I'm not saying that's the case, but I don't doubt they might shift funds if necessary to finish games which are a priority. Apparently I came across as a jackass with my last post, which I didn't mean too, but Broken Age running out of Kickstarter money wasn't giving me more confidence in Double Fine.
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Double Fine launch Spacebase DF-9 on Steam Early Access
- Thread starter Randdalf
- Start date
I'm not saying that's the case, but I don't doubt they might shift funds if necessary to finish games which are a priority. Apparently I came across as a jackass with my last post, which I didn't mean too, but Broken Age running out of Kickstarter money wasn't giving me more confidence in Double Fine.
Given that Spacebase DF9 is currently in Alpha, I think it's fair to say the game was in production well before Double Fine received the Kickstarter money for Massive Chalice.
Chris Remo
Member
This is correct. Spacebase has been in development for roughly six months.
Again, I already explained this in my previous post, but Double Fine has been a multi-project studio for years. We have 60 employees, but none of our games is individually a 60-person game. Putting 60 people on Broken Age wouldn't be financially feasible, but even if it were, it wouldn't actually help the game get done, because the design of that game is not such that it would benefit from tripling the team size.
Broken Age is going to get finished. Period. Double Fine has shipped many, MANY games in the past, and this one will also ship. But just because it's taking longer than originally planned doesn't mean we can afford to simply stop making OTHER games, because we need to employ all the members of our studio, not just the ones making Broken Age. Plus, it's a big part of what Double Fine is, post-Brutal Legend. It's a studio where individual developers can pitch idea and get their games made. That's how JP got to make Spacebase, and how Brad got to make Massive Chalice. It's part of our studio's culture. Tim also his his game, Broken Age, but his game can't simply stomp all over everyone else's game until it's done; we have to keep the whole studio running harmoniously.
And contrary to any conspiracy theories, that's what's happening. All these games are getting made. We're actually being quite open about what's going on with all of them (Broken Age through the backer updates, Massive Chalice through the many teamstreams and blogs, and Spacebase now through the fact that it's playable plus already has a ton of development blogs up on the site).
Anyone who is genuinely interested to learn about the development of these games has many opportunities to find out. We're not covering up big secrets. In fact, it sometimes seems like we should be covering things up instead of being honest about it! But we're not doing so; ultimately, we (and I) believe the best route is to be straightforward and to give people as much information as is possible to share, so that hopefully over time our community becomes more informed about how games are made generally and about how they're made at Double Fine. It's something I care about a lot personally, and I really appreciate that my employer does as well.
I know it seems sometimes that we're asking people to take our ability to ship games on faith. And I'm sure that's true to some extent. But I think it's been overstated. Again, we have shipped a LOT of games, and the ones we're still working have a lot of transparency, much moreso than most developers offer. Even Broken Age has barely been in development for 18 months. That's actually not a long time at all for a game. (It's also not out of money; if it were, we wouldn't still be paying people to make it, which we are.) It only seems like a long time because so many games aren't announced until they're almost done.
Anyway I'm going to stop making long posts about this! But I think people should take care to look at our entire history as a studio, not just a single data point and make all kinds of extrapolations out form it. We've shipped a lot of games, and a lot of different kinds of games, and we are going to keep doing that.
Double Fine's office is broken up into a bunch of galleys and each one is more or less a game team. You can walk past one U shaped curve of desks and see nothing but Broken Age, then the next galley is nothing but Massive Chalice, then Spacebase, etc. It's actually incredibly cool, it feels like a crazy game development co-op or something, except that every person there is doing incredible best-in-breed work on their respective project. It's kind of intimidating, being an outsider who just shows up a couple days here or there to do some UI work on one project.
They said in the livestream people are few to write and stream as much as they want.
Thanks!
I'm in the same mindset, I love everything I see, reminds me a lot of Startopia, but I'm afraid the content may be too thin to jump in at this time. Is there a road map like KSP has?
