2016 PC Screenshot Thread of No Compromises
- Thread starter Stallion Free
- Start date
When I take any sample of shots on Flickr that use watermarks, I find more examples of shitty stuff than good. But that is subjective. As is my dislike of watermarks. However, if you're serious about protecting 'your' stuff, consider these (and many others like them):
https://www.digimarc.com/
http://plumamazing.com/iphoneipad/iwatermark-pro/
The company in the first link actively scans the internet for people using your shots. Of course, it'll cost you. But if you're a professional screenshotter, that stuff is tax-deductible.
Visible watermarking makes me retch. I'm not ashamed to admit it. And when it comes to esthetics, my retching is as valid as your right to keep doing what causes it.
EDIT: I'm not telling you what to do. I'm telling you what I think of what you do. It's your right to ignore it. But I envision a future where anyone will superimpose watermarks over their shots. I want to avoid that future, if I can. If my desire is enough to make you act all offended ('Thanks.'), so be it. That wasn't my goal and I hope you won't attempt to imply it.
https://www.digimarc.com/
http://plumamazing.com/iphoneipad/iwatermark-pro/
The company in the first link actively scans the internet for people using your shots. Of course, it'll cost you. But if you're a professional screenshotter, that stuff is tax-deductible.
Visible watermarking makes me retch. I'm not ashamed to admit it. And when it comes to esthetics, my retching is as valid as your right to keep doing what causes it.
EDIT: I'm not telling you what to do. I'm telling you what I think of what you do. It's your right to ignore it. But I envision a future where anyone will superimpose watermarks over their shots. I want to avoid that future, if I can. If my desire is enough to make you act all offended ('Thanks.'), so be it. That wasn't my goal and I hope you won't attempt to imply it.
I'm just happy that other people are enjoying the shots, regardless of who they think is the creator or originator. But if anyone wants to watermark their thing, it's their prerogative, although I'd prefer to have it without it.
(Not related to watermark conversation): In general, I like when screenshotting people are happy, positive, and constructive people. I don't like when people keep things to themselves, are suspicious about other people, or refuse to share knowledge, tools, and art. It's not a competition, I'd say.
(Not related to watermark conversation): In general, I like when screenshotting people are happy, positive, and constructive people. I don't like when people keep things to themselves, are suspicious about other people, or refuse to share knowledge, tools, and art. It's not a competition, I'd say.
Ditto, each to his own. Whether you think it's tacky or whether you think it detracts from the image, (which I think is bit of an exaggeration because it's hardly noticeable, well for me it isn't anyway since by the time I've scrolled down I've already seen most of the image. But yeah if you're going to go that route, I'd definitely prefer to see an entirely clean image or smaller watermark if I'm blowing it up full size), there are people out there like Otis who don't want someone lapping up all the praise for a screenshot that simply does not belong to them. Someone I follow on Flickr, a brilliant screenshotter (whom some of you guys on here know too), had one of his images stolen (a really beautiful shot too) by a Steam user not long ago. It pissed him off enough that he contacted the user and threatened to take action unless he took the screenshot down. Whether you're making a living out of this or not would you want 1000+ odd people praising Joe Blow for a screenshot that you know you took..wouldn't it grate just a little? Granted, most of us aren't creating works of art here but as Alo81 said, some people have more pride in what they do, especially if you've also added some effects to the shot such as OtisFX which also happens to be something he spent many hours creating.
Edit: At the end of the day it's a valid argument both ways imo because a watermark can be removed..if you know how.
Far Cry 4
"WTF are you guys still arguing about?
CyberPunked
Member
Yeah, because it's so difficult to remove a tiny watermark.
I'm not saying you shouldn't ask people to take down a shot of yours they're claiming to be theirs. I've done similarly, often, until I stopped seeing the merit in it. Too much hassle. Also, contrary to Frans I don't intend to become a professional as I don't quite have what it takes.
Also, I don't get it why every time you bring up something concerning anything you don't agree with, you're instantly branded as unconstructive. What the hell is up with that? Why the long toes?
I never said Frans/Otis shouldn't be allowed to do what he wanted, nor did I say he was an asshole for doing so. I'm saying I'd hate to see any shot's appeal marred by a watermark, no matter how tiny. Also, there are other, better options, which I've linked. But okay then, I'll shut up. I'm obviously not a positive, constructive, sharing kind of guy.
(I removed the watermark in the shot above. My point was made.)
