Support NeoGAF

[Marc]

It sounds that way. I don't think they'd make such a claim if it wasn't true, currently.

But then the question becomes, why weren't the other captures similarly affected if the source of the problem is the Xbox itself?

I haven't done captures so may be missing something, I don't trust DF implicitly enough at this point to take them at their word that they were right and everyone else was wrong.

 

[teiresias]

I presume retail XB1s will have full range RGB output, so I guess DF can re capture using that version if they want. With the other retail updates it may be worth it to recompare them.

If the development Xbones can't even output full-range RGB that must be a nightmare for texture artists working on the damn thing.

Still, I don't know why people even bother using full-range RGB to begin with. It frequently causes more issues than it's worth.

 

[sephi22]

If anything, just to get people to realize that DF blundered the capture process.

We already had a thread on this. It was closed
http://67.227.255.239/forum/showthread.php?t=706051

 

[PairOfFilthySocks]

originally posted by canis lupus:

posted yet

And there it is: uncompressed, native captures with correct output calibration.

PS4 is clearly superior in just about every way.

0_______________________0

Just fucking kill me now.

 

[nib95]

XBO does a good upscaling job, so I don't think I will notice the difference between XBO and PS4 on my HDTV. PC-version plays in another world though.

In these GIFs XBO looks prettier:

Xbox One versions have been way over sharpened. Look at all the cables, construction cranes, grass, steps etc. Lots of aliasing in the XO shots, which will look even worse in motion due to shimmering. If you guys want added sharpness, just add it yourselves on your TV set. The original image should not be sharpened like the scaler is doing with the XO image. It is adding all sorts of negative afflictions including edge halo'ing and more. The PC/PS4 versions look more natural and life like as a result.

 

[Always-honest]

That's what I'm seeing too.

Some of the textures seem more detailed on XO. The XO signal is also a little darker with better color definition.

In the framerate comparison video, XO is also ahead in some sequences. PS4 is ahead in others.

So... what's the explanation? PS4 is slightly more powerful. Was the PS4 version botched?

What you are seeing is a fucked up test.

 

[Hoje0308]

So Digital Foundry admits there was a mistake somewhere along the line but are adamant that the mistake wasn't theirs and with this mistake they are still sticking by their comparison? Wow

Bedwetter, dude. Sorry, Leadbetter.

 

[gundamkyoukai]

Looks like it works, even in 2013, regardless of image quality or resolution. Crush dem blacks and torch those whites and omg looks better than literally everything else!

Yep somethings just don't change , i see this happen among my friends also .
All that detail gone just so it can have more pop is such a sad thing to see .

 

[ohNOitsRO]

In these GIFs XBO looks prettier:

Wow, that's funny cause in those GIFS the PS4 looks prettier

 

[Snapshot King]

Maybe? I would've said at this point it was unlikely any major optimization between now and launch but they're already promising the XB1 some effects so who knows? Maybe they can further optimize the PS4 version a bit

Aww =(. I want 60fps ;_;

 

[coldfoot]

Crushed blacks, sharpen filter can't explain this mess:

Why the hell did DICE put a vaseline filter on the PS4 version and destroy texture detail?

 

[bbalde]

At the Office I showed the video to 5 people, its simple for them it look the same. Perception and reality doesn't needs to be correlated. I didn't showed them the difference, I'm no Sony or Microsoft PR, its their job to do that, not me.

I'll say now it will be down to the price perception. That power talk was so overblown people were expecting an abyssal difference. Perception says otherwise. If you keep telling look at that weak racer he will not even finish the course and argument it to convince people and the day of the race that looser came fourth, well he will be the surprise of the day.

 

[nib95]

Crushed blacks, sharpen filter can't explain this mess:

Why the hell did DICE put a vaseline filter on the PS4 version and destroy texture detail?

You can turn it off in the options.

 

[Hoje0308]

We already had a thread on this. It was closed
http://67.227.255.239/forum/showthread.php?t=706051

My mistake. I'll get off my soapbox now.

