Andodalf
Banned
The motherboard is the majority of the cost. That's the whole APU (CPU and GPU) ram, and the other processing chips/ encoders and whatnot.
PS4K information (~2x GPU power w/ clock+, new CPU, price, tent. Q1 2017)
- Thread starter OsirisBlack
- Start date
The motherboard is the majority of the cost. That's the whole APU (CPU and GPU) ram, and the other processing chips/ encoders and whatnot.
So most 3rd party games... and 1st party games. XD
SmiteOfHand
Member
Yes, and you and those people are wrong. You have misread the situation entirely. Nothing is being gimped. Read OsirisBlack's post on the previous page.
SolarMystic
Member
If that's how it ends up working, then that's good and the fallout isn't necessary. I'd be on board for something like that potentially. How do you ensure that 3rd party developers don't gimp the regular ps4 version though? As we've seen with the current gen, a lot devs use the extra power to cram in better graphics over resolution and fps. If the game is already running 1080p/30fps on ps4k, there wouldn't be a lot of room to downgrade with resolution and fps alone.
OmegaDL50
Member
As I said I will wait and see a official confirmation from Sony directly.
The article from Kotaku might be correct about some things such as a standard PS4 that enables 4K for Blurays and basic upscaling features, yes but a total overhaul of the system hardware for the possibility of 4K native games, when even the most powerful graphics cards on the market even have trouble at this resolution at a consistent 60fps.
Even I can see the merit for the humor in using an article and rolling with it to construct an April Fools thread. The timing is convenient for one thing.
But as I said, I'm neutral about this whole thing. Sony comes out and makes an announcement with the details. Fine, I save money up and eventually buy it.
Either way it makes no difference to me. I'm either getting an upgraded PS4 soon in the future, or I'm not. It's clearly that simple, nothing more, nothing less.
timmyp53
Member
He didn't think this through.
Budgets going up compared to previous gen didn't help... and that the process of updating/upgrading the engine of most of their SCE WW studios.
GlamFM
Banned
Read the OP at least.
That's not really what makes people upset.
I still play my NES and even Game & Watch games, and every other console released since then.
However, there are people that purchased PS4 when PSVR was announced because they were enticed at the prospect of console VR experiences. Those people will now have to buy new hardware to get the fully baked PSVR experience. It's one thing if the two devices were announced together, but it's another to stagger the announcements in the way that Sony is doing now. People who gravitated to the PS4 specifically for the promise of PSVR and who weren't interested in the rest of the PS4 library (because it's available elsewhere) are kinda screwed over.
Rather than having small experimental PSVR software that is tailored to hardware that everyone can enjoy, we are probably going to see fuller games that have PSVR support only on new hardware with regular non-VR gameplay for everyone else - even for those that have PSVR headsets.
I guarantee you that a lot of this outrage would have been mitigated had the new hardware and the VR project been announced together.
This could have been handled a lot better by Sony if they spoke about this project earlier on.
thetester77
Member
Hope to hear the extra info you have but understand you doing your checks 1st.
(Just don't post the info tomorrow as its the 1st April as you're info will be discredited by many so today would be good
)FiveMinuteHero
Member
Lets take FF15 as an example.
FF15 runs pretty badly on a normal PS4 @ 1080p
PS4K will have a GPU twice as powerful, which means FF15 will run ok on a PS4 @ 1080p.
But how will FF15 run at 4K on a PS4?
Probably worse than what a normal PS4 manages to do with FF15 at 1080p.
Guess might as well skip on this one and wait for PS4.6.
FF15 runs pretty badly on a normal PS4 @ 1080p
PS4K will have a GPU twice as powerful, which means FF15 will run ok on a PS4 @ 1080p.
But how will FF15 run at 4K on a PS4?
Probably worse than what a normal PS4 manages to do with FF15 at 1080p.
Guess might as well skip on this one and wait for PS4.6.
