Not really buying this viewpoint. Thug does not equal urban black person.
This is the type of shit I think about when I hear "thug:"
Yeah, that's totally what the makers of that website meant by "thug", hahahahah
VICE - 'Thug Kitchen' is the latest iteration of digital blackface
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Yeah, that's totally what the makers of that website meant by "thug", hahahahah
The Lamonster
Member
They also called themselves "players" but if someone asked me what a player was, I'd say a gamer or a professional organized sports athlete.
Timedog - I was referring to the whole "thug = nword" thing. I've never watched Thug Kitchen so I don't have anything to say about it.
old
Member
Not new. But most prevalent in the north east around New England. Think the Hamptons.
Justin Bieber?
ChawlieTheFair
pip pip cheerio you slags!
But does it's use against Richard Sherman make it a code word?
I only ever see thug used as in "thug life" usually on vine or something when some kid knocks over a box of cereal. However in my head I think of mobsters or criminals.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
Quick Google search lead me to this relevant result, which I haven't watched yet but I'm assuming how it goes since it's the Daily Show: Jon Stewart: Richard Sherman's a Thug, But Justin Bieber and Rob Ford Aren't? (Video)
Thugs don't talk like that. Random emphasized cursing. Can't even adhere to the style you're appropriating. More like Unchecked Impulse Kitchen.
It's wisecrack now.
It's wisecrack now.
Thug is definitely a codeword and the easiest way to spot it is when it makes zero sense in context.
Watch hockey and see someone do some dirty deeds, you'll hear them often referred to as "thugs". Someone gets jumped by a group a people, they're called "thugs". Cornerback cuts a wrestling promo and gets called a "thug". It's easy to spot the difference.
Or how about this. Albert Haynesworth stomping a dude, reasonable to call him a thug. Richard Sherman indulging his inner pro-wrestler, totally not reasonable to call him a thug.
Watch hockey and see someone do some dirty deeds, you'll hear them often referred to as "thugs". Someone gets jumped by a group a people, they're called "thugs". Cornerback cuts a wrestling promo and gets called a "thug". It's easy to spot the difference.
Or how about this. Albert Haynesworth stomping a dude, reasonable to call him a thug. Richard Sherman indulging his inner pro-wrestler, totally not reasonable to call him a thug.
radios shipping overview
Member
Let's boil it down. They call it Thug Kitchen, they use rough, "urban"-sounding language, and there are no pictures of mafiosos, skinheads, yakuza, or brownshirts anywhere. Sounds like they thought it would liven up their bland recipe site to make it sound like it was written by black people.
If someone says "thug life" they are referring to gangsta culture, directly or indirectly.
If someone says "thug life" they are referring to gangsta culture, directly or indirectly.
I thought thug meant criminal, like a group of thugs who are gonna beat up someone.
I truthfully, honestly heard it refer to whites before I heard it used by or applied to blacks.
With that said, there's a sensitivity issue when you're trying to talk like what you think a certain ethnic group sounds like. That's just rude and racist. I also think it's rude to change your accent when talking to different people. I'm a southern boy and people know it when they talk to me.
I truthfully, honestly heard it refer to whites before I heard it used by or applied to blacks.
With that said, there's a sensitivity issue when you're trying to talk like what you think a certain ethnic group sounds like. That's just rude and racist. I also think it's rude to change your accent when talking to different people. I'm a southern boy and people know it when they talk to me.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
Could some of you stop being so predictable with the feigned ignorance
Thug as a safe way to say nigger has been talked about in the media and on Gaf for quite some time
Thug as a safe way to say nigger has been talked about in the media and on Gaf for quite some time
ChawlieTheFair
pip pip cheerio you slags!
Yeah exactly I get the joke. There is no doubt in my mind Thug Kitchen was trying to use "black" language, but I'm talking about the point in the article that thug is used as a code word for "nigger". I think that is wrong.
DietRob
i've been begging for over 5 years.
Interesting that the word 'thug' didn't come up one time in that thread you linked. I wonder why that is?
Beerman462
Member
Thug Life makes me think black, but Jackbooted Thugs makes me think fascism. I'm pretty sure I know which one this couple was thinking. It's a stupid name either way. Why not call is fuggetabout food or some shit.
stufte
Member
Exactly. Seems a bit racist to say that universally thug=black person as a part of the argument in this article..
