BLM protesters at Dartmouth College storm library and yell at people

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Kid Kamikaze10 said:
Ok. If you think this, then help out. Meet up with one of the local chapters online or off, and see if you can provide new, non-asinine ideas.

If it is really effective, I'm sure they would appreciate it.
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Can you prove the "effectiveness" of the current tactics?
What does effectiveness even mean?

I just don't see how hurling insults at college students trying to study is doing anything for them besides getting noticed. Which if that is their only goal, then i guess keep on trucking. i was just hoping there was some grander plan for change.

Disruptive can be an effective tactic. But, you should be disruptive in areas where it matters.

Sit ins were disruptive. But they served a point. They wanted to be able to sit there peacefully and have a meal. What was the point of the library protest? What change did they want to have happen?
 
Enzom21 said:
Of course he would believe shit from Breitbart:

See, the blacks turning to extremes was just a matter of time for him.
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No I already said that every group with good intentions will eventually run to the extremes. Look at Green Peace, Peta proabably started out as a well intentioned organization as well. It is just the nature of things. Whether you are fighting for social equality, environmental protection, or freedom of speech, you're message won't be heard until you start going to the extremes, and at that point the original idea will start to erode further and further.
 
akira28 said:
BLM just needs to be more respectable. Pull up their pants, stand up straight, stop whining so much, maybe someone will take them seriously.
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This kind of reductive nonsense really isn't helpful at all. Advocating that BLM scrutinize their tactics, establish a clear message, and utilize a PR firm to ensure that the message isn't distorted is a far cry from the sarcastic tripe that you're writing.

It's posts like yours that make me think that we progressives are our own worst enemy. Successful people, organizations, and movements possess the ability to objectively analyze their actions, identify faults or things that could be perceived as faults, and adjust accordingly. Instead, people like you simply disregard any opinion that you deem ideologically impure and respond with sarcasm, scorn, and a thinly-veiled accusation of racism to score points on a forum.
 
BearPawB said:
Can you prove the "effectiveness" of the current tactics?
What does effectiveness even mean?
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Yes. Due to BLM, police brutality is a notable topic in the election cycle. Police departments around the nation are having their methodologies questioned. And it has politically mobilized a lot of black people and other minorities. As seen in the colleges and streets.

I just don't see how hurling insults at college students trying to study is doing anything for them besides getting noticed. Which if that is their only goal, then i guess keep on trucking. i was just hoping there was some grander plan for change.
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So, what is your sample pool on this claim? Sounds like you're using one hazily reported incident to make a grandiose conclusion.
 
lenos16 said:
No I already said that every group with good intentions will eventually run to the extremes. Look at Green Peace, Peta proabably started out as a well intentioned organization as well. It is just the nature of things. Whether you are fighting for social equality, environmental protection, or freedom of speech, you're message won't be heard until you start going to the extremes, and at that point the original idea will start to erode further and further.
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You didn't mention shit about other groups, you wrote "good intentions."
BLM has not turned to extremes by the way.
 
Shao Kahn on the Lawn said:
This kind of reductive nonsense really isn't helpful at all. Advocating that BLM scrutinize their tactics, establish a clear message, and utilize a PR firm to ensure that the message isn't distorted is a far cry from the sarcastic tripe that you're writing.

It's posts like yours that make me think that we progressives are our own worst enemy. Successful people, organizations, and movements possess the ability to objectively analyze their actions, identify faults or things that could be perceived as faults, and adjust accordingly. Instead, people like you simply disregard any opinion that you deem ideologically impure and respond with sarcasm, scorn, and a thinly-veiled accusation of racism to score points on a forum.
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How is Black Lives Matter not a clear message?
 
I will say this and it comes as no surprise a black focused movement has to be +1 compared to other movements. No other movements get picked apart so hard. Par for the course for America.
 
