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[xenorevlis]

I'm just not fond of the precedent it creates. If Neo is a success, then this busts open the doors for more nonsense like exclusive software and core features for future "mid-generation" hardware.

It flies in the face of why I like consoles in the first place: generational parity.

Well good thing the precedent Sony's leaked docs seem to be setting is that since it's still a PS4, all PS4 games must work on both. No Neo only titles, and only features like split-screen can be enhanced in Neo mode (as in 2 on PS4, 4 on Neo).

We'll see if anything has changed next week.

 

[Reg]

Just like we used to DLC and micro transactions, things always started moderately.

Well, once they start doing yearly updates is when I'll become annoyed. But as of right now, an update after 3yrs is fine.

 

[Woodchipper]

Pretty much every CE, mobile, computing device, TV, car, shoe, etc, has the concept of model tiers though. This shouldn't make people upset, they'll do what naturally comes to them and buy what they can afford. It's a new thing for consoles but I think we'll adapt quickly.

The PC thing is kind of a joke. When Neo was first rumored, there were a lot of people saying fuck this, I'm jumping to PC. Just more irrational thinking.

Well, what's upsetting in my opinion, is that until now console gaming has been easy. You buy a console knowing you're good for 5, 6 or 7 years. That's what I've always liked console gaming. That and exclusives, of course.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

Well, what's upsetting in my opinion, is that until now console gaming has been easy. You buy a console knowing you're good for 5, 6 or 7 years. That's what I've always liked console gaming. That and exclusives, of course.

It's still easy and your PS4 will be supported for the next 3 or 4 years.

I'm just not fond of the precedent it creates. If Neo is a success, then this busts open the doors for more nonsense like exclusive software and core features for future "mid-generation" hardware.

It flies in the face of why I like consoles in the first place: generational parity.

I like consoles because they are easy to use and I like the exclusives. I couldn't less about parity and I'm not sure why you do either.


No technology should be arbitrarily limited to improvement every 5 to 7 years. It's absurd in today's world.

 

[kyser73]

Well good thing the precedent Sony's leaked docs seem to be setting is that since it's still a PS4, all PS4 games must work on both. No Neo only titles, and only features like split-screen can be enhanced in Neo mode (as in 2 on PS4, 4 on Neo).

We'll see if anything has changed next week.

I'll be honest, I give that feature parity thing 18 months, a year on PSVR.

I still think that OG will be the target spec, with Neo mode still an add-on, but Neo mode will start to see the definition of 'exclusive features' stretch quite a bit.

 

[cheesekao]

I'm just not fond of the precedent it creates. If Neo is a success, then this busts open the doors for more nonsense like exclusive software and core features for future "mid-generation" hardware.

It flies in the face of why I like consoles in the first place: generational parity.

The precedent is already there with the N64 expansion pack and a few others. A recent example is the N3DS and that is pretty successful and if I'm not mistaken you can count the number of games exclusive to it (only 1 sorta kinda major game and a handful of indies) with your fingers and considering how weak the 3ds is to begin with, I wouldn't be too worried about a home console.

 

[mrklaw]

Well, what's upsetting in my opinion, is that until now console gaming has been easy. You buy a console knowing you're good for 5, 6 or 7 years. That's what I've always liked console gaming. That and exclusives, of course.

Buy a ps4, you're good for 6-7 years. What's the difference? You now have the option to buy something new but you don't have to.

Nintendo do this all the time with (mostly cosmetic) refreshes of their handhelds, but things like the GBA SP were functionally superior due to the screen lighting. And the new 3DS is faster in some games and more functional in others (doesn't shut down the background app)

 

[Reg]

Well, what's upsetting in my opinion, is that until now console gaming has been easy. You buy a console knowing you're good for 5, 6 or 7 years. That's what I've always liked console gaming. That and exclusives, of course.

I agree with all of this, but all other hardware besides consoles increments a lot sooner. I think we just need to get use to quicker upgrades. It's the new normal. But also, everything is forwards/backwards compatible like a poster above stated.

edit: I should state that I'm not buying a neo. I can easily stick it out with my og ps4 for another 3yrs.

 

[KurtSloane]

$399 is the max price, it won't be more expensive than the og ps4.

 

[AmyS]

At least there's going to be a more powerful PS4 model.

