Devolution
Member
Yeah I guess, seems non-life threatening enough he could just walk around the station without problems sigh.
Family of Florida boy killed by Neighborhood Watch seeks arrest
- Thread starter Dram
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Yeah I guess, seems non-life threatening enough he could just walk around the station without problems sigh.
You do realize that even if we were all the same color, people would still find shit to complain about, right? My faith in humanity is all but gone at this point. We kill each other over bullshit, we steal from one another, and we argue over the most trivial things. Meanwhile, millions of people across the planet are starving, unemployed, or living in poverty.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
I know. Didn't even need help out of the squad car. You'd think he'd be dizzy/sore/stumbling. Maybe we're making too much out of nothing.
Squirrel Killer
Member
I'm not going to continue to derail the thread on this beyond this post, so here's all my cards on the table.
1) From the 911 calls I've listened to, it doesn't seem to me that Zimmerman ever abandoned his following and pursuit of Martin. To me, that's one instance, just as if you're following someone down the hall and they turn the corner, you're still following them even though you can't see them. Zimmerman's not a Metal Gear Solid guard who stops his pursuit because Martin went stealthy for a second.
2) There are other aspects of this specific stalking law that make it ill-suited for this situation, namely, "maliciously" and "serves no legitimate purpose."
3) Stalking laws in general weren't written for this type of situation. (I don't claim to be an expert, but I do speak from a small bit of experience here. I did bill analysis on stalking model bills and handled stalking-related constituent casework for a state representative who was a sponsor of early (1992-94 era) stalking legislation.)
4) I've never been a fan of piling on irrelevant charges. It's a distraction from the main charges and makes them look weak.
5) I've also never been a fan of broadly interpreting laws because it gives cops another tool to abuse. Frankly, I'm surprised to see you, of all people, so nonchalant about handing cops such a broad brush. Can I expect you to be so sanguine when a hysterical white woman calls the cops on an African American after he "stalks" her by following her down two different streets?
empty vessel
Member
You seem to be mistaking me for somebody arguing that Zimmerman did commit the crime of stalking instead of somebody arguing that it is "quite possible" that Zimmerman committed the crime of stalking.
The point is the hypocrisy of the police department in threatening to unconstitutionally arrest journalists for conduct that doesn't even arguably fall within the statute while failing to cite Zimmerman for conduct that arguably does.
I thought Emceegramr was being ridiculous in service of humor earlier, now it's a lot less funny.
Shake Appeal
Member
I wonder how ABC got that footage. We already heard that the police chief overruled the lead investigator's call to charge Zimmerman; I wonder if someone within the department leaked the pictures because they recognized their importance.
They just ask for it lol.
KamikazeTY
Banned
I've been following this on and off. I have a quick question for you guys.
Is it possible that he wasn't arrested and the police neglected the incident because of who his dad was? If he calls the cops and gets involved ALL the time I think it would be safe to say the local PD knows who he and his father (a judge) is. I know how corrupt cops can be about letting "family" get out of things. Especially if his father holds a lot of pull in the city...
Is it possible that he wasn't arrested and the police neglected the incident because of who his dad was? If he calls the cops and gets involved ALL the time I think it would be safe to say the local PD knows who he and his father (a judge) is. I know how corrupt cops can be about letting "family" get out of things. Especially if his father holds a lot of pull in the city...
Gordon Shumway
Banned
Are you serious?
Yep, thats what they guy said on Lawrence show.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
I totally missed when that was said. Too funny. Who'd of thunk it'd be THAT simple?
This I must know. Also, did his dad contact the state's attorney? If things are as fucked up as I think they could be, I wouldn't be surprised if his dad was in on the coverup and subsequent dismissal of the case.
PhoenixDark
Banned
The officers aren't even wearing gloves...
Dreams-Visions
Member
you're not the only one. but his resume is pretty good.
Yeah maybe he is better in the courtroom. I pretty sure Sanford PD have pics isn't it standard procedure to at least acquire a mugshot?
PhoenixDark
Banned
You'd think so, but who knows. Regardless it's clear he didn't have any noticeable bruises. Didn't his lawyer say he needed stitches? And of course, anyone who has dealt with a broken nose can tell you it bleeds like crazy. Yet his shirt has no blood on it.
On a side note, this would also cast doubt on the idea that Zimmerman shot Martin while he was on top of him, or in any close proximity; if that had happened, there would be blood on his clothes. Seems more likely Zimmerman dis-tangled himself from Martin and shot him.
