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DF Retro: Metroid Prime - Nintendo's first-person masterpiece

B

Broken Joystick

At least you can talk. Who are you?
In this week's episode, John Linneman examines Nintendo's phenomenal Metroid Prime. With the series originally designed as a 2D platformer, the Metroid titles enjoyed huge success on NES, Game Boy and SNES - but there was no Metroid title for Nintendo's first true 3D console, the N64. In truth, it seemed that the platform holder just didn't know how to evolve the franchise.

A collaboration between Nintendo and the then newly formed Retro Studios, Metroid Prime is a technical masterpiece for the GameCube - a 60fps mostly first-person adventure that sees the platform holder dare to radically evolve the franchise to make the best of new technology. It's a fascinating story and one we're happy to share with you.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RwhS76r0OqE
 
Aww yiss! DF retro is the best series in a while. Metroid Prime was the reason I bought a gamecube back in the days. So watching this is gonna be a treat.
 
"used the polygon pushing power.. to pull off detailed visuals without having to rely as heavily on textures.."

"things like cracks in the walls and other smaller details are actually rendered out as polygon measures rather than as simple textures, giving everything a more three-dimension look."


Yep, I was talking about this as late as this week, this is key to the visuals of this game holding up so beautifully. More so than ANY other game of its sort from that era.
 
Thank you John, i haven't even watched the video yet but this is one of my favorite games and needs all the attention it can get.
 
Surprised at John's reaction to the introduction speech, didn't realise that wasn't there in the NTSC version. There's also an ending speech in the PAL version, is that present in the NTSC version?

marc^o^ said:
Does it run well with Dolphin?
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m00h said:
I also would like to know. Still have the GC game, but no GC anymore.
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John briefly touches on this, basically it runs fine but in the video he uses the Ishiiruka version of Dolphin, which add a bunch of visual features.
 
Broken Joystick said:
Surprised at John's reaction to the introduction speech, didn't realise that wasn't there in the NTSC version. There's also an ending speech in the PAL version, is that present in the NTSC version?





John briefly touches on this, basically it runs fine but in the video he uses the Ishiiruka version of Dolphin, which add a bunch of visual features.
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I didn't know about this Ishiiruka build, thanks.
 
Broken Joystick said:
Surprised at John's reaction to the introduction speech, didn't realise that wasn't there in the NTSC version. There's also an ending speech in the PAL version, is that present in the NTSC version?
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There is no spoken dialog in the NTSC version at all. Which, thank God, because honestly it's kind of really stupid lol.

Also, the European version has narrator call-outs for Tallon Overworld and the Impact Crater, neither of which are in the NTSC version, and the Japanese version goes a step further by adding callouts for Frigate Orpheon (Space Pirate Frigate), Chozo Ruins, Lava Caves (Magmoor Caverns), Ice Valley (Phendrana Drifts), and the Phazon Mines, though all only when loading saved games.

Metroid Prime is an interesting one, because it actually got quite a bit of fiddling throughout its localizations, as well as a coupled of patched releases. Nothing major (though the European version had some fairly notable lore changes), but a good bit more than most Nintendo games.
 
Strickland said:
Digital Foundry needs more recognition.
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Yes and it's in the video! It's awesome on Dolphin.

I do recommend Ishiiruka for this one. Regular Dolphin works OK but the shader compilation stuttering is still annoying as hell (though it does eventually go away, obviously).
 
Great video, and once again we can see how advanced this game was, and how great performance and art direction can make a game timeless.

I kind of miss this Nintendo (and my beloved GameCube), i remember that this game was mindblowing back when it was released, hopefully with the Switch we might again see some impressive visuals paired with awesome gameplay.
 
What controller did you use on the Dolphin release, John? The Wii version just doesn't feel right to me and I don't know why. The shooting is obviously great with the pointer, but the jumping feels rigid to me, like there's less control on the timing and the mid-air adjustment.
 
I think I prefer the Trilogy version these days over the Gamecube original. The widescreen display is nice, and the Wii remote controls let me look up and down and all around without hindering the flow of movement. It's a shame about the missing effects, though.
 
Can someone gif / webm that part at 9:50 where the wireframe room behind the door loads? Looks really cool.
 
I posted this in the other thread but didn't Metroid Prime run on a modified version of Unreal Engine 2? Didn't hear John mention it
 
Jonneh3003 said:
I posted this in the other thread but didn't Metroid Prime run on a modified version of Unreal Engine 2? Didn't hear John mention it
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Now that's not something I had ever heard.

Not impossible but...Retro was working on this tech in the late 90s originally. I'm not even sure UE2 was capable of the type of level streaming we see in Prime. No other UE2 game could deliver results like that and the engine was still extremely new at that point.
 
I thought Dolphin rather recently had a major update that fixed a huge number of issues that had plagued it for ages, on top of adding new features. Is John including that in his thoughts about "the standard Dolphin" when saying he's using the custom version?
 
dark10x said:
Now that's not something I had ever heard.

Not impossible but...Retro was working on this tech in the late 90s originally. I'm not even sure UE2 was capable of the type of level streaming we see in Prime. No other UE2 game could deliver results like that and the engine was still extremely new at that point.
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I think it was the discussion of a thread (or was in a thread) a couple of years ago.
 
I had no idea the stuttering was fixed in this Ishiiruka branch. Thanks so much for the heads up! Great vid as usual.

Metroid Prime was such a great game, easily one of the generations' best, and it single-handedly justified my purchase and in general the existence of the Gamecube.