During 1996 - 1997, it was heavily rumored Sony would be coming out with an upgraded PS1 with more RAM / VRAM and a faster, 4x speed CD drive.

http://www.ign.com/articles/1997/02/28/new-information-on-the-playstation-c

27 FEB 1997
NEW INFORMATION ON THE PLAYSTATION C
Upgrade may be more than just a rumor

BY IGN STAFF

There has been much speculation online recently about the PlayStation C, a rumored new version of the current machine. PSXPower has learned from a developer that this is may be more than just a rumor.

The rumored PlayStation C will not be so much of a "brand new" machine, as it will an upgrade. It will have 4 megs of RAM, upgraded from the current 2, and will most likely have a 4X CD-ROM. It is unknown whether the housing will be any different, but it is speculated that it will look just like the current one.

It was not made clear when the model C would be released, or whether there would be a separate add-on for the current model.

http://www.ign.com/articles/1997/03/19/q-and-a-24

18 MAR 1997
Q AND A

Covering light guns, PlayStation C, and Big Bass Fishing!

I was just curious about the new type "C" hardware. Do you guys have any info on it, such as a price, when it will be released, what exactly will it do for the PlayStation? Any info would be most helpful.

Well, this is all steeped in rumor, and nothing has been confirmed, but as we reported a while back, here's what a developer told us: The rumored PlayStation C will not be so much of a "brand new" machine, as it will an upgrade. It will have 4 megs of RAM, upgraded from the current 2, and will most likely have a 4X CD-ROM. It is unknown whether the housing will be any different, but it is speculated that it will look just like the current one. We don't know when it will ship, if at all.

Ah, the parallels!

 

[StrongBlackVine]

$399 is the max price, it won't be more expensive than the og ps4.

And if is is more expensive then what?

 

[Kwansu Dudes]

And if is is more expensive then what?

People pretend they're so outraged and buy it anyway

 

[icespide]

And if is is more expensive then what?

Neo flops

PS4 sales plummet

Sony goes bankrupt

MS brings back it's DRM policies

Trump becomes president

 

[NOOI]

I'll be honest, I give that feature parity thing 18 months, a year on PSVR.

I still think that OG will be the target spec, with Neo mode still an add-on, but Neo mode will start to see the definition of 'exclusive features' stretch quite a bit.

It would be dependent on the market penetration of the Neo. The smaller proportion the Neo take up in the market, the less incentive to spend money giving Neo mode too many advantages. Too small and the studios would just give it lip service.

And really, the market penetration will be dependent on the price. Any more than 399 and I think most studios would wait for PS5 instead.

And if is is more expensive then what?

Then there would be so few Neo out in the wild that it isn't worth making exclusive new features for it.

And as for PSVR, it is more likely that Sony would release PSVR2 along with PS5.

 

[Inuhanyou]

So you don't actually get what you're saying, eh? We don't know what has changed since initial leak at beginning of year, and your metric for price increase makes no sense. Me personally spending $50 or $100 on a better videocard or more RAM will absolutely result in better performance

Now realize that the cost of a more powerful APU, larger HDD, etc. ordered in the magnitude of millions will not be "$50 or $100" more per item. Mass quantities = reduced cost, so the difference between $399 and $499 console can absolutely make a difference.

Nothing changed component wise. How do i know this? because there are no parts for Sony to move to this year that would make a difference to the overall unit besides pushing the release date back.

 

[Hawk269]

I agree with all of this, but all other hardware besides consoles increments a lot sooner. I think we just need to get use to quicker upgrades. It's the new normal. But also, everything is forwards/backwards compatible like a poster above stated.

edit: I should state that I'm not buying a neo. I can easily stick it out with my og ps4 for another 3yrs.

I think in the day and age that we live in, incremental video game consoles will be a easier pill to swallow now instead of like 5-6 years ago. I think the general consumer has been conditioned to understand incremental hardware and/or options at the time of purchase. If this was attempted 5 years ago it would be a train wreck, but I think in today's world it is not going to be that big of a deal.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

Nothing changed component wise. How do i know this? because there are no parts for Sony to move to this year that would make a difference to the overall unit besides pushing the release date back.

The answer is you don't know it.

