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[nelsonroyale]

Kind of shows the economy is a bit fucked if it rises for a massive tumour like Trump. But, of course, the economy is deranged, since the profit motive still takes precendence over social progress and environmental sustainability.

 

[Ziltoidia 9]

After the tax cuts he is proposing (and they are huge) it will probably last at least 4 years or so. But then it will cause another 2008.

 

[studyguy]

It does if you have a retirement account.

I do, it still doesn't matter much.

If people really want to look at the DOW with any sense beyond 'wow 20k as a milestone' then it would make sense to look at the velocity the DOW hit 20,000 from 19,000 (compared to 18,000 to 19,000). I'm not arguing that the DOW is not a good proxy to the overall equity markets, but the DOW itself hitting 20,000 is basically like any other day when the DOW goes up, it was expected to go up, it's not some shocking turn of events.

AT BEST the DOW hitting 20k spurs more confidence but it all the same S/P has been steady, high sure, but steady. As other people have mentioned we've been riding high for years now.

 

[Bam Bam Baklava]

Kind of shows the economy is a bit fucked if it rises for a massive tumour like Trump. But, of course, the economy is deranged, since the profit motive still takes precendence over social progress and environmental sustainability.

The economy is not the Dow Jones Industrial Index. In fact, I've never seen someone talk about the economy like this.

 

[Lumination]

I mean, yes, of course slashing regulations and the prospect of having a fellow "businessman" would raise stocks. This is expected. The danger is the longterm (waaaay past 4yrs) consequences of environmental damage, lack of innovation in renewable energy, etc. that will fuck us. The worst part is that it's so longterm that your average dumb American will not attribute it to Trump, but instead to whichever sucker has the reins when the hammmer falls.

 

[Skellig Gra]

Do you think Wall Street is celebrating because wages are going to go up under a Trump administration? Or because the environment is going to get cleaner? Or because the military industrial complex is going to shrink? Or because Wall Street itself is about to be reined in?

There's no need for pessimism or paranoia when the math is readily apparent to anyone who's not a dipshit.

All I'm saying is that in the short term this benefits more than just "rich people". Although if you read my first post in the thread you'll see that I acknowledge that this shit is going to come crashing down.

 

[marrec]

What if things don't get worse though.

There is an implicit question in here of:

"Worse for who?"

 

[rochet]

Its a good thing stock market is up. If market is up, companies capital is up=more company capex spending=more money to employ and more ppl spending there money. Plus helps retirement. Main street=wall street. But yes it give an added benefit to wall street traders, but remember anybody can trade, im personal in ticker axas. Gaf make and etrade account and invest and do ur due dd.

 

[sphagnum]

Since when have you had to be rich to benefit from stocks going up?

They benefit disproportionately.

 

[The Albatross]

I think I get the most entertainment out of market predictors who incessantly and perpetually predict a massive crash at some point in the future whenever the market hits a new high or has X amount of months of growth.

It's like watching a weather man who predicts that 7 days of sun will one day end in a day of rain, and then when that day of rain comes, he champions himself as Nostradamus. "I TOLD YOU IT WAS GOING TO RAIN!!"

There are just people that want things to be bad all the time, for some reason. If it's a sunny day, they're bemoaning the sun because one day it will rain. If it's a rainy day, it's horrible and they told you so that it would rain one day. If's almsot as if some people would rather be in recession like in 2008 and 2011, than have growth, because being negative and being right is more comforting an idea to them.

They benefit disproportionately.

Well, really, the benefit is exactly proportional to the money they have in the market...

 

[Mr. Poolman]

The crash could be so massive that the next 2 Democrat Presidents could be blamed for it!

 

[onadesertedisland]

Its a good thing stock market is up. If market is up, companies capital is up=more company capex spending=more money to employ and more ppl spending there money. Plus helps retirement. Main street=wall street. But yes it give and added benefit to wall street traders, but remember anybody can trade, im personal in ticker axas.

Companies are not restricted from hiring, they only hire as necessary. It's an absurd fallacy that companies will use increased profits to hire, they will either hoard or divest it to shareholders.

