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[Lime]

Gonna be real hard for democrats to break the Fox News bubble.

Or the Breitbart bubble, which is now part of the presidential administration. Perhaps all of the US will soon be in a Breitbart bubble.

"Gonna be real hard for the rest of the world to break through the Breitbart bubble." would perhaps be more appropriate

 

[KO Traveling Hobo]

There desperately needs to be some kind of educational blitzkrieg on rural America. Send teachers from CA/NJ/NY/etc to drop knowledge all over these motherfuckers, and eradicate the bible from the classroom.

Imagine if the entire country believed in climate change, universal healthcare, etc. Imagine the incredible strides we could make if the difference between the two parties' environmental policies weren't "we believe in global warming" and "we don't believe in global warming", but "we want renewable energy" and "we want nuclear energy", for example.

Helping them also helps us.

 

[Qvoth]

We write a paper on the Big Bang in biology class. When Ashlie strikes out all the questions and simply writes down the story of creation from the Bible, she gets the full score.

hahahahaha

 

[Saya]

We write a paper on the Big Bang in biology class. When Ashlie strikes out all the questions and simply writes down the story of creation from the Bible, she gets the full score.

I'm curious... If Ashlie got the full score for her creationism answer, what score did the students who answered the question scientifically get?

 

[Codeblue]

Sounds like the town I grew up in and currently work in. Except I was one of those Muslims everyone got out of the way of (or hurled insults at, whatever).

There is some malice, but it is overwhelmingly ignorance. Like, to the point where those that are accepting often view me as the exception to their narrow views instead of a challenge to them. It's incredibly frustrating.

The promise of this country is that everything is moving towards cities and these people will be forced to interact with others on a large scale, as opposed to knowing an African American or a Muslim as a novelty.

People say that the liberals are living in their city bubbles, but I can assure you that the conservative bubble is just as isolating if not more so.

 

[LakeEarth]

My favourite part is how Obama was like Hitler because he wants health care for people. Yup, keeping people healthy, classic Hitler!

 

[Staccat0]

I'm from a town with less than 3,000 people in Missouri, and these people sound like fucking idiots compared to who I went to HS with, and we were goddamn numbskulls compared to my TX friends. WTF.

 

[GorillaJu]

In 1999, during his short-lived 2000 Reform Party presidential bid, Trump told CNN's Larry King: "If you can’t take care of your sick in the country, forget it, it’s all over. ... I believe in universal healthcare."

And in his 2000 book "The America We Deserve," Trump made a strong pitch for universal health care. As to how the country might achieve universal coverage, Trump focused on a Canadian-style, single-payer plan.



Heil Hitler, Minnesotans.

 

[Spectone]

Ok, I found it. He wrote that global warming was not man made, but was instead coming from the center of the Earth. His reference:

Bible Gateway passage: Isaiah 5:14 - New International Version. (n.d.). Retrieved August 03, 2016, from https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Isaiah

:-/

You mention the NIV but these people won't read that[1] they read the King James Version which says

"Therefore hell hath enlarged herself,
and opened her mouth without measure:
and their glory, and their multitude, and their pomp,
and he that rejoiceth, shall descend into it."

And they somehow assume that hell enlarging in this verse equates to a warming earth. But that interpretation is erroneous you cannot take single verses of the bible out withou reading them in context. In simplification the verse is talking about the nation of Israel doing bad things and as a consequence being punished and sent into exile. Something that happened before the birth of Christ.

[1] The KJV is an older translation of the bible but its based on documents that appear later chronologically. As earlier documents were found bible scholars discovered that there are errors in the later documents that the KJV was based upon. Because of this newer bible translations are based on the earlier more accurate documents. Some people saw this change as removing or changing scripture that they considered perfect. So they continue to use the older incorrect versions like the King James.

 

[nitekrawlwer]

Ah. I remember being yelled at by teachers for not believing in God or anything else that might upset their extra religious and ignorant views. Luckily my uncle on my father's side was the principal. I might have gotten in trouble a lot more often otherwise. Funny how insisting on the facts that I would read in the workbooks and books that my mother would send me while she was in the Navy in California was trouble making.

It is because I'm from a backwards rural place I think it's really quite pointless to even try changing their views. A huge waste of both time and money.