Also, I don't get it why every time you bring up something concerning anything you don't agree with, you're instantly branded as unconstructive. What the hell is up with that? Why the long toes?
I never said Frans/Otis shouldn't be allowed to do what he wanted, nor did I say he was an asshole for doing so. I'm saying I'd hate to see any shot's appeal marred by a watermark, no matter how tiny. Also, there are other, better options, which I've linked. But okay then, I'll shut up. I'm obviously not a positive, constructive, sharing kind of guy.
(I removed the watermark in the shot above. My point was made.)
CyberPunked
Member
I'm not saying you shouldn't ask people to take down a shot of yours they're claiming to be theirs. I've done similarly, often, until I stopped seeing the merit in it. Too much hassle. Also, contrary to Frans I don't intend to become a professional as I don't quite have what it takes.
Also, I don't get it why every time you bring up something concerning anything you don't agree with, you're instantly branded as unconstructive. What the hell is up with that? Why the long toes?
I never said Frans/Otis shouldn't be allowed to do what he wanted, nor did I say he was an asshole for doing so. I'm saying I'd hate to see any shot's appeal marred by a watermark, no matter how tiny. Also, there are other, better options, which I've linked. But okay then, I'll shut up. I'm obviously not a positive, constructive, sharing kind of guy.
Here we go.
Also, there have been numerous complaints about HUDs and low res shots, which in the end have led to something called the Bullshot Thread. I know it's a useless fight to ask people to post mostly shots that make you stop for a moment and gaze in wonder, so yeah, I've stopped doing that. I guess visible watermarks is just that one thing to push me over the edge. Watchout people, I'ma flip!
The Janitor
Member
I'm not saying you shouldn't ask people to take down a shot of yours they're claiming to be theirs. I've done similarly, often, until I stopped seeing the merit in it. Too much hassle. Also, contrary to Frans I don't intend to become a professional as I don't quite have what it takes.
Also, I don't get it why every time you bring up something concerning anything you don't agree with, you're instantly branded as unconstructive. What the hell is up with that? Why the long toes?
I never said Frans/Otis shouldn't be allowed to do what he wanted, nor did I say he was an asshole for doing so. I'm saying I'd hate to see any shot's appeal marred by a watermark, no matter how tiny. Also, there are other, better options, which I've linked. But okay then, I'll shut up. I'm obviously not a positive, constructive, sharing kind of guy.
That is clearly my shot you have stolen!
sorry I had to 
Garrett Hawke
Member
I would imagine there isn't all that much crossover between the type who steals screenshots and the type who knows how to use photoshop.
Still, let people do what they want with their own screenshots. It's not a big deal in any way and it doesn't affect anyone else or get in the way of this thread, unlike the half page of posts that this conversation has caused :/
Where did I say I want to become a professional? I just post some shots here, which happen to have a tiny mark in them, that's it. Apparently it has to be explained, I do so, and it's a problem.
I'm sorry, but why all the drama about a tiny mark in shots from soneone else? No drama whatsoever about (IMHO) far worse issues with shots here, but oh, the horror someone posted a shot with a watermark!
I didn't say you were unconstructive, I just find it a silly debate. And I'm sorry, but you're telling me I have long toes while you and friends are going on and on (with 'funny picture'!) about a tiny mark in *my* pictures and then I have long toes haha
. I mean, look at what you wrote up above and the picture you posted. Then ask you: all of that because you, a grown man, ran into a shot with a mark. I'm sorry, but aren't you overreacting a bit? If you want to give criticism, I'm all ears, but I'd expect criticism to be about how to make shots better, but it's about tiny details in far corners. It's nothing new people don't like watermarks in pictures. It's also nothing new people don't like copyright statements in large pieces of code, or the license things can be used, and cook up the most insane reasons the original creator is acting silly.
Frankly, that's too bad, but c'est la vie.
I don't think I said that, but whatever. That the mark apparently makes you lose sleep is clear.
GroinShooter
Member
therealminime
Member
Good .gif, good .gif
Was it necessary to post your screenshots mocking Otis? The watermark in the center of your shots in red.. his in the left bottom corner and with what appears to be a very low opacity. I don't understand what your point is there. You made your point when you gave him the links.
Such a long discussion over something so trivial.
Yeah..back to images. More Quantum Break hopefully because the tech looks really impressive.
jim2point0
Banned
I've always wished there was a rule against it in the OP. It's so balls-to-the-wall silly that I can't understand any argument defending it. I mean these are screenshots...
