Is Injustice 2 considered broken???

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PositiveGamer

Member
This is not a complain thread..
It is just an observation.

First of all, I love injustice 2. It is probably one of the deepest must polished fighting titles I have played...

A little about me.. I love all fighting games.. I grew up with them.. I always gravitate to play fair with all of them. From Street Fighter 2 all way to Virtua Fighter. I am not an expert but I am not a scrub either.

My gripe with injustice is the unbalanced gameplay. My main character is Black Canary. I can go to town with pretty much anyone online.

As you may know, black canary doesn't have any powers. Her character relies in simple hand to hand combat.

However, I tend to confront several beyond cheap online opponents. As soon as I pick Canary, they rush to Superman or DR Fate. During the whole match, they literally just stay back and keep shooting at me with projectiles. The worst has to be DR Fate where is literally 2 frames between fireballs..
I can try to dodge, roll forward, time projectiles but it is just beyond impossible.

My only save is canary's scream special but even when I manage to stun superman, or fate, I proceed to jump or get close to continue my attacks but they usually manage to back off using one of their wake up attacks..

Then, they once again continue to step away and shoot projectiles once again...

This is now a running joke as I see. Too many online are doing it when they see Canary.

What do they gain from this?? Does this make them a better opponent online? How does a win like this even encourage anyone to play??

Sorry for the long read, has anyone else experienced this with this game?

BTW.. I am aware I can also just choose another character. But shouldn't a game like this play fair for every character in the roster?
 
Sounds like you should have invested in the No Honor Edition of the game. If you've played fighting games for awhile, this shouldn't be anything new to you. Zoning is a natural part of the game.
 
Sounds more like you're encountering a bad match up more than anything. I'm not too familiar with Injustice 2, but I'm sure other characters have better ways around projectiles.#

The game isn't broken, your playstyle sounds lacking.
 
It's not broken, it just has tough matchups. Canary has a tough time against both, patience is the key. You have to learn out to walk people down and use cartwheel effectively. Once you're in don't let up. Superman is easier to deal with on knockdown because all his wakeups are highs so you can d3 on knockdown to punish basically all his options except scoop I believe. Fate is harder but you can learn to jump his wakeup since it's the only one he has and it mostly covers the space in front of him. Take both characters to training mode, record yourself doing their projectiles, and learn what to look for and how to counter it. Do the same for their wakeups.
 
Injustice has always been Zoning: The Game since the first one and it's garbage. Huge screen space, super fast projectile moves. It's a mess.
 
Human Trashcan said:
Injustice has always been Zoning: The Game since the first one and it's garbage. Huge screen space, super fast projectile moves. It's a mess.
Click to expand...


Yet zoners are not the characters winning, only online where it's harder to react to zoning. Even then I beat many Deadshots, Ivys, Fates, and Supermans with my Canary. The problem is people get frustrated and would rather complain or ask for nerfs than actually learn how to deal with things.
 
Compbros said:
Yet zoners are not the characters winning, only online where it's harder to react to zoning. Even then I beat many Deadshots, Ivys, Fates, and Supermans with my Canary. The problem is people get frustrated and would rather complain or ask for nerfs than actually learn how to deal with things.
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Online is how most people play the game. I don't care how you wanna justify it, it's not fun to learn to play against. And designing the game solely with local play in mind is p dumb
 
Diablohead said:
It's a very netherrealm thing and it bothers me in their games.
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Projectiles are stronger because there's no clash to them (two projectiles meeting and and cancelling each other) but, again, you will not see an Injustice 2 tournament won on zoning. The game has good walkspeed/dashes and mb roll so you can beat zoning if you know how.


Here's Whiteboi (Scarecrow) vs. Forever King (Batman), King zones heavily the ENTIRE set while Scarecrow has no projectile for counter zoning so Whiteboi has to walk Batman down.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8MP9lECVKU

Human Trashcan said:
Online is how most people play the game. I don't care how you wanna justify it, it's not fun to learn to play against. And designing the game solely with local play in mind is p dumb
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It's not justification, it's learning and improving. Learn to walk people down, learn to use meterburn roll, learn to use your tools effectively. Don't just go "gah, zoning", throw your hands up, and complain. Do something about it on your end instead of wanting an aspect of the game severely toned down because you are incapable of dealing with it.

Also, I'm using the royal "you" not saying you specifically. Except this part.


"It's not fun to learn to play against". So you really just don't even want to learn how to counteract it and improve, you just want it nerfed so you can play against whatever you want however you want. Matchups must be played differently and if you're getting zoned out you should be asking how do you stop getting zoned out instead of hoping for the developer to do it for you.
 