 

[Prisoner KSC2-303]

Shinobi better cut out those flawed DF screens from the OP, they are doing more harm than good.

This.

People are talk at cross purposes and accusing each other of being blind, simply because everyone's looking at different images as a point of reference.

The DF shots and the unlabelled sharpened gifs are really muddying the waters.

 

[Lord Error]

When they are both being scaled up to 1080p, to me it is, at least from what I have seen so far. Who knows maybe live the difference will be more noticeable.

This really shouldn't even be brought up. You can 'upscale' a 100x60 image to 1080p just as well. Any resolution can be upscaled to 1080p.

 

[eot]

Sorry to be pedantic, but it's running 33% less pixels.

36%

if we're being pedantic

 

[ToD_]

Crushed blacks, sharpen filter can't explain this mess:

Why the hell did DICE put a vaseline filter on the PS4 version and destroy texture detail?

Maybe it's simply being blurred due to movement (motion blur)? Either that or the PS4 version has a lower res texture.

 

[Gemüsepizza]

You can turn it off in the options.

Yep, and Digital Foundry did not even bother to check the settings for this.

 

[coldfoot]

You can turn it off in the options.

You can? On a console game? Console games where you can enable disable IQ options like PC? What is this sorcery?

 

[Sword Of Doom]

Yep somethings just don't change , i see this happen among my friends also .
All that detail gone just so it can have more pop is such a sad thing to see .

They can just play the PS4 on "vibrant" or "vivid" mode on their tv and it'll look like the XB1 version

 

[Entrecôte]

You can turn it off in the options.

Thought this was only confirmed for 3 version?

 

[NoirVisage]

So Digital Foundry admits there was a mistake somewhere along the line but are adamant that the mistake wasn't theirs and with this mistake they are still sticking by their comparison? Wow

common sense, Leadbetter is clearly the captain of the ship in every way.

So... If you genuinely believe this was intentional, you need to spend some time off the internet to let the crazy wear off. Don't interpret this post as me probably being a fanboy. Interpret it as me, a fellow human being. If you think this was done to misrepresent the disparity you need a break.

you're a bit full of yourself, let people think as they will, whaty stake do you have in white knighting DF?

 

[nib95]

You can? On a console game?

Yeap. FXAA (AA) option is in the menu.

 

[Gemüsepizza]

You can? On a console game? Console games where you can enable disable IQ options like PC? What is this sorcery?

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=87955389&postcount=5072

 

[plagiarize]

But then the question becomes, why weren't the other captures similarly affected if the source of the problem is the Xbox itself?

I haven't done captures so may be missing something, I don't trust DF implicitly enough at this point to take them at their word that they were right and everyone else was wrong.

all other captures were done with the Xbox One set to limited colour output, which works fine. full is always preferable though, so since there was the option they chose it, but apparently it's not working properly yet, and thus blacks were seriously crushed.

everyone else used the pre configured capture equipment and settings. DF brought their own and set the consoles up as they normally would, not aware that the Full RGB output option wasn't working right.

 

[Prisoner KSC2-303]

36%

if we're being pedantic

Touche!

 

[Entrecôte]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=87955389&postcount=5072

"If there's the same on BF4 of PS4 it will solve the blurry, vasaline textures some of you have been complaining about."

 

[Bossofman]

they left the poor guy to fend for himself

Yup, they are Bending him over without even the courtesy of a Reach Around.

 

[Superflat]

The real story here is both of these new next gen systems are well behind a modern mid-range pc and that is appalling.

Mid-range? Mid range PC can play current gen games with high settings, not what the PS4 and XBO can put out at 60 fps and 1080. Unless there was a sizable standard jump in the past week.

 

[zomgbbqftw]

You can turn it off in the options.

You can? That would be novel for console games!

