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[Bebpo]

So I was at the mall and I happened to stop by the local dvd store. There, the store employee tried very hard to get me to join their club thingy, "If you buy lots of dvds you'll save money". So I tell him, "No, thanks. I'm not really buying many dvds anymore as I'm waiting for Blu-Ray".

Hearing this the clerk goes off about how he just came from a video convention with Blu-Ray and he says, "The Sony guys tell me that if you have a good HT setup you won't really notice a difference between Blu-Ray and DVD, so you should just stick to buying dvds" and continues to say that "Standard dvd players will play Blu-Ray discs so you should keep buying dvds since you'll still have your dvd player (I think he just accidently got it backwards that Blu-Ray players will play dvds)", and then finishes the conversation by saying "Blu-Ray won't actually come out. Unless it merges with the HD-DVD format they're not going to release it so keep buying dvds".

Obviously he wanted me to keep buying dvds and in the process sign up for his member card thingy. So yeah, if clerks are telling all their customers stupid info like this, it'll be a long uphill battle to get people to pick up Blu-Ray films once they are out.

 

[Keyser Soze]

So let me get this straight.....

...Why did you not join his club?

 

[Lardbutt]

The clerk could be right...

 

[Mihail]

You under-over-estimate customers.

People don't even know how DVDs work. The average person is not going to know if they're using HD-DVDs or Blue-Ray disks. It doesn't matter what the clerks tell them -- they'll buy whatever is on the shelves.

 

[Kung Fu Jedi]

Actually, the average consumer hasn't heard of HD-DVD or Blu-Ray. Haven't got a clue. Most don't have an HDTV to take advantage of them either, so I'm guessing you're the first, or one of only a few, to actually bring up next-gen DVD stuff.

 

[impirius]

So let me get this straight.....

...Why did you not join his club?

Seriously.

You could get a discount.

 

[karasu]

Ugh. I like when the store clerk spent thirty minutes trying to convince me that I wouldn't notice a difference between a DVI cable and S-Video. @_@

 

[VALIS]

I don't think Blu-Ray and HD-DVD will be taking off for a long time, and will never come close to the popularity of DVD. The parallels between higer def DVD and higher def audio are many. They both look like the older media they're superior to, yet they can't be played in the same machines as the older media unless those machines have specific capabilities for them, which means the purchasing of new hardware. There is multiple format confusion with the higher def CDs, there will be multiple format confusion with the high def DVDs. The higher def audio is usually more expensive than standard CDs, HD and Blu Ray will be more expensive than standard DVDs. Higher def CDs have struggled since their release, higher def DVDs will ______?

 

[Phoenix]

I think the difference is that few people can actually hear the difference between the regular and high def CDs and most people certainly aren't going to drop cash on a receiver to try. Meanwhile people DO tend to upgrade TVs more often and there are certainly more factors (like consoles, HD content already available at broadcast, etc), that will encourage them that going HD video will make 'some' sense. I could go out in a few months and buy a HD audio system, but I really really don't see the point. All my music sounds just fine. Hell the stuff I get off iTunes sounds just fine to me. I can however SEE a need for improvement in the video space.

 

[ManaByte]

I think the difference is that few people can actually hear the difference between the regular and high def CDs and most people certainly aren't going to drop cash on a receiver to try. Meanwhile people DO tend to upgrade TVs more often and there are certainly more factors (like consoles, HD content already available at broadcast, etc), that will encourage them that going HD video will make 'some' sense. I could go out in a few months and buy a HD audio system, but I really really don't see the point. All my music sounds just fine. Hell the stuff I get off iTunes sounds just fine to me. I can however SEE a need for improvement in the video space.

That's because most people just listen to their audio through two speakers.

You're supposed to listen to high-def stuff through AT LEAST a 5.1 setup.

 

[Phoenix]

That's because most people just listen to their audio through two speakers.

You're supposed to listen to high-def stuff through AT LEAST a 5.1 setup.

Yep, but outside of 2 rooms in my house (living room, family room) - I can't think of a place where I could put a 5.1 setup I CAN put an LCD or Plasma screen in all of them though

 

[maharg]

A person interested in video games is obviously going to see the appeal of high def television options, but asking such a person about the mainstream appeal of those technologies is like asking a musician about the appeal of high definition audio technologies.

 

[Cooper]

IHigher def CDs have struggled since their release, higher def DVDs will ______?

Besides what Phoenix said, a big difference between video and audio is that relatively few people actually just sit down and listen to music for a long period of time. People usually play music while exercising, or driving, or working on the computer, or some other task. It doesn't matter if they can't hear all the original subtleties, since their attention is only partly focused on the audio anyway.

On the other hand, it's quite common to exclusively watch a TV show, movie, or sporting event for a few hours. This makes a video upgrade more worthwhile to most people than an audio one.

 

[VALIS]

I think the difference is that few people can actually hear the difference between the regular and high def CDs and most people certainly aren't going to drop cash on a receiver to try. Meanwhile people DO tend to upgrade TVs more often and there are certainly more factors (like consoles, HD content already available at broadcast, etc), that will encourage them that going HD video will make 'some' sense. I could go out in a few months and buy a HD audio system, but I really really don't see the point. All my music sounds just fine. Hell the stuff I get off iTunes sounds just fine to me. I can however SEE a need for improvement in the video space.

