Support NeoGAF

[Snowdonhoffen]

It'd be 30 mil if she looked like this

Was just scrolling through reddit and saw this, can't complain tbh

 

[64gigabyteram]

im seriously tempted to make a thread where i tell all the overly boomer anti sjw incel types on this forum to shut the fuck up about everything they dont like being woke, it's seriously so damn annoying everytime i come across a thread about a western game i like only to have the replies be bombarded with people saying it's 'woke'. holy shit it's not 2016 anymore

 

[Arachnid]

Was just scrolling through reddit and saw this, can't complain tbh

That is the only picture I've ever seen her look above a 6. Pretty damn good tbh

Solid rebuttal

 

[8BiTw0LF]

Some dudes are detached from the real world - that's why they connect so well with the virtual world.

They have a hard time resonating with how their virtual world has begun reminding them of the real world.

Next up is scripted dialog vs. artificial intelligence dialog. AI will try to mimic real life women, so you can forget about the doll-minded women in most games in the future.

The future is just so "woke" lol...

 

[NikuNashi]

Que the 'if you have an opinion about this your must be an incel' crowd. Lots of insecure guys here you flip out at the mere suggestion that not wanting to see ugly, overweight, feminist inspired girls isnt bad.

 

[TGO]

They turned Aloy from an decent girl to a face that's fit for a feminist.

Aloy is fine that's just a bad capture from the reveal trailer.
But there is a problem with facial mo-cap which is more evident in cutscenes, probably due to them using the voice actor for the facial mo-cap, they not a good match so you can see her expressions come through but don't suit the face models facial structure.

 

[KàIRóS]

? why would they need luck? That is a subjective idea. If you take a group of women in real life, many of us would have different views on what we thought was attractive or not, why would that fucking change with a game character?

Thats like saying "good luck finding a good pizza place" cause you like deep dish. Did you not know that was a subjective thing? As in...subject to differ from person to person? Using this logic, it would be like saying the Pizza place has an agenda against you, look they made the slices thin, as if they WANT to force some agenda, as thin pizza is bad and they know its bad, good luck finding good pizza broz.

I don't know what to tell people like this at this point, what you fucking like or not is not a objective thing we all agree with 100%, what you like will be different from me and vice versa, thus one can't really force some idea that what makes your pp hard isn't an agenda and what make it soft suddenly is lol

be like "when will the pizza illuminati understand that catering to thin pizza is for people not even interested in pizza? When will they realize deep dish is the way to go? why do they hate good pizza? CLEARLY an agenda is afoot" /s lol

Wait so you're saying femininity is subjective? that's a new one, I can't agree though, feminine women have very easy to spot traits and it's been awhile since I've seen any in western gaming.

It's been a good while since we had one of these fucking incel threads. I hope you're proud of yourself.

I wanted it to be a good discussion about gaming business, I guess I expected too much of the thread though, still I genuinely believe western games would sell a lot more if they weren't catering to the wrong people.

 

[64gigabyteram]

Que the 'if you have an opinion about this your must be an incel' crowd. Lots of insecure guys here you flip out at the mere suggestion that not wanting to see ugly, overweight, feminist inspired girls isnt bad.

i dont mind liking sexy girls in games but there's something wrong if you're making entire fucking threads and polls going apeshit about how 'woke' the industry is
and keep in mind it's not just one person but nearly the entire site sharing this sentiment. it's fucking annoying seeing the same word repeated with the same talking points over and over like a broken record

 

[Danjin44]

My view is they can do whatever they want, its their game, most my problem comes from when western media start complaining why Japanese games have sexy design in their games, like what happened with Kamitani for his Dragon's Crown designs.

Freedom works both ways, if western devs are free to make design ugly then so is Japanese devs are free to make their design sexy.

 

[KàIRóS]

...Could you also clarify which you consider to be an example of "femininity"?

Aerith of course: peaceful, motherly, emphatetic, gentle, sensible.

A lot of you are mentioning beauty but femininity really isn't about beauty.