Shao Kahn on the Lawn said:
This kind of reductive nonsense really isn't helpful at all. Advocating that BLM scrutinize their tactics, establish a clear message, and utilize a PR firm to ensure that the message isn't distorted is a far cry from the sarcastic tripe that you're writing.
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Tactic scrutiny is already being done within said circles. But different chapters have different ideas on what will work and what won't. It's not even confirmed that this incident had anything to do with the local chapter in New Hampshire, if there is one. But scrutiny isn't something they are afraid of.

The message has been made pretty clear a number of times by the main parts of BLM and affiliates, but different chapters have different more localized concerns.

And I agree that when it comes to modern movements, PR firms are very necessary. Especially to push back the predatory nature of some news sources.


Doesn't make the condescension displayed when protests are held any less ridiculous and echos of the past.
 
Slayven said:
I will say this and it comes as no surprise a black focused movement has to be +1 compared to other movements. No other movements get picked apart so hard. Par for the course for America.
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If Occupy got the level of scrutiny BLM gets regularly, it would have been dead on arrival, IMO.
 
Enzom21 said:
You didn't mention shit about other groups, you wrote "good intentions."
BLM has not turned to extremes by the way.
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I said "all" which included any group as far as I am aware of. Heck you can already see people in this thread debating the effectiveness of such methods. Medias also tend to only report sensationalized stories where something shocking has happened, there is no way to garner widespread attention to your cause beside going to the extremes. You either do something shocking or your message goes under in a wimper.
 
Prost said:
Protesters reportedly shouted “F– you, you filthy white f–-” “f– you and your comfort” and “f– you, you racist s–.”

Great way to make allies there.

"One woman was reportedly pinned to a wall by protesters who shouted “filthy white b–-” in her face."

wtfff
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Fighting racism with... racism. Alrighty then. You can't attack people who have done nothing and make any kind of point. Nor can you run around attacking people just because they are white and supposedly 'privileged' because of being white. It's bullshit, it's insulting and it's nonsense.
 
Occupy Wall Street isn't even a good barometer, they didn't get shit done. Maybe they should have been more like black movements. *sips tea*

BearPawB said:
Can you prove the "effectiveness" of the current tactics?
What does effectiveness even mean?
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We just had a democratic debate in which one area of focus was police brutality, black incarceration rates, among a few other things. You have republican candidates saying how evil they are, so you know what they're doing is effective as fuck.

But then again I would say of course what they're doing is working. While people who don't care only see what a few random BLM members going into libraries to protest. People who actually follow BLM know that there are many more doing town hall meetings, talking with their local representatives and meeting with presidential candidates. But that doesn't make the news and sites like Breibart. Only when other members are disruptive, then people who normally don't care about any of it suddenly are Civil Rights activists, scholars, and marched alongside MLK telling people how it SHOULD be done.

And I mean that's cool and all but JFK would be rolling in his grave if he saw how apathetic people are until it bothers them.
 
Kid Kamikaze10 said:
So, what is your sample pool on this claim? Sounds like you're using one hazily reported incident to make a grandiose conclusion.
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Ok, it's clear you don't want to actually discuss anything. I didn't say anything grandiose. There is nothing "hazy" about the videos from this library event.

I support BLM, I support the ideas behind BLM. I think it is an important and vital message.

I think yelling at random white people and calling them bitches is not a way to have anyone take you seriously, or do anything but fear you. No one wants to be yelled at, especially people who might actually agree with the cause, just because they happen to be white and in a library.

I get anger, I understand resentment. People just need to choose better targets.

But, I am out. So maybe realize how your own tone, and the way you talk down to people like children, pisses off people who believe in the same ideals and goals. And think about how to foster an environment of mutual respect and discussion, rather than your tone of constant dismissal and bitterness.

Angelus Errare said:
People who actually follow BLM know that there are many more doing town hall meetings, talking with their local representatives and meeting with presidential candidates. But that doesn't make the news and sites like Breibart. Only when other members are disruptive, then people who normally don't care about any of it suddenly are Civil Rights activists, scholars, and marched alongside MLK telling people how it SHOULD be done.