 

[KingV]

Yeah I give it another 6 months before the recession hits.

No shit. When he starts the trade war with Mexico and China a lot of those red states that voted him in are going to be hurting bad.

 

[Night Angel]

People making low effort "rich get richer" posts obviously don't understand that anyone with a pension, 401k, or IRA would benefit massively from an improved market. Cool beans guys, you're so edgy.

Not that this by itself is enough indication that the market has significantly improved, but come on. It's essentially shitposting and reveals a lack of real analysis.

Companies are not restricted from hiring, they only hire as necessary. It's an absurd fallacy that companies will use increased profits to hire, they will either hoard or divest it to shareholders.

Or they'll grow their business, which usually requires hiring people.

 

[Moppet13]

Its a good thing stock market is up. If market is up, companies capital is up=more company capex spending=more money to employ and more ppl spending there money. Plus helps retirement. Main street=wall street. But yes it give and added benefit to wall street traders, but remember anybody can trade, im personal in ticker axas.

This is an overly simplistic view, as much as I hate the comparisons in this thread about 1929 I'll have to compare this to 1929. Up to 1929 the market was booming because of overspeculation and margin spending. Stocks were at all time highs, but the average price earning ratio was about 32.2 the general average is about a price earning ratio of 20, which varies from sector to sector. meaning the price of the stocks were valued much more over their earnings than usual. Tech stocks typically have very high price to earning ratios so you'd think with the high weight of information technology stocks on the S&P 500 we would see high average price earning ratios. But the average is still well below the 1929 average of 32, and at about 25. Just because a stocks price is going up doesn't mean the company is making more money.

 

[JB1981]

Since when have you had to be rich to benefit from stocks going up?

2% of Americans hold 50% of investments.

 

[Skellig Gra]

2% of Americans hold 50% of investments.

And the people holding the other 50% benefit from this as well.

 

[Bishman]

My co-worker was not pleased when I told him this lol

 

[rochet]

Companies are not restricted from hiring, they only hire as necessary. It's an absurd fallacy that companies will use increased profits to hire, they will either hoard or divest it to shareholders.

Yes that is true but not all companies. Oil company capex goes up they drill more and need more employees to drill. Same with software companies etc games companies. It depends on company model, if there model is to always have to reinvest in capex then those companies will hire. However if it is a mature company like resturant or food company or service sector then they dont really need to invest in capex and it goes to investors. This is a over simplication example.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

TRUMP is going to make a lot of people richer, but the environment and personal freedoms fuck those things

 

[TylerD]

It's good that it (the market) goes up because that is what it has to do over time or our most popular retirement accounts are fucked. So glad we have drastically reduced the prevalence of pensions! Retirement being tied into the market is sooooooo much better and more exciting!!!

 

[damisa]

Yeah, if the Dow and SP500 were perfect indicators of the economy, then there shouldn't be any "economic anxiety."

Let's see if people are happy with the quality of their jobs in 4 years.

American workers are happier on the job than they have been since 2005, according to a new study.
The Conference Board business research association released the results of their latest employment satisfaction survey, revealing nearly 50% of U.S. employees are satisfied with their current job, an 11-year high.

http://fortune.com/2016/07/20/americans-happier-at-work-study/

• Unemployment is very low
• Stock Markets are at all time highs
• Housing prices have recovered
• Most people are happy in their jobs
• No current wars

Yet all the credit will probably go to Trump instead of Obama because Democrats suck at messaging

 

[reKon]

Its a good thing stock market is up. If market is up, companies capital is up=more company capex spending=more money to employ and more ppl spending there money. Plus helps retirement. Main street=wall street. But yes it give an added benefit to wall street traders, but remember anybody can trade, im personal in ticker axas. Gaf make and etrade account and invest and do ur due dd.

Which industry's are going to see the job growth? Can you tell me how to future of automation & AI comes into play here? Is this something that you've even thought of?

 

[Timeaisis]

Well, that's good, I suppose, but we gotta just hope he doesn't screw everything up with tariffs everywhere.

