I'm waiting for his supposed head transplant to be a giant reveal for Metal Gear Rising 2.
SPOILER: Metal Gear Solid V Spoiler Thread | Such a lust for conclusion, T-WHHOOOO
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I'm waiting for his supposed head transplant to be a giant reveal for Metal Gear Rising 2.
Corpsepyre
Banned
I have some questions. Why did venom sound like boss? Also, what became of that doctor story? Was it really marketing?
Red Blaster
Member
The medic was just kiefer's voice but altered so you can just say it was magic hypnosis BS that made it sound exactly like Boss.
It was nothing.
I mean even if someone forgets about Kojima wearing the Ishmael mask, MGS3 had multiple lengthy conversations about Blinking and Mouth moving masks in the future.
I sort of don't really know how people didn't automatically assume he was wearing some type of mask when they started noticing the issues of things like his eye and beard and hair etc.
Or maybe I am crazy for looking at a perfectly realistic face and assuming it's probably a lie.
(It also shines oddly plastic-like in certain lights too)
OmegaTreeFish
Banned
Lol yeah tons of stuff makes no sense but its metal gear so.....
Venoms voice and what? Hypnotised to fight as good as BB and have his memories?
Metal gear has always been dumb as hell but its normally a really fun ride with tons of cool attention to detail. This game seems different in that the story side of things is weaker than normal but the gameplay if far superior to the previous games.
Corpsepyre
Banned
Or maybe it was some sort of voice manipulator they used on venom. Considering all the items they have in 1984, a manipulator would be handy.
You know, I kind of assumed that's why Venom is only rank A++ in everything and not S or S++, he was a really good soldier, good enough to fill Big Boss's shoes when forced to have the right mindset (Just like Raiden), but slightly weaker.
Corpsepyre
Banned
I think what they did to venom here was a precursor to what we see in 2. The S3 program. Giving someone the right situation and see him be the person intended.
Haunted
Member
a hero for the richest 1% in the US
denied the presidency by common sense
punished by the international community with laughter and ridicule
OmegaTreeFish
Banned
To me i just thought it was in your head what with the shrapnel and coma and stuff. Saying that i was kinda just "ah ok" when i saw the reveal. And the reveal was kinda pointless in the grand scheme of things so i dunno.
Think the game would have been better ending at chapter 1 and just having a few of the tidy up story bits as a short epilogue. Then just let you carry on with side ops and let you redo any mission as the alternate modes for people who want more.
Graphics Horse
Member
Peace Walker was like that though, and it's not like being an R&D genius is the mark of a good soldier.
They should have given him a huge medical stat but that might be too obvious
Yeah I mean they can make wormholes so I'm gonna go on a limb and say they probably also have the technology to change a guy's voice.
Peace Walker was like that though, and it's not like being an R&D genius is the mark of a good soldier.
They should have given him a huge medical stat but that might be too obvious
Yeah Big Boss was also simply an A ranked soldier in PW. I mentioned that some pages back but physical prowess is not the main reason why any of the snakes are considered legendary soldiers.
Shin Kojima
Banned
I know it doesn't make sense and I kind of have to ignore Ground Zeroes and some Phantom Pain audio for it but in my custom reality Hayter is still Big Boss and Sutherland is Venom.
Oh god
Come to think of it, the whole head transplant thing is true in some form.
The conspiracy theorists were right.
OmegaTreeFish
Banned
What if ground zeroes is actually venom in a coma having his memories altered to believe it was him there.
What? How?
I get us, learning I was right about the twist at the end of the the game was kinda overshadowed by how pointless it ended up being. Like it doesn't actually matter that you aren't the Big Boss since you are effectively the Big Boss. It just makes the whole thing sad since this guy who had his life erased gets no credit for his accomplishments.
Legendary---
Banned
Just like how we heard Ocelot sound like Liquid in MGS2?
Secret endings like that are super cool... Provided people don't just datamine them and post them on Youtube before anyone unlocks it :F
OmegaTreeFish
Banned
I guess, maybe, it shows big boss is a bit of a dick.... Well the whole crew kinda is. No wonder venom becomes evil down the line (MG1).
It's not a particularly subtle twist, hell people called it since the first TPP trailer and Ground Zeroes. Considering the usage of The Man Who Sold The World as well, MGSV has to have the most predictable twist of this entire series from the very moment you first load up the game, although I guess that's really one of the few times in the entire game that the story allows to set it up.
