Thurott: $299 version of Xbox v.Next will come with a $15/mo XBLG sub, not $10
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BruiserBear
Banned
I'll be shocked if the minimum entry point for the Nextbox is $500 without a subscription.
BRocknRolla
Member
I'm curious to know this too. However, correct me if I'm wrong, wasn't this subsidized xbox only offered at Microsoft Stores? If that's the case, you've got a very small sample size full of very specific MS oriented customers, so I'm not sure we could derive any kind of conclusion from it.
This makes me very sad. I know it's true, but it's sad that our society functions in such a way. I know my parents always struggled at Christmas time when I was a child, and I guess that's to be expected given the increased costs during that time of year, but I just look back on it sometimes and feel terribly guilty.
MightyHedgehog
Member
But how much will a beastly powerful PS4 be?
LittleJohnny
Banned
Officerrob
Banned
I'm honestly confused, are people generally clueless or just trolling? Leave it to GAF to turn consumer options into a BAD thing. "But, it costs more in the long run!" No shit! That's how these things work!
mysteriousmage09
Member
This is the company that increased the rate of Xbox LIVE from $8 a month to $10 a month already and are now going to bleed people dry with bs contracts but keep thinking MS is a generous company. $300 + 240 for $540 total would make sense but fuck that, throw in another $120 to bring it up to $660. No price increase to Xbox LIVE? Lol. I see the PR statement already.
"We at Microsoft strive to give our Xbox LIVE Gold users compelling content and features year after year and with the release of the Xbox Infinity, we have bumped out efforts to the next level. With next gen comes new next gen features and for only pennies extra per day, we will provide you with the best Xbox LIVE experience to date!"
AKA a bunch of shit the average gamer doesn't care about and even more ad ridden garbage then we have already for an increased price that people will brush aside with the same stupid ass attitude as the last price increase, aka, "It's not that much of an increase, it doesn't affect me so who cares.".
Cell phones aren't really analogous to this.
With the exception of T-Mobile (and that's super recent), you pay the same exact price for 24 months of cell phone service regardless of whether or not you pay for the phone up front. To that end, you'd be silly not to take advantage of the subsidy.
With this, you're paying more for the subsidy. It may not be something most would consider significant, but it's more. Similar I guess, but it's different.
The thing is though, phones are seen as a necessity and people have been used to the subsidized model for a long time. I mean, you still have to pay a phone bill no matter what. That's not really the case with a game console and I can see it being a big problem for parents or relatives buying the Xbox as a Christmas or birthday present. Put yourself in the shoes of a parent or grandparent. When you're at the store buying a console for little Jimmy, do you really want to be locked into ANOTHER two-year contract that just adds to your monthly bill? Probably not, especially since an Xbox is basically a toy in the eyes of most parents.
RukusProvider
Banned
Anyone mention finance charge yet or too complicated of a concept for gaming side?
Bleedorang3
Banned
I think both of you are setting yourself up for disappointment.
If its just about a cheaper headline figure then why not offer finance up front? Presumably you need a credit check to qualify for this?
Just launch at E3 and say the damn console is free but you pay $25 per month for two years. What's the difference?
theusedversion
Member
I wasn't really sure about tax on the Live part. I wasn't sure if tax was already included in the price and I couldn't remember if they would charge sales tax on a monthly subscription. What tax rate would they use? Would they use general state tax rates or the higher local tax rates? I used to live in TN, USA but I have been living in Asia for several years so I can't really remember how things work. Also is there any word that they would do this subsidized plan outside of the US? Are they doing the subsidized 360 outside of the US right now?
Ah I see. That is interesting. I didn't know that they would do that. Kind of sucks.
LittleJohnny
Banned
I think a subsidised model is an absolutely brilliant idea if they can get the pricepoint right. It will achieve 3 things all in one console sale.
- Eliminate reselling the console
- Guaranteed revenue from LIVE
- Price cut their competitors, so the casual will strongly consider this when comparing
Personally I won't be doing this (like most of us here on GAF), but I can really see the potential in this.
- Eliminate reselling the console
- Guaranteed revenue from LIVE
- Price cut their competitors, so the casual will strongly consider this when comparing
Personally I won't be doing this (like most of us here on GAF), but I can really see the potential in this.
Right. The issue here, at least for me, is games vs services. For a while now, the industry has been trending towards games being offered as a service, not as a product you purchase outright. This is a bad thing for consumers.
Console prices shouldn't be tied to an online service. I get that it's an option right now, but if this is successful what's the incentive to continue to offer a non subsidized version of the console? If my 720 breaks in 3 years, will I have to sign up for 2 more years of Live when I buy it?
Beer Monkey
Member
Why so salty?
Look, I could be a dumbass and have a cell phone contract (I don't, I pay $30 a month and buy my phones without subsidy), but that doesn't mean the phone company would be the one to blame.
Wrong. They don't advertise that you can get a lower monthly rate out of contract, but you can. All you have to do is call them up. I've gotten cheaper monthly rates than advertised from multiple cell carriers. You can totally get your bill reduced by going out of contract. Also PAYG carriers like Cricket and Virgin have provided alternatives for way longer than T-Mobile.
MightyHedgehog
Member
I don't think MS wants to get in that deep, at least, not alone. With cable/satellite services in the mix, though, I could see free** units with a contract. Yes, the current X360 plan requires credit check, so I assume this will.
What on earth are you going on about.. the $15 isn't just for LIVE, it's paying off the rest of the console. This thread is not about increasing the monthly price of live from $10 to $15. The current financed model is also $15 a month
Sho_Nuff82
Member
Makes more sense, I (and others) said as much on the last thread.
Still hard to believe that it's $500 considering what's rumored to be under the hood, but we'll see.