If OsirisBlack is anything to go by... @FiveMinuteHero doesn't seem to understand the principle of how PC games work when they have open architectures and scalable specs.
OT. I never understood this thing about April fool. Seriously. I'm quite humorist but I always found this tradition a pure idiocy and never get what is it funny about it.
I dont care about 4K. Not really vested in FPS for normal games or that it may have extra effects over the launch system. What kills me is my anticipation for PSVR and how it may (will likely) affect those games. All the talk/rumors seem to indicate PS4K will be the optimal system for it. I get it, the PS4 may be barely competent but I still feel slighted. Could partly be because I feel that with the PS4 Ive just been waiting. Waiting for the core games/franchises/new stuff from the larger first parties, etc... but especially waiting for Morpheus/PSVR, and now that the wait is almost over, BAM!, new system. With all that, I have decided to take a break from PS4, sold it last night along with most of my games. As well as some older systems and games. Currently deciding what to do with my PSVR preorder. On one hand, I think Sony is going to have the bigger games but on the other, the money I got from selling my PS4 put both the Rift and Vive on the table sooner rather than later.
It is upscaled 4K, not native 4K.
Dr. Zoidberg
Member
I think a lot of them understand, but from the thread it appears that many gamers bought the PS4 because that console had the best hardware and was therefore the best place to play 3rd party games. That will no longer be the case when the PS4K comes out and as a result they feel cheated and angry.
While it's true that the PS4 will get the same games, and the PS4 is no less powerful than it was before, these things don't exist in a vacuum. There are always comparisons, and it seems many of these people have a problem with perceiving their existing console and/or it's games as inferior or "gimped". Many simply won't be able to enjoy the games as much if they know that the PS4K is able to play them better. A lot of it is mental. Every frame hitch or sub-1080 game will be blamed on devs not optimizing for PS4, etc. To avoid this, they will feel "forced' to upgrade even though the only one forcing them is themselves because they can't deal with having a lesser experience.
Now, someone is thinking, "PC's always better, why don't they just buy a PC" which is true, and some people will do that. But in many console gamer's minds, PC and Consoles are still apples and oranges, whether it's true or not. They don't care if the PC version is better, but they WILL care if PS4K is better than their PS4 and it will hurt their experience unless they fork out the dough for the new one.
this is some concern trolling, right?
Exactly. If anything the opposite will happen and PS4 will be be the LCD while the PS4k will get ports that don't quite take advantage of the hardware. This inferiority complex is something to watch.
TheSlySoul
Member
That is my biggest issue as well.
If they announced PS4K and PSVR together saying you will need both for the best experience, I would be less pissed about it.
Mostly been thinking about getting a gaming setup ready for VR but I am thinking of just getting a PC since it feels more future-proof.
Could care less about 4K, but there is no way games are going to be built with old PS4 in mind. I do not like the fact that games are going to be pretty awful when designed with PS4K in mind.
FiveMinuteHero
Member
You mean they won't make native 4K games for PS4K?
it will if they move to an iterative console going forward. ps4 and ps4k now. when ps5 comes out support for new games is dropped on ps4 while ps4k keeps getting supported. then when ps5.5 comes out ps4k is dropped. each console gets a 6-7 year life of support.
this would give you some options when a new console comes out. when ps4k comes out you can upgrade and get the most powerful console, or buy/keep a ps4. then when ps5 comes out, if you kept a ps4 you can upgrade to ps4k for cheaper or move up to ps5, like you would have if ps4k didn't exist. some would upgrade with every system, some will wait for new systems to drop price, some will only upgrade when they have to. this move would give everyone more options.
FiveMinuteHero
Member
So I've calmed down a bit since reading this last night, and I realize my earlier comments were somewhat hyperbolic and ill-informed. The gap doesn't seem as large as I thought, and PS4 games will likely still look and run OK on the OG PS4 (hopefully). I'd still rather consoles stay as they are and provide me with the life cycle I expect, but I'm willing to take a wait and see approach with this before condemning it. One thing that could bring me over to the "dark side" so to speak, and actually want one of these things would be if most games could run at 60FPS. If I could get 60 in most games by upgrading my console every few years, I might be willing to upgrade providing prices remain reasonable, and places like GameStop and Best Buy have good trade in deals. Anyone think there's any chance of this happening?