Chris Remo
Member
We have a general list of intended features here:
http://www.spacebasedf9.com/devplans
We're not getting super roadmappy with it though, for reasons I coincidentally wrote up a post about just seconds ago:
http://www.spacebasedf9.com/post/64282312845/ive-take-a-look-at-the-list-of-updates-to-come-and-it
The intended feature list is good enough for me, I'm loving what I'm seeing.
PsychoSoldier
Banned
That walkthrough sold me on the game. Looks rad even in this early state.
They haven't run out of money to finish their Kickstarter game. Stop it.
Well, that was fun. The game in its current state works really well. I had a base up and running after only one restart - I ran out of materials the first time before I built the life support 
It'd be nice if the base seed could be a starting basic reactor/life-support system that just needs a room placed around it. And maybe an airlock
Are the derelicts supposed to appear? I had the message they'd appeared a couple of times and couldn't find them.
Looking forward to seeing where this game goes!
Oh, and I only accidentally spaced one of my crew
It'd be nice if the base seed could be a starting basic reactor/life-support system that just needs a room placed around it. And maybe an airlock
Are the derelicts supposed to appear? I had the message they'd appeared a couple of times and couldn't find them.
Looking forward to seeing where this game goes!
Oh, and I only accidentally spaced one of my crew
Man, these technicians are killing me. Well, not me personally, but everyone on my spacebase. Doesn't seem to matter how many you've got at any given time - I had ten three-star and above Techs on my station, and there was no way they could keep up with all the exploding air scrubbers and doors.
Now everyone is dead
Sure does.
Now everyone is dead
Sure does.
Chris/ Jake
Just wanted to get your view, as a Dev, of the steam forums (Or discussions on the community hubs) for a game like this? (Or of one of the many released titles on steam)
Do you guys even bother going in there? I glanced at it when I was downloading the Alpha and it's downright scary the amount of misinformation or at least .. anger that those forums harbour.
I mean does the poisonous demeanor actively dissuade you to actually take part in there?
This is mostly for my own amusement to be honest.
Btw awesome job so far. Love the music and the UI is sick as hell (actually makes the game feel more polished with such a decent UI). Really enjoyed what I played so far, just waiting for that combat fix as I imagine the correct saying goes 'Can't hit the side of a barn' comes in play here.
Just wanted to get your view, as a Dev, of the steam forums (Or discussions on the community hubs) for a game like this? (Or of one of the many released titles on steam)
Do you guys even bother going in there? I glanced at it when I was downloading the Alpha and it's downright scary the amount of misinformation or at least .. anger that those forums harbour.
I mean does the poisonous demeanor actively dissuade you to actually take part in there?
This is mostly for my own amusement to be honest.
Btw awesome job so far. Love the music and the UI is sick as hell (actually makes the game feel more polished with such a decent UI). Really enjoyed what I played so far, just waiting for that combat fix as I imagine the correct saying goes 'Can't hit the side of a barn' comes in play here.
Messofanego
Banned
So it's basically a Double Fine convention. When are they selling tickets for Double Fine Con? DFCON?
?
Haha, that was a good one.
Lovely game execution, but people who are on the fence might want to wait for more content if they arent too fond of the alpha style versions in general. Did the devs announce what the are planning on adding to the game in the short/mid/long term?
Not sure about which feature set they're aiming for right now.
But here is the general idea of moving forward http://www.spacebasedf9.com/devplans
Oh god, I just wet my pants skimming over this.
It would still be cool to have a short/mid term development plan though to know whats up next. I mean they should probably know what they are working on atm, right?
Think they'll announce something along the lines of what the focus will be. Seems to be alot of requests for this ... and complaints of not having it.
So if there was no plan, I would highly suggest some sort of early /mid /late goal post on the steam page.
Just for discussions sake:
I ... see where they are coming from with this, but its still not really sitting well with me to not share the current development plans with the community who are basically supporting and funding your game development for you and even though these complaints in the steam forums are WAY out of proportion and needlessly harsh, I cant really... disagree on a fundamental level. You are obviously a seasoned dev and dont need any advice from a poor forum sod like me, but I suggest every small Indie developer I am coming across with that development model to be upfront with their users and tell them whats going on, what they spent money on and what they should be excited for (which in turn is good PR and drives further sales).