 

[Joe Shlabotnik]

Everyone should remember that the Dow Jones Industrial Average is actually a really lousy indicator of anything.

http://www.fool.com/investing/gener...-dow-jones-industrial-average-is-useless.aspx

In contrast, the S&P 500, a much better market indicator, hasn't seen very little movement over the month of January.

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/01/24/the-sp-500-is-on-course-to-do-something-it-hasnt-in-52-years.html

Financial stocks took off, basically.

 

[harSon]

People making low effort "rich get richer" posts obviously don't understand that anyone with a pension, 401k, or IRA would benefit massively from an improved market. Cool beans guys, you're so edgy.

Not that this by itself is enough indication that the market has significantly improved, but come on. It's essentially shitposting and reveals a lack of real analysis.


Or they'll grow their business, which usually requires hiring people.

I doubt anyone responding right now is at a point in their life where the ups and downs of their retirement plan is meaningful.

 

[Get Buff]

The rich are getting richer. Yay!!

The poor can buy stocks, too.

 

[Sidewinder]

After the tax cuts he is proposing (and they are huge) it will probably last at least 4 years or so. But then it will cause another 2008.

Yeah this will undoubtedly happen, but the question is when will it all tumble down? I'd rather it'd happen in 2 years, then at least he wouldn't get re-elected...although who knows, "Remake America Great Again" is a superb slogan and should be more than enough to get 4 more years!!1

 

[biggersmaller]

After the tax cuts he is proposing (and they are huge) it will probably last at least 4 years or so. But then it will cause another 2008.

You are correct about a collapse.

However, tax cuts will not be the cause. Like 2008, deregulation and Wallstreet in the administration allowing growth-at-any-cost fraud will. Trump will gut Frank-Dodd.

 

[JaggedSac]

Of course it is. Deregulation is going to make these companies bank

Yep. These stock prices have all of the anticipated actions built into them. We are technically in a bubble right now. If infrastructure spending and tax changes don't occur, the stock market will readjust. People decided they could make money on the chance that those things did occur. Odds were good too, since Repubs control the executive and legislative branch.

 

[TylerD]

You are correct about a collapse.

However, tax cuts will not be the cause. Like 2008, deregulation and Wallstreet in the administration allowing growth-at-any-cost fraud will. Trump will gut Frank-Dodd.

And Dodd-Frank too!

Deregulation, great for short term growth. Long term? Hold on to your butts.

 

[pr0cs]

Facepalm for anyone saying this only is good for rich people

 

[Deadbeat]

TRUMP is going to make a lot of people richer, but the environment and personal freedoms fuck those things

Speaking of freedoms, when is the machine gun registry being opened again? Isnt trumps kid super pro guns?

 

[Master Yoshi]

I don't give a fuck about money, I just want a future for my children...

 

[bachikarn]

http://fortune.com/2016/07/20/americans-happier-at-work-study/

• Unemployment is very low
• Stock Markets are at all time highs
• Housing prices have recovered
• Most people are happy in their jobs
• No current wars

Yet all the credit will probably go to Trump instead of Obama because Democrats suck at messaging

I do truly think that the economy has gotten better for most people under Obama. Unfortunately a certain segment of the population didn't and even worse, that segment has a relatively high amount of Electoral power.

I doubt any of that stuff that Trump is doing will help those people. Will those people still be pissed in four years when nothing has improved or will they stop caring because their guy is in charge? We will see.

 

[Sidewinder]

The poor can buy stocks, too.

The poor can only rely on their human capital, they aren't in a position to save 1'000s of $ to invest in the stock market and when markets crash they'd be fucked even more, because they might need that money then and there.

 

[reKon]

This is concerning to me because mother 60 now is likely to retire in the next 4-5 years. I know that we're going to be the ones to help support her at this point as she doesn't have enough in her 401K to support her very long. A perfectly timed crash right before she takes has to withdraw would be infuriating and would make things much harder for me as I'm trying to keep moving in my career (I'm trying to wipe out my remaining student debt in 3 years).

 

[mr stroke]

Yeah I give it another 6 months before the recession hits.

