Xbox Project Scorpio Announced - 6TFlops, 320GB/s - Fall 2017

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c0de said:
It is not conflicting but saying something more specific. 6 TFlops of GPU power is of course also 6TFlops of CPU and GPU power.
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Saying SoC definately does imply that the CPU + GPU equal to 6TFlops. I updated my post with the bit of the trailer where its said.

I hope it's the GPU only.
 
leeh said:
Please watch the video again guys, he says "6TFlops of computing power on the SoC" (or some slight other wording) then they quickly start to specifically talk about the GPU.
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The CPU would account for sub-150Gflops which means It would have to be a 5.9TF gpu at the minimum for it to be a 6TF SoC.
 
leeh said:
Saying SoC definately does imply that the CPU + GPU equal to 6TFlops. I updated my post with the bit of the trailer where its said.

I hope it's the GPU only.
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I don't really get what you are trying to say. The SoC means CPU + GPU. If one part of it is 6TF than the SoC is also 6TF. At least.
 
I think, Sony will upgrade their Neo, too. Otherwise they had an announcement at E3 - I think, they cancelled the announcement last minute.
But after all I assume those new machines will be round about 700-800$. Hoping, the new consoles (including Xbox One S) are as quiet and cool as the actual Xbox One. Really a gamechanger for me, will they be in our living room.

Also I'm hoping for a Oculus bundle.
 
Durante said:
That's what I currently expect. Or rather Puma/Puma+.
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Do you think Puma/Puma+ are powerful enough to support VR though?

Besides Jaguar/Puma seeming like an architecture AMD has abandoned, and this being a fall 2017 console, Zen will already be a year old at that time. I see no reason why this wouldn't be MS's CPU of choice for the next gen system.

The GPU is getting ~ 4/4.5x boost, memory bandwidth is going from 68+102 to over 320GB/s. It's reasonable to assume CPU (and the amount of RAM) would also see significant boosts.
 
alouette said:
I think, Sony will upgrade their Neo, too. Otherwise they had an announcement at E3 - I think, they cancelled the announcement last minute.
But after all I assume those new machines will be round about 700-800$. Hoping, the new consoles (including Xbox One S) are as quiet and cool as the actual Xbox One. Really a gamechanger for me, will they be in our living room.

Also I'm hoping for a Oculus bundle.
Click to expand...

If there was more time between the two I think Sony would be ok with Neo as-is. As soon as scorpio comes out then there would be rumblings of the next Sony upgrade, or at least those bought-in to the Sony ecosystem would know it would be a temporary lack of power.

but if they're really considering not coming out with Neo until early next year, then it might only have a few months on the market before scorpio, and therefore it would be at least two more years after scorpio until 'neo 2'. So they might try and upspec it a bit
 
alouette said:
I think, Sony will upgrade their Neo, too. Otherwise they had an announcement at E3 - I think, they cancelled the announcement last minute.
But after all I assume those new machines will be round about 700-800$. Hoping, the new consoles (including Xbox One S) are as quiet and cool as the actual Xbox One. Really a gamechanger for me, will they be in our living room.

Also I'm hoping for a Oculus bundle.
Click to expand...

I was under the impression the Neo was never planned for E3, and that it would be revealed at the same time as NX at TGS.
 
I don't really like this situation. I'm scared it's going to be:
2016 PS4 NEO>>>>PS4/ONE
2017 Scorpio>>>>PS4 NEO
2018 PS4 Powah>>>Scorpio

And I think that those monstrous Scorpio specs are going to be wasted with the 4k resolution.
 
I like MS position. By leaning into cross platform, I could easily see a world where every Xbox game is also a PC game. Thus games are adapting to scaling hardware already, keeping their own aging dedicated hardware in the mix.

I wonder if we could see things with the Scorpio like scaling down of assets in games when it detects your screen is less than 4k. Essentially turning a 4k30fps game into a 1080p or 1440p 60++ game. How reasonable is that I wonder?

