that and find more of the same. People are saying that...but that is kinda the point isnt it? People say a whole lot of horrid shit on twitter and it is ridiculous. Playing the "who said the worst thing on twitter" is a never ending battle that nobody wins. Regardless if someone thinks they are. I could probably hashtag search anything on twitter to get my conformation bias going of people being horrible on twitter.

 

[jabuseika]

People against bullying acting like bullies.

 

[GutZ31]

In every single societal issue, there's going to be an example that proves and an example that disproves any statement, but that doesn't mean that trends do not exist. A group of 20 people out of a million don't make a trend, but are we supposed to ignore it if 10% are acting badly? 50%? 99%?

At some point you have to admit a problem, but no matter what, in every situation "not all ____" is going to be true, and so it really is meaningless whether you're on the right side or not. "Not all _____" is never, ever going to convince anyone that their statement is wrong. It's just going to sound patronizing that you think they're that big of an idiot when no one is that dumb.

If someone is promoting a false or destructive generalization then there are other ways to argue against it, like questioning if the claim has substantial evidence behind it, or describing how destructive and counterproductive the generalization is.

Did you just drop some wisdom on this thread?

 

[Metal Gear?!]

Oh wow. I might actually throw up. This is exactly what me and many others are talking about. This fucking, disgusting generalization.

This is nothing more than Nazi tactics. You pick a group of people based on something they do or the way they were born (in this case, being born white, male and like to play games) and label them as something sub-human.

People against bullying acting like bullies.

Hahahahahahaha

You really don't get the joke do you

 

[andymcc]

People against bullying acting like bullies.

i would wager that some of these tweets are not completely earnest.

Hahahahahahaha

You really don't get the joke do you

It's like they are incapable of googling who K. Thor Jensen is...

 

[unbias]

In every single societal issue, there's going to be an example that proves and an example that disproves any statement, but that doesn't mean that trends do not exist. A group of 20 people out of a million don't make a trend, but are we supposed to ignore it if 10% are acting badly? 50%? 99%?

At some point you have to admit a problem, but no matter what, in every situation "not all ____" is going to be true, and so it really is meaningless whether you're on the right side or not. "Not all _____" is never, ever going to convince anyone that their statement is wrong. It's just going to sound patronizing that you think they're that big of an idiot when no one is that dumb.

If someone is promoting a false or destructive generalization then there are other ways to argue against it, like questioning if the claim has substantial evidence behind it, or describing how destructive and counterproductive the generalization is.

So you are saying there is a healthy way to approach a subject? That would require no mudslinging. I'm not holding my breath on that ever happening on the internet, not with the way twitter is acting right now.

 

[jaosobno]

People against bullying acting like bullies.

Nietzsche warned us long time ago about this in his legendary quote:

"He who fights monsters should see to it that he himself does not become a monster."

I think we are way past point where some people became the same thing they claim they fight against.

 

[UrbanRats]

People against bullying acting like bullies.

Hahahahahahaha

You really don't get the joke do you

Well they're meant as jokes, i get that, but i don't see a net positive to something like that, in a situation where emotions run high as they do at the moment.
Whereas an article criticizing the problems of "gaming culture" has merit, a dumb 4 words tweet calling gamers "future murders", doesn't.

Infact, it's just useless gasoline on the fire.

 

[Metal Gear?!]

Nietzsche warned us long time ago about this in his legendary quote:

"He who fights monsters should see to it that he himself does not become a monster."

I think we are way past point where some people became the same thing they claim they fight against.

Hahahahaha

Oh man. You're serious, aren't you?

Well they're meant as jokes, i get that, but i don't see a net positive to something like that, in a situation where emotions run high as they do at the moment.

Whereas an article criticizing the problems of "gaming culture" has merit, a dumb 4 words tweet calling gamers "future murders", doesn't.

Infact, it's just useless gasoline on the fire.

Seems pretty useful to me, if only for showing which gamers have problems understanding really obvious humor and what to take seriously or not.

Also it's produced plenty of humor:

https://twitter.com/Bendilin/status/506647159333085184

 

[Myggen]

Oh wow. I might actually throw up. This is exactly what me and many others are talking about. This fucking, disgusting generalization.

This is nothing more than Nazi tactics. You pick a group of people based on something they do or the way they were born (in this case, being born white, male and like to play games) and label them as something sub-human.

Lol, are you fucking serious? You must be trolling with this shit.

 

[Neoriceisgood]

Someone with a mega mole avatar participating in this somehow makes it all okay to me.

