The Hobbit trilogy - News, rumours and discussion

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Did they mention why Eomer looks so weird at the end of the movie? I think it's either bad CG or a different actor with makeup on to look like him. I vaguely recall hearing that he was away on another movie and unavailable for that ending shot of them riding towards the camera.

Yes. He is his double, and the plan was to insert Eomer's face in post-production, but they forgot until it was too late.

Peter Jackson jokes and says is a brand new Rohirrim who is going to star his own TV spin off after the films.
 

Cheebo

Banned
I would prefer that they actually get involved with an HBO version of the Silmarillion sometimes next decade. Like GRRM with the Game of Thrones adaption but with even more editorial control.

The Tolkien family doesn't want ANY on screen version of Middle-Earth. The only reason Hobbit and LOTR got them was Tolkien needed the money in the 60s and sold the rights. They won't let HBO do Silmarillion.
 

Pilgrimzero

Member
So I decided to re-watch the old 1977 Hobbit cartoon film.

How did the Dwarves plan to beat Smaug? They didn't seem to be armed at all until the found the troll treasure. They ran from the Trolls (leaving Bilbo to die). The run blindly into the Goblin Cave and immediately get captured. The get captured by the Attercaps while sleeping.

Heck the only time the plan to fight is at the battle of the 5 armies at the end.
 

LastNac

Member
The Tolkien family doesn't want ANY on screen version of Middle-Earth. The only reason Hobbit and LOTR got them was Tolkien needed the money in the 60s and sold the rights. They won't let HBO do Silmarillion.
Christopher Tolkien doesn't want any screen version of Middle-Earth. He's 90. Once hes gone someone like Simon Tolkien will sell the rights.
 

Cheebo

Banned
Christopher Tolkien doesn't want any screen version of Middle-Earth. He's 90. Once hes gone someone like Simon Tolkien will sell the rights.
Simon Tolkien is not taking over after Christopher dies. Adam Tolkien is.

I think it will take another generation after Adam at the very least. Simon Tolkien is not involved in managing the estate. He and his father made up after not talking in years but he is not involved in managing the Tolkien estate at all unlike Adam Tolkien, Christopher's son from his second marriage. Simon was raised by his mother who divorced Christopher Tolkien when he was young. Adam Tolkien will be the one making the calls after Christopher is gone.

Adam Tolkien co-edited Children of Hurin with Christopher as well. He is groomed as the heir for managing the estate. Adam has even talked about this, and how he will not turn Tolkien into a "business" either.

No chance he will be selling off Silmarillion rights and he is in mid-40's. We have a LONG way to go.
 

Real Hero

Member
I couldn't believe what I was watching when
Kate from Lost was crying over a dead dwarf and said 'WHY DOES IT HURT SO MUCH???'
What the fuck were these films.
 

Pilgrimzero

Member
I couldn't believe what I was watching when Kate from Lost was crying over a dead dwarf and said 'WHY DOES IT HURT SO MUCH???' What the fuck were these films.

That scene made me realize her whole reason for being in this film was just to have a female character. Her arc went absolutely no where and her whole purpose was padding the film with a dismal and ultimately pointless love story.

Not to mention she was completely over shadowed by Legolas, yet another character that really had no point in this tale.
 

Edmond Dantès

Dantès the White
So I decided to re-watch the old 1977 Hobbit cartoon film.

How did the Dwarves plan to beat Smaug? They didn't seem to be armed at all until the found the troll treasure. They ran from the Trolls (leaving Bilbo to die). The run blindly into the Goblin Cave and immediately get captured. The get captured by the Attercaps while sleeping.

Heck the only time the plan to fight is at the battle of the 5 armies at the end.
That's the charm of the story and why it's the most faerie-like of all of the tales from the Legendarium. Not just one event of eucatastrophe, but multiple events; each time Bilbo's influence increasing, thus his maturation.
Christopher Tolkien doesn't want any screen version of Middle-Earth. He's 90. Once hes gone someone like Simon Tolkien will sell the rights.
Adam is the most likely successor. The rights can also protected via perpetuity. The rights will not be sold for a long time to come, if ever.
 