 

[Captain Toad]

Yeah, Aerith is so hot.

 

[NikuNashi]

Incoming

fck, cant post imgur links anymore? image cannot be loaded from the passed link. How do all you nerds post images these days?

 

[digoutyoursoul]

Incoming

You better clean up afterwards

 

[CatLady]

I said western games, good luck finding one.

Lara Croft, Kassandra A/C Odyssey, Amicia A Plague Tale, Chloe Lost Legacy etc. As a woman I prefer attractive characters, both men and women. I think Aloy looked much better in HZD but I think she looks a million times better than prepubescent little girls or 10,000-year-old dragon toddlers in weeb games.

 

[DragoonWalker]

Do I like beautiful women? Yes. Do I like to see them all dolled up and swaying their hips and giving me their "fuck me" face? Yes. Do I want those kinds of women in games? Absolutely.
Unfortunately OP, these are not the kinds of women who are making your games (and they are making your games, far more than before). The women making games make games because they've spent a lifetime being tomboys and nerds, not learning how to look good, and riding the wave of feminism that tells them they're beautiful without needing to do anything (while secretly being jealous of truly beautiful women). So that's what you get. The babes, meanwhile, are making the best of their beauty, making bank off their looks, enjoying attention, etc., not giving a shit about this whole debacle. The men of course, have their dicks cut off in today's game companies, so they're not gonna be pushing for anything.

Just try to enjoy what you can.

Never. It's not their thing to decide. How media should look was decided way higher than some devs office. And if creators wont follow the agenda they will be cancelled. Same way artist were not allowed to criticize marxism in USSR - technically they were free to do it, but it would be the last thing they publish in their life.

Sadly, this is is as true as it gets. I never thought, coming out of the 90s and 2000s, that I would live in a cultural climate this suffocating and repressed.

 

[EDMIX]

mere suggestion that not wanting to see ugly

subjective.

What you think is ugly or not will be different from person to person. Thus no one can develop around that, make your own game.

Wait so you're saying femininity is subjective? that's a new one, I can't agree though, feminine women hav

Its subjective.

it's been awhile since I've seen any in western gaming.

Its been a while since you've see what you perceive it as, others would disagree, thus...subjective.

I wanted it to be a good discussion about gaming business

I doubt that. Saying shit like "the woke west has tried to destroy" cause something didn't make your pp hard isn't trying to have any discussion, it leaps right into a accusation of some conspiracy cause you don't like how something looks, then proceed to force that it MUST be a conspiracy.

I genuinely believe western games would sell a lot more if they weren't catering to the wrong people.

I genuinely believe most don't give a fuck, they really don't. Most gamers barely complete a fucking game let alone even give a shit about half of what you are crying about for me to believe anyone as a majority is buying their games solely based on any of this. One of the best selling games on Earth is Tetris, you telling me some block fetish is going on and they are catering to block people?

Horizon Zero Dawn moved 20 million units, cause your pp didn't get hard, you telling me all 20 million of those people are feminist? lol So not all characters are made to cater to the demographic of said character, the folks designing the games also know most don't care and know they are playing a fake game. You going to tell me Twilight Princess was made to cater to the wrong people ie werewolves? Where are their thumbs? They can't use money to buy the game or speak, so why would Nintendo do this dog agenda? Look at even Nintendogz, clearly they have an agenda going on. /s

you have to be dumb AF to not realize that men will always like beautiful women

You'd have to be dumb AF to not realize "beautiful women" is subjective.... So...everything that doesn't make your pp hard can't just be someone catering to this or that anymore then a place making thin pizza doesn't have some agenda to purposely make bad pizza, they are merely making something you disagree with.

Go to a different fucking pizza shop, that isn't a conspiracy, that isn't an agenda, that is simply you disagreeing with something subjective.

 

[64gigabyteram]

Aloy is fine that's just a bad capture from the reveal trailer.
But there is a problem with facial mo-cap which is more evident in cutscenes, probably due to them using the voice actor for the facial mo-cap, they not a good match so you can see her expressions come through but don't suit the face models facial structure.

