Graphics Horse
Member
Yeah I thought the tanks were an exception but obviously not. For the meeting I tailed the southern guy all the way there.
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SPOILER: Metal Gear Solid V Spoiler Thread | Such a lust for conclusion, T-WHHOOOO
- Thread starter MMarston
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Yeah I thought the tanks were an exception but obviously not. For the meeting I tailed the southern guy all the way there.
Enter the Dragon Punch
Banned
"all i was doing was masturbating to pictures of the boss and you caused the creation of outer heaven? god dammit"
While this is true, how many people replayed the series in the lead up? A member of the staff couldn't do that to help avoid inconsistencies? The retcons are frustrating and I think the only reason they exist is because Kojima doesn't really care about the overall narrative of the Metal Gear world. He cares about each individual game and it's themes and prioritizes them over having a cohesive Metal Gear world or timeline. Which as a fan of the lore frustrates me
SuperStiltzkin
Member
It's because he made it way more complicated than he needed to. There's plenty of backstory and lore to explore and draw upon, and yet for some reason he decides he doesn't want to flesh out these plot lines. He simply wants to add upon the already complicated story. So many people speculated that we might see Solidus or Gray Fox. Or maybe we'd see Eva, or Para Medic, or Sigint, or Zero again. Yet we see nothing of them. Nothing that fleshes out how they became the mysterious Patriots. The entire Cipher/Zero/Big Boss conflict established in 4 that complicated that past already is a side story relegated to tapes. Instead of fleshing out past events and characters, they just add more organizations and more characters and more conflicts and more everything until it's all a jumbled mess of overlapping retcons. XOF, Skull Face, Sahelanthropus, Parasites, Quiet, Code Talker, Venom Snake.
What pisses me off is that outside of the reference to the Patriots from MGS2, MGS3 was perfect in terms of estabilshing characters and having clean breaks.
We didn't need to tie Paramedic to Grey Fox, the cloning project, etc. We didn't need to make SigInt the dude you go to rescue in MGS1.
We didn't need to tie the entire cast to the Patriots. None of that. It was a good clean break and story for the entire thing.
Buuuuut noooooo we need to tie them in for MGS4 and then fill out that entire thing with MGS3's supplemental games. :|
We didn't need to tie Paramedic to Grey Fox, the cloning project, etc. We didn't need to make SigInt the dude you go to rescue in MGS1.
We didn't need to tie the entire cast to the Patriots. None of that. It was a good clean break and story for the entire thing.
Buuuuut noooooo we need to tie them in for MGS4 and then fill out that entire thing with MGS3's supplemental games. :|
Enter the Dragon Punch
Banned
also we tied them all to mgsv via parasites enjoy
Big Boss is an infinitely more interesting character than Solid Snake. The character however was just wasted in this game. I wanted to play a morally dubious protagonist and witness his descent into madness and what I got here instead was shit.
Also what the hell happened to meaningful level design and boss fights the series was known for? Where is my 'End' quality boss fight?
Sorry Quiet does not compare. They had an open world to work with and had the opportunity to further develop that MGS3 boss fight and set the bar for all Sniper fights from on. What a wasted opportunity.
Even MGS4 bosses destroys every so called boss fight in V. I had more fun fighting Laughing octopus than any boss in this game. Man on fire was a joke compared to The fury. The gameplay is sublime and has the best gameplay mechanics in a stealth game ever ( sorry thief, splinter cell etc... the bar has been raised now ) but everything else around it is so disappointing for a MGS fan. Chapter 2 is proof that Kojima either ran out of budget ,publisher backing or game design ideas.
Also what the hell happened to meaningful level design and boss fights the series was known for? Where is my 'End' quality boss fight?
Sorry Quiet does not compare. They had an open world to work with and had the opportunity to further develop that MGS3 boss fight and set the bar for all Sniper fights from on. What a wasted opportunity.
Even MGS4 bosses destroys every so called boss fight in V. I had more fun fighting Laughing octopus than any boss in this game. Man on fire was a joke compared to The fury. The gameplay is sublime and has the best gameplay mechanics in a stealth game ever ( sorry thief, splinter cell etc... the bar has been raised now ) but everything else around it is so disappointing for a MGS fan. Chapter 2 is proof that Kojima either ran out of budget ,publisher backing or game design ideas.
LimitedRunGames
Member
I personally really enjoyed MGSV. That being said, I did feel like this game's second half was just butchered. It had some really great missions, but the replays should of just been something to unlock for all the missions, not actual main missions.
My only other beef is people that stalk my FOB. They fail at infiltrating me, then I steal their staff, and they keep coming back. I would leave them alone if they just gave up.