Bobby Roberts
Banned
In your first reply in this thread, you used the caveat "unless I'm ignorant."
You then keep using solely personal anecdotes from your experience, and your experience alone, often experiences occurring only inside of your own head, in fact, while either combating or minimizing the fact there was prolonged media attention and discussion on the use of the term as a racial codeword during the last Super Bowl.
Meaning that in this case - you actually were ignorant. This isn't an imaginary thing. You might have missed it, and that's fine. But when presented with the possibility that it's a real thing (and it's not a possibility - it's a real thing) it doesn't really help much to retreat back to "well, that's not how I ever thought of it."
You can't offer up the possibility that you might be ignorant to a situation and then reject attempts to educate you on the discussion at the same time. If you're going to allow that you might be ignorant about the coding of that word, then you have to allow for someone to explain how that works.
PhantomHound
Banned
I've heard thug used a lot in politics to refer to corrupt politicans.
stufte
Member
Because there are lots of words for what that guy is, and just because it didn't come up in that thread, doesn't mean that he isn't also a thug.
I haven't seen any major publication say it. The people I've heard say it usually mean he's trying to acting black.
Holy shit yes.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
In my experience, politicians used the word to refer to rappers and rap music during one of the early 90s political crusades to save the children from negative cultural influence, at which point rappers began using the term as a fuck you to said politicians. At which point it began getting used more and more in hip hop, and once popularized, white people looking to mock black culture without having to be overtly racist about it used the term, alongside other terms like "homie" or "Gee" or "homie gee" - giving themselves wriggle room to claim they weren't making fun of black people, they were making fun of "crap rappers" or "Gangsta wanna-bes," although eventually the usage by white people tended to creep towards being used solely to remark upon any black man who appeared to be getting "out of line" in their words or actions.
The English language is a flexible thing.
ChawlieTheFair
pip pip cheerio you slags!
I said I may be ignorant in thug's historical origins, which I am, I have no idea where it came from or who is was originally used to refer to. I have read and understood that some believe the word is a code, I disagree with that.
I didn't watch the last superbowl, and I have no memory of such talks about Richard Sherman ever occuring, hell I don't care about football at all.
I'm not rejecting attempts at my own education, more so just expressing my disagreement with the idea in question.
I know that thug is being used by some to try and replace the N word. But like one of the posters here said, I always associated it with behavior not race. I've seen and know Black people that will call other black people 'thug' depending on their behavior. Thug is often used here, even in the news, when talking about gang life and gang culture. We even had an article in the newspaper with the Headline "The Thug Life Runs Deep" which talks about gang culture and behavior.
The Editorial with smaller title but on the newspaper the font was huge.
http://www.suntimes.com/opinions/30179649-474/the-thug-life-runs-deep.html
The Editorial with smaller title but on the newspaper the font was huge.
http://www.suntimes.com/opinions/30179649-474/the-thug-life-runs-deep.html
It's incredibly obvious that they are attempting to use ebonics.
The older the recipe, the more obvious it is.
Yes, the word "Thug" is used in other contexts.. but come on people.. this one was obvious from the start.
Yes but what is "thuggish" about the behavior of the blog?
All they are doing is throwing fuck around a lot mixed in with lame attempts at ebonics.. what about posting healthy recipes for free to the internet actually represents being a Thug exactly?
The intent is rather obvious... to invoke images of an African American.. it's like the type-casting of Samuel L. Jackson in "recipe web site" form.
The older the recipe, the more obvious it is.
Yes, the word "Thug" is used in other contexts.. but come on people.. this one was obvious from the start.
Yes but what is "thuggish" about the behavior of the blog?
All they are doing is throwing fuck around a lot mixed in with lame attempts at ebonics.. what about posting healthy recipes for free to the internet actually represents being a Thug exactly?
The intent is rather obvious... to invoke images of an African American.. it's like the type-casting of Samuel L. Jackson in "recipe web site" form.
Delta Assault
Member
This sounds like a Portlandia skit.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Yes you are. People are pointing out to you why the word is regarded as code in many cases. That you disagree with them because you didn't know about the examples they're using? That's essentially the definition of ignorance. Your opposition is firmly rooted in your lack of knowing what the other people are talking about. That's how ignorance works.
That your counter-examples are "I saw a kid knock over a cereal box at the supermarket" and that said counter-example is being offered up as if it carries equal cultural weight is annoying on top of it.
