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[shawnbuddy]

http://www.npr.org/2017/08/11/54267...re-for-all-bill-wont-pass-thats-not-the-point

Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders will introduce a bill next month to create a government-run, single-payer health care system. And he knows it's going to fail.

"Look, I have no illusions that under a Republican Senate and a very right-wing House and an extremely right-wing president of the United States, that suddenly we're going to see a Medicare-for-all, single-payer passed," he said recently, sitting in his Senate office. "You're not going to see it. That's obvious."

The point of the bill, Sanders says, is to force a conversation: "Excuse me: why is the United States the only major country on earth not to guarantee health care to all people? Why are we spending far, far more per capita on health care than any other nation? Why do we pay the highest prices in the world for prescription drugs?"

I thought this was interesting. What do you think, waste of time or worthwhile?

 

[shnurgleton]

Sounds fine, whatever. Of course I'm in favor of single payer but maybe if the berninator wasn't going it alone as usual there would actually be a conversation instead of him, dressed in sackcloth and alone, shouting at a bleary eyed congress

 

[Steel]

There have been a few healthcare bills introduced by dems over the last 6 months, but none of them have made it out of committee and as such no one even knew they existed. This will be no different.

 

[GoldenEye 007]

I think it's fine. But yeah, Steel with the good point. This will never make it out of committee.

 

[jack_package_200]

There have been a few healthcare bills introduced by dems over the last 6 months, but none of them have made it out of committee and as such no one even knew they existed. This will be no different.

Perhaps but I appreciate the effort

 

[neoemonk]

It's like this guy is just playing politics or something.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

Sure, why not, although acting like it isn't already a conversation is being a bit disingenuous

 

[Foffy]

It seems like a nice attempt at raising awareness to America's literal cartel system.

But right now, all we can do is take the broken thing we have and hide it from the GOP who want to drop MOABs on it. :/

Sure, why not, although acting like it isn't already a conversation is being a bit disingenuous

It's not a conversation to the GOP.

European healthcare is seen as a negative compared to what we already have.

 

[CloudyTuba]

Any effort is appreciated effort and nobody should shit talk a guy for trying.

 

[jtb]

Whatever. If it gets people to turn out in 2018 then it's a worthwhile stunt.

 

[Sephzilla]

I at least appreciate the effort

 

[TurnipFritters]

There have been a few healthcare bills introduced by dems over the last 6 months, but none of them have made it out of committee and as such no one even knew they existed. This will be no different.

People will know this existed.

 

[Steel]

Perhaps but I appreciate the effort

Yeah, just saying no one remembers the attempts that have already been murdered.

Sure, why not, although acting like it isn't already a conversation is being a bit disingenuous

Yeah, McConnel's already been saying that the Dems simultaneously don't have ideas and want evil single payer.

People will know this existed.

There won't be a full vote on it, so there won't be much to remember.

 

[ianpm31]

Any effort is appreciated effort and nobody should shit talk a guy for trying.

Pretty much

 

[mlclmtckr]

It's good to get people on record, one way or another. Helps to define the party lines going forward.

But I don't think this will be some big defining moment for the Democrats, it will just quietly fail. Still worth doing though.

 

[Sectorseven]

Hypothetically, if this bill passed, would Trump sign it?

I mean, he might hear it's a healthcare bill and just sign it without even reading it.

 

[mlclmtckr]

It's like this guy is just playing politics or something.

wait what

 

[jtb]

Pretty much

Any effort is appreciated effort and nobody should shit talk a guy for trying.

Well, it's not like there are also important issues with the ACA that need to be fixed right now also. So let's not give too much credit for doomed legislation that will help zero people.

 

[TurnipFritters]

Hypothetically, if this bill passed, would Trump sign it?

I mean, he might hear it's a healthcare bill and just sign it without even reading it.

Depends on if they rename it to the Donald Trump Very Good Health Care Bill.

 

[jack_package_200]

Depends on if they rename it to the Donald Trump Very Good Health Care Bill.

