Support NeoGAF

[Mibu no ookami]

Naughty Dog canceled TLOU Online/Factions, but it's not like they deleted their work. With the massive success of Helldivers, I can't help but wonder if Sony and Naughty Dog re-evaluate the expectations for TLOU Online. They've probably repurposed their resources to focus on single player games that they want to release as soon as possible, but...

The cancellation never made a ton of sense to begin with at least with the explanation that they gave being it would consume their studio. This did happen to Epic who used to release games like Unreal, Unreal Tournament, and Gears of War before focusing almost entirely on Fornite, but I feel like Naughty Dog had a few options.

A) Shift entirely to a GaaS company like Epic (not what they would want to do)
B) Expand significantly to be able to do both (Like Rockstar has done with two games: Red Dead AND Grand Theft Auto)
C) Farm out the game to another studio (maybe they didn't want to do this given their experience with TLOU remake and TLOU PC Port, but I feel like that just means you need to find more trusted partners)

Instead, they selected option D which was to cancel the game (and probably reutilize the assets elsewhere). I would love to know the real story. Listening to Colin and Mystic they both claim to know people who played the game and said it was fun, so if the only issue was about maintaining content for years, I can't imagine the right choice was made. Especially if they can sell the game upfront for 40-50 dollars like Helldivers.

Hell you could make this a 20 dollars add-on to either TLOU Part 1 or TLOU2 Remastered, so is a write-off really the more profitable option? I wonder.

 

[Die Namek Ability]

I personally hope not if it's at the cost of current ND game dev. If another studio takes it sure why not.

 

[nial]

It could be revived in the far future, but don't really expect anything now. Sony already made a choice.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

No chance.

TLoU Online failed due to player retention problems and the cost/resources required to keep players engaged.

PlayStation dodged a bullet.

I will say, I expect a new GAAS project from Naughty Dog to be revealed in a few short years.

 

[Guilty_AI]

They're very different games conceptually, just because both are GAAS/Online doesn't mean both will see the same amount of success.

Helldivers 2 is a coop shooter, and coop has become really popular in recent years. We have many examples of indie coop shooters that outdid expectations or major games with strong coop elements breaking every expectation previously set.

 

[Gojiira]

No, the reason they gave made perfect sense, the resources and manpower needed to maintain it would mean no possibility of any other games for years.
They obviously didnt want to be tied to just one game so they made a good choice.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

They're very different games conceptually, just because both are GAAS/Online doesn't mean both will see the same amount of success.

Helldivers 2 is a coop shooter, and coop has become really popular in recent years. We have many examples of indie coop shooters that outdid expectations or major games with strong coop elements breaking every expectation previously set.

It doesn't have to be the same game in order for it to be similarly successful. If anything you want a variety of different GaaS/Online games.

 

[Bartski]

Salvaging it into a MP mode DLC for part 2 remastered would be amazing

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

TBH, I don't think The Last of Us would have been anywhere near as imaginative and epic as Helldivers 2

If it was just a "good" tacked on game with the same shooting mechanics, I don't think that would have caught fire.

It would have needed some genuinely interesting design elements that deviated a lot from the single player stuff in order to make the online compelling.

 

[Codes 208]

I’d rather they revive socom, killzone or resistance to scratch that shooter itch

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

I’d rather they revive socom, killzone or resistance to scratch that shooter itch

Yeah if they re-did Killzone's Warzon MP, with next gen Decima graphics and some of the epic bells and whistles that helldivers has, it would be incredible.

 

[Bombolone]

Just work on SOCOM please. It’s right there.

Sorry to answer the thread.
I think the gameplay of TLOU is visceral and gives the player a great feeling of that.
Reminds me of Gears in a way.
I just don’t think it would have been anything special to capture the amount of people Sony/ND would want.
It would have its hardcore fan base, but that wouldn’t satisfy Sony.

 

[Faust]

Yeah if they re-did Killzone's Warzon MP, with next gen Decima graphics and some of the epic bells and whistles that helldivers has, it would be incredible.

I would only want Killzone to return if they made it feel as heavy as Killzone 2 did. I was not a fan of the more generic/speedy movements of 3 and 4.

 

[DaciaJC]

No chance.

TLoU Online failed due to player retention problems and the cost/resources required to keep players engaged.

PlayStation dodged a bullet.

I will say, I expect a new GAAS project from Naughty Dog to be revealed in a few short years.

Referring to Part I Factions mode? I wasn't aware it was considered a failure, it seemed to be reasonably popular.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Referring to Part I Factions mode? I wasn't aware it was considered a failure, it seemed to be reasonably popular.