Well, I agree that higer def DVD will be more popular than higher def CDs, but I just don't think they're gonna catch on to any huge degree. Laserdisc, Part II: Only for Enthusiasts. Eventually in the future (10-20 years?) they'll be the standard provided that another format or technology hasn't displaced them. Price, of course, is the biggest thing. I'll pay a some extra for a better picture on just one movie, you'll pay some extra for a better picture on just one movie, most people absolutely will not.

 

[Azih]

Man all of this should be pushed back to 2009 or so with a higher capacity technology than either BR or HD.

 

[Tenacious-V]

Man all of this should be pushed back to 2009 or so with a higher capacity technology than either BR or HD.

Yup HVD!!!!!!!!!!!! 200GB per layer baby!!

I don't like either BD or HD-DVD.....

 

[Bebpo]

Yup HVD!!!!!!!!!!!! 200GB per layer baby!!

I don't like either BD or HD-DVD.....

100GB BD isn't large enough for a 2-3 hour film at 1080p? I was under the impression that it should handle that at a high bitrate.

 

[maharg]

According to BD fans, more storage is always and universally better. Funny how when waiting to introduce a new format until it's more likely to be successful, and significantly higher storage capacity options are likely to be available, it suddenly isn't true anymore.

Anyways, since when is 100GB BD even an option? That would be 4 layers. That's highly unlikely to be possible on a mass production scale, just like it turned out to be for DVD, where even double-sided, double-layered is prohibitively expensive.

 

[Bebpo]

According to BD fans, more storage is always and universally better. Funny how when waiting to introduce a new format until it's more likely to be successful, and significantly higher storage capacity options are likely to be available, it suddenly isn't true anymore.

Anyways, since when is 100GB BD even an option? That would be 4 layers. That's highly unlikely to be possible on a mass production scale, just like it turned out to be for DVD, where even double-sided, double-layered is prohibitively expensive.

There's always going to be higher storage mediums. The thing with HD-DVD vs. Blu-Ray is you were talking about less than 6 months difference and the potential for over 3x the space. HVD is not going to be 6 months after Blu-Ray, it's going to be much farther down the line and with HDTVs selling really well a Hi-Def video format has to be chosen soon for all these HDTV owners because it's pretty lame that run of the mill TV stuff looks better than all the best films in the world on a current HDTV.

And I think 100GB Blu-Ray will be more like Dual-Layer dvds in terms of use. I bet very few will use them at the start, but if it seems like films need more bitrate I can see them going to 100GB and as they add extras and stuff I can see 100GB eventually being the norm.

 

[Shinobi]

You under-over-estimate customers.

People don't even know how DVDs work. The average person is not going to know if they're using HD-DVDs or Blue-Ray disks. It doesn't matter what the clerks tell them -- they'll buy whatever is on the shelves.

Yeah, just like they bought Laserdisc and Video CD. And I hear SACD and DVD-A has really taken off!

The mainstream need compelling reasons to buy something, and they have to know WTF it is before doing so. It was pretty easy to sell DVD next to VHS...it looked new, all nice and shiney and thin and coming in box sets with trilogies or full seasons. A far cry from the bulky ass, ancient looking VHS. Blu-Ray won't have that physical advantage. Christ, some people still believe fullscreen is better then widescreen, and that difference is obvious as the nose on your face. And then you've got DVI, HDMI, and all this other crap that frankly I don't have a clue about. Meanwhile most people are only just getting around to upgrading to component. :lol

It's gonna be a looooong uphill battle for Blu Ray (forget HD-DVD)...anyone who thinks otherwise is kidding themselves.

Man all of this should be pushed back to 2009 or so with a higher capacity technology than either BR or HD.

Agreed...and I imagine that's what would happen if the movie industry wasn't pissed off with Warner over the current DVD deal. While I understand their position, I think the rush to push these formats out is a colossal mistake that'll only serve to cause massive confusion in the next couple years. In fact, pushing out two competing formats is what'll really hurt the chances for growth. If they could've resolved this silly Blu-Ray/HD-DVD spat, a single format would stand a much greater chance. Here's hoping something can still get resolved, though it's hard to imagine either side budging now.

 

[maharg]

The difference in capacity between HD-DVD and BD is less than 2 times per layer. Not 3 times (I can't even see where this number came from).

And I think 100GB Blu-Ray will be more like Dual-Layer dvds in terms of use. I bet very few will use them at the start, but if it seems like films need more bitrate I can see them going to 100GB and as they add extras and stuff I can see 100GB eventually being the norm.

I'm sorry, but if you're actually expecting 4 layer BD, you're deluding yourself. It's not going to happen on any serious scale. There has been no promise of it, only 'experimentation' (and I might add, there has been such experimentation with DVD and HD-DVD as well). There are significant manufacturing difficulties as you increase the number of layers, and they don't just go away.

Let alone the idea of 4 layer BD being as common as 2 layer DVD. That's just plain insane. It's not going to happen.

 

[MrSingh]

Let alone the idea of 4 layer BD being as common as 2 layer DVD. That's just plain insane. It's not going to happen.

You mean insanity isn't a good thing!? Darn. Back to the drawing board.