Cheebo

Banned
Edmond Dantès;144526753 said:
Adam is the most likely successor. The rights can also protected via perpetuity. The rights will not be sold for a long time to come, if ever.
Yep, Adam has even in interviews stated as much that he will be in charge of things and how he won't exploit his grandfather and doesn't like the movies. Adam is very much in the mold of Christopher.
 

Edmond Dantès

Dantès the White
That scene made me realize her whole reason for being in this film was just to have a female character. Her arc went absolutely no where and her whole purpose was padding the film with a dismal and ultimately pointless love story.

Not to mention she was completely over shadowed by Legolas, yet another character that really had no point in this tale.
To be fair to Legolas his inclusion makes sense considering his position in the realm of Mirkwood. And before the trilogy split it was thought that he would have a much smaller role; something akin to a cameo. Tauriel though was a mistake. Taking cues from the novel would have sufficed. Bilbo as an androgynous protagonist; equally appealing to both boys and girls, thus negating the need for a female character.
 

Curufinwe

Member
Edmond Dantès;144527974 said:
To be fair to Legolas his inclusion makes sense considering his position in the realm of Mirkwood. And before the trilogy split it was thought that he would have a much smaller role; something akin to a cameo. Tauriel though was a mistake. Taking cues from the novel would have sufficed. Bilbo as an androgynous protagonist; equally appealing to both boys and girls, thus negating the need for a female character.

A man in his 40s like Freeman just isn't going to appeal to young girls the same way. Not that I think that justifies creating Tauriel and spending so much screen time with her and Kili.
 

Edmond Dantès

Dantès the White
A man in his 40s like Freeman just isn't going to appeal to young girls the same way. Not that I think that justifies creating Tauriel and spending so much screen time with her and Kili.
Of course the nuances of the novel are lost in a live action adaptation and what works in the novel via Tolkien's elegance is hard to translate on film. That's one reason why I would have preferred a high budget animated adaptation rather than a live action trilogy. I don't really care for visual continuity, but many would be bothered by the jump from animation to live action if viewing the two adaptations back-to-back. But then it would help to distinguish the faerie essence of The Hobbit.

An art style taking cues from Tolkien's own artwork would be splendid. Maybe in a few decades.
 

FinKL

Member
I got trolled by Fandango hard, saw Digital 3D HFR scheduled for 6:20 on Fandango.com website, got to my movie theater and the 6:20 is just for an original 2D screening =/ (JBX & Atmos are different sound system configurations, but both are 2D) To make matters worst, they told me they stop showing HFR past 2pm so I went ahead and got tickets anyway.

4G3vbib.png


Make sure to double check the movie before going!

With that said, is there ANY possible way to see HFR 2D or 3D of the previous movies as I have yet to witness this feat? I'm not sure if there IS a way, as I recall, there might of been a problem with getting that much data on Blu-ray?
 

Vashetti

Banned
With that said, is there ANY possible way to see HFR 2D or 3D of the previous movies as I have yet to witness this feat? I'm not sure if there IS a way, as I recall, there might of been a problem with getting that much data on Blu-ray?

The Blu-ray standard doesn't support 48fps.

I believe it's been said there's no plans to support 48fps in the new 4K Blu-ray standard too.
 

LastNac

Member
Simon Tolkien is not taking over after Christopher dies. Adam Tolkien is.

I think it will take another generation after Adam at the very least. Simon Tolkien is not involved in managing the estate. He and his father made up after not talking in years but he is not involved in managing the Tolkien estate at all unlike Adam Tolkien, Christopher's son from his second marriage. Simon was raised by his mother who divorced Christopher Tolkien when he was young. Adam Tolkien will be the one making the calls after Christopher is gone.

Adam Tolkien co-edited Children of Hurin with Christopher as well. He is groomed as the heir for managing the estate. Adam has even talked about this, and how he will not turn Tolkien into a "business" either.