 

[andymcc]

Nietzsche warned us long time ago about this in his legendary quote:

"He who fights monsters should see to it that he himself does not become a monster."

I think we are way past point where some people became the same thing they claim they fight against.

 

[IcyStorm]

People against bullying acting like bullies.

Making (terrible) jokes that aren't directed anyone in particular is equivalent to targeting specific individuals and harassing them? Okay.

 

[UrbanRats]

Someone with a mega mole avatar participating in this somehow makes it all okay to me.

Well, out of those it is the funniest.

 

[jabuseika]

Hahahahahahaha

You really don't get the joke do you

i would wager that some of these tweets are not completely earnest.

People passing by, not in the known, won't know this is a joke.

I personally don't take anything on twitter seriously.

But acting vile, even in jest, looks bad on you.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

Well, out of those it is the funniest.

Dumpster Escapee is a game I would want to play.

 

[andymcc]

People passing by, not in the known, won't know this is a joke.

I personally don't take anything on twitter seriously.

But acting vile, even in jest, looks bad on you.

These are mostly accounts that are known for weird, esoteric humor so I don't think comparing them to dudes that directly harass women for being women is quite equivalent.

 

[jaosobno]

Hahahahahahaha

You really don't get the joke do you

If that's suppose to be a joke, and I didn't get it (and I try to stay on top of things to the best of my abilities and abundance of "controversies"), what chance do people not involved in gaming have of understanding this?

So, if this is suppose to be funny, it's the worst attempt at humor I've ever seen. And instead of laughing at people, you could try explaining.

 

[andymcc]

If that's suppose to be a joke, and I didn't get it (and I try to stay on top of things to the best of my abilities and abundance of "controversies"), what chance do people not involved in gaming have of understanding this?

So, if this is suppose to be funny, it's the worst attempt at humor I've ever seen.

these are people that purposefully sabotage popular hashtags.

 

[jaosobno]

these are people that purposefully sabotage popular hashtags.

Thanks for the explanation, didn't know about this.

 

[RMS Gigantic]

I think this is an astute take. The most critical problem is that there's just no one (really no group of people) with the standing or the intellectual heft to put a stop to it, or at least to give structure to the debate. Games pop critical theory is at an extremely primitive stage of development, games journalism is an intellectual wasteland, and games Twitter is far, far worse.

I like to draw parallels between the history of video games with the history of movies. For example, just like many of the earliest pieces of software were what we would now approximate to be simulators, the earliest movies were what would later be classified as documentaries. Donkey Kong can be seen as the video game equivalent to "Life of an American Fireman" and Super Mario Bros. would therefore be "The Great Train Robbery" of video games.

For the most part, the two mediums developed very similarly, and at rather similar rates thus far. Thus, I'm now curious if there were any big personality-related arguments in the 1930's to 1940's or so. Sure, back then they didn't have the Internet, but that hasn't stopped the video game industry from following in the movie industry's footsteps before! (Movie studios and video game studios are rather comparable throughout their histories as well, in addition to the art-focused independently made projects).

 

[Widge]

That's where I'm starting to go with this.

 

[UrbanRats]

These are mostly accounts that are known for weird, esoteric humor so I don't think comparing them to dudes that directly harass women for being women is quite equivalent.

I don't think they even closely compare, really ( i wouldn't call that bullying, myself).

Doesn't mean i have to find them a good idea, in this specific situation, given the massive confusion a lot of people have, about what's going on.

these are people that purposefully sabotage popular hashtags.

Hard to tell when people are genuinely sarcastic or not, these days.
Still, i guess my point about spreading confusion still stands.

 

[boogie2988]

Hey guys, boogie here.

This video just came about because I had a fucking breaking point. After being involved in this for about 20 days and being pulled in every direction both by the internet and by my own internal conflict in all of this I kind of just lost my shit.

The point of the video was pretty simple. I think MOST people are good, I think MOST gamers are good, and I think that EVERYONE taking a bad rap for a handful of shitty people is wrong.

I obviously care about equal rights of all types. I attempt to champion it. I succeed rarely and fail most of the time, but my message on twitter and youtube is always this; You are equal to everyone and no one is better than you. be kind.

I'm so very frustrated right now after a LIFETIME of fighting for 'gamers' to be an ok thing to see it get pushed back very, very far.

I've read your criticisms here and I agree that this was probably a misfire. I knew I was going to regret turning on the camera and talking about it and after reading this thread, of course I do.

But please understand it comes from a good place. Two wrongs never make a right and smearing the name of gamers and reading things like "All gamers are worthless" and "All gamers are neckbeards" and "All gamers are misogynists" is fucking killing me inside. I snapped. I lost it. I poured that emotion out in a video and its helped me. I think I might sleep tonight.