Compbros said:
It's not broken, it just has tough matchups. Canary has a tough time against both, patience is the key. You have to learn out to walk people down and use cartwheel effectively. Once you're in don't let up. Superman is easier to deal with on knockdown because all his wakeups are highs so you can d3 on knockdown to punish basically all his options except scoop I believe. Fate is harder but you can learn to jump his wakeup since it's the only one he has and it mostly covers the space in front of him. Take both characters to training mode, record yourself doing their projectiles, and learn what to look for and how to counter it. Do the same for their wakeups.
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Thanks for the reply. I'll check it out. It is just sad how some just exploit it.



Stone Ocean said:
Some characters will naturally suffer vs zoning. That's how fighting games have always been.
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I feel I haven't had this problem with any fighting game till this one. Even with MKX, my main was Cassie Cage, and I was really good versus anyone with patience. However, with Injustice, I feel that even with patience, I get nowhere with cheap players. Those 2 frame fireballs by Fate are beyond annoying!
 
Terrible matchups all over the place and huge emphasis on zoning does kinda break the game for me. But it's in usual NRS fashion. Only reason I even played it for a bit was because Black Adam felt fun to play but that's about it. I haven't played in awhile, and putting MK characters in the game is a huge turnoff for me as well. I don't hate MK I just don't want to see them in the game when DC has characters NRS has ignored, and gave the slots to MK characters instead.
 
Zoning is strong in this game but there are certainly ways around it. Some characters just have a really easy time of getting through it (Cheetah) while some have to work harder to get through it.

But either way, zoning is currently in no way broken to the point where it can't be beaten. It's just incredibly unfun to play against the likes of Deadshot and Firestorm (Firestorm in particular, fuck that guy and his airdash and low freezing shit) because you have to work hard and slow to gain ground but you can lose a lot of it in one slipup. Or you have to commit resources to get through it which is never a guarantee.
 
Compbros said:
Yet zoners are not the characters winning, only online where it's harder to react to zoning. Even then I beat many Deadshots, Ivys, Fates, and Supermans with my Canary. The problem is people get frustrated and would rather complain or ask for nerfs than actually learn how to deal with things.
Click to expand...


I hope you are not referring to me. The first thing I wrote here was that this was indeed not a complain thread. Just an observation!
 
For success in Injustice you need to know several characters. You're complaining about getting counter picked but you're not doing any counter picking yourself. Look at EVO. Honeybee (a Flash main) knew that Flash vs. Aqua is a horrible matchup. So he himself switched to Aqua for the mirror (albeit unsuccessfully). All the top players know at least 2-3 characters.
 
PositiveGamer said:
My only save is canary's scream special but even when I manage to stun superman, or fate, I proceed to jump or get close to continue my attacks but they usually manage to back off using one of their wake up attacks..
Click to expand...

You should be able to rush in and do a good damaging combo after using Canary scream. You need to dash in before they hit the ground.

If you block the wake up attacks, you can punish supes and fate pretty good. For most players, once you block their initial wake up and they go down again, they'll likely try something else instead. You can keep the pressure on in that case.
 
It's not considered broken on, because there are thigns you can do to get around it, like meter burn in order to close the distance.

But it is considered be pretty lame. Injustice 1 EVO grand finals usually devolved into Sups vs sups with full screen eyelazers being the talk of the town. It was boring to watch.

There's a lot of lame shit in Injustice 2 as well like deadshots sniper, Aquaman's spear rush, sups' eyes...it's not broken, but it is a gigantic amount of reward for basically no risk. It's why most people I know fell off of Injustice really early. That playstyle is very difficult to punish, tot he point where it simply makes more sense to use another lame character to get the win.

It's why most marvel 3 matches have doom on the team. His skill set is very lame and has very little personal risk.

Human Trashcan said:
Online is how most people play the game. I don't care how you wanna justify it, it's not fun to learn to play against. And designing the game solely with local play in mind is p dumb
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This isn't true at all. The stats for all modern netherrealm games corroborate the fact that most people play offline exclusively. It's something like 20-40% that actually go online for longer than 50 matches.
 
Compbros said:
It's not justification, it's learning and improving. Learn to walk people down, learn to use meterburn roll, learn to use your tools effectively. Don't just go "gah, zoning", throw your hands up, and complain. Do something about it on your end instead of wanting an aspect of the game severely toned down because you are incapable of dealing with it.

Also, I'm using the royal "you" not saying you specifically. Except this part.