Yep

This is a clear sign of an incoming downturn, it's been 10 years were due.

 

[damisa]

This is concerning to me because mother 60 now is likely to retire in the next 4-5 years. I know that we're going to be the ones to help support her at this point as she doesn't have enough in her 401K to support her very long. A perfectly timed crash right before she takes has to withdraw would be infuriating and would make things much harder for me as I'm trying to keep moving in my career (I'm trying to wipe out my remaining student debt in 3 years).

When you are close to retiring you should move your money away from stocks and into safer investments like bonds

 

[Lord Frieza]

Well, I like this news. It's good to hear a Trump effect being positive for once. Hope it lasts.

I mean, it won't. At least not very long in the grand scheme of things.

 

[SyenceLabb]

Facepalm for anyone saying this only is good for rich people

I know, right? What's the alternative? Would you like the market to fall off a cliff instead?

 

[rochet]

Which industry's are going to see the job growth? Can you tell me how to future of automation & AI comes into play here? Is this something that you've even thought of?

Silicon valley, insurance ppl are getting older, energy oil/natgas, defense which is where im employed. Not everything will get automation/ai, you still have some manual workers in the car factorys. If you believe that then we will eventually become a socialized economy cause nobody can work, and anything other then a engineer degree will be useless. I dont belive that, and am putting money where my mouth is. Short the market then and see where that gets ya.

 

[JustenP88]

YES. Can't wait for them corporate profits. I went down to the local homeless shelter and told all the guys to expect tremendous GDP growth soon and they seemed excited.

 

[neorej]

Obama gets zero credit for Dow 6000 to 18000.

Trump gets credit for dow 20000. LOL

Reverse affirmative action.

Worse yet: Obama gets shat on for "bringing the economy down".

 

[tuxfool]

Yep. These stock prices have all of the anticipated actions built into them. We are technically in a bubble right now. If infrastructure spending and tax changes don't occur, the stock market will readjust. People decided they could make money on the chance that those things did occur. Odds were good too, since Repubs control the executive and legislative branch.

If trade is disrupted by protectionist policies that will cause readjustment. Infrastructure spending is also a very big unknown. The only thing that is worthy of confidence is that tax cuts will occur.

 

[Keasar]

Where have I seen this before?

 

[Bam Bam Baklava]

This is concerning to me because mother 60 now is likely to retire in the next 4-5 years. I know that we're going to be the ones to help support her at this point as she doesn't have enough in her 401K to support her very long. A perfectly timed crash right before she takes has to withdraw would be infuriating and would make things much harder for me as I'm trying to keep moving in my career (I'm trying to wipe out my remaining student debt in 3 years).

Should be divesting from riskier positions as much as possible. You are describing something that happened to a lot of people in 2008 and they had no choice but to get out at the bottom.

 

[commish]

Should be divesting from riskier positions as much as possible. You are describing something that happened to a lot of people in 2008 and they had no choice but to get out at the bottom.

Pretty much. If you are retiring in 4 years then you should be pretty bond heavy, I would imagine. At least I would be. I'm a chicken.

 

[rochet]

The poor can only rely on their human capital, they aren't in a position to save 1'000s of $ to invest in the stock market and when markets crash they'd be fucked even more, because they might need that money then and there.

Look not everybody can invest, but majority can if they make some sacrifices. Where i work which is boeing/defense as a technician i make the same salary as my peers and they seem to never have money nor be able to save money and never want to do overtime. Then they think im doing something illegal on the side because i have more then them. But these are the ppl who go out to bars/ have adventures, go on vacation all the time and buy small electronics all the time. I never go out to lunch and barely go on vacation and live a humble but boring lifestyle and worked 600 hours of ot last year, and invested any extra money i could for the last 10 years and is finally paying off and next year i should be able to start a flight school business. It really saddens me when people feel so hopeless they dont even have motivation to try. Before boeing i was target backroom for a year and best buy inventory stock for year and half, and alot of them lost all hope to move on.

 

[demosthenes]

So what happens after this high ends?

If the talks about rolling back regulations are true, the high might not end for a while. Businesses will be able to make more money in the short run.