BaltimoreLarry
Member
I do. But I've seen Montana and Peyton play. If you go best QB, no Superbowls, but best person ever at throwing footballs, it be Manning.
Jonny U because Baltimore,Baltimore,Baltimore,Baltimore!
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NFL 2011 Divisional Round |OT| Jesus cast flag merchants, rapists out of His temple
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I do. But I've seen Montana and Peyton play. If you go best QB, no Superbowls, but best person ever at throwing footballs, it be Manning.
Jonny U because Baltimore,Baltimore,Baltimore,Baltimore!
Goro Majima
Kitty Genovese Member
Manning is second in my book for how he changed the QB position into a psuedo-OC.
At some point though when you compare the two resume's between Montana and Manning, 4 Super Bowl wins sticks out when combined with everything else he's done, screw you Bradshaw!
Johnny U
Manning didn't change it. Just maybe brought it back into vogue but it never fully went away. QB calling his own plays I mean. The OC position was created to take away play calling responsibilities from the QB in the first place.
Art Donovan is the only person I can take seriously claiming Unitas is better than Montana and that's because he does it with such enthusiasm. "that pansy never threw the ball more than 4 yards down the field, Unitas was a quarterback!"
Yeah. Young is not the greatest QB of all time, maybe just because he started so late and took so long to actually develop (remember when people wanted to make him a running back). But he was amazing to watch. Incredibly accurate, slippery in and out of the pocket and could break a nice run, and his attitude in interviews always made him seem like he was really enjoying the game.
Of quarterbacks I've seen, Montana and Manning have impressed me the most. Montana has the superior resume, and the come backs, the calming presence, and being outcast to the Chiefs and still having some success. Montana had a lot more injury issues than Manning throughout his career (whereas Manning is mostly being hit hard now), but also had a lot of talent around him. Manning has just been so impressive to watch control the offense, basically making all the adjustments himself on the fly.
DeaconKnowledge
Member
Homer answer: Bradshaw
Real Answer - Montana
Real Answer - Montana
elway
2009 Brent.
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
Antrel Rolle just got me crazy hyped for the game on his weekly spot with Joe and Evan on FAN. Evan asked how are you going to matchup with their weapons?
Rolle says: "They have more weapons than you can count on one hand and we know what kind of fight we're in for, but you know what, so do they."
Fuuuuuuuuuuuck yeeeeeeeeaaaaah!!!!!
Can't fucking wait!!
Rolle says: "They have more weapons than you can count on one hand and we know what kind of fight we're in for, but you know what, so do they."
Fuuuuuuuuuuuck yeeeeeeeeaaaaah!!!!!
Can't fucking wait!!
But every quarterback in the next ten years will have better stats than Montana (or nearly any other QB prior to 1999). It'll be tough to judge quarterbacks on stats alone if 5,000 yard seasons become the norm, more because of rule changes than quality of play.
Futurevoid
Member
Yeah, it was a great spot. I particularly like Joe trying to bait him into the JPP guarantee. To which Rolle responded:Wellington said:
"Hey, I didn’t even say it this time. That’s all JPP! I'll guarantee ... we'll be the best fighting Giants we can be. That's the only guarantee you'll get out of me."
Love how much he's turned into a "Coughlin guy" but still has that same fire he came to the team with. It helps that he's been playing his ass off the past few weeks.
So...this is actually what the discussion was/is about. How serious are you guys with your homer answers? Would you seriously make a case for Bradshaw or Elway?
You should have just left it at Brady.
jordan0386
Member
Denver will jump out to a 21-3 halftime lead. Brady will storm back, but will fall just short.
Broncos 30
Pats 24
One more match...err....One more week!
Broncos 30
Pats 24
One more match...err....One more week!
Joe Montana.
And I'm not just saying that because I'm a niners fan and today is the 30th anniversary of "The Catch".
Barack Lesnar
Banned
Lol'd @ the Montana mentions. The guy never even threw for 4000 yards in his entire career. His legend was made thanks to the incredible team around him, both offensive and defensive personnel. Yeah he was clutch but again look at the team around him. All the Super Bowls are great but this is a team game. He's the name everyone goes to when this question is asked and it's so cookie-cutter and lacks any depth. Both Peyton and Brady are better than he ever was.