Not my best work though and I'll take your criticisms to heart. thanks for watching the video.

 

[jabuseika]

Hey boogie, I like your kindness.

 

[thesolidshark]

Good video, I liked what he had to say.


And the "gamer in 4 words" thing was a joke? At this point, unless there's some notice to go with the hashtag or everyone typing lol afterwards, not everyone will get that it's a joke. I took that stuff seriously up to this point. It's kind of dumb to me to do it this soon, if this is an attempt at levity or something.

 

[Majukun]

Wasn't really aware of all this shit going on,it' hilarious.

 

[jaosobno]

I've read your criticisms here and I agree that this was probably a misfire.

Why would you think your video was misfire? Because few people here said it was?

You are actually the only public persona in gaming that had the balls to speak up against this wave of hateful articles and tweets (as far as I know, if there have been others, I'm not aware of them).

I respect you more because of this video, don't back down because few people on NeoGAF disagree with you.

 

[Harlock]

The main problem is the lack of new games to talk about now.

 

[andymcc]

I don't think they even closely compare, really ( i wouldn't call that bullying, myself).

Doesn't mean i have to find them a good idea, in this specific situation, given the massive confusion a lot of people have, about what's going on.

Hard to tell when people are genuinely sarcastic or not, these days.
Still, i guess my point about spreading confusion still stands.

the humor can be a little esoteric, so if you are not in the know or if quotes are stripped of context, yeah, it can be confusing. but these types of users respond to other serious issues in a similar manner.

 

[SliceSabre]

Hey guys, boogie here.

This video just came about because I had a fucking breaking point. After being involved in this for about 20 days and being pulled in every direction both by the internet and by my own internal conflict in all of this I kind of just lost my shit.

The point of the video was pretty simple. I think MOST people are good, I think MOST gamers are good, and I think that EVERYONE taking a bad rap for a handful of shitty people is wrong.

I obviously care about equal rights of all types. I attempt to champion it. I succeed rarely and fail most of the time, but my message on twitter and youtube is always this; You are equal to everyone and no one is better than you. be kind.

I'm so very frustrated right now after a LIFETIME of fighting for 'gamers' to be an ok thing to see it get pushed back very, very far.

I've read your criticisms here and I agree that this was probably a misfire. I knew I was going to regret turning on the camera and talking about it and after reading this thread, of course I do.

But please understand it comes from a good place. Two wrongs never make a right and smearing the name of gamers and reading things like "All gamers are worthless" and "All gamers are neckbeards" and "All gamers are misogynists" is fucking killing me inside. I snapped. I lost it. I poured that emotion out in a video and its helped me. I think I might sleep tonight.

Not my best work though and I'll take your criticisms to heart. thanks for watching the video.

I didn't see anything all that wrong with your video. So some people didn't agree with you...and? No matter what you said people were gonna disagree with it. Not a big deal. You felt the need to get your point across and I didn't see anything wrong with that.

 

[Scofield94941]

Hey guys, boogie here.

Snip

Speaking your mind is why we love you boogie, dont regret making the video. This will pass and gamers will be stronger and more bonded then ever

 

[GutZ31]

Hey guys, boogie here.

-Snip-

Not my best work though and I'll take your criticisms to heart. thanks for watching the video.

Its been a wild ride.
You have the support of many, and you support the many.
Sleep well knowing this.

 

[FF Seraphim]

I obviously care about equal rights of all types. I attempt to champion it. I succeed rarely and fail most of the time, but my message on twitter and youtube is always this; You are equal to everyone and no one is better than you. be kind.

Any person who stands up for equality in a genuine manner, never truly fails. The fact others know someone is out there fighting for them is better than thinking no one cares for them.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

Hey guys, boogie here.

This video just came about because I had a fucking breaking point. After being involved in this for about 20 days and being pulled in every direction both by the internet and by my own internal conflict in all of this I kind of just lost my shit.

The point of the video was pretty simple. I think MOST people are good, I think MOST gamers are good, and I think that EVERYONE taking a bad rap for a handful of shitty people is wrong.

I obviously care about equal rights of all types. I attempt to champion it. I succeed rarely and fail most of the time, but my message on twitter and youtube is always this; You are equal to everyone and no one is better than you. be kind.

I'm so very frustrated right now after a LIFETIME of fighting for 'gamers' to be an ok thing to see it get pushed back very, very far.