Just a note of what you are planning to work on next, and if that doesnt work out (because the systems dont fit together) , just tell the community. People buying into alpha games like being kept in the loop.
Week 1: Hey guys, we are working on the food system. Still ways to go and we need to implement more variety and ways for the player to actually make it work.
Week 2: We couldnt find a way to properly integrate and balance the food system for now, so we'll look at that later again and work on something easier to implement for our next update. We are still deciding between giant enemy crabs or small defensive means/weapons/turrets.
Week 3: Defenses come along nicely, here is a graphic for you: [snip]
Week 4: Patch is out! Defenses are in! Please report bugs there and there. Oh and ... as an additional bonus: [insert pic of giant enemy crab].
This alpha funding model is a fundamentally different challenge in terms of player communication, selling and PR. You have the incredibly lucky opportunity to develop such a game under the banner of a very prominent and good name - Double Fine, which gives you the benefit of the doubt even if things might start out a bit rough. Make the best of it!
Finally got to play it for about an hour or so, I guess I've seen all there is to see so far, and I potentially love it! Potentially because it's pretty hard to tell what this will end up being: Dwarf Fortress in space? Prison Architect in space? The Sims in space? Even after checking out the future development plan I'm not really sure although The Sims seems to be the most likely comparison.
That being said, I love "Aufbaustrategiespiele" (whatever you actually call it) and I already like DF-9 better than the (also very interesting) Prison Architect, mostly because it feels less abstract and, well, space is a more fun place than a prison. UI looks pretty amazing despite being a bit cluttered here and there. The only thing I didn't like is how derelicts are handled, that is a weird system so far with bits of old space stations suddenly popping up next to you.
The one thing I was missing in the development plan, even if it's not carved in stone, was different ranks for crew members -- my space station needs a captain and a bridge! Giving crew members more personality seems to be planned though, so that's cool.
Other than that, I just hope that the game over time develops a "grander" feeling if that makes sense. I mean, it's space, there are dozens of different species around, would be sweet if there was some kind of mission or diplomacy system coming.
But, yeah, overall it seems really promising!
That being said, I love "Aufbaustrategiespiele" (whatever you actually call it) and I already like DF-9 better than the (also very interesting) Prison Architect, mostly because it feels less abstract and, well, space is a more fun place than a prison. UI looks pretty amazing despite being a bit cluttered here and there. The only thing I didn't like is how derelicts are handled, that is a weird system so far with bits of old space stations suddenly popping up next to you.
The one thing I was missing in the development plan, even if it's not carved in stone, was different ranks for crew members -- my space station needs a captain and a bridge! Giving crew members more personality seems to be planned though, so that's cool.
Other than that, I just hope that the game over time develops a "grander" feeling if that makes sense. I mean, it's space, there are dozens of different species around, would be sweet if there was some kind of mission or diplomacy system coming.
But, yeah, overall it seems really promising!
Messofanego
Banned
If the ships "jumped" into your plane like Battlestar Galactica, that would be a great visual flourish.
I would think that its something they will eventually add. Its just work on a little bit of visual spice that is better used on other parts of the game atm.
PsychoSoldier
Banned
I'm glad I'm not the only one having problems with technicians.
I think I may try to just go without technicians and just rebuild instead for now.
I think I may try to just go without technicians and just rebuild instead for now.
chrominance
Member
I agree, it's totally fine to not set deadlines and be able to change dev priorities at will because shit happens, but it'd be nice to know what the rough plan is for development. I know I keep bringing up Dwarf Fortress, but the DF homepage is basically a dev blog, and it tells you what Toady's working on that day and what the short term priorities are. Obviously it doesn't need to be so detailed; Toma's suggestion would be fantastic.
I don't think reasonable people will balk if one week you say you're working on something, and then the next week have to say you dropped that thing to work on something else. I think people just want an idea of how their game's likely to change/improve in the coming weeks.
Messofanego
Banned
hey_it's_that_dog
benevolent sexism
Is this new news? I didn't know this before and it's kind of exciting.