Looking at this stuff gives me an appreciation for Horizon Forbidden West's truly amazing models. they put a LOT of work in to the visuals and it shows

 

[Bernardougf]

Well considering western society is fucked atm, whenever that blows over.

This

 

[KàIRóS]

subjective.

What you think is ugly or not will be different from person to person. Thus no one can develop around that, make your own game.



Its subjective.


Its been a while since you've see what you perceive it as, others would disagree, thus...subjective.



I doubt that. Saying shit like "the woke west has tried to destroy" cause something didn't make your pp hard isn't trying to have any discussion, it leaps right into a accusation of some conspiracy cause you don't like how something looks, then proceed to force that it MUST be a conspiracy.



I genuinely believe most don't give a fuck, they really don't. Most gamers barely complete a fucking game let alone even give a shit about half of what you are crying about for me to believe anyone as a majority is buying their games solely based on any of this. One of the best selling games on Earth is Tetris, you telling me some block fetish is going on and they are catering to block people?

Horizon Zero Dawn moved 20 million units, cause your pp didn't get hard, you telling me all 20 million of those people are feminist? lol So not all characters are made to cater to the demographic of said character, the folks designing the games also know most don't care and know they are playing a fake game. You going to tell me Twilight Princess was made to cater to the wrong people ie werewolves? Where are their thumbs? They can't use money to buy the game or speak, so why would Nintendo do this dog agenda? Look at even Nintendogz, clearly they have an agenda going on. /s



You'd have to be dumb AF to not realize "beautiful women" is subjective.... So...everything that doesn't make your pp hard can't just be someone catering to this or that anymore then a place making thin pizza doesn't have some agenda to purposely make bad pizza, they are merely making something you disagree with.

Go to a different fucking pizza shop, that isn't a conspiracy, that isn't an agenda, that is simply you disagreeing with something subjective.

Damn you're triggered AF xD you're giving me a good laugh though.

Well I'll just say this, I don't agree with you at all, I don't think we are even talking about the same thing I literally wrote femininity and you keep insisting on talking about beauty and my pp for some reason.

 

[Bernardougf]

subjective.

What you think is ugly or not will be different from person to person. Thus no one can develop around that, make your own game.



Its subjective.


Its been a while since you've see what you perceive it as, others would disagree, thus...subjective.



I doubt that. Saying shit like "the woke west has tried to destroy" cause something didn't make your pp hard isn't trying to have any discussion, it leaps right into a accusation of some conspiracy cause you don't like how something looks, then proceed to force that it MUST be a conspiracy.



I genuinely believe most don't give a fuck, they really don't. Most gamers barely complete a fucking game let alone even give a shit about half of what you are crying about for me to believe anyone as a majority is buying their games solely based on any of this. One of the best selling games on Earth is Tetris, you telling me some block fetish is going on and they are catering to block people?

Horizon Zero Dawn moved 20 million units, cause your pp didn't get hard, you telling me all 20 million of those people are feminist? lol So not all characters are made to cater to the demographic of said character, the folks designing the games also know most don't care and know they are playing a fake game. You going to tell me Twilight Princess was made to cater to the wrong people ie werewolves? Where are their thumbs? They can't use money to buy the game or speak, so why would Nintendo do this dog agenda? Look at even Nintendogz, clearly they have an agenda going on. /s



You'd have to be dumb AF to not realize "beautiful women" is subjective.... So...everything that doesn't make your pp hard can't just be someone catering to this or that anymore then a place making thin pizza doesn't have some agenda to purposely make bad pizza, they are merely making something you disagree with.

Go to a different fucking pizza shop, that isn't a conspiracy, that isn't an agenda, that is simply you disagreeing with something subjective.

# triggered

 

[rodrigolfp]

Was just scrolling through reddit and saw this, can't complain tbh

A solid 5/7 here.