No, I was referring to Factions 2.

 

[DrFigs]

No chance.

TLoU Online failed due to player retention problems and the cost/resources required to keep players engaged.

PlayStation dodged a bullet.

I will say, I expect a new GAAS project from Naughty Dog to be revealed in a few short years.

It wasn't a huge hit, but it has a dedicated fan base which plays it to this day. That's after ND did a lot to mess it up w/ pay to win microtransactions and no support.

 

[DaciaJC]

No, I was referring to Factions 2.

Then how can you say it failed due to player retention problems when it wasn't ever released?

 

[Kerotan]

If anything it makes them realise online games are much better off launching on ps5 and pc.

 

[Spyxos]

Game dead, let it go.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Then how can you say it failed due to player retention problems when it wasn't ever released?

That was the Jason Schreier rumor. He's fairly reliable.

Plus, they alluded to as much when they referenced how many resources were going to be required to keep the game afloat.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Then how can you say it failed due to player retention problems when it wasn't ever released?

He's probably referring to reports that Bungie felt it would be hard to retain players interest in the game.

 

[SJRB]

 

[AJUMP23]

No it is canceled. And ND is going to go do something else.

 

[Vick]

Hopefully not, let ND work on single player stuff.

No Return is already the perfect bonus mode for the series.
And if you really want Multiplayer, the original Factions still plays great and it's a ton of fun.

 

[Aenima]

No. NaughtyDog made it clear they dont want to be tied to an live service game for years to be able to support its GAAS nature. They are a single player studio and props to them for canceling the project before going deep into the rabit hole.

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

The game was cancelled because the scope of its vision was too large such that it would have required a fundamental restructuring of the studio to realise. It would have changed ND forever and negatively impacted their ability to make the kinds of games they have always been known for.

ND is better sticking to what they do best. They could have considered created a team within Bungie and letting them make TLOU2 under ND leadership. But it's always better for teams to make games they're passionate about, instead of being forced to work on someone else's sloppy seconds.

 

[SHA]

Is it a system seller? I'm interested in gaas, I want your opinion.

 

[splattered]

Not unless bungie says so..

 

[DaciaJC]

That was the Jason Schreier rumor. He's fairly reliable.

Plus, they alluded to as much when they referenced how many resources were going to be required to keep the game afloat.

He's probably referring to reports that Bungie felt it would be hard to retain players interest in the game.

Ah, okay.

 

[TGO]

TLOU2 Online was just their excuse to buy them some time until they could cancel it and give another excuse which they can cancel when they finally do start developing a new game once Neil finally think's of a another shit story for TLOU3 to keep his place in the studio.
Give them another 3 years and we'll see TLOU3 and maybe a Remake of 2.

 

[DForce]

They would have to give it to another studio because ND will not work on it

 

[Yoboman]

Nope if anything it proves it was the right choice. Part of the reason they abandoned the game was if they had success it would take all of NDs resources, so you're effectively gutting Naughty Dogs strength as a single player Dev to chase GaaS (see also: Rocksteady)

If Helldivers 2 proves anything it's that you don't need a big name dev or well known IP if the product hits right. And that organic growth working with second parties is a smart move

Hopefully their learning is that their single player Devs can be left well enough alone and GAAS should be coming from a new side of the business they are building with a different set of devs

I'd also add, Naughty Dog still have multiplayer devs. I expect for them they revert back to smaller multiplayer modes in their games

 

[Codes 208]

I would only want Killzone to return if they made it feel as heavy as Killzone 2 did. I was not a fan of the more generic/speedy movements of 3 and 4.

Ohhh agreed, especially 4, as beautiful as it was, it felt too watered down in a way, like a poor mix of crysis and call of duty

Not to mention I HATED how everything was unlocked from the start for multiplayer, part of the fun of competitive shooters like destiny, cod and halo is earning newer guns/cosmetics

 

[RoadHazard]

ND doesn't want to be a studio that spends all their resources maintaining a live service game. Sure, this is a decision Sony could make over their heads, but I don't think they want to risk displeasure and an exodus of talent from one of their most revered studios. Better to have other studios do that stuff if ND doesn't want to.

 

[Complistic]

No, game development needs to be based on whether or not a game is good. Not what sort of game is trending. You currently get into the mess we find ourselves chasing the latter.

 

[NomenNescio]

Whatever they did for Factions 2 will go as a multiplayer add-on for Part III.