Perhaps less reasonable than simply asking the customer to buy an increasingly affordable 4k TV. But the prospect sounds more than just consumer friendliness to me. It sounds neat! For a game console anyway.
 
darkinstinct said:
That does not look like double to me:

edit-4k.png
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Something is very wrong here.
 
http://www.wired.com/2016/06/xbox-vr-scorpio-phil-spencer/?mbid=social_twitter

New Interview with Phil.

But just because Microsoft is pushing ahead with a new console so soon doesn’t mean it plans to release them at a faster pace forever. “Consumer expectation is that, if you wanted to, you could go buy a new cell phone every year. I don’t want to get into that mode with a console,” Spencer says. “I see the next inflection point as 4K, and I want to make sure we have a console there to support that, and Scorpio will do that. We’re not on a hardware tick-tock that says I need to put out a console every two years or every one year to get people to upgrade. That’s not the console model.”
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Spencer maintains, though, that the VR experiences on today’s consoles won’t look as good as standard games. “The truth is, a console that can run a 2-D version of Doom or Fallout today, which a PS4 and Xbox One can, is not going to be able to do a stereoscopic, high-framerate version of those games,” he says. “We don’t want to force VR into a middle ground between the scale that we see in mobile, and what our customers [expect].” So even though future Xbox games will be compatible with all the Xbox One systems, the VR games will likely be Scorpio-exclusive.

“The best place for VR innovation is the PC,” Spencer says. “I think developers should still go focus on the PC, because I think that’s a great place to innovate. What we’re doing… is we’re able to take some of the PC innovation that we see… and bring it to the console space, to enable those magical experiences on Scorpio when it launches.”
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But when you do play VR on Project Scorpio, what exactly will you be putting on your head? Spencer isn’t saying, but it won’t be made by Microsoft. “Right now we are not focused on a first-party VR hardware device,” he says. He didn’t call out any particular headset that might plug into Scorpio, but noted that Microsoft hoped to “enable many hardware manufacturers to make progress there.” So it might be a BYOHMD situation. Maybe you even already own your Xbox VR headset.
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Lots of new stuff in there.
 
I don't know if this has been discussed yet, but what if Scorpio is strictly a 4K dedicated console.
I was in all those pre E3 threads about Scorpio and Neo and the majority of us was assuming that the new consoles will do better framerate, effects and so on.
Unless there are not offering settings options a la Last of Us remaster, will a person with a HD TV even benefit from the extra power?
The Scorpio will be between 3 and 4 times as powerful as the PS4, which is the requirement for native 4K as much as I know, meaning there's not much left to do other stuff let alone 60fps.
So XboxOne will be the console for HD TV owners and Scorpio the premium model for 4k TV owners. When it comes to games - they will be exactly the same - only the res output will be different 1080p/4K
 
Markoman said:
I don't know if this has been discussed yet, but what if Scorpio is strictly a 4K dedicated console.
I was in all those pre E3 threads about Scorpio and Neo and the majority of us was assuming that the new consoles will do better framerate, effects and so on.
Unless there are not offering settings options a la Last of Us remaster, will a person with a HD TV even benefit from the extra power?
The Scorpio will be between 3 and 4 times as powerful as the PS4, which is the requirement for native 4K as much as I know, meaning there's not much left to do other stuff let alone 60fps.
So XboxOne will be the console for HD TV owners and Scorpio the premium model for 4k TV owners. When it comes to games - they will be exactly the same - only the res output will be different 1080p/4K
Click to expand...

I think a 1080p supersampled image of a 4k render will look awesome on a 1080p panel.
 
ekim said:
http://www.wired.com/2016/06/xbox-vr-scorpio-phil-spencer/?mbid=social_twitter

New Interview with Phil.







Lots of new stuff in there.
Click to expand...

As we all no doubt had expected, MS not making the VR hardware. Smart if you ask me. This way they don't have to worry about making the hardware, neither the costs of making it. Really do wonder if Scorpio will work with both OR and Vive then.

It makes sense that VR games will be mostly exclusive to Scorpio, but i am also hoping in due time there will be non VR exclusives for it, games that truly take advantage of the hardware.
 