"It's not fun to learn to play against". So you really just don't even want to learn how to counteract it and improve, you just want it nerfed so you can play against whatever you want however you want. Matchups must be played differently and if you're getting zoned out you should be asking how do you stop getting zoned out instead of hoping for the developer to do it for you.
Click to expand...

Uh I'm not complaining or asking for nerfs I'm just saying it's not fun to play at all so I hopped off the Injustice train after 1 and seeing that 2 was more of the same. Hard pass. I think it's shit. You can't even begin to play the game until you learn how to deal with all the zoning shit. That is awful, terrible game design in my opinion.
 
Is a game considered broken when you are bad at it?

That's not to say you are bad at Injustice per se, just that you seem to have become frustrated with the game and decided it was the game's fault and not yours.
 
PositiveGamer said:
I feel I haven't had this problem with any fighting game till this one. Even with MKX, my main was Cassie Cage, and I was really good versus anyone with patience. However, with Injustice, I feel that even with patience, I get nowhere with cheap players. Those 2 frame fireballs by Fate are beyond annoying!
Click to expand...



MKX was different as it was rushdown/mixup heavy, toned down the zoning heavily, and had the run mechanic to help you get in.


PositiveGamer said:
I hope you are not referring to me. The first thing I wrote here was that this was indeed not a complain thread. Just an observation!
Click to expand...


Not at all, was referring to others.
 
Human Trashcan said:
Uh I'm not complaining or asking for nerfs I'm just saying it's not fun to play at all so I hopped off the Injustice train after 1 and seeing that 2 was more of the same. Hard pass. I think it's shit. You can't even begin to play the game until you learn how to deal with all the zoning shit. That is awful, terrible game design in my opinion.
Click to expand...



If you are saying "it's not fun to learn how to deal with it" and you refuse to play because you aren't willing to learn how can I take that as anything but "I don't want to learn so if they're not gonna tone it down I'm not gonna play".

You have to learn how to play against Guile and his zoning, you have to learn how to play against Morridoom and their zoning, you have to learn how to play against Peacock and her zoning. You have to learn how to deal with zoning in any fighter with fast projectiles just like you have to learn how to deal with mixup/rushdown/grappler characters.
 
Compbros said:
If you are saying "it's not fun to learn how to deal with it" and you refuse to play because you aren't willing to learn how can I take that as anything but "I don't want to learn so if they're not gonna tone it down I'm not gonna play".

You have to learn how to play against Guile and his zoning, you have to learn how to play against Morridoom and their zoning, you have to learn how to play against Peacock and her zoning. You have to learn how to deal with zoning in any fighter with fast projectiles just like you have to learn how to deal with mixup/rushdown/grappler characters.
Click to expand...

To be fair, Doom missiles was always always always too good.
 
First of all, it's not broken. What you're talking about is balance, not whether the game is broken or not.

PositiveGamer said:
As you may know, black canary doesn't have any powers. Her character relies in simple hand to hand combat.

However, I tend to confront several beyond cheap online opponents. As soon as I pick Canary, they rush to Superman or DR Fate. During the whole match, they literally just stay back and keep shooting at me with projectiles. The worst has to be DR Fate where is literally 2 frames between fireballs..
I can try to dodge, roll forward, time projectiles but it is just beyond impossible.

My only save is canary's scream special but even when I manage to stun superman, or fate, I proceed to jump or get close to continue my attacks but they usually manage to back off using one of their wake up attacks..

Then, they once again continue to step away and shoot projectiles once again..
Click to expand...

You get a full combo off level 3 scream. Learn it. The Canary match-up against zoners is about them being too scared to press a button full-screen once you have level 3 scream, because it's a full and free combo for you. You can then use their hesitation to close the gap.

Superman's wake-up attacks aren't safe. Block and punish.

Dr Fate's push him away and he doesn't have Superman's mobility, so you can slowly back him into a corner.

Armored moves blow through both characters' wake-ups.

I'm not being rude when I say this but you need to explore match-ups and the game thoroughly before suggesting the game itself is broken. Not saying fighting zoners isn't frustrating (it can be a reeeeal grind and a test of patience) but again, not the same as broken.
 
It's not broken but it's frustrating if you like rushdown characters but have so much screen space required to get in, doesn't help that there's chip damage and characters who can teleport so closing out matches can feel like a foregone conclusion if your aren't a zoner character yourself.
 
Human Trashcan said:
Online is how most people play the game. I don't care how you wanna justify it, it's not fun to learn to play against. And designing the game solely with local play in mind is p dumb
Click to expand...