Quite a far cry from MGS2's carefully deliberate plot twist.
ichtyander
Member
Was on an almost complete blackout while playing MGSV, so now that I've finished the story, I just felt I needed to share my punched-to-the-gut feeling with everyone. Super Bunnyhop's analysis pretty much sums up my thoughts on the game. I'm sure I'll go on and play lots of the Side Ops for a while, just because the gameplay is so damn fun to play around with, but the overall MGS experience this time around was almost heartbreaking, to see the series close in such a chaotic mess. And I can say I liked all of the insanity, the midichlorians, kill all English (although it looks like the people of 1984 can build bipedal monstrosities but have forgotten the magic of using the written word) and even the most obvious plot twist we were all expecting but didn't really think it would happen, but the way it was handled, the journey, is really not very good. In hindsight, and now analyzing all of the details, it can make sense, and if it were handled more coherently it might've been a classic MGS title.
It's a damn shame. Still, I'm glad we got to have even this game, it's been a fun ride. Hopefully, Kojima will learn from this game and finally start making something new, with a fresh set of ideas.
It's a damn shame. Still, I'm glad we got to have even this game, it's been a fun ride. Hopefully, Kojima will learn from this game and finally start making something new, with a fresh set of ideas.
TheBoss1
Member
I've heard about it. Link?
No Ocelot actually DID have Liquid's voice in MGS2 because he actually DID have Liquid's arm, being the son of The Sorrow, he was susceptible to being a medium, which is why Liquid could even possess him in the first place.
In MGS4 his arm is gone, it's a cyborg arm in 4, implying he removed it before he decided to do the hypnosis stuff and also why he stopped sounding like Liquid, he was no longer possessed and simply thinking he was (It should have been a huge giveaway).
But for whatever reason people assumed it was all retconned, just like Paz being in TPP, yep one huge retcon.
Corpsepyre
Banned
This friend of mine messaged me after ending the game and all he said was... 'So, Big Boss was a motherfucker'?
I could imagine how he felt, and I laughed for the next 10 minutes.
I could imagine how he felt, and I laughed for the next 10 minutes.
Zomba13
Member
Ok, this is my new favourite.
But only if we release a youtube video featuring content from a supposed OT3 at around 30% completion.
while that is true, I don't see why that specific scene could not be tied to FOB just because it is in a preview of chapter 2
GekigangerV
Member
I wonder if Ground Zeroes was supposed to happen chronologically when it was still part of The Phantom Pain or if it was supposed to be a flashback during that trip on the whaler.
Gameplay-wise I cannot see them doing Ground Zeroes which laid the foundation of most of the gameplay mechanics then going to such a rudimentary tutorial level in the hospital right afterwards. I can see them originally doing the hospital to let the player know hiding is important and to give them a controlled environment in Camp Omega to kind of test out their stealth as well as gun mechanics.
That would have also allowed them to sneak in the avatar you created in the hospital scene to tease the twist.
Of course, things could have been completely shifted around after Ground Zeroes was broken off and you just created your avatar from the get go and went into the Ground Zeroes mission and it went on from there chronologically.
Marty-esque
Member
Is MGSV not MGS5? MGSVenom. Was Kojima planning on the next game being MGS5?
Berserker976
Member
Ok, so I've heard people make this claim a lot, but I haven't seen the evidence that supports this NOT being a retcon.
I was under the impression that according to MGS4 the "possessions" were faked all along using hypnotherapy as part of Ocelot's larger plan to fool the Patriots, and the only reason he got rid of Liquid's real arm was because it was causing some vague "problems" with Ocelot's mind. Which to me just implies that he got rid of it because having Liquid Snake's actual arm was making Ocelot crazier than he intended to be.
I don't remember them explicitly saying the initial possessions were real, or that it was because of Ocelot's heritage. If someone could link me to proof countering this I'd be appreciative.
Corpsepyre
Banned
So, I just played through Mission 43 again, and fuck. Still gives me chills.
That part where the soldiers put their arms down and surrender to Venom. Absolute chiller. The first time I played it, I had to pause at that scene and put my controller down for a bit.
That part where the soldiers put their arms down and surrender to Venom. Absolute chiller. The first time I played it, I had to pause at that scene and put my controller down for a bit.
technically PW is 5.
5 tells the story of BB and how he turns into his own monster i guess.
V is its mirror with Venom at the helm. In that respect. It makes sense.
Note: I haven't read a single bit off the info on the cut content so this is all definitely wrong.
Note: This is the dumb ramblings of an idiot viewer discretion is strongly advised.