Markoman said:
I don't know if this has been discussed yet, but what if Scorpio is strictly a 4K dedicated console.
I was in all those pre E3 threads about Scorpio and Neo and the majority of us was assuming that the new consoles will do better framerate, effects and so on.
Unless there are not offering settings options a la Last of Us remaster, will a person with a HD TV even benefit from the extra power?
The Scorpio will be between 3 and 4 times as powerful as the PS4, which is the requirement for native 4K as much as I know, meaning there's not much left to do other stuff let alone 60fps.
So XboxOne will be the console for HD TV owners and Scorpio the premium model for 4k TV owners. When it comes to games - they will be exactly the same - only the res output will be different 1080p/4K
Click to expand...
That makes no sense at all. Why the heck would they design a new console that would provide zero improvement on the vast majority of HDTVs out there?

They're going to let developers use that power as they see fit. It makes no sense for MS to say "Scorpio games must run at 4x the resolution of One games but be otherwise identical".
 
shark sandwich said:
That makes no sense at all. Why the heck would they design a new console that would provide zero improvement on the vast majority of HDTVs out there?

They're going to let developers use that power as they see fit. It makes no sense for MS to say "Scorpio games must run at 4x the resolution of One games but be otherwise identical".
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I don't feel adressed by that point in any way...
It will be Ms's and Sony's problem how to market these things.
MS was talking about 4K in the announcement, so people might feel cheated if games on Scorpio run at 1080 just with better graphics.

Once again, this will only work if devs offer various settings in their games. Otherwise it will be pretty pointless to call it a 4 K machine, with some of the devs maybe prioritzing something else.
 
Nikodemos said:
It's not actually 4x 1080. It's "four 1080 screens". That is, four 1080p sized (1920x1080) screens in a single rectangle. Thus 3840x2160.
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Stevey said:
Jesus.
Its 1920 x 2 horizontal and
1080 x 2 vertical
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D4Danger said:
it's four 1080 screens not 4x1080

edit: answered above.
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napata said:
3840×2160 = 8294400
1920x1080 = 2138400

8294400/2138400 = 3.88

So 4k is almost 4 times as many pixels.
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Thanks for all these answers. Got it now ;)
 
Here's some benchmarks. Remember, the 480 is essentially what Scorpio is using.
AMD-Radeon-RX-480-3DMark-FireStrike.png

Now, with this in mind, refer to the performace that the 1080 gets at 4K:
brawly said:
Here are some average 4k framerate numbers from the GTX 1080, a 9TFLOP card:

Crysis 3: 39,8
Tomb Raider: 43,2
Witcher 3: 44,1
Metro Last Light: 52,7
Hitman: 46

Source

But hey, set yourself up for a disappointment.
Click to expand...
Games will look phenomenal on this thing, but not at 4K.
 
There seems to be confusion. The GPU itself is 6tflops. That was confirmed by Microsoft, we asked afterwards. And I personally don't want all, or even the majority of games targeting 4K. I think with this kind of power, 1080p is the sweet spot to do significantly more with the game visually. I don't want too much of the power dedicated to running at 4K.
 
brawly said:
Here are some average 4k framerate numbers from the GTX 1080, a 9TFLOP card:

Crysis 3: 39,8
Tomb Raider: 43,2
Witcher 3: 44,1
Metro Last Light: 52,7
Hitman: 46

Source

But hey, set yourself up for a disappointment.
Click to expand...

Yep, its going to be impossible to maintain high fidelity while running native 4K. I think the console manufacturers are using 4K on a loosely based term, much like 1080P leading into the current console gen.

In the end, I think we are going to see a lot more detail in games, at native 1080P, with a lot of scaling on the base model PS4/Xbox One.
 
brawly said:
Here are some average 4k framerate numbers from the GTX 1080, a 9TFLOP card:

Crysis 3: 39,8
Tomb Raider: 43,2
Witcher 3: 44,1
Metro Last Light: 52,7
Hitman: 46

Source

But hey, set yourself up for a disappointment.
Click to expand...

These are also with maxed out PC settings, not what you see on consoles even at 1080p
 
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