Regarding the openness of the project, I think more Kickstarter-style projects could take a page out of the book of Stonehearth (just watching another of their weekly livestreams right now) ... really open to the community, sharing development of things as they go, answering questions, bringing the community into the design process (to some degree).
Godus was good with their videos where they sometimes directly addressed backer concerns or questions, but it was nowhere near as interactive.
DFA has been really good with the incredibly polished videos - I've been really enjoying them, but there's absolutely no interaction with backers there, and I think that's a shame. Obviously with DFA there's a bunch of secrecy due to the nature of the game, but for something like DF9 there doesn't need to be as much secrecy.
Godus was good with their videos where they sometimes directly addressed backer concerns or questions, but it was nowhere near as interactive.
DFA has been really good with the incredibly polished videos - I've been really enjoying them, but there's absolutely no interaction with backers there, and I think that's a shame. Obviously with DFA there's a bunch of secrecy due to the nature of the game, but for something like DF9 there doesn't need to be as much secrecy.
Chris Remo
Member
By popular demand, we've split up the Dev Plans page into near-, mid-, and long-term plans:
http://www.spacebasedf9.com/devplans
http://www.spacebasedf9.com/devplans
bonesmccoy
Banned
This is all I needed. In @$25.
Technosteve
Banned
is this game like caesar III in space?
Awesome
Now if only the site wouldnt be hammered 
My own impressions:
- Spacedate 9118.5: Normal life was settling in after we got the O2 supply and refineries running. Our technician Carl had some spare parts from the refinery construction and managed to build a fusion reactor from these scraps, which is kinda incredible. No one had the heart to tell him that all our machines are, for some strange reason we've yet to discover, running without any power supply, though.
- Spacedate 9118.10: We needed some bed rooms, and though totally unnecessary, we decided to build an orbital ring around our station in which the bed rooms are supposed to be located. Construction work started. Carl is constantly repairing the useless fusion reactor. Hopefully, we'll find him something else to do before he realizes that there is no food stored on the ship, except... us.
- Spacedate 9118.15: The good news: We got visitors! The bad news: They are trying to kill us. For no apparent reason, as they just told us over the intercom. No one is trained as a guard, so we'll need to rush everyone through a quick 5 minute briefing, give them some weapons and hope for the best.
- Spacedate 9118.17: We managed to defeat the intruders, but 4 of our crew died fighting them. Carl is currently still trying to put out the wildfire in the main hall. I need to go help him immediately or we might run out of oxygen.
- Spacedate 9118.18: YOU HAVE REACHED THE LAST ENTRY OF THIS PROTOCOL
Spacebase DF-9 is a simulation game which takes more than a few nods from Dwarf Fortress. Before your fear of ASCII makes you run in away in panic, let me tell you though that the newer Dwarf Fortress style simulation games are actually rather accessible (the fantastic Gnomoria would be another example for this). Everything you want to do, can be done with a few simple mouse clicks through very self-explanatory menus.
Build walls -> click the built room -> select room type.
Click build room objects -> select room type -> build objects for that room.
I have a hard time imagining someone would ever feel lost with the way the UI is set up and I think Double Fine did a marvelous job at making it "work" intuitively. There are some kinks here and there, but overall its already surprisingly polished and workable. The developers also put an astounding amount of charm into the game through fitting flavor text and character animations. It is simply endearing to notice how Kevin tries to socialize with the other crew members, only to write down in his personal log later "Wont somebody be my friend? ;_______;". The gameplay itself will be familiar to those who already played similar games. The general premise is to expand your station, which you either do to build defensive measures and a bigger/better infrastructure, or to improve the life of your crew members. Enemies are, once again, the driving force behind the players construction plans. After you overcame the first enemy, your shrinking oxygen supply, you will likely be visited by raiders and pirates who are attracted to your space station. If I didnt mention it yet, the game is trying to kill you. Quite much.