I also didn't mind the ending, but would of definitely liked to of seen the cut mission completed.
My only other beef is people that stalk my FOB. They fail at infiltrating me, then I steal their staff, and they keep coming back. I would leave them alone if they just gave up.
I also didn't mind the ending, but would of definitely liked to of seen the cut mission completed.
Deckard Chapel
Banned
Then, like the fanbase he seems so eager to please - he could play through all the other games in this saga that he has created and then make an informed decision when attempting to retcon something that he doesn't remember properly.
Coherency and fluidity - It's not too much to ask.
The Silver
Member
Well that's not really true either, Venom is a really good guy.
Because he doesn't really care about internal consistency. He explicitly said he would rather take liberties with the canon in order to tell a good story than try to mold a story into a canon.
Love Deterrence
Member
Nah, he's fine. He could use a fresh canvas to work with though, and he'll have just that at Tencent.
SuperStiltzkin
Member
I hate everything MGS4 established about the past. But MGS4 tells us that it's important. Cipher is a huge factor into creating the world that MGS lives in today. Everything that happened in MGS1,2,4 stemmed from Cipher and Zero and MGS3 radio team. I hate it, but if I'm going to ride this crazy rollercoaster, then fuck it, I'll see where it leads. Instead, MGSV tells us to get of this crazy rollercoaster and ride this new one with new characters and new organizations that have fuck all to do with Cipher or Zero or MGS3 radio team or anything might redeem MGS4's stupid retcons.
Deckard Chapel
Banned
This.
I am one of those fans that replayed all of the games in preparation for "the missing link" of the saga and that is why I know in detail, all the details for why I am so incredibly disappointed and irritated at how the finished game turned out.
The Silver
Member
I don't know why cipher even had to be a thing, why can't they have just always been called the Patriots? Like it tells us in MGS3/4? Kojima really wanted to take his "Zero" puns to the next level.
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
Yeah I like Solid Snake way, way more then Big Boss.
Unknown One
Member
Big Boss is just a stupid version of Solid Snake + Emo Anakin Skywalker.
Also...writers of novels and fantasy series absolutely keep notes and BINDERS full of ideas. George RR Martin, writer of A Song of Ice and Fire has so many notes and stories and god knows what written about that series that he employs people just to keep track of it all for him!
Kojima is focused on the metaphor and the unique properties of the games. Not on the narrative. People are mad that we play as some nobody unimportant medic. But I don't think that was his intention. The intention is obvious, to reach through the game and acknowledge our role in the continuation of the story and his career. But that metaphor compromises the game's story and the history of Metal Gear and once again doesn't provide us with any of the things we've been after since MGS2.
Since rumors of the twist happened I have been like "THat would be stupid but the gameplay looks so good who gives a shit" and then it happened and now I give a shit. I look at Big Boss while I'm playing and I'm just like "Ugh. UGH!". It's a maddening and weird game but also the best game I have played in years? If not for the unnecessary twist and the lack of mission 51 I wouldn't have any complaints.
I wish there were more interactions with other NPCs. Like you could talk to Quiet in her cell, or Emmerich in his lab. You can visit them, but they say nothing and there's no interaction.
This would have gone a long way to making the world seem more alive.
Edit.
I'd like a game set after MGS and during after MGS2 where Solid Snake is going around the world destroying all the Metal Gears that various nations / militias have. Him and Emmerich set up that damn organization, and there is so much potential there for a cool, globe trotting adventure.
It could even be done as a series of separate maps as sandboxes. Each area being an infiltration and then ending with a confrontation with a metal gear or another boss. Would be cool to see the different metal gears that got developed and would make for a cool game, trying to take them all down.
This would have gone a long way to making the world seem more alive.
Edit.
I'd like a game set after MGS and during after MGS2 where Solid Snake is going around the world destroying all the Metal Gears that various nations / militias have. Him and Emmerich set up that damn organization, and there is so much potential there for a cool, globe trotting adventure.
It could even be done as a series of separate maps as sandboxes. Each area being an infiltration and then ending with a confrontation with a metal gear or another boss. Would be cool to see the different metal gears that got developed and would make for a cool game, trying to take them all down.
Deckard Chapel
Banned
That part was news to me - and despite being super-pissed off at him, Konami and anyone else responsible for cutting the final mission and costumes out of MGSV [making them available as DLC later on, so it seems] - I will be excited to hear the news regarding whatever his next project may be.
He is a talented creator, after all and any new IP he creates will be remarkable - just don't get excited for the retconned sequels.
Mr.Fletcher
Member
Both Big Boss and Solid Snake go through similar hardships but only the latter becomes a true legend for the right reasons.