 

[PreyingShark]

That said, most of the time you get warnings not to go to Mall of America not for gay people, because black people. "Black people target white people, especially naive rural white people", it's said. "stay away from the Mall of Africa".

Sounds about right.

The core Twin Cities and most of the rest of Minnesota (including the outer cities) are two very different Minnesotas.

 

[dabig2]

Gonna be real hard for democrats to break the Fox News bubble.

Or the Breitbart bubble, which is now part of the presidential administration. Perhaps all of the US will soon be in a Breitbart bubble.

"Gonna be real hard for the rest of the world to break through the Breitbart bubble." would perhaps be more appropriate

Even with television and the internet around, AM radio is probably still the biggest hurdle. Most of that stuff is pure, unfiltered conservative crazy and tens of millions listen to it every day.

 

[BocoDragon]

https://hbr.org/2016/11/what-so-many-people-dont-get-about-the-u-s-working-class

This article might help you get into a better headspace of the middle American Trump voter. It actually made me feel better than the OP did.

 

[Lime]

https://hbr.org/2016/11/what-so-many-people-dont-get-about-the-u-s-working-class

This article might help you get into a better headspace of the middle American Trump voter. It actually made me feel better than the OP did.

No it's not a very good piece. The open declaration that we should pull back on criticizing police violence is what makes this morally repugnant.

I do not defend police who kill citizens for selling cigarettes. But the current demonization of the police underestimates the difficulty of ending police violence against communities of color. Police need to make split-second decisions in life-threatening situations. I don’t. If I had to, I might make some poor decisions too.

Fuck that trash. This is what it looks like to begin to accommodate a white nationalist politics.

Also, this: http://bust.com/feminism/18550-white-working-class.html

And finally, the myth that it's the poor or working class that voted Trump is demonstratively false. This narrative of the disenfranchised white poor people who vote Trump doesn't necessarily hold true, and it also ignores Black and Hispanic in the working class. And even if it was true, it also reproduces white supremacy in that white feelings take precedence over non-white lives. It's a bad article and it obscures the issues.

 

[Dai Kaiju]

Good read. Thanks for the translation.

 

[The Pope]

I think if I hadnt gone to school in such a diverse nation I might have turned out like these guys. Wouldnt change living in SA for anything, you can never be racist once you experience black excellence on a daily basis in school.I go to an EXTREMELY Christian school, yet our headmaster denounced Trump after the results. It is possible to change mindsets, whilst SA still has a VERY long way to go, the difference between the Apartheid white generation and the born free white generation is enormous. We may have a shortage of teachers but atleast our curriculum isn't awful. At my school evolution is the only viewpoint taught(and taught very well) in Biology, no room for creationism despite it being the view of the school. Our government has protected against the hijacking of education by religion. South Africa was also the first country to legalise gay marriage. How can a country like South Africa go from being the most conservative and racist country in the world, to one of the most progressive, gives me hope that one day the switch will flip in the USA. In 8 years I predict a sea of blue on the election map.

Good read though, I dont buy that biology creationist test story where the girl scratched everything out. No way that is true....really?????

 

[autoduelist]

One thing I will not budge on is social issues.

Racism is evil and wrong. There is no justification for it. Racists are capable of change and that should be the goal. But there should not be an inch in making racism feel accepted.

That was the point I was making in the first paragraph. This is how the religious right feels about issues such as abortion. They shut down, and refuse to listen. They do not budge an inch, because 'abortion is evil and wrong'. I agree, racism is terrible. So does most of the right. But the right defines racism differently that you do, and comes at it from a different angle, just like the religious right comes at the abortion issue from a completely different angle. There are certainly racists out there. Obviously. But the reductionism of all that is Trump into a single word ignores why many actually voted for the man despite him being so crass, vulgar, and unlikeable -- even to many of his voters.

This isn't about accepting racism - nobody wants to do that. It's about effective communication and engaging the 'other' without shutting off. Calling someone a racist who doesn't think they are a racist is about as effective as someone calling someone who is pro-choice a 'baby murderer'. It gets nowhere, fast. It's actually worse than nowhere. It makes communication impossible. Sure, there are plenty of repugnant people out there. But this idea that suddenly half the country is repugnant and not worth talking to is short sighted.

Both sides think the other side is morally repugnant. Do you see what I mean? You think you're on the side of what is just and right, and.... so does the religious right. Now, I'm not religious, and I veer radically left on social issues and veer right on economic issues. it's clear as day that this country has destroyed it's ability to communicate with the 'other'.