If I remember correctly Metal Gear 2 is still canon so if V was the Big Boss of Metal Gear 1 was he also the cyborg Big Boss of Metal Gear 2 or was that proper Big Boss and if the Metal Gear 1&2 Big Boss was V, then is V the Big Boss of Metal Gear Solid 4. If V is the Big Boss of Metal Gears 1&2 and Metal Gear Solid 4 then he must have killed proper Big Boss at some point preceding Metal Gear 1 then assumed his place completely.
But is it possible that V and proper Big Boss allied before Metal Gear 1 and the Big Boss guiding Solid wasn't the Big Boss in Outer Heaven, but then if we accept this theory was V guiding Solid or was proper Big Boss guiding Solid. I think we must assume given the intentionally incorrect information that guide Big Boss(whether V or not) gave Solid, that the two Bosses (if in fact there were still two at this point) are functioning as a unit.
Now we all know Solid Snake of course won the day in both Metal Gear 1&2, so the question right now needs to be who was Metal Gear 2 Big Boss was it V or the proper Big Boss. I would argue given the fact Master Miller is a contact in Metal Gear 2 and he made the proclamation of support to V and Big Bosses sons, that the Big Boss of Metal Gear 2 must be proper Big Boss. But maybe the reason Miller is not in the first Metal Gear is because the Outer Heaven Big Boss and the guide Big Boss are the proper Boss in control Foxhound and Outer Heaven.
Now if we accept this V may already either be dead or retired. Alternatively its possible that after the death of the real Big Boss in Metal Gear 1, V's fragile psyche had a complete break with reality causing him to abandon Miller and be fully subsumed by the personality real Big Boss. Miller having used V may have offered his aid to Solid Snake in the second Metal Gear game in order to complete his revenge on the Big Boss by annihilating his phantom.
If we accept this theory then isn't possible Miller planned to take his vengeance even further and kill the sons of Big Boss (or at least the two he would've known of). This brings me to another important question did when did Liquid meet and join forces with Liquid, Liquid surely would've remembered Ocelot as the man who was damn close to torturing him as a child, so what must've occurred that would convince Liquid to ally himself with someone from his past like Ocelot.
Also is it possible that interacting with Liquid helped Psycho Mantis slowly repair the mental damage done to him as a child and develop his own identity and seeing the extent of his abilities in MGSV, I think we can assume that seeing the similarities between Solid and Liquid the two sons of Big Boss he may have gone easy on his friends(??) brother leading too his death.
Note: I haven't read a single bit off the info on the cut content so this is all definitely wrong.
I know, its just that i'm hilariously bad at figuring out twists no matter how obvious so I have to pat myself on the back for this one.
That is what MGS 4 tells us, but prior to its release there was good reason to think the possession real.
I don't think anyone ever attributes it to Ocelot's dad. Certainly no one in MGS 2, since that plot point hadn't happened yet.
FlashbladeGAF
Member
I think it's mentioned in the database.
Marty-esque
Member
So PW is mgs5 but they removed it from the title? Why?technically PW is 5.
5 tells the story of BB and how he turns into his own monster i guess.
V is its mirror with Venom at the helm. In that respect. It makes sense.
I know I'm days late, but thank you for this.
I wonder how the retcon of Liquid's arm came to be.
"Kojima, everyone thinks 'I live through this arm' is stupid."
"No no no, it's cool, I got this" *makes ocelot's dad into a medium*
"OK now it's less stupid but still. Let's forget that"
"No no no, It's cool, I got this" *makes ocelot have been pretending all the time"
"Kojima that is even worse. somehow you managed to make it even more stupid"
"No no no, it's cool, I got this" *releases the MGS4 database so both versions are right at the same time*
I assume Konami wasn't cool with the next numbered entry in their series to go to the PSP, which, while big in japan, wasn't as relevant outside, and the rest of the world is a bigger MGS fan than japan.
"Kojima, everyone thinks 'I live through this arm' is stupid."
"No no no, it's cool, I got this" *makes ocelot's dad into a medium*
"OK now it's less stupid but still. Let's forget that"
"No no no, It's cool, I got this" *makes ocelot have been pretending all the time"
"Kojima that is even worse. somehow you managed to make it even more stupid"
"No no no, it's cool, I got this" *releases the MGS4 database so both versions are right at the same time*
I assume Konami wasn't cool with the next numbered entry in their series to go to the PSP, which, while big in japan, wasn't as relevant outside, and the rest of the world is a bigger MGS fan than japan.
Konami convinced them to not make it 5. Since they wanted the "canon" of the story to remain on console. Kojima has stated several times tho, that MGS PW is MGS5.
Someone correct me if i am wrong.
"Nah Bro its cool I was only possessed by the arm for like a year, the rest of the time I was totes faking."
"Wat"
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