 

[Pedro Motta]

Yeah she was no supermodel in the first game but she was nice looking. The sequel though, well lets just say i'm surprised she didnt have a shaved fade and stubble to go along with dat face.

It's fucked up when the only thing you know about the game is that screenshot, you should try playing it.

 

[EDMIX]

Damn you're triggered AF xD you're giving me a good laugh though.

Well I'll just say this, I don't agree with you at all, I don't think we are even talking about the same thing I literally wrote femininity and you keep insisting on talking about beauty and my pp for some reason.

All of that is subjective.

So...you didn't come for any discussion.

you have to be dumb AF to not realize that men will always like beautiful women

I literally wrote femininity and you keep insisting on talking about beauty

Yea..you didn't read your own fucking post?

Yet you came to discuss something though right? lol

 

[Ghost of Caelid]

Women in games aren't any less "feminine" and games continue to sell well...this is a non existent issue. And if it was an issue theres plenty of beautiful/feminine women irl to make up for this non existent issue.

 

[ReBurn]

It's only really an issue if you play video games using your penis.

 

[Ghost of Caelid]

They turned Aloy from an decent girl to a face that's fit for a feminist.

Didn't she age a fair bit? Rounding of the face is common as one ages.

 

[DeepEnigma]

A solid 5/7 here.

 

[rodrigolfp]

It's only really an issue if you play video games using your penis.

I am always using my penis. How does one take out his penis to play video games?

 

[digoutyoursoul]

It's only really an issue if you play video games using your penis.

It’s rather soothing actually, particularly for the special moves in Street Fighter.

 

[Bernardougf]

Aerith of course: peaceful, motherly, emphatetic, gentle, sensible.

A lot of you are mentioning beauty but femininity really isn't about beauty.

You are seeing right here in this forum how this subject triggers people, and thats your answer, triggered people are more vocal and agressive as you also can see here, the devs prefer to deal with you just complaining about lack of femininity them deal with the crazy triggered screaming crowd.

 

[Doom85]

as i was saying, you are a hypocrite

Hypocrite?

Dude, I can appreciate both types. I’m not screaming at Square on how to design their female characters. Likewise, I’m not screaming at Guerrilla over the same thing. OP has to be aware of how tired this topic is getting as plenty of people keep bringing it up. If a game’s character design isn’t for someone, fine, don’t play it if they can’t help but get hung up on what many of us consider a trivial detail. But non-stop threads complaining about it just makes their OPs look like:

 

[KàIRóS]

All of that is subjective.

So...you didn't come for any discussion.




Yea..you didn't read your own fucking post?

Yet you came to discuss something though right? lol

I was talking about the first post you wrote and I replied with a question

Wait so you're saying femininity is subjective? that's a new one, I can't agree though, feminine women have very easy to spot traits and it's been awhile since I've seen any in western gaming.

Well here's my statement on beauty if you really want to know it that much, it's not subjective, at least physical beauty that is, if you ask people who they find more attractive a fat person or a fit person 99% will say the fit person so yes I would argue that for the vast majority of people physical beauty is not subjective it's actually objective.

 

[CamHostage]

Didn't she age a fair bit? Rounding of the face is common as one ages.

I don't think that's always true. Jessica Rabbit is over 30 years old, yet she looks the same as she did in 1988...

 

[NikuNashi]

You are seeing right here in this forum how this subject triggers people, and thats your answer, triggered people are more vocal and agressive as you also can see here, the devs prefer to deal with you just complaining about lack of femininity them deal with the crazy triggered screaming crowd.

This, a certain subsection of men get wildly excited over this topic scrambling to defend these fictional 3d polygon models.

 

[CamHostage]

I am always using my penis. How one take out his penis to play video games?

...carefully!

 

[64gigabyteram]

Hypocrite?