Photographers watermark their stuff because there is a LOT of work that goes into photography. Cameras and lenses are crap I know absolutely nothing about. And if you hiked to the top of a mountain, climbed a damn tree, then waited until sunrise to get the perfect shot from the best angle possible, then I can understand a watermark. Photographers can't fly through the air, freeze the world, then manipulate the sun in order to get perfect compositions of a world that was designed by someone else.
So comparing game screenshots to something like photography is something I always find amusing... regardless as to how much work you think you've put into a screenshot.
Dictator93
Member
I'm not mocking Otis, GavinUK86. There's nothing to gain in that. I'm making a point by hyperbole. For some people my watermarks are eyecancer-inducing, for some people Otis's are, even if they're small. Aliasing is small and some people don't mind seeing it, either. That doesn't stop me from pointing people to solutions to help combat aliasing. I've never once said Otis can't do what he wants. Not even once. I'm pointing out what I don't like seeing (and I'm sure I'm not alone even if my opposition is currently more vocal), and I've offered some valid alternatives to visual watermarking. For me, visual watermarking is akin to shouting 'This content copyright by me' at the start or end of every song, or plastering a watermark over every frame of a film. I don't like it. That's not being petty. God damn.
EDIT: Nick, I'm not mocking Otis. If anything, I'm mocking watermarks on shots. Read my reply to Gavin's removed response above. Everybody, stop taking stuff so personal and stop acting so crazy defensive. Or go ahead, if that makes you feel better.
EDIT: Nick, I'm not mocking Otis. If anything, I'm mocking watermarks on shots. Read my reply to Gavin's removed response above. Everybody, stop taking stuff so personal and stop acting so crazy defensive. Or go ahead, if that makes you feel better.
jim2point0
Banned
Of course. You didn't know? People are rising to fame and fortune on IMGUR with other peoples' screenshots.
^^ A little picture I just made in photoshop
Watermark your stuff guys. Screenshots is serious business.
Can you imagine if everyone here watermarked their shots? The thread would look like a portfolio for people showing off themselves rather than the art in the games... which was what I always thought the point of taking screenshots was in the first place. Anywho, that's the last I'll say on it....
You offered alternatives, and you offered mocking images, you stated my mark makes you retch, and it's eyecancer inducing. I don't know man, that's a lot when you consider it's a 27pixel high image of my name blended with 25% opacity. If my name blended with 25% opacity at 2.25% of the vertical resolution on the picture gets you worked up like that you spend all that time replying here, then I have to wonder: why.
I know about the alternatives, I know removing a tiny name at the bottom is easy. If people want to go through great lengths, they'll do that. That's not why I added the marks, you know the reasons, I gave them in an earlier post. That you disagree with them, that's OK.
But sorry, don't come to me you're seriously offended by a 25% opacity blended name which is 2.25% of the height of the shot. SO much offended you spent considerable time arguing it's so utterly bad, and that you meant it as constructive criticism. Of course you're not offended at all, it was all a joke or whatever. I don't know man, I just post shots I take from games with a tiny name in the corner. Scroll passed them if you don't like them, ignore me on the forum if you want. What you posted here is just immature nonsense.
Anyway, it's not my first day on the internet, far from it, and sometimes people just flip and things like this occur. People jump in, have their fun, everybody has a good laugh and that's it. At least, it should. But looking at the posts now, I see the moaning still continues, by the usual suspects. Guys, the time spent on dicking around about a 25% opacity blended image of a pity little 27pixels, you could also create some shots and please the rest of the audience.
Well, perhaps you are not encumbered with copyright law, but yeah, it is copyright by me, like your shots are copyright by you. I added it to the picture, it's my right to do so, like it's your right not to add them to your shots.
As the person whose pictures started this little whining, I can say, yes I felt you mocked me and what I in all seriousness had said. I'm too old for internet flame wars, after more than 25 years of usenet one reaches the point where lameness such as this isn't worth the time and I can't share your fun and games with this.
Garrett Hawke
Member
Pretty much. It was a tiny watermark on their own screenshots lol. They are free to do whatever they want to their screenshots and I doubt a watermark is going to ruin someone else's day, while this pointless arguing maybe has.
Who is flaming who now? Don't make this into more than it is. I could just as easily state that I feel offended whenever my stating what I feel is made out to be more than what it is. But I'm not offended, even if I feel passive aggressive self-victimization is totally uncalled for.