No chance he will be selling off Silmarillion rights and he is in mid-40's. We have a LONG way to go.

Edmond Dantès;144526753 said:
That's the charm of the story and why it's the most faerie-like of all of the tales from the Legendarium. Not just one event of eucatastrophe, but multiple events; each time Bilbo's influence increasing, thus his maturation.

Adam is the most likely successor. The rights can also protected via perpetuity. The rights will not be sold for a long time to come, if ever.

Yep, Adam has even in interviews stated as much that he will be in charge of things and how he won't exploit his grandfather and doesn't like the movies. Adam is very much in the mold of Christopher.
And in this situation without Adam?
 

Cheebo

Banned
And her stance?

She is in agreement with her father from family interviews that have been done.She would be basically disowned if she didn't which is what happened to Simon for years. Simon Tolkien is a blacksheep. The estate was never going to go to him. He has had no involvement at all. The only ones who are involved with the state are all about "protecting" the brand.

Adam Tolkien was only born in 1969 and is steadfastly anti-film. You will never see the rights sold in your lifetime. It is a multiple generations away thing.

There is literally NO ONE in the family who would take over the estate who likes the films or wants film/tv adaptions of the work.
 
Edmond Dantès;144527974 said:
To be fair to Legolas his inclusion makes sense considering his position in the realm of Mirkwood. And before the trilogy split it was thought that he would have a much smaller role; something akin to a cameo. Tauriel though was a mistake. Taking cues from the novel would have sufficed. Bilbo as an androgynous protagonist; equally appealing to both boys and girls, thus negating the need for a female character.

Legolas being in the hobbit sort of ruins his lotr character arc in that he became best friends with a dwarf. Its not nearly as effective given that he spent an entire trilogy running around with dwarves before that
 

Edmond Dantès

Dantès the White
And her stance?
Both Christopher's sister (Priscilla) and his daughter Rachel share similar views. Priscilla more so, but her age may be a significant factor and Christopher may not want to burden her with such a role. Although the solicitors who represent the Estate do much of the work, they do defer to the Literary Executor who has absolute power.
 
Legolas being in the hobbit sort of ruins his lotr character arc in that he became best friends with a dwarf. Its not nearly as effective given that he spent an entire trilogy running around with dwarves before that

Eh, it's not like he became friends with any of the dwarves. There was some mutual respect between him and Thorin at the end which showed he could be open to a friendlier relationship with a dwarf which eventually happens in LOTR. I think it kinda works but not everyone will agree.
 
I couldn't believe what I was watching when
Kate from Lost was crying over a dead dwarf and said 'WHY DOES IT HURT SO MUCH???'
What the fuck were these films.

I was very annoyed when in the end she didn't even avenge his death and proceeded to reiterate the stereotype that women need to be saved by men. The filmmakers could have very well justified her inclusion by having her actually do something of weight in place of breaking down so Legolas can have yet another gratuitous fight scene.
 

Loxley

Member
Edmond Dantès;144527974 said:
To be fair to Legolas his inclusion makes sense considering his position in the realm of Mirkwood. And before the trilogy split it was thought that he would have a much smaller role; something akin to a cameo. Tauriel though was a mistake. Taking cues from the novel would have sufficed. Bilbo as an androgynous protagonist; equally appealing to both boys and girls, thus negating the need for a female character.

Yep, there's nothing exceedingly masculine about Bilbo as a character, nor anything in particular that that would lead me to think he was meant to appeal specifically to young boys. The mark of a truly great children's book is one that appeals to both boys and girls, which The Hobbit obviously does. Including Tauriel because there's a lack of female characters that girls can identify with (which I believe Boyens has practically admitted to over the years) is kind of a moot point when the story has always appealed to both genders.
 

Curufinwe

Member
Eh, it's not like he became friends with any of the dwarves. There was some mutual respect between him and Thorin

Yes, that was all that was there. So I don't think it affects his LotR arc, and as I said earlier this film give a reason for his behavior towards Boromir at the CoE.
 