Dude, I can appreciate both types. I’m not screaming at Square on how to design their female characters. Likewise, I’m not screaming at Guerrilla over the same thing. OP has to be aware of how tired this topic is getting as plenty of people keep bringing it up. If a game’s character design isn’t for someone, fine, don’t play it if they can’t help but get hung up on what many of us consider a trivial detail. But non-stop threads complaining about it just makes their OPs look like:

i dont think you actually ARE a hypocrite for this, but i just couldnt help point out the peach profile picture while you were repping for HFW being an example of great selling games that dont have necessarily hot girls in them (though, aloy isn't what i would call ugly.)

 

[EDMIX]

my statement on beauty if you really want to know it that much, it's not subjective,

good luck with that fake shit bud.

By default it is a subjective idea, you just seem pissed that 100% won't agree with you as its not feasible to get 100% to agree with such a thing... as its subjective lol

 

[e0n]

You don't make 1 million plus sales just by having pretty characters. It's mostly by genre popularity and marketing.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

When was even the last time we saw a feminine woman in a western game?

The woke west has tried so hard to destroy the image of what a woman is that now the craving of men for one is harder than ever.

Actual photo of a what a Real Woman IS.

When will these weirdos realize that the persons they are catering to with all those masculine fictional women aren't even interested in gaming?

Maybe you have a point in this one. But you lack nuance.

Do they really plan to keep losing sales to asian devs that know what men want to see?...and woman.

If there's one thing that has always sold for the entirety of the human history it's Sex, you have to be dumb AF to not realize that men will always like beautiful women

OMG so hoooooot

 

[karasu]

Alloy is one of the worst-designed characters in history holy shit. She looks like a lumpy pillow.

 

[KàIRóS]

good luck with that fake shit bud.

By default it is a subjective idea, you just seem pissed that 100% won't agree with you as its not feasible to get 100% to agree with such a thing... as its subjective lol

I'm not pissed at all, there's only been one of us insulting the other one and it's not me.

I knew I would get backlash making this thread, it's certainly not 100% you should take a look at that poll again.

 

[NikuNashi]

good luck with that fake shit bud.

By default it is a subjective idea, you just seem pissed that 100% won't agree with you as its not feasible to get 100% to agree with such a thing... as its subjective lol

Beauty isn't all subjective though. There are underlying recognisable rules, symmetry, proportion. You may have a type / preference, however you will share the same understanding of what beauty is.

Regarding size / shape. being a healthy weight to birth a child successfully and live long enough to raise it to be a fully functioning adult again isn't subjective, its a deep rooted subconscious attraction born out of millions of years of evolution.

Same as femininity isn't subjective, there are feminine and masculine traits, these are not up for debate.


Genuine question, why are you so threatened with people being unhappy with female representation in western games? It seems to irrationally fire you up.

 

[EDMIX]

I'm not pissed at all, there's only been one of us insulting the other one and it's not me.

I knew I would get backlash making this thread, it's certainly not 100% you should take a look at that poll again.

To be so desperate as to try to pretend such a thing isn't a subjective view is some massively narrowminded thinking. Make your own fucking game and you can make characters based on what you think beauty is. That isn't some ironclad idea as to why this thread has so many different views, that literally the only evidence needed to even fucking disprove any of that shit btw. The fact that POLL EXIST shows its not a factual view, but a subjective one as many people had many views...why poll a fucking fact with 1 answer? lol foh

Your view and my view included on who we think is beautiful isn't some fucking gospel, its a opinion on what we think is beautiful or not. The moment you tried to remove that idea simply cause you can't take someone disagrees with you, it was no longer a discussion. If anyone can disagree with you on how a female or male for that matter looks, it means its an idea that can't be objective.

You are going to have to deal with that reality bud.

Have a good one.

NikuNashi Yea...you can't take people's opinions away from them just cause you are triggered. Its a subjective view. Deal with it bud.I mean you can't fucking take that its not a think we all would agree with, we can't. Its not feasible as everyone will have different views on who they thing is or isn't beautiful. So I can't tell you what that is to you anymore then you can tell me what that is for me. Something you are going to need to deal with.. the lolz on you thinking your fetish was fact for everyone

lol easiest ignore I've had a while.