I've read your criticisms here and I agree that this was probably a misfire. I knew I was going to regret turning on the camera and talking about it and after reading this thread, of course I do.

But please understand it comes from a good place. Two wrongs never make a right and smearing the name of gamers and reading things like "All gamers are worthless" and "All gamers are neckbeards" and "All gamers are misogynists" is fucking killing me inside. I snapped. I lost it. I poured that emotion out in a video and its helped me. I think I might sleep tonight.

Not my best work though and I'll take your criticisms to heart. thanks for watching the video.

At the very least I don't think anybody's going to think your heart wasn't in the right place.

I just think it's such a bizarre and volatile situation at the moment that it's more than a bit difficult to just stand behind one side even with the best of intentions and not expect any blowback. I still don't entirely get what GamerGate is, and while I have the unpopular opinion that the entirety of /v/ isn't only a haven of internet terrorist rapists, I'd definitely look beyond them for formulating your opinion on this entire drama.

 

[boogie2988]

Why would you think your video was misfire? Because few people here said it was?

You are actually the only public persona in gaming that had the balls to speak up against this wave of hateful articles and tweets (as far as I know, if there have been others, I'm not aware of them).

I respect you more because of this video, don't back down because few people on NeoGAF disagree with you.

I'm not backing down, i stand by the video. But I'm saying its a misfire because it did not adequately communicate the point that I wanted to make to the gaffers and I really wish that it had. I'll blame my exhaustion over the issue and other personal issues I'm having.

all I wanted to say is that people who are not involved need to get involved if they value their hobby because we're about to re-enter the shit I went through in highschool. When this gets picked up by CNN and the like, and i believe it will at this point, we're fucked. Get ready to be pantsed by jocks for having a game on your fucking phone. Get ready to have to hide the fact that you play video games from people at the office.

If people speak up before that happens maybe they'll report that, too.

 

[Parmenide]

The irony...

 

[MacNille]

Hey guys, boogie here.

snip

Good post Boogie. I love your work.

 

[Bold One]

This whole 'GAMER' thing has gone too far and been blown out of al recognisable proportion

 

[Booty Patrol]

Not 'people of diversity'.

 

[HUELEN10]

Hey guys, boogie here.

This video just came about because I had a fucking breaking point. After being involved in this for about 20 days and being pulled in every direction both by the internet and by my own internal conflict in all of this I kind of just lost my shit.

The point of the video was pretty simple. I think MOST people are good, I think MOST gamers are good, and I think that EVERYONE taking a bad rap for a handful of shitty people is wrong.

I obviously care about equal rights of all types. I attempt to champion it. I succeed rarely and fail most of the time, but my message on twitter and youtube is always this; You are equal to everyone and no one is better than you. be kind.

I'm so very frustrated right now after a LIFETIME of fighting for 'gamers' to be an ok thing to see it get pushed back very, very far.

I've read your criticisms here and I agree that this was probably a misfire. I knew I was going to regret turning on the camera and talking about it and after reading this thread, of course I do.

But please understand it comes from a good place. Two wrongs never make a right and smearing the name of gamers and reading things like "All gamers are worthless" and "All gamers are neckbeards" and "All gamers are misogynists" is fucking killing me inside. I snapped. I lost it. I poured that emotion out in a video and its helped me. I think I might sleep tonight.

Not my best work though and I'll take your criticisms to heart. thanks for watching the video.

Hey Boogie. I know you say you were at a breaking point and might think this isn't your best or regret turning on the camera, but know that your video was from the heart, and it was very respectful. I think you said "you are equal to everyone and no one is better than you." but you didn't just say it, you mean it from the heart. Good for you for being respectful and standing by your video. I applaud you for speaking from the heart, even though some might disagree with your views.

 

[romulus91]

this is selfish victimization........ drawing attention away from the real issue

EDIT: i love Boogie's work and he is level headed but the vid is misguided even if with good intent

 

[ponpo]

When this gets picked up by CNN and the like, and i believe it will at this point, we're fucked. Get ready to be pantsed by jocks for having a game on your fucking phone. Get ready to have to hide the fact that you play video games from people at the office.

I don't think you associate with a wide enough variety of people if you think any of that nonsense is going to start happening.

Thankfully, people are more reasonable in real life than on the internet and no one is going to care about you playing a game on your phone.

 

[andymcc]

I don't think you associate with a wide enough variety of people if you think any of that nonsense is going to start happening.

Thankfully, people are more reasonable in real life than on the internet and no one is going to care about you playing a game on your phone.

Not to mention the "jocks" (nice generalization) are the ones in high school wearing video game/nerd culture shirts now anyways...