OmegaDL50
Member
I did. I misspoke. I understand there will be some minor sacrifices for some software parity such as current PS4 games still running on the hardware but slightly unoptimized, as according to OsirisBlack's information, devs would concentrate getting games to work on the PS4K as a baseline first and foremost.
For all I know the PS4K could just be a prototype name, but the 4K nomenclature would give general public of buyers an impression that sort of device would be 4K ready in all aspects.
Although that doesn't mean Native 4K games aren't an impossibility, such as simple stuff like Terraria or maybe a 4K version of Stardew Valley.
It's about having expectations and knowing the benefit of what to expect.
Of course the biggest thing is the PS4K taking better advantage of the PSVR compared to the standard PS4 being limited in that regard. That would be acceptable, after all more powerful console should naturally be able to do more powerful things, makes sense.
Thank you!
Indie stuff probably and maybe some titles that are not graphically heavy but 1st Party at 4k is PS5 territory.
GatticusFinch
Member
Very much doubt it. A $500 console isn't going to be able to run native 4k games very well when you have $700+ GPUs that still struggle to run 4k at 30 fps.
Surprised no one's seeing the positives here. If you've not invested in this gen yet you get a better box for a reasonable price that's a lot more future proof as far as 4K video content goes.
AND I think the big takeaway here is that the new console plus PSVR will offer a very comparable level of VR against Oculus/Vive recommended specs and still only for a fraction of the cost of PC VR when you include the system to run the headset from. All wrapped up in console simplicity etc.
Yeah early adopters have a justification to be a bit pissed but you'll still get a significant upgrade and once you take off PS4 trade in price will be relatively affordable for those who want to jump in, PLUS all your already owned games work guaranteed, this isnt like an old fashioned new generation where you start from scratch again.
I definitely think satisfied customers will outweigh the aggrieved ones.
AND I think the big takeaway here is that the new console plus PSVR will offer a very comparable level of VR against Oculus/Vive recommended specs and still only for a fraction of the cost of PC VR when you include the system to run the headset from. All wrapped up in console simplicity etc.
Yeah early adopters have a justification to be a bit pissed but you'll still get a significant upgrade and once you take off PS4 trade in price will be relatively affordable for those who want to jump in, PLUS all your already owned games work guaranteed, this isnt like an old fashioned new generation where you start from scratch again.
I definitely think satisfied customers will outweigh the aggrieved ones.
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
As expected. Good stuff!!
FiveMinuteHero
Member
Ah well, that's ok then. I don't need a new TV as I am happy with my 1080p, and I don't care for 4K TV content. Or PSVR.
TheSlySoul
Member
If that is the way it goes, then I can see it being fine.
However, history has a way of developers just optimizing the newest tech and leaving the rest behind. It will really depend if Xbox gets a 1.5 or not.
Wether PS4K was a thing or not, then yes your PS4 that you've barely used was a useless purchase.
Some of these posts are laughable.
HF2014
Member
Well i simply hopes visual will look the same on both console. If one is 4k 60fps, and the other look the same, no texture degrading, no field of view degrading, and it can remain 30fps , might swallow it better. I hope developpers will have to make sure it look the same, minus the resolution change. I just dont want to see medium settings on PS4 and ultra settings on PS4K.
Sounds interesting. Has potential. But I'd prefer it if it were just PS5 and came about a bit later next year.
I'm a big PC critic who left PC gaming for about 12 years, but came back last August. Things are definitely better now, but only really if you buy a pre-built PC. Building your own makes it ten times the work and stress (though of course far cheaper).
Every game that releases today: yes. I do every day. Played all of SOMA, Assassin's Creed Syndicate and Mad Max like that. Was great.