That YOU don't do that is sorta immaterial to the fact A LOT OF PEOPLE do. It's disingenuous to further suggest that because YOU dont' do that means others are simply incorrect about how often it happens everywhere else. That doesn't even follow, logically.
Am I racist if I could tell it was written by a white person / people before it was revealed?
I'll ponder on that.
I know I'm probably showing my ignorance, but I think the pendulum swung when 2 Pac popularised the phrase 'Thug Life' and now the word has a racial association. I could be totally wrong about that though.
I'll ponder on that.
Yup, same here. A thug is like a henchman. It's an old Indian word that we Brits stole.
I know I'm probably showing my ignorance, but I think the pendulum swung when 2 Pac popularised the phrase 'Thug Life' and now the word has a racial association. I could be totally wrong about that though.
Abso-fucking-lutely.
stufte
Member
Careful, don't turn this into a racism/tipping thread.
Dude Abides
Banned
Yep, trying and failing. It's like a simulacrum of ebonics as imagined by white yuppies.
People who follow cases such as Trayvon Martin should not assume that their train of thought is somehow a world wide consensus just because local media outlets support their point of view with articles related to racial divisions etc.
The word thug does not have a racial connotation in Europe or many places in America even. It is associated with low class culture and behaviour. The sort of people who act aggressively and have tattoos. Football hooligans are thugs and so are members of motorcycle gangs. It is more often used when a person is part of a larger group, a henchman of sorts who is nothing but muscle. But there's no point denying that it has also been used as code for something worse during these highly publicized incidents.
The word thug does not have a racial connotation in Europe or many places in America even. It is associated with low class culture and behaviour. The sort of people who act aggressively and have tattoos. Football hooligans are thugs and so are members of motorcycle gangs. It is more often used when a person is part of a larger group, a henchman of sorts who is nothing but muscle. But there's no point denying that it has also been used as code for something worse during these highly publicized incidents.
Anton Sugar
Member
Don't you think you should educate yourself/understand the context of the word in our society, before you dismiss the idea?
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
I love when real world stats come in.
Just to repeat it for people who don't believe this is a real thing.
radios shipping overview
Member
Oh I agree this example is blatant racism by mocking black people.
Son, this post is my JAM!
What particular cultural group do you think I was attempting to mimic there?
If you are unaware; it's African American culture.
They have language like that in their recipes.
There is absolutely nothing actually "thuggish" about their recipes.. they do not promote violence, they do not discuss gang activity.. they aren't posting poisonous recipes.
They are just attempting to use ebonics.
And calling it "Thug Kitchen"...
The thing people in this thread seem to be missing when trying to rationalize why thug isn't a dogwhistle for "nigger", is that it means all the negative things you've said, and more. There is a certain subset of people that specifically use it in the context of being a safe and clean method of saying the above forbidden word without saying the word. Because we're a post-race society, amirite?
It doesn't always mean this when you use it in relation to a black person, and many people using it may not understand that that's why a certain group of people use it, but that is definitely what it means, regardless if you meant it that way, or not.
It doesn't always mean this when you use it in relation to a black person, and many people using it may not understand that that's why a certain group of people use it, but that is definitely what it means, regardless if you meant it that way, or not.
Anton Sugar
Member
Even this definition is problematic. What does "low class culture and behavior" mean? In the US, viewing black communities as "low class" "uneducated" "vulgar" "aggressive" etc. is a real problem.
Tattoos? C'mon, son.
jim-jam bongs
Member
This is a reasonable stance to take in rebuttal of some posts in this thread, however it's pretty hard to argue that the creators of Thug Kitchen were ignorant of the connotations inherent in the name.
Anton Sugar
Member
Aside from the racist connotations, it is, without a doubt, cultural appropriation for the sake of irony and comedy.
Like all these fucking white girls on Tinder who "love to do ratchet things" or who are "kinda ghetto".
Listening makes people uncomfortable. Much easier to say "nawww, you're being too sensitive."
Like all these fucking white girls on Tinder who "love to do ratchet things" or who are "kinda ghetto".
Listening makes people uncomfortable. Much easier to say "nawww, you're being too sensitive."
Foxy Fox 39
Banned
I think its time for some posters to listen to what people are saying, rather than arguing and finding it hard to believe.
uncredited male
Member
When I was a kid I would get thug eyed. But no longer. Changed relatively recently I would guess. Make up your own words you hateful people you.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Thanks for this.
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