The "Donald's Large Hands Not A Russian Puppet Healtharece Bill"

 

[Chindogg]

Well, it's not like there are also important issues with the ACA that need to be fixed right now also. So let's not give too much credit for doomed legislation that will help zero people.

It's almost like you can't both support fixing the ACA and introduce single payer legislation at the same time.

Oh right, you can. People just wanna shit on Bernie because they're still mad over the election.

 

[Schattenjäger]

Comparable to when Cruz introduced bills to repeal the ACA
More symbolic than anything

 

[Meowster]

I appreciate the effort even if it isn't likely to pass. We need more work on our healthcare - especially after that bullshit the GOP tried passing.

 

[Steel]

Hypothetically, if this bill passed, would Trump sign it?

I mean, he might hear it's a healthcare bill and just sign it without even reading it.

You're acting like the bill has a chance of being put up for a vote to pass. Even bipartisan healthcare bills that stabilize Obamacare and not much else are gonna be thrown aside by McConnell without ever being voted on.

 

[IAmAnAgnostic]

Wont this divide the Democratic party though? Or are all expected to vote yes?

 

[kirblar]

Yeah, I'll give Sanders a lot of shit for how he handled this in the campaign, but he's admitting this is a stunt and his language has changed a lot recently. Note here that the first point he makes its about a lack of Universal Healthcare. In recent appearances (last two months or so) he's been talking about the importance of getting the Public Option back in the ACA that got vetoed by Lieberman & co in the Senate back in '09.

Wont this divide the Democratic party though? Or are all expected to vote yes?

I don't think so, someone clearly got through to him that he needed to change his messaging. It also won't make it to the floor.

 

[Veitsev]

Wont this divide the Democratic party though? Or are all expected to vote yes?

It will likely not even get to the point where its vote on.

 

[psyfi]

Yes, this is smart. Help people remember what is possible, what responsible and caring government can look like.

 

[Steel]

Wont this divide the Democratic party though? Or are all expected to vote yes?

If it somehow made it to a vote (Which would require it to pass a Republican held committee and be allowed to be voted on by McConnell), then it would be similar to the ACA repeals during the Obama years, everyone would vote yes for the symbolism regardless of how much or little the bill contains. But it won't get that far.

 

[Fenderputty]

Comparable to when Cruz introduced bills to repeal the ACA
More symbolic than anything

Yeah but those symbolic bills were part of the multi-pronged push to drive public perception on the right. Doing this hopefully accomplishes the same for the left and moderate dems.

 

[zelas]

I don't appreciate the effort. This does absolutely nothing for me. It will literally fail to even create the conversation in Congress that you're interested in.

Stop voting to deny quicker help to kids with cancer or to put FDA jobs at risk.

 

[shawnbuddy]

Wont this divide the Democratic party though? Or are all expected to vote yes?

They will never vote on this bill, it'll die long before that point.

 

[Chindogg]

I don't appreciate the effort. This does absolutely nothing for me. It will literally fail to even create the conversation in Congress that you're interested in.

Stop voting to deny quicker help to kids with cancer or to put FDA jobs at risk.

What the fuck are you talking about?

 

[mlclmtckr]

Wont this divide the Democratic party though? Or are all expected to vote yes?

I think that if it somehow came to a vote every D would vote yes.

But it is also about 'dividing the party' in the sense that it forces everyone to take a side. Which is good and how party politics are supposed to work.

 

[kirblar]

Yeah but those symbolic bills were part of the multi-pronged push to drive public perception on the right. Doing this hopefully accomplishes the same for the left and moderate dems.

One of the problems w/ endless symbolic non-starter bills (especially in Healthcare) is that when you actually get the votes, often times the work hasn't been done to actually make an alternative work.

We've seen this year both on the right w/ "Repeal and Replace" and on the left w/ California's doomed single-payer proposal, which died because they had the votes to pass one, but not an actual workable plan to do it. (It may also not actually be feasible there due to CA's stupid propositions handcuffing them w/ raising enough tax revenue, but we'd know that if they actually worked up a real bill rather than one meant just to signal a position.)

 

[Your Entertainer]

I don't appreciate the effort. This does absolutely nothing for me. It will literally fail to even create the conversation in Congress that you're interested in.