Windam

Scaley member
Yes, that was all that was there. So I don't think it affects his LotR arc, and as I said earlier this film give a reason for his behavior towards Boromir at the CoE.

Yeah, Legolas going off to find Aragorn and spending time with him before the events of LotR does a lot to explain why he so quickly jumped to Aragorn's defense against Boromir. Part of me wants to believe that this was PJ's intention with that scene, but part of me feels like he was thinking "oh, why not?".
 

Edmond Dantès

Dantès the White
Another random trivia: the son of Aragorn and Arwen is actually son of Nori (Jed Brophy).

lotr3-movie-screencapscom-4448_zps598c1a9c.jpg
If WB do decide to expand on the licence that they currently have, the above would provide for the manner in which the narrative is told. Older Aragorn narrating to his son the adventures of his life. Viggo would reprise his role and he would of course be the perfect age for it.
 

LastNac

Member
She is in agreement with her father from family interviews that have been done.She would be basically disowned if she didn't which is what happened to Simon for years. Simon Tolkien is a blacksheep. The estate was never going to go to him. He has had no involvement at all. The only ones who are involved with the state are all about "protecting" the brand.

Adam Tolkien was only born in 1969 and is steadfastly anti-film. You will never see the rights sold in your lifetime. It is a multiple generations away thing.

There is literally NO ONE in the family who would take over the estate who likes the films or wants film/tv adaptions of the work.

So we gotta wait out two more Tolkiens?

Damn, Christopher sounds like an awful person.
 

Edmond Dantès

Dantès the White
So we gotta wait out two more Tolkiens?

Damn, Christopher sounds like an awful person.
On the contrary, he's merely an individual who has a deep connection to his father's work and thus finds it difficult to let go. Let us not forget that one man's genius has benefited from the lifetimes of two men.
 
Edmond Dantès;144542020 said:
If WB do decide to expand on the licence that they currently have, the above would provide for the manner in which the narrative is told. Older Aragorn narrating to his son the adventures of his life. Viggo would reprise his role and he would of course be the perfect age for it.

I like that idea, though I don't know if there is enough material for a good stand alone film. Just one. Because I hope the thirst for trilogies has been satiated.
 

tcrunch

Member
Including Tauriel because there's a lack of female characters that girls can identify with (which I believe Boyens has practically admitted to over the years) is kind of a moot point when the story has always appealed to both genders.

Could have just made some of the dwarves girls too.
 

LastNac

Member
Edmond Dantès;144543358 said:
On the contrary, he's merely an individual who has a deep connection to his father's work and thus finds it difficult to let go. Let us not forget that one man's genius has benefited from the lifetimes of two men.

Wanting to protect intellectual property that you are close to? Fine, respectable.

Doing it at the coast of disowning your own son? Come on, now.
 

Edmond Dantès

Dantès the White
I like that idea, though I don't know if there is enough material for a good stand alone film. Just one. Because I hope the thirst for trilogies has been satiated.
It would essentially be the Tale of Aragorn and Arwen with other elements of the appendices. One film, that's all. But it could lead to a 'Tales from Middle-earth' type of franchise, which I'm not too sure about.
 

Cheebo

Banned
Edmond Dantès;144542020 said:
If WB do decide to expand on the licence that they currently have, the above would provide for the manner in which the narrative is told. Older Aragorn narrating to his son the adventures of his life. Viggo would reprise his role and he would of course be the perfect age for it.

Viggo won't be doing a Middle-earth movie with Jackson ever again one would imagine after the harsh comments he made about Peter Jackson and The Hobbit films.
 

Edmond Dantès

Dantès the White
Wanting to protect intellectual property that you are close to? Fine, respectable.

Doing it at the coast of disowning your own son? Come on, now.
An extreme reaction certainly, but they have since reconciled and one wonders if the issue between them was deeper than just a disagreement over intellectual property, but that is firmly in the realm of speculation and family affairs are family affairs and none of our business.
 