 

[pager99]

Why do I have a sneaky feeling were in for a surprise in regards specs

 

[icespide]

Why do I have a sneaky feeling were in for a surprise in regards specs

dual 1080s. 30lbs. $999

 

[Primethius]

Figure this would be useful for some folks:

In FY2015, Sony shipped 17.7 million PS4s.

For FY2016, Sony is predicting 20 million PS4s.

In Q1FY2016, the PS4 shipped 3.5 million, up 500k from 2015.

So with these numbers, by March 2017, I think it'd a safe prediction to say that the OG PS4 plus slim will account for 18.5-19 million sales of the 20 million prediction.

That should give a good indication as to what Neo is expected to do, and how tough it's going to be for Scorpio next year.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

Why do I have a sneaky feeling were in for a surprise in regards specs

September 7th is going to be a shit show on Neogaf. I have a feeling that the people that want higher specs at a higher price will be able to handle things not going our way much better than the negative crowd will.

Figure this would be useful for some folks:

In FY2015, Sony shipped 17.7 million PS4s.

For FY2016, Sony is predicting 20 million PS4s.

In Q1FY2016, the PS4 shipped 3.5 million, up 500k from 2015.

So with these numbers, by March 2017, I think it'd a safe prediction to say that the OG PS4 plus slim will account for 18.5-19 million sales of the 20 million prediction.

That should give a good indication as to what Neo is expected to do, and how tough it's going to be for Scorpio next year.

VERY interesting. It doesn't look like they are depending much on Neo at all. If the Slim is $250 they will easily surpass that prediction.

 

[demigod]

Figure this would be useful for some folks:

In FY2015, Sony shipped 17.7 million PS4s.

For FY2016, Sony is predicting 20 million PS4s.

In Q1FY2016, the PS4 shipped 3.5 million, up 500k from 2015.

So with these numbers, by March 2017, I think it'd a safe prediction to say that the OG PS4 plus slim will account for 18.5-19 million sales of the 20 million prediction.

That should give a good indication as to what Neo is expected to do, and how tough it's going to be for Scorpio next year.

My prediction, Neo will easily hit 2.5mil by March.

 

[bitbydeath]

I expect meltdowns if it is stronger than leaked and if it is $449 or higher.

People put too much stock in rumours, imagine the meltdowns if it turned out to be 3TF or less.

 

[Hawk269]

September 7th is going to be a shit show on Neogaf. I have a feeling that the people that want higher specs at a higher price will be able to handle things not going our way much better than the negative crowd will.

It is going to be interesting. I happen to be off on the 7th, so it worked out great for me. My plan is to watch the presser, then check out the reactions here with a bag of popcorn. In between refreshing Gaf since whatever the thread is called is going to be flying fast, I will be seeing when Gamestop is going to open up pre-orders for the Neo and get my ass over there immediately and put money down for one.

I just hope, whatever the specs are for the Neo, that they show real world footage of what benefits the Neo will bring. I would think a few (at least 3-4) current games running at higher frame rate and/or perhaps higher resolution will be something that will "show" what it can do. In the end, it is going to be very entertaining around here and that is just going to be the tip of the iceberg.

 

[Woodchipper]

It's still easy and your PS4 will be supported for the next 3 or 4 years.

But games will look and run worse on original PS4, and it makes people feel like they have a shitty console, while in earlier generations one simply wouldn't have to worry about a thing.

 

[vpance]

Figure this would be useful for some folks:

In FY2015, Sony shipped 17.7 million PS4s.

For FY2016, Sony is predicting 20 million PS4s.

In Q1FY2016, the PS4 shipped 3.5 million, up 500k from 2015.

So with these numbers, by March 2017, I think it'd a safe prediction to say that the OG PS4 plus slim will account for 18.5-19 million sales of the 20 million prediction.

That should give a good indication as to what Neo is expected to do, and how tough it's going to be for Scorpio next year.

Companies often like to low ball expectations so they can beat them later. In the past, Sony had a bad habit of missing expectations and kept getting pummeled for it come report time, so now they're pretty conservative on that sort of thing in general.

20M is a bare minimum, no question, and doesn't really tell you much about actual Neo sales targets.

 

[Hawk269]

People put too much stock in rumours, imagine the meltdowns if it turned out to be 3TF or less.