Stop voting to deny quicker help to kids with cancer or to put FDA jobs at risk.

New headline: "Neogaf poster to make snarky remark on Sanders in a Sanders thread"

 

[Neuromancer]

Fuck this guy for even trying.

 

[y2dvd]

I don't appreciate the effort. This does absolutely nothing for me. It will literally fail to even create the conversation in Congress that you're interested in.

Stop voting to deny quicker help to kids with cancer or to put FDA jobs at risk.

I read this 5 times over and I'm still lost.

 

[BanGy.nz]

I hope this bill has substance to it so it can be used as a foundation for future movement on healthcare, if it's just the lefts version of those 'repeal obamacare' bills the GOP pushed for years I'll be very frustrated.

 

[kirblar]

I read this 5 times over and I'm still lost.

They're talking about Sanders grandstanding with a vote against a vote to re-authorize FDA funding to keep it from shutting down drug trials this month: http://thehill.com/policy/healthcar...drug-policy/345182-senate-passes-fda-user-fee

(This I can understand the frustration with, at least w/ this failed bill he's acknowledging the game.)

 

[jtb]

It's almost like you can't both support fixing the ACA and introduce single payer legislation at the same time.

Oh right, you can. People just wanna shit on Bernie because they're still mad over the election.

Stop playing the victim and learn how to read.

 

[El_Tiguere]

Comparable to when Cruz introduced bills to repeal the ACA
More symbolic than anything

It is only symbolic in America (even if it is good policy across the modern industrialized world), because we have lapdog congressmen on both sides of the isle siding with health insurers and the rest of the racketeers in US health care, in direct opposition to most Americans who want cheaper reliable health care.

The obstructionists of progress because they have to protect corporate profits are a cancer in our country.

 

[pigeon]

Legit I have no idea why it took him this fucking long. Conyers's bill was introduced in January.

 

[Steejee]

"(Start|Force|Begin|Have) a conversation" is one of those phrases that gets auto-translated in my brain to "Nothing will happen"

Yeah I'd like Medicare for All, but there will be no conversation resulting from this, no consequences.

 

[Battersea Power Station]

Hypothetically, if this bill passed, would Trump sign it?

I mean, he might hear it's a healthcare bill and just sign it without even reading it.

Just call it the Donald J. Trump MAGA Excellent Healthcare Bill. He'll sign it on live TV.

 

[Koomaster]

If it's an actual, well thought out and competent bill - as in you could take it, vote on it, and enact it 'as is' - great. We need actual legislation on the road to single-payer and the more thorough it is the better. Needs to show how it will affect people, the amount it covers and what it will do to budgets and the economy before we can even start the conversation. Can't just have a piece of paper that says 'Medicare for All' written over and over again.

If it's just more of his grandstanding (which it probably is) he can get lost. Don't need him muddying the waters trying to have a 'conversation' by throwing breadcrumbs into the sea.

 

[cakely]

Expanding Medicare to all ages and levying a tax to pay for it would be a terrific fix for hour health care system, but yeah, it's not happening.

All those publicly traded insurance companies are not going to be willingly put out of business, and that's the end of that.

 

[TetraGenesis]

You've gotta start somewhere. Symbolic gestures like this aren't entirely meaningless in the face of the Republican failure to pass a new healthcare bill. There are more people that need to hear this alternative talked about in the media and elsewhere.

 

[shawnbuddy]

If it's an actual, well thought out and competent bill - as in you could take it, vote on it, and enact it 'as is' - great. We need actual legislation on the road to single-payer and the more thorough it is the better. Needs to show how it will affect people, the amount it covers and what it will do to budgets and the economy before we can even start the conversation. Can't just have a piece of paper that says 'Medicare for All' written over and over again.

Let's be realistic, you know it won't be. A real Medicare For All bill is going to be a huge undertaking. Why waste all that effort on a symbolic gesture?

 

[mlclmtckr]

Let's be realistic, you know it won't be. A real Medicare For All bill is going to be a huge undertaking. Why waste all that effort on a symbolic gesture?

this but unironically