LastNac

Member
Edmond Dantès;144545038 said:
An extreme reaction certainly, but they have since reconciled and one wonders if the issue between them was deeper than just a disagreement over intellectual property, but that is firmly in the realm of speculation and family affairs are family affairs and none of our business.

Unless family affairs obviously made public. The man seems irrational, and its a damn shame because he probably he is genius in his own right.

Honest question Edmond, do you think he ever hears the rhetoric that many fans are waiting for him to die in order to get more content? Do you think it bothers him?
 
Edmond Dantès;144544297 said:
It would essentially be the Tale of Aragorn and Arwen with other elements of the appendices. One film, that's all. But it could lead to a 'Tales from Middle-earth' type of franchise, which I'm not too sure about.

Yeah, as much as I love this films, I'm also a bit scared of what might come out of further stretching the series. The Hobbit, despite the multiple licenses they have taken, at least has a solid and very detailed base.

Peter said in FOTR EE (or TTT, I'm not sure now) that they actually filmed a shaved Viggo Mortensen (to look younger) meeting Arwen for the first time in a forest. If the sequence is good enough, I would like they just re-inserted it somewhere for the upcoming 6 films box. That's all I need as "Aragorn-Arwen prequel".
 
Legolas being in the hobbit sort of ruins his lotr character arc in that he became best friends with a dwarf. Its not nearly as effective given that he spent an entire trilogy running around with dwarves before that

I thought for sure they were going to give him more direct motivation for disliking dwarves. Like Tauriel dies in the defense of Kili, and then he's like "man, those dwarves got the love of my life killed. I will never be friends with a dwarf!"
 

Atruvius

Member
Just came home from the theater and thought the film was a lot better than the earlier ones. I have read the book a couple of times and was still surprised by a few scenes. And I somehow could get more into the movie.

HFR looked amazing again, just like it did in DOS. The higher framerate just gives the film a more realistic and clearer look. Though some slow-mo shots looked a bit jittery, but I don't think that's HFR's fault. I would so like 48 fps the the new standard in movies.
 
HFR looked amazing again, just like it did in DOS. The higher framerate just gives the film a more realistic and clearer look. Though some slow-mo shots looked a bit jittery, but I don't think that's HFR's fault. I would so like 48 fps the the new standard in movies.

The burning Lake Town looked incredible in HFR. The visuals in the entire opening sequence were just jaw-dropping.
 

Edmond Dantès

Dantès the White
Unless family affairs obviously made public. The man seems irrational, and its a damn shame because he probably he is genius in his own right.

Honest question Edmond, do you think he ever hears the rhetoric that many fans are waiting for him to die in order to get more content? Do you think it bothers him?
He lives with his wife in seclusion in France away from the public. He has washed his hands of the films and most probably ignores the media. I'm sure that he's aware that there is a dislike of his position, but at his age, such things are meaningless really.

Were I to hazard a guess, the upcoming publication of his father's version of The Tale of Kullervo (from the Finnish Kalevala) is probably at the forefront of his mind.
 

Windam

Scaley member
I thought for sure they were going to give him more direct motivation for disliking dwarves. Like Tauriel dies in the defense of Kili, and then he's like "man, those dwarves got the love of my life killed. I will never be friends with a dwarf!"

The Elves still remember the death of Thingol and the (first) destruction of Doriath at the hands of the Dwarves. Especially with Legolas being a Sindarin Elf (as was Thingol), though he was not alive for the destruction of Doriath, the contempt towards Dwarves would have certainly existed. That and Thror shafting his father with the white jewels.
 

Vashetti

Banned
I thought for sure they were going to give him more direct motivation for disliking dwarves. Like Tauriel dies in the defense of Kili, and then he's like "man, those dwarves got the love of my life killed. I will never be friends with a dwarf!"

If anything, Legolas is the more mature one in the LOTR Dwarf/Elf rivalry. Gimli is far more antagonistic.

We could look at that as Gloin and the rest of the Dwarves blaming Tauriel for Kili's death, so the hatred of Elves got passed on.
 
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