Devolution
Member
Sanford PD and standard procedure is fast becoming oxymoronic.
You know, on my way home I was eating some Skittles and Arizona Ice Tea and man, you ain't kidding. I live on the fourth floor of my apartment and I didn't even need to take the stairs or elevator, I fucking leapt to my balcony. I felt like fucking Superman.
Megidolaon
Member
I think you all are missing the point during the struggle. Nobody ever said that Zimmerman's injuries were the reason he feared for his life. If there was a fight and Martin then discovered that Zimmerman was armed, they probably at that point struggled for the gun. Then both parties had every right to fear for their life at that point. At that point, if Trayvon hadn't been shot, Zimmerman probably would have. I don't think Trayvon intended to kill him at first, but when he saw the gun, he probably did feel like he had to use lethal force. It's a complicated and sad situation if true.
Go ahead and call me a contrarian all you want, I still think a lot of you guys are choosing not to think the situation all the way through because you want so badly to hate Zimmerman. I get that, a kid is dead and he should not be. But most of you guys aren't objective, so just admit it. Most people here made up thier minds long ago as soon as they heard the word Skittles and can't wait to find any possible hole in Z's story and are not viewing all the media articles and reports with adequate skepticism.
As for the security tapes, I agree that he doesn't looks like road pizza. In certain frames, I can see what looks like he may have a black eye and a broken nose. Nothing visible on his head. It is blurry though and doesn't tell you how long after the altercation this was. Did he change his clothes? Did he get cleaned up? I dunno. Still doesn't negate the aforementioned scenario about struggling for a gun.
So I expect to be called names for this, whatever. I'm a murderer defender blah blah blah. Actually, I don't think Zimmerman should have ever got out of his car. He acted irresponsibly. Doesn't prove that he stalked and chased and murdered anyone.
I just can't help but interject when I see such a one-sided discussion blinded by (understandable) emotion egged on by bad media reporting and involving a lack of all the facts.
Go ahead and call me a contrarian all you want, I still think a lot of you guys are choosing not to think the situation all the way through because you want so badly to hate Zimmerman. I get that, a kid is dead and he should not be. But most of you guys aren't objective, so just admit it. Most people here made up thier minds long ago as soon as they heard the word Skittles and can't wait to find any possible hole in Z's story and are not viewing all the media articles and reports with adequate skepticism.
As for the security tapes, I agree that he doesn't looks like road pizza. In certain frames, I can see what looks like he may have a black eye and a broken nose. Nothing visible on his head. It is blurry though and doesn't tell you how long after the altercation this was. Did he change his clothes? Did he get cleaned up? I dunno. Still doesn't negate the aforementioned scenario about struggling for a gun.
So I expect to be called names for this, whatever. I'm a murderer defender blah blah blah. Actually, I don't think Zimmerman should have ever got out of his car. He acted irresponsibly. Doesn't prove that he stalked and chased and murdered anyone.
I just can't help but interject when I see such a one-sided discussion blinded by (understandable) emotion egged on by bad media reporting and involving a lack of all the facts.
The Culture Vulture
Member
I think we have proof that he stalked, don't we? I agree with some of your points though.
Except for the fact Zimmerman never told the cops Martin tried to grab his gun and if that was the case he would obviously tell the cops that story since that would be the perfect defense. Instead he told a very wishy-washy story about chasing him and going back to his car, a story with holes in it.
I am pretty sure he murdered someone.
Also, it's stupid to accuse us of blindly opposing Zimmerman. Nearly all "evidence" on Zimmerman's side has been exposed and proven to be false or shady. His dad lied a bunch of times. Zimmerman himself has had like three prior run-ins with the law, one of which was for assaulting a police officer. Assaulting a police officer. Now we have a video tape that clearly shows he did not have anywhere near the injuries that his camp claimed he did. He was told by the police not to follow Trayvon yet he did anyway. He may or may not have uttered a racial slur but it's pretty clear he was racially profiling Trayvon. His dad, a retired judge, has gotten him out of trouble every time. He's a self-appointed neighborhood watch captain who goes to school for this shit. He's obsessed. He's a wannabe cop who tried to take things into his own hands and ended up killing someone.
Trayvon has had no record of violence and is for all we know a normal kid. How many normal kids' first reaction when followed by a stalker is to kill them, or even confront them with physical violence?
Either way, it may come down to Trayvon's word versus Zimmerman's and unfortunately Trayvon will never be able to tell his side of the story. Zimmerman doesn't need you to defend him.