 

[Jack cw]

At the Office I showed the video to 5 people, its simple for them it look the same. Perception and reality doesn't needs to be correlated. I didn't showed them the difference, I'm no Sony or Microsoft PR, its their job to do that, not me.

I'll say now it will be down to the price perception. That power talk was so overblown people were expecting an abyssal difference. Perception says otherwise. If you keep telling look at that weak racer he will not even finish the course and argument it to convince people and the day of the race that looser came fourth, well he will be the surprise of the day.

What? I can show an 360p image upscaled to 1080p to a average joe versus a native 1080p shot of the same frame of the same game and he wouldnt notice it. Fact is, there is a huge power gap. Spin it as you like with arguemtns like this, the gap is there and its as big as it was expected.

 

[ymmv]

XBO does a good upscaling job, so I don't think I will notice the difference between XBO and PS4 on my HDTV. PC-version plays in another world though.

In these GIFs XBO looks prettier:

I wonder why people keep using these GIFs. Don't people see that the UI elements don't line up? The PS4 UI elements are closer to the edge of the screen than the Xbox One's. What this probably means is that the original PS4 image was blown up slightly so it could be aligned with the Xbox One screenshot, which makes the GIF completely useless as a compairson: the PS4 screen is not in its original resolution anymore and less sharp.

 

[Gemüsepizza]

"If there's the same on BF4 of PS4 it will solve the blurry, vasaline textures some of you have been complaining about.
"

Why wouldn't there be the same option? It's trivial to implement.

 

[RoadHazard]

Crushed blacks, sharpen filter can't explain this mess:

Why the hell did DICE put a vaseline filter on the PS4 version and destroy texture detail?

This is the one truly weird thing to me. The PS4 version really does look like it has a lower-res texture here, and I just can't see any good reason for that given what we know about the hardware.

 

[Sword Of Doom]

all other captures were done with the Xbox One set to limited colour output, which works fine. full is always preferable though, so since there was the option they chose it, but apparently it's not working properly yet, and thus blacks were seriously crushed.

everyone else used the pre configured capture equipment and settings. DF brought their own and set the consoles up as they normally would, not aware that the Full RGB output option wasn't working right.

You'd think they would notice the full RGB mode was causing problems and not turn it on

 

[Snapshot King]

I wonder why people keep using these GIFs. Don't people see that the UI elements don't line up? The PS4 UI elements are closer to the edge of the screen than the Xbox One's. What this probably means is that the original PS4 image was blown up slightly so it could be aligned with the Xbox One screenshot, which makes the GIF completely useless as a compairson: the PS4 screen is not in its original resolution anymore and less sharp.

I believe the UI is actually larger on the Xbox One because of the lower resolution, which would make sense if they're using the same UI assets for everything.

 

[Entrecôte]

Why wouldn't there be the same option? It's trivial to implement.

Sure. But until it is shown to be definitely there, no point in saying it is definitely there.

 

[theDeeDubs]

In some of the pics half the detail on the screen is literally lost in the darkness but whatever more contrast! more sharpness! vivid mode hooray!

It reminds me of when my parents got their first HDTV a few years ago, and I spent a few hours calibrating it. When I finished they were like, "ugh that doesn't look that great. I want it to pop like our neighbor's." So I switched it to Vivid and of course they said, "There. Right there. Now that's a good picture!" I paused one of the blu's I was using and switched back and forth trying to show how all the detail was lost in the shadows, but they weren't having it. Switching back and forth made the correct calibration look really washed out and this is what happened to the PS3 comparisons last gen and looks to continue for the PS4. I hate crushed blacks. I ended up switching their set to the correct setting when they weren't looking.

 

[Masked_Ninja]

Anybody know when we will see some ghost footage on both console's?
That's gonna be interesting.

 

[The One Who Knocks]

Ah, then why is this thread 105 pages based on footage and images that don't look the way they actually look? And it seems kind of asinine that people are actually claiming one is more dominant over the other if that's the case. Does that mean they just prefer the way DF fucked up the PS4 capture instead of the way they fucked up the XB1 capture?