I can't imagine what would happen if something like that would happen. Based on how some are so "invested" in this being 4.2tf or even more powerful, if it came to be a 3tf system I can see some people just losing their shit all over the place.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

I can't imagine what would happen if something like that would happen. Based on how some are so "invested" in this being 4.2tf or even more powerful, if it came to be a 3tf system I can see some people just losing their shit all over the place.

I just wouldn't buy it just like any other product that doesn't appeal to me. How simple is that?

But games will look and ruin worse on original PS4, and it makes people feel like they have a shitty console, while in earlier generations one simply wouldn't have to worry about a thing.

Things change. Any worry is self-inflicted.

 

[Hispanic! At the Disco]

Neo flops

PS4 sales plummet

Sony goes bankrupt

MS brings back it's DRM policies

Cats and dogs living together

Trump becomes president

FTFY

 

[Primethius]

Companies often like to low ball expectations so they can beat them later. In the past, Sony had a bad habit of missing expectations and kept getting pummeled for it come report time, so now they're pretty conservative on that sort of thing in general.

20M is a bare minimum, no question, and doesn't really tell you much about actual Neo sales targets.

Sure, and Sony often low balls their own targets. But even increasing the targets by a few million, to say 22 million, you get a good indication for the share of the sales that Neo is expected to do.

It gets bumped from 1 million to 2. My point was more that the OG PS4 and Slim are going to be doing all the heavy lifting.

And people are pinning way to many hopes on Scorpio. If Neo is expected to do 2 million or about, imagine Scorpios struggle.

 

[vpance]

Sure, and Sony often low balls their own targets. But even increasing the targets by a few million, to say 22 million, you get a good indication for the share of the sales that Neo is expected to do.

It gets bumped from 1 million to 2. My point was more that the OG PS4 and Slim are going to be doing all the heavy lifting.

Oh of course, Slim will carry the load.

I wonder if Neo does well enough, maybe they'll release sales numbers for it. FY ending in March, I think they can hit 2-3M easy, even at $499.

 

[mulac]

dual 1080s. 30lbs. $999

+165 turbo boost gsync ready.

DAY.ONE.

 

[Nostremitus]

Just so I understand... People are saying that because the power supply is supposedly bigger and the box is supposedly heavier, that means Sony upped the clocks and installed and giant, heavy, heatsink to compensate?

 

[Primethius]

Just so I understand... People are saying that because the power supply is supposedly bigger and the box is supposedly heavier, that means Sony upped the clocks and installed and giant, heavy, heatsink to compensate?

Yes. Though I feel like it's speculation based on already existing speculation which makes it really hard for me to believe.


I still think it's a 4.2 TF console, which is a sizable enough upgrade for me over the PS4 in 2016.

 

[Hawk269]

Just so I understand... People are saying that because the power supply is supposedly bigger and the box is supposedly heavier, that means Sony upped the clocks and installed and giant, heavy, heatsink to compensate?

You forgot the one where there are rumors that the power cord uses a 3 prong for the outlet, which implies it is using a lot more power.

But, yes, I think some are thinking because it is heavy, bigger power supply and/or power usage some are thinking that they upped specs and perhaps had to have a larger heat sink to help compensate for the increased heat.

 

[Backfoggen]

Neo flops

PS4 sales plummet

Sony goes bankrupt

MS brings back it's DRM policies

Trump becomes president

Knack 2 is released

 

[Sanctuary]

Buy a ps4, you're good for 6-7 years. What's the difference? You now have the option to buy something new but you don't have to.

Nintendo do this all the time with (mostly cosmetic) refreshes of their handhelds, but things like the GBA SP were functionally superior due to the screen lighting. And the new 3DS is faster in some games and more functional in others (doesn't shut down the background app)

There seems to be this weird prevailing logic as though the existence of the Neo will somehow invalidate all PS4s, and that because it exists, someone is forced to purchase it. Depsite the fact (or at least what's been claimed by Sony) that your PS4 is still going to play games the same as if the Neo had never existed anyway. I totally get the worries about what might happen (just look at DLC from 2006 to now), and I actually expect it to. Every six - eight years.

But games will look and run worse on original PS4

Like they would have anyway.

 

[eyeball_kid]

Someone's having a laugh at Apple. First Apple has their WWDC keynote the day of Sony's E3 keynote, and now Apple is having their iPhone 7 event the day of the Neo reveal.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

Knack 2 is released

There were rumors that Knack 2 is actually a thing.