I'd say that each game featuring the former has only served to, ironically, empower Solid Snake as a character.
I'd say that each game featuring the former has only served to, ironically, empower Solid Snake as a character.
I think that Metal Gear Solid has enough of an identity that it could continue without Kojima. His team might not have been able to jump into a new genre with ease, but they could have made a big budget stealth game that's more faithful to the characters, like Portable Ops compared to Peace Walker.
And Kojima could do with a new series to work with.
It's just a shame he couldn't hand off the series to his own team. We'll have to see if another team are capable.
And Kojima could do with a new series to work with.
It's just a shame he couldn't hand off the series to his own team. We'll have to see if another team are capable.
He is moving to tencent?
Agreed. Snake and Otacon understood the Boss's will without even meeting her. Zero and Big Boss thought they knew her so well only they could decipher her will but in the end only served their own egos.
plot holes are a regular thing in fiction, especially in long-running series with complicated plots. plot holes are also something that the general populace doesn't care about, so the pressure isn't exactly on to keep it straight.
Vigilant Gambit
Member
I have a bit of a request.
I haven't finished the game yet, but I heard about some kind of post-game mission regarding Ishmael from the prologue. What I read was that dedicated players get access to that mission if they fulfill certain requirements.
Can someone mention what those requirements are? I'd google them, or search this thread, but I'd hate to be bombarded with spoilers in the process.
Depending on what it is, I'd like to make sure I hit those requirements as I play through the game instead of going back to do them later. Just please quote this post so I see your response highlighted. Thank you!
I haven't finished the game yet, but I heard about some kind of post-game mission regarding Ishmael from the prologue. What I read was that dedicated players get access to that mission if they fulfill certain requirements.
Can someone mention what those requirements are? I'd google them, or search this thread, but I'd hate to be bombarded with spoilers in the process.
Depending on what it is, I'd like to make sure I hit those requirements as I play through the game instead of going back to do them later. Just please quote this post so I see your response highlighted. Thank you!
Unknown One
Member
Do the yellow highlighted missions/side ops missions.
Vigilant Gambit
Member
Thank you! That should be fairly easy.
Deckard Chapel
Banned
Unless the Japanese version of the bonus Blu-Ray differs in content - there is no making-of feature.
Sadly [I was devastated to see that there wasn't one] we will all have to wait and
see if one is released posthumously.
Just talking to a good buddy of mine. We were discussing MB.
As it has been established, and i think this is pretty much across the board the same opinion. MB is under utilized. It felt like it was never completed, and never reached the potential it was presented it to be at.
Mission 43, relies on you to care about your soldiers. Honestly, i felt like this was not important at the time. But the more i think about it, the impact of you caring for them would be a bigger blow to your gut when the time comes. We even discussed you killing one of your buddies in this mission.
But mostly. we talked about MB. I think Paz does a great job at giving you a taste of living at MB in her tapes. Its an awesome place. People train, people move and have chats, people play soccer, or bust into fights over nothing. Like BB and Kaz fighting naked. The thing is. MB is an empty "shell" (notice that reference to MGS2 right there.) If they had more interactions of a small city alive, then i think you loosing members of MB would be more meaningful, and not only that. You come to terms to why Kaz and VB lust for revenge.
We talked they should have done a hacky soccer playtime, where they hack from PES or something, i dunno. Things to get you involved in the game and appreciate MB. Right now you never interact with it directly. Only the target practice.. and those are a waste of time.
We both agreed that one of the most successful sequences in a MGS game was that ladder in MGS3. It just works... it creates emotion... and its just good. We compared that to the ride in the jeep with Skullface... and that whole segment was just embarrassing. Not to mention the awkward moment where they stop talking already, and Sins of the Father starts playing. VB at no point reacts to Skullface... he just has this blank look on his face through the whole ride. So why let you look at both of them? Why not make this scene first person, and really make some great motion capture and facial expressions with Skullface? at least that would've engaged me more.
Anyways.... just food for thought i guess. Call me out on any BS. After all... i never really know what i am talking about.
As it has been established, and i think this is pretty much across the board the same opinion. MB is under utilized. It felt like it was never completed, and never reached the potential it was presented it to be at.
Mission 43, relies on you to care about your soldiers. Honestly, i felt like this was not important at the time. But the more i think about it, the impact of you caring for them would be a bigger blow to your gut when the time comes. We even discussed you killing one of your buddies in this mission.