And I mean that's cool and all but JFK would be rolling in his grave if he saw how apathetic people are until it bothers them.
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Then i would argue that you agree that you think these types of events as mentioned in the OP are not helping, because they are masking the true good work so many of the members are doing?
 
What were those students chanting? Didn't catch it from the video.

Edit: we have counter protesters to this crazy Baptist evangelical man on campus. He's obnoxious but at least he can keep spouting different thoughts and biblical verses. The students just shout the same three chants over and over. Such repition is not a good look IMO.
 
whitney_receipts.gif

not buying it.
 
Slayven said:
How is Black Lives Matter not a clear message?
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"Black Lives Matter" is an effective slogan, not a message. Use President Obama's campaign as an example: "Change We Can Believe In" and "Yes We Can" were his slogans but they were only vehicles that allowed him to deliver his campaign messages and the discipline with which they handled that delivery is something to aspire to.

An effective rhetorical message contains clear, concise prescriptions to perceived problems that the organization wishes to address and is conveyed in a reliable, consistent way that is managed by professionals. Black Lives Matter gets the attention but there has to be something after it. The slogan isn't the message.
 
Shao Kahn on the Lawn said:
"Black Lives Matter" is an effective slogan, not a message. Use President Obama's campaign as an example: "Change We Can Believe In" and "Yes We Can" were his slogans but they were a vehicle to deliver his campaign messages and the discipline with which they handled that delivery is something to aspire to.

An effective rhetorical message contains clear, concise prescriptions to perceived problems that the organization wishes to address and is conveyed in a reliable, consistent way that is managed by professionals.

Black Lives Matter gets the attention but there has to be something after it. The slogan isn't the message.
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Slayven said:
http://www.joincampaignzero.org/#vision

http://www.wetheprotesters.org/
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.
 
Shao Kahn on the Lawn said:
It's posts like yours that make me think that we progressives are our own worst enemy. Successful people, organizations, and movements possess the ability to objectively analyze their actions, identify faults or things that could be perceived as faults, and adjust accordingly. Instead, people like you simply disregard any opinion that you deem ideologically impure and respond with sarcasm, scorn, and a thinly-veiled accusation of racism to score points on a forum.
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yay. forum points. again. eventually I will trade all these points in for a cup of coffee and a maybe a leftover fuck if anyone has any left to give.

your criticisms can be reduced and disregarded just as easily and freely as you issue them.
 
AnathemicOne said:
Darn studying students are the real enemy against minority oppression, fighting dat gewd fight.
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White students at an ivy league institution? Absolutely they're the enemy. It's those elites that are the future propogaters of insitutional racism and white supremacy.
 
cashman said:
White students at an ivy league institution? Absolutely they're the enemy. It's those elites that are the future propogaters of insitutional racism and white supremacy.
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Is this a joke?

Because they are white and go to Dartmouth that automatically means they are an elitist/racist/supremacist?

How on earth do you jump to that conclusion?
 
BearPawB said:
Then i would argue that you agree that you think these types of events as mentioned in the OP are not helping, because they are masking the true good work so many of the members are doing?
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Most of us are in agreement, where we disagree is that many of you seem to be under the disillusion that black people are a hivemind and that by simply having this ever nebulous "leader", BLM would be super cordial and would be opening the doors for people while they hand them coffee and tell them to have a great day, as they form protest circles in designated safe spots (spots picked by the "offended") to hold hands and sing kumbaya. And the ghost of MLK will appear and give them a thumbs up and say "You're doing it the right way now!"
 
cashman said:
White students at an ivy league institution? Absolutely they're the enemy. It's those elites that are the future propogaters of insitutional racism and white supremacy.
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And this is where you lose me. I'm white. I study at my university library all the time. I support what BLM is trying to do. Am I still the enemy?

What a ridiculous generalization.
 
Whom_Gods_Annoy said:
And this is where you lose me. I'm white. I study at my university library all the time. I support what BLM is trying to do. Am I still the enemy?