 

[ClosBSAS]

Helldivers 2 is just a success accident, not sony or even arrowhead assumed it would reach this. This isnt enough for sony....yet

 

[Shut0wen]

Naughtydog literally cane iut saying they didnt have the man power to even support it I.E. they wouldnt be able to make another game while creating content for fractions, deal with it its dead

 

[Saber]

Lmao, no they probably though they were way up their asses with this franchise. But Bungie probably just threw a hard cold truth on them, saying that this game fails miserably because of lack of appeal and doesn't have what it takes to be a GaaS. The project is gone, take a hint already.

 

[Damigos]

Hopefully not. Let ND do what they do best

 

[Sleepwalker]

Its dead, let it rest.

 

[FunkMiller]

Of course not. Suicide Squad KTJL just happened, and that’s a lot closer to what Factions 2 probably would have been than Helldivers.

 

[Raonak]

GAAS requires so much development resources. It's one thing to make a multiplayer game, it's a whole different thing to keep supporting with constant updates and the constant balancing required.

 

[Robb]

Very very doubtful imo. But I’m sure they’ll re-purpose that work in one way or another in the future. That’s usually how it goes.

 

[odhiex]

The ship has sailed, I believe. They could do another attempt by TloU 3 window or being part of the package, with a different monetisation model. Never say never.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Helldivers 2 is just a success accident, not sony or even arrowhead assumed it would reach this. This isnt enough for sony....yet

They might not have expected the game to be this successful (would be absolute hubris if they did), but it wasn't luck. The game was in development for 8 years... It's absolutely part of Sony's GaaS strategy.

Fairgames has been in development since 2021.

Firewalk was established in 2018 and Sony purchased them in 2023. It's possible that Concord has been in development since 2018. That could be six years of development. Firewalk is partnering with Bungie in developing Concord.

Both Haven and Firewalk are both about 50% larger than Arrowhead studios with full backing from Sony.

If either of their games are successful are we going to continue to call it lucky or accidental?

 

[Ivory Samoan]

Referring to Part I Factions mode? I wasn't aware it was considered a failure, it seemed to be reasonably popular.

Hugely popular, still is populated all these years later.....I'm not sure what game he was referring to in regards to Player retention lol.

 

[StueyDuck]

Naughty Dog canceled TLOU Online/Factions, but it's not like they deleted their work. With the massive success of Helldivers, I can't help but wonder if Sony and Naughty Dog re-evaluate the expectations for TLOU Online. They've probably repurposed their resources to focus on single player games that they want to release as soon as possible, but...

The cancellation never made a ton of sense to begin with at least with the explanation that they gave being it would consume their studio. This did happen to Epic who used to release games like Unreal, Unreal Tournament, and Gears of War before focusing almost entirely on Fornite, but I feel like Naughty Dog had a few options.

A) Shift entirely to a GaaS company like Epic (not what they would want to do)
B) Expand significantly to be able to do both (Like Rockstar has done with two games: Red Dead AND Grand Theft Auto)
C) Farm out the game to another studio (maybe they didn't want to do this given their experience with TLOU remake and TLOU PC Port, but I feel like that just means you need to find more trusted partners)

Instead, they selected option D which was to cancel the game (and probably reutilize the assets elsewhere). I would love to know the real story. Listening to Colin and Mystic they both claim to know people who played the game and said it was fun, so if the only issue was about maintaining content for years, I can't imagine the right choice was made. Especially if they can sell the game upfront for 40-50 dollars like Helldivers.

Hell you could make this a 20 dollars add-on to either TLOU Part 1 or TLOU2 Remastered, so is a write-off really the more profitable option? I wonder.

They aren't even closely related because of budget and the quality/budget expected from a naughty dog product.

They are probably super happy they cancelled it and are raking it in instead from a smaller title

 

[Famipan]

Factions also require co-op and tactical communication with voice chat or sign messages but it’s probably more hardcore than Helldivers in that it’s PvP and not PvE and you probably need to be better at communicating than in Co-op PvE.

But I have only dipped my feet in Factions and haven’t played much Co-op PvE games except Zombies in COD Mobile and such games are easy communication-wise. I imagine Helldivers works well with auto matchmaking while Factions 2 would require more tactic talk.

 

[Loxus]

Haters gonna hate, but think about this for a moment.

Game play mechanics of Part 2
Huge character customization
A battle royal mode with infected as the circle, whereas you start with a pistol and you find upgrades that can turn that pistol into various weapons.
Team deathmatch.
Co-op missions.
Solo missions.
A camp/home with upgrades and companions for missions.

Even with half that list, this game very successful. I have no idea why some of you all hated Fractions 2.