 

[Aureon]

We write a paper on the Big Bang in biology class. When Ashlie strikes out all the questions and simply writes down the story of creation from the Bible, she gets the full score.

What the hell is even happening in there.
Also, is bullying a real thing in highschool for america \ rural america? I've always thought it was a television thing. I've never seen or heard of anyone getting physically intimidated or anything like that through my entire journey through school (Italy)

https://hbr.org/2016/11/what-so-many-people-dont-get-about-the-u-s-working-class

This article might help you get into a better headspace of the middle American Trump voter. It actually made me feel better than the OP did.

I was kind of with it, until the police violence thing. That's one of the most stupid, debunked answers to police brutality.

It has some points, but definitely gets a weird narrative to tell for a 2-3% swing from 2012 to 2016.

 

[digdug2k]

Sounds about right.

The core Twin Cities and most of the rest of Minnesota (including the outer cities) are two very different Minnesotas.

While I don't doubt that towns like this exist, they're not all like that (mine wasn't). This "as soon as you get out of the city people are idiots" mentality is probably part of the rift. I think teachers probably drive these attitudes at school, and parents at home. Its sad that most of our school testing programs are probably about be rolled back so we'll have an even harder time identifying districts like this and getting these awful teachers out.

 

[BajiBoxer]

You mention the NIV but these people won't read that[1] they read the King James Version which says

"Therefore hell hath enlarged herself,
and opened her mouth without measure:
and their glory, and their multitude, and their pomp,
and he that rejoiceth, shall descend into it."

And they somehow assume that hell enlarging in this verse equates to a warming earth. But that interpretation is erroneous you cannot take single verses of the bible out withou reading them in context. In simplification the verse is talking about the nation of Israel doing bad things and as a consequence being punished and sent into exile. Something that happened before the birth of Christ.

[1] The KJV is an older translation of the bible but its based on documents that appear later chronologically. As earlier documents were found bible scholars discovered that there are errors in the later documents that the KJV was based upon. Because of this newer bible translations are based on the earlier more accurate documents. Some people saw this change as removing or changing scripture that they considered perfect. So they continue to use the older incorrect versions like the King James.

Interesting, didn't know that about the translations. The reference I listed though isn't mine, that's a direct copy/paste of the reference this guy provided. I still have access to my course website ;-)

 

[Spectone]

Interesting, didn't know that about the translations. The reference I listed though isn't mine, that's a direct copy/paste of the reference this guy provided. I still have access to my course website ;-)

I may be wrong about this particular persons adherence to KJV but I see it a lot in similar conspiracy minded people. The NIV version just replaces hell with the grave but that doesn't make as much sense in context.

 

[Blablurn]

I rememeber when my classmates, that went to america for an exchange year in high school, told me that many Americans asked them if Hitler was still alive :lol

Absurd.

 

[Seventy70]

Liberals really need a Fox News of their own. The appeal to rural people must be the blunt attitude of it. The audience of Fox News is most likely the same kinds of people who only watch reality TV. We need a TV channel that is shameless and has an emotional tone, something that caters to the reality TV audience.

 

[besada]

New map:

This map mostly shows you don't understand what's happening in the country. It's not a coast versus flyover, it's rural versus city, even in the coastal states. Go take a look at the county by county vote totals for New York, and you'll begin to realize why this map is so dumb.

Beyond being dumb, it's insulting. It also contains the vast majority of the country's black population, a huge part of its Hispanic population, and the majority of its poor population. So keep posting it if you want to signal you have no clue what you're talking about, and that you'd like to exclude black, Hispanic, and poor people from America. That's a good look.

 

[Pilgrimzero]

There really is 2 Americas. Maybe we would be better splitting into 2.

 

[Lime]

There really is 2 Americas. Maybe we would be better splitting into 2.

No we need better and stronger institutions and less poisonous hate media. That would go a long way in creating better grounds for happiness and a feeling of collectiveness

 

[Beefy]

There really is 2 Americas. Maybe we would be better splitting into 2.

2 America's would eventually wage war on each other.

 

[Alex]

This map mostly shows you don't understand what's happening in the country. It's not a coast versus flyover, it's rural versus city, even in the coastal states. Go take a look at the county by county vote totals for New York, and you'll begin to realize why this map is so dumb.