It's like I'm not part of the inside joke...this just looks like your typical 360/PS3 comparison thread where there are some visual differences and trade offs with both. The PS4 looks overall better but I'm not seeing this domination that I'm reading about in here. I know there's all kinds of crazy things going on under the hood that swing things even more in PS4's favor (if what I'm reading on here is true) but it doesn't look like it's making that big of a difference.

While the footage from Digital Foundry is pretty irrelevant, the framerate analysis (unless I'm missing something) is not and that is the most telling aspect (which leads to the 'domination' that is being suggested). The reason for this is that the Playstation 4 version is at 900p, while the Xbox One version is 720p. If the Playstation 4 had a higher resolution, but an inferior framerate, there wouldn't be much of note here; this isn't the case though as the Playstation 4 version, overall, runs better and at a higher resolution than the Xbox One version, with an additional feature (Ambient Occlusion). This additional feature will be added to the Xbox One version, but it is not unlikely that this will bring with it a performance hit, further increasing the gap between the framerate of the two (as I've mentioned in a post a few pages back, to say how much of an impact it will have would merely be surmising). What this ultimately means is that the Playstation 4 version runs better, and at a higher resolution, than the Xbox One version (of course the computer version is definitely the best version, I'm ignoring that solely to focus on the relevant console versions). Now looking at screens (that aren't botched), maybe to some people there isn't a large difference, but on paper there is quite a gap between the two.

EDIT: Although it is worth noting that before anything conclusive can be stated, we really do need to wait for the release build and a decent comparison between the two where we can be assured that differences are not the result of a poor capture. EDIT: The picture of the head above is quite baffling though.

EDIT 2: Ok, so it seems that Digital Foundry was seemingly not at fault and it's the Xbox One's hardware itself that's causing the issue. I'm unsure what effect this would have on the validity of the comparison.

 

[Oppo]

This thread just sucked up two hours of my life. It was extremely enlightening and entertaining. Time to do it all again at that certain Russian's blog, which will be even more entertaining!

have you guys gone over there yet

it is amazing

 

[Sword Of Doom]

This is the one truly weird thing to me. The PS4 version really does look like it has a lower-res texture here, and I just can't see any good reason for that given what we know about the hardware.

Maybe Sony needs to patch their upscaling software

 

[TheCanisDirus]

You can turn it off in the options.

Just like PS3. Wait... let's hope you still can on the PS4... do we have any confirmation?

 

[coldfoot]

Maybe Sony needs to patch their upscaling software

That has nothing to do with upscaling

 

[Gemüsepizza]

Just like PS3. Wait... let's hope you still can on the PS4... do we have any confirmation?

No because those "journalists" from Digital Foundry did not bother to check.

 

[Ebomb]

I wonder why people keep using these GIFs. Don't people see that the UI elements don't line up? The PS4 UI elements are closer to the edge of the screen than the Xbox One's. What this probably means is that the original PS4 image was blown up slightly so it could be aligned with the Xbox One screenshot, which makes the GIF completely useless as a compairson: the PS4 screen is not in its original resolution anymore and less sharp.

Um no. The UI elements look smaller and towards the edge of the screen due to resolution difference. UI is one of the most noticeable things for me on PC when adjusting resolution.

 

[Lord Error]

So Digital Foundry admits there was a mistake somewhere along the line but are adamant that the mistake wasn't theirs and with this mistake they are still sticking by their comparison? Wow

The mistake is in the XB1 firmware, he's right to point that out. Their methodology was not flawed.

 

[PaNaMa]

Can someone (I wonder) post a non vaseline smeared PS4 screen shot? I don't know if anyones knows anyone at DF or whatever. At least make them aware the smear can be turned off? Are we sure this is what accounts for the blur, and not the upscaling?

 

[DR3AM]

my tv is only 720p, 1080i and 1080p. ps4 version is 900p. can I still play it on my tv?