Sanctuary said:
I thought Dolphin rather recently had a major update that fixed a huge number of issues that had plagued it for ages, on top of adding new features. Is John including that in his thoughts about "the standard Dolphin" when saying he's using the custom version?
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The Prime games still run full of stuttering in regular Dolphin.
 
Sanctuary said:
I thought Dolphin rather recently had a major update that fixed a huge number of issues that had plagued it for ages, on top of adding new features. Is John including that in his thoughts about "the standard Dolphin" when saying he's using the custom version?
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Yeah, the very latest build of Dolphin 5.0 still stutters. It is better, but not quite what I want.

Ishiiruka completely solves the issues and, having played for two hours using it, the game basically feels 99% perfect. There's a couple minor issues but it's very polished overall.
 
Watched the video and now I need to replay this masterpiece once again o/

I have never played MP3, I have a trilogy disc, how does it run on dolphin ?
 
A Prime example why high framerate with huge polygon count stands the test of time far better than focusing on some fancy textures.
 
dark10x said:
Yeah, the very latest build of Dolphin 5.0 still stutters. It is better, but not quite what I want.

Ishiiruka completely solves the issues and, having played for two hours using it, the game basically feels 99% perfect. There's a couple minor issues but it's very polished overall.
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Well good to know I guess. I actually haven't messed around with Dolphin since finishing Xenoblade Chronicles in 2013, so I don't really have any idea how the games play on iterations beyond 4.x.
 
marc^o^ said:
Does it run well with Dolphin?
Click to expand...

m00h said:
I also would like to know. Still have the GC game, but no GC anymore.
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Watch the video?
Give DF a well deserved click ;) Seriously DF Retro is awesome.
Although I have to say given the research John&co usually do, I'm a little disappointed they straight up given the wrong information about the Wii version's graphics which are anything but *identical* especially as far as effects go.

Also wow I never knew the PAL release had a voiced intro :O
Back then I still used to buy everything imported from the US/JPN since the risk of 50Hz and delayed releases was still too high.
 
Jonneh3003 said:
I posted this in the other thread but didn't Metroid Prime run on a modified version of Unreal Engine 2? Didn't hear John mention it
Click to expand...

dark10x said:
Now that's not something I had ever heard.

Not impossible but...Retro was working on this tech in the late 90s originally. I'm not even sure UE2 was capable of the type of level streaming we see in Prime. No other UE2 game could deliver results like that and the engine was still extremely new at that point.
Click to expand...
The rumor was based on very little. If I recall correctly, a handful of files had naming structures in line with files generated by UE2 tools or something vaguely along those lines. Someone overstated it all and made some bigger claims to make it seem like a grand discovery, but I believe it was all largely debunked.
 
dark10x said:
Now that's not something I had ever heard.

Not impossible but...Retro was working on this tech in the late 90s originally. I'm not even sure UE2 was capable of the type of level streaming we see in Prime. No other UE2 game could deliver results like that and the engine was still extremely new at that point.
Click to expand...

I think there was a rumour floating around earlier but it was debunked afaik.
 
Probably my favourite game of that generation. Certainly in my all-time top 5, too. Enjoyed Echoes just as much. These games defined the GameCube for me; more than Wind Waker, F-Zero, Sunshine and Resi 4.
 
It's cool to see the game getting some love. My roommate at the time got his copy signed by one of the Retro guys at a Gamestop by our place. Heh, good times. I still prefer the Wii version of the game. Remote and nunchuck just feels great and I was actually able to beat it then. Got stuck at one of the bosses on the GC version a long time ago. Playing through it again on the Wii and was easily able to get past that part. Felt great. Good game, though. And regardless of how you like to play it, it's definitely worth playing again.
 
The game still looks great and I never even noticed the water ripples. I sort of remember MP2 working even harder to create a believable world, even if Aether itself is less "alive" than some of the areas of Tallon 4. They went hard in on ambient creatures for it. I also think the game itself was better in my last playthrough, although that might be because I've played the first game to death.

The Jennifer Hale voice over is a pretty good fit for Samus, if they hadn't had any other dialog in the game it could have worked decently. But given how easily dialog can ruin the atmosphere it's probably best they erred on the side of not having any.
 
Nice one. GameCube had some amazingly complex looking games at 60FPS.

@Dark
I'm wondering if you've given it a thought to do one of these for MGS2 or the more complex MGS3 (I'm still amazed at the foliage in that game and neither MGS4 nor MGS5 seem to match up to it in foliage density or interaction)
 
Fantastic episode, far out I love DF Retro.

I wish he'd gone a little into the differences between the GC and Wii versions (something about that ripple effect being removed? I can't remember the details. Also I think they added small visual flourishes between NTSC and PALl releases but I'm only going from hearsay).

I've recently discovered that the original GameCube version runs like a dream in widescreen using Swiss home-brew. Definitely got to set up a date with GameCube Metroid Prime soon.
 
Can you guys imagine a next gen MP? Something running on frostbite or equivalent modern day engine? It's a shame Nintendo bowed out of the tech race. :/ I had an incredible time playing MP. Damnit.
 
It's insane how well the visuals of this game hold up today

Metroid Prime, Wind Waker, and Mario Sunshine are the only games that made it out of that generation still looking great today
 
Great video, but they said that the Wii version of MP is identical graphically to the GCN version despite several videos such as this one showing all the little graphical effects dropped from/changed in the Wii version.
 
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