Beyond being dumb, it's insulting. It also contains the vast majority of the country's black population, a huge part of its Hispanic population, and the majority of its poor population. So keep posting it if you want to signal you have no clue what you're talking about, and that you'd like to exclude black, Hispanic, and poor people from America. That's a good look.

Pretty much, American geography is complicated. Even the much beloved blue states have tons of red in them. I live in SE Washington and it's another world from NW Washington.

 

[BajiBoxer]

I may be wrong about this particular persons adherence to KJV but I see it a lot in similar conspiracy minded people. The NIV version just replaces hell with the grave but that doesn't make as much sense in context.

Yeah, though I tried not to overthink it. It's intirely possible he didn't even read his reference, and assumed they were all the same. Looking at some other things he wrote, the main crux of his argument against worrying about global warming comes down to it being impossible to ruin the planet, so the reason behind global warming doesn't really matter that much in the end. Basically, God created the planet, and man can't destroy what God created. I've come across this reasoning more among evangelical Christians as the data is more conclusive. Rather than lie about it, or deny it, more are just hand waving it away.

 

[eyeball_kid]

“If a nation expects to be ignorant and free in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be. An informed citizenry is at the heart of a dynamic democracy.”
– Thomas Jefferson

“The death of democracy is not likely to be from assassinations or ambush. It will be a slow extinction from apathy, indifference, and undernourishment.”
– Robert Maynard Hutchins

It is my view at this point that the education system needs to be Federalized. We are producing Americans that don't have the education required to be vigilant in their defense of democracy, and an appreciation of their civic responsibility to do so.

 

[Jonm1010]

"This is totally unfair, that people who do not work at all still get the same insurance as someone who works day and night. If I had worked hard for my wealth, it would be unfair if I did not have a better health insurance, „ says my host dad.

In my politics class in Berlin, we would teach him that he falls for an ideology that is designed to preserve class differences.

This cuts to the core of what really differentiates America from a lot of Western Europe IMO.

 

[BocoDragon]

No it's not a very good piece. The open declaration that we should pull back on criticizing police violence is what makes this morally repugnant.



Fuck that trash. This is what it looks like to begin to accommodate a white nationalist politics.

Also, this: http://bust.com/feminism/18550-white-working-class.html

And finally, the myth that it's the poor or working class that voted Trump is demonstratively false. This narrative of the disenfranchised white poor people who vote Trump doesn't necessarily hold true, and it also ignores Black and Hispanic in the working class. And even if it was true, it also reproduces white supremacy in that white feelings take precedence over non-white lives. It's a bad article and it obscures the issues.

Your dismissal of it seems radical. It was a rather dry analysis written by a feminist legal scholar and a contributor to HuffPo.

We can't sweep away attempts to understand the mainline voters in America because we'd prefer to force an interpretation of it as pure white nationalism.

 

[godhandiscen]

Great read.

 

[Holundrian]

You know I really want to empathize with these people but stories like these make it insanely hard. Like I just cannot fathom the stupidity of these positions(the rural America ones). Nothing is based on facts. I just can't....

Interesting read though, good on her for being diplomatic enough... I personally would have shut myself out in that environment.

 

[Xater]

I don't think I would have lasted in a scenario like that myself. I am also German and probably would have gotten into arguments every single day.

 

[KeRaSh]

We write a paper on the Big Bang in biology class. When Ashlie strikes out all the questions and simply writes down the story of creation from the Bible, she gets the full score.

This must either be exaggerated or made up to make the story more interesting / funny.
I refuse to believe that.

Spoiler

 

[Munti]

Also, is bullying a real thing in highschool for america \ rural america? I've always thought it was a television thing. I've never seen or heard of anyone getting physically intimidated or anything like that through my entire journey through school (Italy)

What? I'm also from Europe and bullying is definitely a thing, even outside of America.
I'm rather shocked and jealous that you didn't experience/see this behaviour in your school time. Good for you

 

[sanstesy]

hi Paulina

?

 

[Cipherr]

I mean, it's well written, but the main crux seems to be "These people aren't dumb, they are just raised dumb". Which to me, isn't really a whole world of difference.