Spacebase definitely already works as a means to experience a story, because it makes you attached to what you are building, the people you are guiding and will make you experience loss, be that in the form of expensive materials being destroyed or lives lost. However, it currently does not work all that well as a "game", not because there is no way to win (which is very common in this genre), but because the game doesnt have enough options to create a balance of fairness and because it is missing longevity. You will learn to overcome some odds while creating your space station, but the odds are still massively stacked against you, because the player has not enough means to prepare for any danger. At its fundamental level, Spacebase currently has 4 different rooms with 1 object each and the desire to play Spacebase is largely driven by a creative desire to create a decent looking space station with people running around and to discover random relicts, other space ships and space stations which are filled with secrets. And those secrets are deadly, and usually come in the form highly trained raiders that take out half of your crew. Experiencing that once is fun and makes for a good story about heroic deaths, however experiencing that twice with no way to do anything about it is frustrating, because the current version of the game doesnt allow for learning from past strategies or mistakes and you are likely to die from the same dangers over and over again:
There are some more technical issues like path finding and glitches, but while I do think it is fair to tell the potentially interested customer about the shortcomings of the current version of the game, it also needs to be considered that the game is currently in alpha and therefore missing a lot of features and polish that we are going to see added over the next few weeks and months (years?) as it is currently far from being feature complete. A very good example of that would be how the game ends when you die. You will idle in space without any sort of screen telling you that your crew died. In fact you might not even have noticed that that the crew died if you were busy watching another part of the ship. If you want to get an idea of where the game might be heading in the long term, here is a long list of interesting features they are currently considering: http://spacebasedf9.com/devplans
This game shows a LOT of promise and has some very talented developers behind it that will likely not disappoint their customers in the long run, even if the early weeks might be a bit rough. Should you immediately go out and buy it? Probably not if you feel ripped off if you don't get enough content on day 1. Don't if you aren't prepared for the occasional bugs and instabilities. But if you aren't too tight on cash at the moment and like what you see and like the idea of revisiting a constantly changing game, offering new opportunities after every update, then join me and Double Fine on our way toconquerdie in space.
No, see my impressions above. Its currently a very, very simple Dwarf Fortress style game, but with lots of promise and polish. I really hope they can put a lot of work into this.
Messofanego
Banned
Well-detailed impressions, Toma, and I liked the journal entries 
Carl needs to go!
I'm not far enough in the game to say whether it's unbalanced and not enough options to fight back, but that's good feedback that's fit for the Double Fine forums.
Carl needs to go! I'm not far enough in the game to say whether it's unbalanced and not enough options to fight back, but that's good feedback that's fit for the Double Fine forums.
Because they now divided their upcoming features, here are the short term features:
Food, growing and processing is a very, very good decision for the current focus. It allows for another element that needs to be maintained while adding more depth to the base layouts.
Food, growing and processing is a very, very good decision for the current focus. It allows for another element that needs to be maintained while adding more depth to the base layouts.
Has anyone had issues with a glitch where the entirety of the space background turns white? It turns back to normal only when I pause the game, but goes back to being white when I resume. It is incredibly distracting for me and I cannot keep playing until I get it to fix itself somehow. I will try to reproduce the solution but I do not know how it starts in the first place.
bistromathics
facing a bright new dawn
Where is this KSP Roadmap you speak of?
efyu_lemonardo
May I have a cookie?
I think Tim would be proud of the comparisons to Nintendo
Oh man, I think your gifs just sold me on this game!
Seems very similar to STARTOPIA from 2001. Thematically at least. STARTOPIA was isometric 3D while this is in 2D
http://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/startopia
Some let's plays:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMCdt_mDH5w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftqGpsXQZeI
It should be mentioned in this thread that Startopia was recently greenlit on Steam!
I encourage anybody who's a fan of such games to check it out, either there or on GOG where it's been for several years now.
Most of all, I'd love to hear impressions from the good people at Double Fine developing Spacebase DF9. Have you guys played Startopia? What did you think were its strengths and weaknesses, and how will SBDF9 build or improve upon them?
Shining Sunshine
Banned
How do I get rid of dead bodies?
They disappear after 10 minutes. I assume they'll eventually introduce a system to take care of that (Space burials!), currently just wait for them to disappear.
PM me.