No, this isn't me joking around: I'm speaking my mind on what I think of watermarks. That is it. Similar arguments have been made concerning HUD shots, or cutscene shots. I never said I didn't like any shot whatsoever (not that I think that's somehow uncalled for either). I only said I don't like watermarks, however transparent, however small. Anywhere. Screenshotting is something I feel passionately about, yeah. I spend hours upon hours doing it, because I like the continuing evolution of game art. If you think passion can only be expressed positively, I don't get that. I simply state how I (negatively) feel about a given practice. I've never said Otis makes me retch. I'm not forcing anyone to do anything. I'm stating my opinion. Clearly.
And for some reason, I can't use wit to underline how I seriously feel either? Come on. People are so easily offended these days. The right to take offense, I've heard people call it. Well, be my guest, be offended. I have no inclination to retract anything I've posted, as none of it is meant to offend. And if anyone reading something they don't care for on a screenshot thread? Have patience, it'll soon be relegated to oblivion anyways. That's it for me. If anyone wants to take this up via PM, that's fine by me.
EDIT (keep forgetting to add shots):
No, this isn't me joking around: I'm speaking my mind on what I think of watermarks. That is it. Similar arguments have been made concerning HUD shots, or cutscene shots. I never said I didn't like any shot whatsoever (not that I think that's somehow uncalled for either). I only said I don't like watermarks, however transparent, however small. Anywhere. Screenshotting is something I feel passionately about, yeah. I spend hours upon hours doing it, because I like the continuing evolution of game art. If you think passion can only be expressed positively, I don't get that. I simply state how I (negatively) feel about a given practice. I've never said Otis makes me retch. I'm not forcing anyone to do anything. I'm stating my opinion. Clearly.
And for some reason, I can't use wit to underline how I seriously feel either? Come on. People are so easily offended these days. The right to take offense, I've heard people call it. Well, be my guest, be offended. I have no inclination to retract anything I've posted, as none of it is meant to offend. And if anyone reading something they don't care for on a screenshot thread? Have patience, it'll soon be relegated to oblivion anyways. That's it for me. If anyone wants to take this up via PM, that's fine by me.
EDIT (keep forgetting to add shots):
Lordy lordy..let's lighten up and all agree to disagree. Live and let live. If we had this discussion over a few drinks face to face I'm sure it might have panned out differently.
Now howz aboutz some screenshots..more FC4? No?
Tough, here's a few more to this soon to end page
Edit: Midhras, I don't think anyone is saying you're not entitled to your opinion and no doubt there are others who object to a watermark for whatever reason and just as many who could give two shits. It's just to what length and how one chooses to get their point across.. hyperbole or not, exaggerating the fact often leads to a feeling of contempt unless you actually know each other to some degree.
Now howz aboutz some screenshots..more FC4? No?
Tough, here's a few more to this soon to end page
Edit: Midhras, I don't think anyone is saying you're not entitled to your opinion and no doubt there are others who object to a watermark for whatever reason and just as many who could give two shits. It's just to what length and how one chooses to get their point across.. hyperbole or not, exaggerating the fact often leads to a feeling of contempt unless you actually know each other to some degree.
Sigh... give it a rest, Midhras, you made your point, thread's been 'fun', right? Good job making it a great read for everybody.
Now on to the reason this thread is really here. To please everyone, one with and one without a name. I actually forgot to add the name in the second shot.
Tire patting.
She gently patted and stroked the tire. As if it was a pet. The guy started to make gestures as if he was mansplaining to her what a bike was and how a wheel worked. She of course was totally not impressed, it was actually pretty funny.
Now on to the reason this thread is really here. To please everyone, one with and one without a name. I actually forgot to add the name in the second shot.
Tire patting.
She gently patted and stroked the tire. As if it was a pet. The guy started to make gestures as if he was mansplaining to her what a bike was and how a wheel worked. She of course was totally not impressed, it was actually pretty funny.
Dio Brando
Banned
Such a fun game to screenshot. shame i was having so fun with it tho, so i ended up forgetting to screenshot sometimes.
potatohead
Member
I think my favourite thing about this discussion is that it reminded me that Vita automatically watermarks game screenshots with the title of the game when you use it, at least for some games lol.
I know it does with MGS HD Collection
I know it does with MGS HD Collection
jim2point0
Banned
Real screenshotters watermark their images with wingdings
TheOctagon
Member
To be honest, if you take the textures, models, lighting, art direction and scene composition of an Ubisoft game and stick your own copyright symbol on it, you can't really shit the bed when people call you out, however they choose to do so. None of us is as different to the 'wrongdoers' on Tumblr, etc, as we like to think.