Most games from the last 10-15 years: yes, with a little bit of work (download/install a program to make it think the DS4 is an X360 controller, then play with almost no issues.)
Games from before 1996/1997: Nyehhhh. Yes, but lots of work.
I've played the Division and Rainbow Six Siege on PC with a controller a lot and not noticed too much. IMO a controller is 85% as good as KBM and strategy/clever play wins out the majority of the time.
Very little. I only update once every couple of months, and when I do I just click on the 'GeForce Experience', click 'Upgrade driver', click on 'Express install', then it's done in about a minute.
I'm a big PC critic who left PC gaming for about 12 years, but came back last August. Things are definitely better now, but only really if you buy a pre-built PC. Building your own makes it ten times the work and stress (though of course far cheaper).
Every game that releases today: yes. I do every day. Played all of SOMA, Assassin's Creed Syndicate and Mad Max like that. Was great.
Most games from the last 10-15 years: yes, with a little bit of work (download/install a program to make it think the DS4 is an X360 controller, then play with almost no issues.)
Games from before 1996/1997: Nyehhhh. Yes, but lots of work.
I've played the Division and Rainbow Six Siege on PC with a controller a lot and not noticed too much. IMO a controller is 85% as good as KBM and strategy/clever play wins out the majority of the time.
Very little. I only update once every couple of months, and when I do I just click on the 'GeForce Experience', click 'Upgrade driver', click on 'Express install', then it's done in about a minute.
Well yeah, PS4k will eventually start selling when it replaces the OGPS4, but that's not happening until the PS5 is out. So until then, most people will be buying the original PS4.
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
Right. Its getting upset over something that hasn't even happened.
And the point was everything around you is replaced with updated versions. Why should consoles be off limits?
joecanada
Member
thanks for clarifying. Obvious but there's a bunch of people in this thread who just want to complain about anything they can grasp onto.
OmegaDL50
Member
Well considering how relatively brief in terms of console life Sony would bring out a 4K version of the console, rather than waiting a few years and going full 4K with a PS5, would probably suggest that this console generation might last longer then some people anticipate.
Just looking at the overall bigger picture here. I mean who wants to deal with iPhone pricing models, and a new revision of the PS4 happens every 3 to 4 years? Would such a thing be unsustainable for console level hardware?
Although to be fair, some Enthusiasts already do with with PC hardware, replacing their graphics card to the current best for each generational release.
I suppose an Enthusiast console market would be an interesting precedent, no?
thetester77
Member
April Fools is called April fools for a reason - its on the 1st April or maybe its just clickbait like Kotaku for the advertisment $$
I believe the rumours are true - to what extent Sony go to I will wait and see, but it wouldn't be uncommon for Sony to refresh their hardware for a slim model and with 4K HDR specs and UHD Blu ray being finalised I'm not surprised that Sony would want to include these in the refresh as they have always tried to push CD/DVD/Blu Ray and can't afford to wait for PS5.
They also have their own UHD Streaming Store that just launched on Bravia TV's and they will want to push this too.
I still think the motivation was around Media and they have taken that opportunity to make some addional resources available mainly so they stay competitive with Vive and Oculus.
So the theory is good, the trouble is the marketing and not to confuse average Joe.
Do you know if the 4k is being built as a 60fps target with PS4 remaining 30? I feel like Sony will want to implement some sort of standards for this to make sure the PS4 doesn't get forgotten.
This maybe an early April Fools joke. Especially with new that Deep Down is still alive as a game release.
Beaten.
Beaten.
Its not. Deep down is known to still be in development.
joecanada
Member
this is a great business plan. better to kind of ease people into base models and Plus models so that it is more seamless from one to the other, instead of suddenly everyone jumping ship to a new gen, I wish I could play bf4 with my friend on ps4 but he doesn't have one yet.... so I still play on ps3 sometimes. by the time he gets a ps4 I'll probably have a PS4K which is way better.
This is what I want to know as well.