But mostly. we talked about MB. I think Paz does a great job at giving you a taste of living at MB in her tapes. Its an awesome place. People train, people move and have chats, people play soccer, or bust into fights over nothing. Like BB and Kaz fighting naked. The thing is. MB is an empty "shell" (notice that reference to MGS2 right there.) If they had more interactions of a small city alive, then i think you loosing members of MB would be more meaningful, and not only that. You come to terms to why Kaz and VB lust for revenge.
We talked they should have done a hacky soccer playtime, where they hack from PES or something, i dunno. Things to get you involved in the game and appreciate MB. Right now you never interact with it directly. Only the target practice.. and those are a waste of time.
We both agreed that one of the most successful sequences in a MGS game was that ladder in MGS3. It just works... it creates emotion... and its just good. We compared that to the ride in the jeep with Skullface... and that whole segment was just embarrassing. Not to mention the awkward moment where they stop talking already, and Sins of the Father starts playing. VB at no point reacts to Skullface... he just has this blank look on his face through the whole ride. So why let you look at both of them? Why not make this scene first person, and really make some great motion capture and facial expressions with Skullface? at least that would've engaged me more.
Anyways.... just food for thought i guess. Call me out on any BS. After all... i never really know what i am talking about.
Unknown One
Member
No problem, make sure to go back to Motherbase from time to time as well. It'll unlock some.
but they sang happy birthday to me
Broken Joystick
At least you can talk. Who are you?
Do you reckon they'll let you play as Huey in MGO? Running around on cyborg legs shouting "REVENGE"?
also
also
Thats actually a good callout. But unfortunately. my BD is not until April 5th.
*sigh.
Also, did you get to play through any of that segment? I feel like all significant moments at MB are a cutscene. Except for obviously, mission 43.
SJRB
Gold Member
Do you reckon they'll let you play as Huey in MGO? Running around on cyborg legs shouting "REVENGE"?
also
I'd fucking run right in the line of fire every time.
Huey should be a punishment character for cheaters or something, lol.
nope but as I walked around soldiers would salute and say "Happy birthday, Boss!" or a derivative
I guess thats something.
It felt good the first few times when i landed at MB and i saw soldiers and DD there to receive me. They would salute and say. Welcome back, Boss!!
But that lots it effect quite often. When i just headed to the medical bay to bring photos to Paz. But after i noticed MB didn't have any places to go do something, i kinda turned it off. Would just go back to MB to see if i can trigger then next cutscene.
Sumio Mondo
Member
Do you reckon they'll let you play as Huey in MGO? Running around on cyborg legs shouting "REVENGE"?
also
I want to play as Skull Face and whenever a team mate dies shout "Such a lust for revenge...WHOOOOOO"
TheStruggler
Report me for trolling ND/TLoU2 threads
maybe just MAYBE it was joakim mogren who made this game all along...he is Kojima's phantom and it makes sense because Konami had the real Kojima on office arrest pretty much that he was unable to contribute his ideas to his staff. Maybe the real MGS5 is still in development and will be released by the real Kojima soon
In all honestly however I think this shows especially MGS4, Kojima grew out of touch with his audience, and his franchise. He did it for so long I think he somewhat lost his passion for it and didnt give a damn at times. He wanted to be done after MGS2, this seems like fatigue from a man that was constantly harassed by his fanbase "just one more, just one more, I wont play a metal gear game unless Kojima's name is on it" Well look what it resulted in.
In all honestly however I think this shows especially MGS4, Kojima grew out of touch with his audience, and his franchise. He did it for so long I think he somewhat lost his passion for it and didnt give a damn at times. He wanted to be done after MGS2, this seems like fatigue from a man that was constantly harassed by his fanbase "just one more, just one more, I wont play a metal gear game unless Kojima's name is on it" Well look what it resulted in.
Deckard Chapel
Banned
*gut-punch*
Imagine having to kill D-Dog because he got into some of the Vocal Cord parasite specimens...
...I don't think I could do it.
DD wouldn't understand what was going on - he was just loyal to me because he loves me and seeing him whimper and beg for life would be too much.
Kojima, you wasted this opportunity.
Love Deterrence
Member
Well, the whole point is that you created a connection with a buddy of choice. And having to do something ot hat buddy seems like a better chance to get an emotion.
Ishida dropping bombs. MGS4 lovers til the end, BROTHERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
NANOMACHINEZ >>>> PARAZITEZZZ
i dunno about that. To me... they seem to be around the same. Parasites are probably nanomachines later.
It's actually a split timeline. In one timeline Venom is destroyed completely which leads to MG2. In another, Venom's consciousness is preserved and the events of Snake's Revenge happen. In the third one Venom kills Solid Snake, with no Solid the Patriots ultimately win and proxy wars are carried out by soldiers playing collectible card games adopting identities of past heroes.
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