Also, it seems to suggest that these kids have no way of finding information that isn't enclosed within their own town. They still have the ability to read, they still have the internet, so I don't think the 'small town echo chamber' excuse really holds as much weight as it used to.

Right wing nonsense hasn't let the internet come and just whisk these people into correct information. Breitbart and more are riiiiiight there to be the landing spot for people with these fucked up mindsets.

They have to truly want to see other perspectives in order to break free of that shit IMO. There's not much there to push them into it if they don't really desire it themselves.

 

[Turin Turambar]

Leaving the echo chamber really helps shaping perspective, not everything is black and white. If I was brought up in such an environment I'd probably think Trump was a good candidate as well.

Well, in this case seems to me changing one echo chamber for the other. Because she described a very strong echo chamber.

And yeah, doh, of course where you are born and grow up decide most of your beliefs, maybe if I was born in Afghanistan I would be right now a Taliban wanting to blow up Americans. But that doesn't mean blowing up American is also a equally valid choice in life, in comparison with others.

 

[Randam]

I mean, it's well written, but the main crux seems to be "These people aren't dumb, they are just raised dumb". Which to me, isn't really a whole world of difference.

Also, it seems to suggest that these kids have no way of finding information that isn't enclosed within their own town. They still have the ability to read, they still have the internet, so I don't think the 'small town echo chamber' excuse really holds as much weight as it used to.

this

Fuck. Off.

And this in particular.

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

Amazing read.

 

[paradise_circus]

sounds like the khan Academy should rename itself to jesusacademy or something.

 

[Fritz]

I think it is indisputable imho that she is coming from one "echo chamber" into another "echo chamber". She recognizes this in the last paragraph.

 

[Vitten]

They should massively expand the exchange student program and send a lot more youngsters abroad. Send these kids a year to another continent and experience the real world outside of their shell.

Pretty sure they would change their mind on lots of things.

 

[thetrin]

"What is the problem with Obama?" I ask.

Everyone is laughing at me. As if that were really a question.

But, well, stupid: "He wants to give everyone health insurance."

Yes, he is truly Hitler, because he wants to give everyone healthcare. Jesus Christ.

“If a nation expects to be ignorant and free in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be. An informed citizenry is at the heart of a dynamic democracy.”
– Thomas Jefferson

“The death of democracy is not likely to be from assassinations or ambush. It will be a slow extinction from apathy, indifference, and undernourishment.”
– Robert Maynard Hutchins

It is my view at this point that the education system needs to be Federalized. We are producing Americans that don't have the education required to be vigilant in their defense of democracy, and an appreciation of their civic responsibility to do so.

This 100%. The undereducated heart of America is killing the country from within, slowly and painfully.

 

[-MB-]

I mean, it's well written, but the main crux seems to be "These people aren't dumb, they are just raised dumb". Which to me, isn't really a whole world of difference.

Also, it seems to suggest that these kids have no way of finding information that isn't enclosed within their own town. They still have the ability to read, they still have the internet, so I don't think the 'small town echo chamber' excuse really holds as much weight as it used to.

The issue here they are tightly knit communities with low tolerance for views that do not jive with them, so any of those people there that do what you see, get enlightened, then try to tell/teach others there what u figured out, they usually get ostracized or shunned, and they likely either shut up, or more likely move outta there, so you still end up with that small
tightly knit community that have a very narrow worldview.

 

[Randam]

I think it is indisputable imho that she is coming from one "echo chamber" into another "echo chamber". She recognizes this in the last paragraph.

Isn't everyone coming from an echo chamber?
But you that kind of echo chamber and you have that other kind of echo chamber.

 

[Turin Turambar]

Are there any rural german rural cities where the evolution theory is a no go?

America is the only place in the Western world where there is a hot debate around it. In the rest of the world, even for conservative/right-leaning areas, there is indifference. Most people don't even think about it, it's just a "well... I suppose the scientists are right, they are the experts. /shrug" type of thing.

 

[pswii60]

"This is totally unfair, that people who do not work at all still get the same insurance as someone who works day and night. If I had worked hard for my wealth, it would be unfair if I did not have a better health insurance, „ says my host dad.

Ugh.

Regardless, I don't know how Obamacare works, but in the UK, obviously we have the NHS. But that doesn't prevent those 'with wealth' from signing up for private healthcare, where you get the additional benefits of private hospitals, additional treatment options and significantly reduced waiting times.