Still hard to believe that it's $500 considering what's rumored to be under the hood, but we'll see.
BRocknRolla
Member
Is the comparison really apt though? If I want a new iPhone or Samsung Whatever (Which would be a great phone name by the way), I can pay the premium for an unlocked version for say $500. But I can't use it without paying for a subscription. How many phone companies allow you to:
A.) Bring an unlocked phone to them and use it on their network,
B.) Offer equivalent services and quality, and
C.) Pay an amount that is substantially less that other subsidized subscribers such that you end up saving money over the next two years?
Seems like that would be hard to find in a lot of places. (I understand that it works differently outside the US, so this is US centric.)
NemesisPrime
Banned
No you will get it for "free", just like your phone as long as you pay the sub.
China Dont Care
Banned
If you want that console day 1 for $99, you'll know you are going to get this deal. I myself have a couple of bucks lying around.
That has nothing to do with a subscription model.
Pretty sure it's not, but you care to elaborate? You are getting a $200 discount for signing the contract ($299 instead of $499). $15 x 24 months = $360. I get Gold for $30 a year for a total of $60 for 2 years. That means you are essentially paying $100 more.
Subsidized Total Cost: $299 + $360 = $659
Unsubsidized Total Cost: $499 + $60 = $559 (this is if I even wanted Gold for 2 years)
I do believe your math is off.
Vane_MagicCity
Banned
The 360 subsidy thing is likely just being used as a test for the 720. The major changes are more likely to come with a new console that includes subsidies from the beginning.
If my phone breaks I can get a new one for free but that's only because I buy insurance, not because I am in a contract.
To be honest, it isn't a horrid deal. Assuming you would pay $60 a year for XBL and $500 for the machine. Only $40 difference. Of course I wouldn't want my console's 'life' hinging on a contract. And of course there are always ways to get XBL cheaper than $60 a year (i.e. Amazon selling it for $47 atm).
Also, why are people calling this a subsidy lol...
Also, why are people calling this a subsidy lol...
dorkimoe
Member
The ps3 launched at $600 7 years ago..
famousmortimer
Banned
There's a lot of people in here saying the subsidized model is "a bad deal." Um, yeah, that's the point of subsidizing. They aren't giving it to you for less up front because they are nice guys... they are doing it because they are going to take more in the long run.
RukusProvider
Banned
You're using special deal prices to substitute for MSRP? LOL!
I don't know if you are joking, but that's a great idea I think! MS or Sony should do it.
And why Sony can't do the same with PS4($299 subsidized)?
If you want to purchase the subsidized version then yes.
LOL! Why not it's not like the special deal price is rare. If they offered sales on the subsidy I would compare that, but they don't. The only thing "LOL!" about it is people who buy the year sub at $60.
grimshawish
Banned
Microsoft to celebrate the purchase of the Ridge Racer IP with an hour long remix of Kaz saying RIIDDDGE RACER this May.
$599 entry tickets.
Its not $99 though. You want to pay as much up front as you can so that you are paying less in the long term.
$599 entry tickets.
Its not $99 though. You want to pay as much up front as you can so that you are paying less in the long term.
Maybe someone has already done this math on previous pages, but if you assume a 7 year console life cycle. And if you assume that having money for a year is worth about 8% (the cost of my student loans, for instance).
And if you apply the 8% compounding discount rate to a $180 per year rate (15*12), as well as a $60 per year rate (about the cost of 1 year of XBLG up front), then the net present cost of the subsidized Xbox vNext is $1,237.15, and unsubsidized is $812.38.
Of course, this assumes that one sticks with the same pricing structure for 7 years, and that the pricing structure itself is static, and not including any discounts or promotions.
The math is basically initial system cost + the sum of annual fees discounted by 8% compounding.
And if you apply the 8% compounding discount rate to a $180 per year rate (15*12), as well as a $60 per year rate (about the cost of 1 year of XBLG up front), then the net present cost of the subsidized Xbox vNext is $1,237.15, and unsubsidized is $812.38.
Of course, this assumes that one sticks with the same pricing structure for 7 years, and that the pricing structure itself is static, and not including any discounts or promotions.
The math is basically initial system cost + the sum of annual fees discounted by 8% compounding.
And it was so expensive that it effectively killed any chance of the PS3 selling well for at least two years. $499 is a terrible price if the leaked specs are true. It amazes me that so many people are "ok with it" after the PS3 fiasco.
BRocknRolla
Member
The state you live in levies the sales tax. I believe my monthly phone bill doesn't include a state sales tax, and this is added on separately in the bill. Not every state has moved to put taxes on online sales. IL used to use the honor system of reporting online purchases, but you can imagine how well that went, so they've since moved to make it mandatory at checkout.
I would be interested to know too how this sort of this is viewed internationally, or has been viewed internationally if the subsidized 360 was sold out of the states. Would this ever fly outside the US?
Vane_MagicCity
Banned
The "you can get Live for half price" people crack me up.
They want to compare Microsoft prices against Amazon or New Egg prices. They should be comparing Microsoft prices against Microsoft prices. I guess they realize that an extra $1.67 per month for 24 months isn't really a bad financing deal.
TheDarkKnight774
Member
The standalone will be even more rare then the launch $499 PS3. MS will bury the no subsidized model
theusedversion
Member
But you are assuming that the new Live will have the same deals. It's a whole new Live, right? They are doing away with the points and whatnot?
I'm not an XBOX user so I have no idea.
It's only a 2 year contract. If you want to pay monthly for live after the contract it's $10 a month (which is obviously a bad deal, but hey it's an option). After the contract, the financed buyers can pay the $60 a year rate as well (or not at all)
Ol No Bones
Banned
The ps3.
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