Super happy that NRS left zoning alone and refuse to listen to people like you that refuse how to learn to play.
 
Compbros said:
Projectiles are stronger because there's no clash to them (two projectiles meeting and and cancelling each other) but, again, you will not see an Injustice 2 tournament won on zoning. The game has good walkspeed/dashes and mb roll so you can beat zoning if you know how.


Here's Whiteboi (Scarecrow) vs. Forever King (Batman), King zones heavily the ENTIRE set while Scarecrow has no projectile for counter zoning so Whiteboi has to walk Batman down.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8MP9lECVKU
Click to expand...

Man, I hate this fucking matchup. Teleport does not function properly. Come on, mannnnnnnnn.
 
PrivateRyan said:
First of all, it's not broken. What you're talking about is balance, not whether the game is broken or not.



You get a full combo off level 3 scream. Learn it. The Canary match-up against zoners is about them being too scared to press a button full-screen once you have level 3 scream, because it's a full and free combo for you. You can then use their hesitation to close the gap.

Superman's wake-up attacks aren't safe. Block and punish.

Dr Fate's push him away and he doesn't have Superman's mobility, so you can slowly back him into a corner.

Armored moves blow through both characters' wake-ups.

I'm not being rude when I say this but you need to explore match-ups and the game thoroughly before suggesting the game itself is broken. Not saying fighting zoners isn't frustrating (it can be a reeeeal grind and a test of patience) but again, not the same as broken.
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Thanks for the tip..


Crossing Eden said:
So basically people are counter picking your main character?
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Not what I said at all! Big contrast between countering and not even fighting.
 
PositiveGamer said:
Did you even read what I said?
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Um, yes? You opened the thread by implying you think the game is broken. I disagree.

Then, you further imply the game is broken by saying that too many people online rely on zoning, going so far as to imply that it's an unfair and exploitive way to play "What do they gain from this?? Does this make them a better opponent online? How does a win like this even encourage anyone to play??". Again, I disagree.

You should learn to cope with the zoning, not blame the game or other players for your lack of skill in coping with zoning.
 
Compbros said:
Yet Dooms are losing, on and offline. People had to learn how to deal or get swallowed up.
Click to expand...

Edit because that's some dumb shit.

Doom on point is still middling as it's always been. People got better about pulling him out early to deal with him, but that doesn't mean that doom missiles aren't the best assist in the game, even after being nerfed.
 
Symbiotx said:
It's frustrating but not broken.

Forward dodge roll meter burn, punish, repeat.
Click to expand...



I feel like an idiot. I completely forgot about the forward dodge roll! LOL I been focused with other moves and her cartwheel to get around since I started playing!


stanislavskov said:
Um, yes? You opened the thread by implying you think the game is broken. I disagree.

Then, you further imply the game is broken by saying that too many people online rely on zoning, going so far as to imply that it's an unfair and exploitive way to play "What do they gain from this?? Does this make them a better opponent online? How does a win like this even encourage anyone to play??". Again, I disagree.

You should learn to cope with the zoning, not blame the game or other players for your lack of skill in coping with zoning.
Click to expand...

That's why I said, I feel this game is one of the deepest and best fighters out there. Then I proceeded to talk about the balance of this game. Yes, As I am reading here, there are ways around. But me questioning cheap players is legit. I understand if you have to zone because you are losing or need time to regenerate a meter. But the whole match? That's just exploiting the game!
 
Injustice 2 isn't broken, but the game is a bit zoning-heavy. As for your situation, it sounds more like a bad match-up than anything else. I also wouldn't say it's the deepest fighting game out there. It has depth, yeah, but not on something like UMvC3 or GGXrd's level.

Ravelle said:
They had a the chance of redeeming Aquaman and making him into a cool Jason Momoa type character with some interesting moves, instead they kept him as a lame character trying to pick up pees from a plate.
Click to expand...
You can make him look like Jason Momoa via gear parts, but they aren't gonna completely change his look without killing off Regime Earth Aquaman & replacing him with an Aquaman from another Earth.
 
Mesoian said:
Yeah it only took 3 years and an even more broken character (Virgil) to break him.

And even then, Doom is still a pools favorite because he still works most of the time against people who aren't the best of the best.
Click to expand...


Doom is in a lot of teams beyond his good assist. He has 3 good assists, great movement, an "easy" infinite, high damage, and good mixups. On top of that you're able to pick him up and be competent with him fairly quickly as opposed to someone like MODOK or Iron Man.
 
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