Not even remotely. In fact, I was scolded for engaging yesterday.
To me he turned around the franchise and led average teams to superbowls. He's should be in the argument, and I think he has a good blend of stats and titles to be considered one of the greatest.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
What's your problem? You were wrong about Tebow's performance, get over it you elitist weirdo.
I don't see how anyone can say Bradshaw, but definitely Elway. To me, the only other guy would be Manning. Elway carried that offense in the 80s. He had no Jerry Rice or Bill Walsh helping him during his Dan Reeves days. He actually called his own plays. People just remember his teams getting crushed by the big money NFC teams in SBs, and forget how he got his teams there.
Then when all those good defensive players they had on defense retired, he still got them to the playoffs (only to lose to Buffalo). Once Shanahan showed up, he was older but still dominant. He finally had all the surrounding pieces that Montana always had, and won his SBs.
Rings
I'm specifically asking for #1.
For background, my buddy sent me this:
http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/qb1995
DVOA for 1995. 1. lol FO, what a fucked list and 2. Elway
Anyway, he was saying how terribly over rated Elway is and I was kind of surprised to hear it. Mostly because I didn't realize people rate Elway terribly high. Top 10-15 QB's of all time surely, but #1? Not a chance right? He tells me he has read about a lot of arguments for just that.
I posited that there are three realistic answers to the question: Montana, Unitas and Marino (like Mays, Ruth and Cobb). Anything else is homerism or idiocy.
I think we've come close to making that argument here, though I may have over-rated the regard in which Marino is held. Maybe there are only really two answers.
As to Manning and Brady...let's wait til they retire. Lots of people were saying the same thing about Favre, and he isn't realistically in the discussion after some reflection. I don't think those are idiotic or homerish, just premature.
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
I forgot what game it was last year, but remember him complaining because they got to the stadium too early and it apparently threw him off? That was laughable but he is such a different player right now. Before anything (and I want to say - now that he's passed the whole "at the end of the day" thing, he's got a "first and foremost" thing going) he constantly praises Coughlin and Fewell for getting the team ready and providing a really good game plan. That is a far cry from what we as fans think from game to game. Glad to hear it from Antrel.
He has really turned around my opinion on him.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
You posited wrong, which isn't a surprise from a dude that tries to act like he's the be-all end-all of football discussion.
Are you just looking at him never winning a ring or saying he cost his teams rings?
eznark said:
Barack Lesnar
Banned
There's nothing homerish or idiotic about having guys like Manning and Brady in that discussion.
He made crucial errors in tight playoff games like the young Peyton used to, like throwing deep when just out of field goal range rather than trying to setup a sure score, not managing the clock well, etc. Marino was a very unimpressive playoff QB in my opinion. He just never grew into what he could have been.
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
Homer answer: Babe Ruth.
Ignore function is awesome, btw.
Ignore function is awesome, btw.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Joe Montana. It's not even close.
That said, I know 10 years from now his name will be coming up less and less in these conversations, much like Terry Bradshaw's is now because of looking at stats.
Manning, I think he's probably up there. Brady*, come one mang.
The Skins scored 28 (35?) pts in the 2Q. Don't really think a blown fumble call changes the outcome on that. Denver always had nice players on defense, but never anything like the beastly defenses the NFC had. And Reeves was a very good coach, but he wasn't in the class of Walsh, Gibbs, or Parcells.
I love Montana. Think he was great. But all he ever ran in his whole career was the WCO. Elway ran Shanahan's WCO, and Reeves' Dallas pro-set. If I was going to take a historical QB and start building a team, it would be Elway
I prefer manual ignore, you play with auto-sprint on?
It was 35 squicken, I know it's outlandish, but it certainly dictated the early pace of that game. Of course, maybe it says something that he/they were so easily shaken.
DeaconKnowledge
Member
The only argument I could make is rings. Simply put, Bradshaw has 4 rings and as a result has to be put into the discussion, factors that contributed to those rings notwithstanding.
Obviously that has a lot of holes in it, the biggest of which being...well, it's pretty obvious. In fact, Bradshaw pretty much admitted that Joe Gilliam was the better QB at the time and chances are had they stuck with him he would have won 4 rings too.
Dutch Gronk
Banned
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