 

[SolidSnakex]

But games will look and run worse on original PS4, and it makes people feel like they have a shitty console, while in earlier generations one simply wouldn't have to worry about a thing.

Sony's been really good this generation of explaining things on clear terms. That's really what they need to do here. Make it clear to current PS4 owners that there will not be a single game released exclusively for the Neo. Go on to reiterate the games that they've seen like GTS, Spider-Man, GoW, and Horizon were all running on current PS4 hardware rather than Neo, so it's not as if PS4 games are suddenly going to look ugly. The point out that the Neo will simply allow games to look even better than they do on the PS4, which is wording that makes it clear that PS4 games already look great. In other words, make them feel like they've already got a Ferrari and the Neo is an upgraded version of that Ferrari.

 

[bitbydeath]

Just so I understand... People are saying that because the power supply is supposedly bigger and the box is supposedly heavier, that means Sony upped the clocks and installed and giant, heavy, heatsink to compensate?

It makes it more likely they went with option/rumour B.

Sony is currently testing two different PS4 Neo models, out of these two only ONE will be selected for consumers. The first PlayStation 4 Neo variant offers a 4.2TF performance and has a Jaguar CPU and internally carries a price tag of $399.

The second variant of PlayStation 4 Neo offers a 5.5TF GPU and comes with a brand new CPU and carries a price tag of $499.

http://www.gamepur.com/news/23460-m...powerful-high-clock-speed-55tf-price-499.html

 

[StrongBlackVine]

It makes it more likely they went with option/rumour B.



http://www.gamepur.com/news/23460-m...powerful-high-clock-speed-55tf-price-499.html

I find it interesting that the only comment OsirisBlack has made regarding Neo in recent memory was to quote the Total Recall gif that had 5.5 in it. Obviously you can't put too much stock into an innocuous comment like that, but I do pay attention extra attention to things that "insiders" say. John Harker also hinted at an upgrade, but no numbers.

 

[Inuhanyou]

It makes it more likely they went with option/rumour B.



http://www.gamepur.com/news/23460-m...powerful-high-clock-speed-55tf-price-499.html

They don't have the leeway to test two entirely different units plus two different versions of dev kits for developers before launch at the same time, i call BS

 

[Backfoggen]

There were rumors that Knack 2 is actually a thing.

Arrogant Sony truly is back.

 

[Ovek]

Well, once they start doing yearly updates is when I'll become annoyed. But as of right now, an update after 3yrs is fine.

Pretty much, after three years my launch ps4 is as loud as a jet engine and loves to try and eject games that aren't in the drive.

As a result I was going to buy a new ps4 anyway so it might as well be the neo.

 

[bitbydeath]

They don't have the leeway to test two entirely different units plus two different versions of dev kits for developers before launch at the same time, i call BS

What if they never tested the 4.2 then?
It's all rumours it could be anything.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

They don't have the leeway to test two entirely different units plus two different versions of dev kits for developers before launch at the same time, i call BS

You still haven't explained how you know these things about what is and isn't possible. Not saying he's right, but he's verified and you are...

 

[MilkyJoe]

 

[Deleted member 465307]

They don't have the leeway to test two entirely different units plus two different versions of dev kits for developers before launch at the same time, i call BS

It sounded preposterous to me, too, but OsirisBlack seems to be pretty well trusted around here and they were the one I first saw give info about Sony giving strong consideration to two different models. However, IIRC, OsirisBlack also said that if Sony went with the more powerful model, it'd likely release in 2017 because it would be hard to price at $500 earlier than that.

Thinking about the possibility of that second model, I can see why some people believe Neo will be $450-$500. However, I don't see Sony announcing this new powerful console right before the holiday season and not putting it on sale. Then again, if it is indeed a $500 box, then I don't think its announcement (with maybe a February or March release date) would hurt the holiday sales of a PS4 Slim priced at $250-$300 because they'd be in totally different price tiers with different audiences.

Spoiler

It'd also probably not hurt NX's sales if it's $500 and released next March, but that's for a different thread.

 

[Bitch Pudding]

When I saw the Neo's 4,5kg / 10lbs weight i started drooling. I love it!!! Something about buying a console that weights so much makes me feel like I'm really getting my money's worth.