But I love these arguments, they're entertaining.=p
I agree about the screenshots though.
PlayALLtheGames
Banned
PlayALLtheGames
Banned
First a question: what's the difference with a picture of a cup on a table, taken by a photographer? Is it (c) canon who wrote the millions of lines of code in the DSLR camera and made sure the photographer made an in-focus shot with proper balanced colors/whites, is it the maker of the cup? It's not a cutscene frame which would arguably be the same as taking a frame from a motion picture. Some of the reshade shaders I use are my own, camera / dof setup takes a lot of time sometimes, I tweak the color/tonemap/curves for each shot which can take a while, how is that different from a photographer taking a shot of a cup on a table s/he didn't make?
But you do bring up a good point, namely is a screenshot of a game what's called a derivative work, or a work on its own. In case of the former, you're right (as it falls in the category which is also covered by 'can I take a picture of a painting' and 'can I create a painting from a picture') In case of the latter, you're not. Although I've read up a lot about copyright law (but mainly for software) for my work, I'm not a lawyer so I started reading up onto this for pictures in particular. If you post shots here, I think it's important to know what rights we all have on the material we create, whether or not we think we own it or not.
I can only conclude that it's a grey area where there's no real conclusion to be drawn: wikimedia's commons rules for example are very strict and state any screenshot is a derivative work, others state it's not that clear and one could argue it is a work on its own, although based on work of others, which then comes down to the screenshot being based on assets used in a 'fair use' policy (as no usage permission has been granted)
As an example of what's the case, I'll link to this thread http://webmasters.stackexchange.com/a/39504 (and comments) which illustrates properly what's the case. There's this thing called https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secondary_liability which means it's not clearly stated what exactly is marked (pun intended, hey let's keep it entertaining, right) as 'fair use', 'derivative work' or 'own work'.
So as it comes down to 'fair use' (as the materials in the shot are the copyright of someone else), it's unclear whether a screenshot is (c) the person who takes the shot or (c) the game company, it depends on the shot, the stand of the sun and whether or not the judge had a bad night. I.o.w.: it's fuzzy.
I don't like fuzzy in the area of copyright, and I even more don't like a mess in this area as I know what's it like to be on the other side of it (the person whose copyright was infringed, years ago a company from the Philippines grabbed my open source software and sold it as theirs). To my knowledge I wasn't doing anything wrong with adding the (c) as I was convinced I created a new work, but reading up on the material I realized it's unclear where we as screenshotters stand legally (as it depends on, among other things, 'fair use' which is decided on a case by case basis)
As it's unclear, I won't add the (c) anymore to my shots as it is legally unclear whether that's allowed.
Thanks TheOctagon for being civil in this and bringing up a good argument. It's not hard to have a normal discussion on this topic which is important to us all (not the (c) with my name, the 'do I have copyright on this shot' argument). No need for words like retching, or eyecancer.
Thanks.
TheOctagon
Member
As you suggest, it comes down to what you feel comfortable claiming is your own versus work that you've appropriated, or whether you're a Sherrie Levine type who thinks appropriation in itself is an artistic statement. (Ick.) I spend a lot of time with Cheat Engine but tend to see that in itself as a 'work' rather than whatever I put it to use on. Making a ReShade shader is likewise impressive, but I personally wouldn't use it to claim co-authorship of work that's taken dozens of people years to produce.
The bottom line is that watermarks just aren't worth it, imo. They will prompt debates like this at one point or other, and, because they're so easy to remove, will achieve literally nothing else. I just see people posting my stuff on Tumblr as a sign I'm doing something right. If they stop, then I've got something to worry about.
Q
Queen of Hunting
Unconfirmed Member
im gonna add this here since ive done this very thing, i have used some of the screenshots in this thread as deskptop backgrounds, im one of these people who like to keep my desktop to a minimal, and watermarks distract that. theres some beautiful screenshots in this thread that would be ruined if that poster used a watermark.
bare in mind i could just cut that watermark out of the pic and carry on using it as my desktop background.
hell even as otis is worried about i could take your picture cut out the watermark area in paint and add it as my own on flickr insta etc.
bare in mind i could just cut that watermark out of the pic and carry on using it as my desktop background.
hell even as otis is worried about i could take your picture cut out the watermark area in paint and add it as my own on flickr insta etc.
And why the bad image quality
Grainy and blurred. I reckon you have to play on 4k to make it look at least SOMEWHAT sharp...
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