Forceatowulf
G***n S**n*bi
You know what could have prevented a struggle for the gun? Zimmerman not stalking a kid walking in his parents neighborhood after he was explicitly told NOT TO DO SO.
People aren't just upset over a kid losing his life because of a mere gun struggle, but because an overzealous fake watchman decided to take the law into his own hands when he had no reason to do so.
Dude Abides
Banned
I'm surprised they're still going with the broken nose thing after that surveillance footage. I'm not a doctor, but my understanding is that a broken nose is quite painful and typically involves a lot of blood. Everyone in the video seems relatively nonchalant.
It's also curious as to why Zimmerman is cuffed if he's not under arrest.
It's also curious as to why Zimmerman is cuffed if he's not under arrest.
(former) JUDGE ROBERT ZIMMERMAN
Well, there's the answer everyone's been looking for. There's your answer as to how and why murderer-Zimmerman was protected. The man's father was a judge. He likely has contacts and Old Boys Club friends all the way up the authority chain.
This explains everything about the case, and also tells us exactly how it's going to end, too.
Well, there's the answer everyone's been looking for. There's your answer as to how and why murderer-Zimmerman was protected. The man's father was a judge. He likely has contacts and Old Boys Club friends all the way up the authority chain.
This explains everything about the case, and also tells us exactly how it's going to end, too.
MightyHealthy
Banned
Nobody?
Or by nobody, do you mean his father and Joe Oliver?
Thank you so much, so glad to see a voice of reason here.
I wasn't thinking the situation all the way through, I sincerely appreciate that you apparently can do it for me
</sarcasm>
Al-ibn Kermit
Junior Member
I don't see it getting sweeped under any rug after all this media attention but I guess the Grand Jury in two weeks will decide whether this case gets reopened or is left closed.
I was too young to remember but it feels like this story is probably getting at least as much attention as the Rodney King beating, although that obviously didn't result in justice.
Closed. Judge Zimmerman is going to use every single favor he has to keep his son out of prison.
And it'll work.
That won't work in a case as high profile as this. If anything the recent public trashing of Treyvon Martin's character should tell you that the Zimmerman camp is preparing for a jury trial. This isn't just going to go away like some are hoping it will. Don't forget that someone lost their life.
Megidolaon
Member
Actually he did say this I didn;t just make it up.
http://www.christianpost.com/news/george-zimmerman-trayvon-martin-was-reaching-for-my-gun-72106/
The media not knowing Zimmerman's full story =/= Zimmerman never saying it. Remember, the full story isn't out yet, the media doesn't have access to all the facts either.
StoppedInTracks
Member
Except that he DID murder a kid. You missed that small detail, huh?
Zoe
Member
I don't think they would need to at that point.
Megidolaon
Member
oh, so you were there? are you gonna testify at the trial, since you obviously witnessed the whole ordeal?
Mortrialus
Banned
That he shot Martin in not in dispute. Even he admits to it.
Zoe
Member
Murder/man slaughter/self defense is up for debate though.
lolwat?! where are they saying this?
SquiddyCracker
Banned
This is a really high profile case, it's even gotten some international attention.
Old favors cease to work in conditions such as these, and I wouldn't be surprised to hear about some corruption in the coming weeks.
Man, it must be great to be able to run after somebody with a loaded weapon then claim self-defense when the other side feels threatened by it.
Even if Zimmerman had been beaten up, it's his own fucking fault. That he didn't only shows us there are liars involved here.
Even if Zimmerman had been beaten up, it's his own fucking fault. That he didn't only shows us there are liars involved here.
Forceatowulf
G***n S**n*bi
You don't need to witness the crime to piece together the fucking obvious.
An unarmed 17 year old walking in his own god damn neighborhood got shot by a fake watchmen who initiated an incident that should have never transpired in the first place. Those are the facts.
I don't give a damn if Trayvon supposedly fought his stalker off, because he should have never been fucking with him in the first place. Period.
A man with a 9mm initiated an incident with a kid with a bag of skittles. That kid is dead now. The man with the gun is still very much alive. If that isn't an injustice to you.. well then you're just fucking lost.
He'll probably get off and it'll be bargained down to something like "involuntary manslaughter due to self defense" or some legalese jargon that basically means he doesn't go to jail and instead does like 1000 hours of community service.
Community service...
Fox news has yet to have their analysts concur the video is not a fake.
I broke my nose in football and it barely bleed . So I dunno what to tell you on that one.
BTW i think this guy should be in jail. So i'm not trying to defend him
Bravo.
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