 

[ResurrectedContrarian]

There is a problem here, and no, it isn't that we're asking for strippers in every game. Just asking for beauty, like Aerith in the screen shown.

There's a new civic / quasi-religious ideology that dominates the younger always-online generations, and this ideology believes that beauty is a problem. Or a weakness, something to be minified, specifically when it pertains to women. Sexualized male images are okay to them, however... simply because that's traditionally less prominent, and anything that feels vaguely taboo-ish / "my-dad-would-hate-it" is inherently good now--and that's about as deep as the combined minds of that entire diversity religion can think, unfortunately.

A bigger piece underlying the shift is that people expect video game characters to "represent" or empower them in some way. This is idiotic; video game characters are like action figure toys on a virtual playing field; they shouldn't have anything to do with representing your identity. Mario worked because the mustache looked funny in the pixels they had, and the name "Mario" was funny to pair with that mustache. Trying to make game characters that are anything more than digital toys is idiotic.

Anyhow, since this mind virus has everyone in the younger generations obsessed with identity, the fun part of fantasy goes away. Of course we should want fantasy games to be beautiful, and plenty of beautiful or cool looking fantasy characters populating them. But you arent' allowed to do that with the female characters in the west because that would be "normative," or more succinctly: "my dad would like that." An entire generation or two of overgrown children who can't appreciate anything other than ugliness, or resisting some fantasy of an authoritarian they have stuck in their minds.

 

[CityHunter1981]

Honestly, I also don't get it anymore. These days I feel like there are people that considers you to be a pervert, just because you like beautiful or cute women. People should realize that these feelings are human nature and that this will never change.

I mean I don't know why they focus so much on the game industry. I mean in the movie industry a beautiful woman generally have higher chances to become successful than an ugly woman, because men prefer to see beautiful woman.
The same in the music industry, how many really ugly woman are successful there? There may be a few, but these usually have really great voices, while for beautiful women often a good voice is sufficient to be successful

I mean, is it fair that that it is like this? No way, but its not like men can change their taste in women.
And people should stop to complain because it is the same when it comes to men in the movie or music industry, good looking does always sell better.

 

[Astral Dog]

They turned Aloy from an decent girl to a face that's fit for a feminist.

Yeah she's a little chubby and looks like a bulldog but judging by the sales most gamers appear to have the hots for new Aloy

 

[SteelCurtain 59]

Maybe I'm in the minority, but I've never been swayed (positively or negatively) by the attractiveness of any video game character. I play video games for the gameplay, for the great stories, for the experiences I can't get in other media, not for hot women. Not judging anybody who cares about this, as you should 100% "like what you like", but it's not something I ever give a 2nd thought to, and will never influence any purchasing decisions I ever make.

 

[thegame983]

It's 2022. We're all gay now

 

[ReBurn]

It's 2022. We're all gay now

Oh ok I didn't know

 

[ResurrectedContrarian]

Honestly, I also don't get it anymore. These days I feel like there are people that considers you to be a pervert, just because you like beautiful or cute women. People should realize that these feelings are human nature and that this will never change.

Unfortunatley, it makes people feel bad to acknowledge the obvious power of beauty in all human affairs. Or the fact that certain bodies and faces are more appealing than others. Any woman with half a brain knows immediately which other women in her orbit are actually objectively beautiful, and they know how that affects everyone around them and draws others into their orbit.

Today there is a rebellion against this online, even though the unfettered internet is--at the same time--clearly confirming the reality of beauty: just look at how easy it is for photogenic young women from anywhere in the world to instantly get millions of followers on instagram etc and pretty have the guarantee that they'll be given access to just about any life they want.

If anything, the web has only unmasked how extreme the power of beauty can be, when not hemmed in by more local & tradional softening effects of shame or modesty (which is a bad thing to see, but at least it confirms human nature once again)... even while the other half of the internet rages in absolute denial of the human nature on display here and tries to wash it out of all media and fantasy.