What a ridiculous generalization.
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are you headed for a C suite in a Fortune 500 company in a few years out of college, after a cursory "internship"? you might be enemy then.
 
Won't comment on some of the claims that aren't backed up with video, but I'm a bit confused why one of the protesters would feel the need to flip the bird to the person filming the YouTube video. Isn't exposure the goal?


edit: I guess it's silly to speculate on that without knowing what else the cameraman was doing.
 
If you read the article in the OP, you would assume that only black people were at this event in the library. It was a coalition of men and women of all racial backgrounds. It's a bias article at best.

They feel as though that this is an issue and want to inform people about it. I'm not against it. If they tried conventional means, they would have as much popularity as media outlets informing people about a massacre in Beirut or Kenya.
 
Angelus Errare said:
Not sure why anyone would even be mad at that, everyone keeps saying BLM should be more like MLK.

MLK blocked highways.
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Because it is still disrupting the lives of innocent people who have done nothing. I should not have to stop my world and feel guilty just because I'm white. I support the general theme of the message and I understand it. But I don't support acts like this.
 
ironcreed said:
Because it is still disrupting the lives of innocent people who have done nothing. I should not have to stop my world and feel guilty just because I'm white. I support the general theme of the message and I understand it. But I don't support acts like this.
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You don't support acts like blocking highways or interrupting people at a library?
 
Dangansona said:
Because then you would be The Man.
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Even worse, maybe The Cis Man.

akira28 said:
are you headed for a C suite in a Fortune 500 company in a few years out of college, after a cursory "internship"? you might be enemy then.
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Wouldn't these protesters who are also students, be headed to the same C suite after an internship too?

ETA- Based on what I've read, it seems unlikely all the stuff happened. One study group was interrupted by their adviser and berated for not joining the protest. Another was shouted at until they were in tears and then followed out outside to be berated some more. Sounds like a lot of bs.
 
ironcreed said:
Because it is still disrupting the lives of innocent people who have done nothing. I should not have to stop my world and feel guilty just because I'm white. I support the general theme of the message and I understand it. But I don't support acts like this.
Click to expand...

Make up your minds people, be more like MLK, don't be like MLK.

LRMWY1H.gif
 
ironcreed said:
Because it is still disrupting the lives of innocent people who have done nothing. I should not have to stop my world and feel guilty just because I'm white. I support the general theme of the message and I understand it. But I don't support acts like this.
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If you feel guilty that's on you. No one is trying to make you feel that way.
 
Shao Kahn on the Lawn said:
It's posts like yours that make me think that we progressives are our own worst enemy. Successful people, organizations, and movements possess the ability to objectively analyze their actions, identify faults or things that could be perceived as faults, and adjust accordingly. Instead, people like you simply disregard any opinion that you deem ideologically impure and respond with sarcasm, scorn, and a thinly-veiled accusation of racism to score points on a forum.
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You're not alone.
 
Yeah these dumbasses give BLM a bad look. Completely against the solidarity the movement is trying to foster.

EDIT: Before I'm misconstrued, I support them taking their message to places people wouldn't expect, like study halls or libraries such as in this case, or blocking road traffic. People tend to think they're "safe" from the reality of the message of these protests outside of very specific locations, which makes them care less about them.

OTOH, you don't just go off at the mouth calling people "white bitches" and "fucks" when they've done nothing to you as an individual. You can get people's attention and address imbalances of privilege (yeesh I hate that word) without antagonizing them as individuals, even if they indirectly benefit from systemic processes more than others.
 
Angelus Errare said:
Make up your minds people, be more like MLK, don't be like MLK.

LRMWY1H.gif
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By all means, spread the message. But do it in a way that does not interfere with the lives of others who have done nothing. Do it in a way that does not involve doing the same kinds of things you are protesting against. It's pretty simple.
 
ironcreed said:
By all means, spread the message. But do it in a way that does not interfere with the lives of others who have done nothing. Do it in a way that does not involve doing the same kinds of things you are protesting against. It's pretty simple.
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Explain what they should be doing then, please.
 
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