At a certain point you need to make a decision whether it's more important to get a ward up in an important position so that the cores can farm or for the 5 position venge to keep the 200ish gold they'll lose in the event that they get picked off in the process of placing that ward. He's not a perfect player by any means, but C9's style requires a player playing that sort of role.
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DOTA 2 |OT8| DOTA Asian Championship (1/27-2/9)
- Thread starter Teknopathetic
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At a certain point you need to make a decision whether it's more important to get a ward up in an important position so that the cores can farm or for the 5 position venge to keep the 200ish gold they'll lose in the event that they get picked off in the process of placing that ward. He's not a perfect player by any means, but C9's style requires a player playing that sort of role.
NormalFish
Banned
Yup, I'm on the same page, I just think that there are plenty of support players who do the same role better.
Yup, looks like it's a $120ish loss with the Shadow Shaman and Undying items, $80 for the Razor item, breaking even with the Skywrath item and doubling your money with Earthshaker.
Monochromaticx
Member
Yeah, PPD plays an identical role but dies way less.
I disagree. PPD is always with Zai and thus in a much more secure position as Zai plays a far less greedy support than Aui.
It leaves PLD wandering around by him self while Aui is likely in the enemy safe lane split pushing
NormalFish
Banned
Pie carries every so often. His Bounty games (that go well) are good examples.
The stats back this up as well. Aui averages 388 gpm on a much less successful team than zai's 350 gpm.
Why do people play mid when they do not contest runes? No wonder Bane destroyed our Tinker mid.
I mean, these days it's the supports job to secure runes.And if your mid doesn't have good wave clear there can often be some very detrimental effects to rushing to get one as it spawns.
That said, Tinker has better wave clear than Bane so he should have been on top of it.
Dreams-Visions
Member
Agree with all that. But tbh...All Bane has to do is Nightmare him. Every rune is free for a Bane in such a race. TBH I probably wouldn't have left mid to contest any of them either if I was Tinker unless I knew a support was going to meet me at the rune. Or, I would have gone after the rune I was sure Bane wasn't going to.
Tough situation in pubs. Especially when you may or may not have a ward to give you some detection/heads up. Tinker has too much to lose by dying early because he needs that 2500g item.
Bane is going to miss a ton of creeps if he's chasing a max march Tinker around like that. Maybe the Tinker went laser/rocket in that game.
Contesting runes is a team effort now. Tinker probably thought he could get a boots faster if he just focused on the lane and I can't really fault that logic. The bounty rune almost negates the old "push wave at xx:40" mid strat, which is what kept Tinker in the game with regards to rune control.
2 min rune bane nightmares tinker and gets the bounty rune top, then it's a race for the bottom haste rune (which none of you guarded), bane gets.
4 min top rune is bane's with the haste from earlier, tinker gets the regen bot.
6 min he gets tower dove by axe + bane/drow right before the spawn. Top rune is gone and the only reason you get bottom rune is because you were chasing them in the river.
7:30 your top tower is dead, your jungle is invaded constantly, wards are dead, gl getting any runes.
I wouldn't blame the tinker for the runes personally in this game, I'd blame the team.
4 min top rune is bane's with the haste from earlier, tinker gets the regen bot.
6 min he gets tower dove by axe + bane/drow right before the spawn. Top rune is gone and the only reason you get bottom rune is because you were chasing them in the river.
7:30 your top tower is dead, your jungle is invaded constantly, wards are dead, gl getting any runes.
I wouldn't blame the tinker for the runes personally in this game, I'd blame the team.
Dreams-Visions
Member
thanks for giving us context to the image. images devoid of context can be misinterpreted or outright twisted so easily.
Extending:
1) If you're trilane support and the lane isn't in danger, camp the rune
2) If you're a jungler at a moderate amount of HP and enemy lanes are mostly there, camp the rune
3) If you're a solo suicide and you're being bullied out of exp range, camp the rune
4) If you're duo lane support and your carry has the space he needs to farm, camp the rune
And make sure to call out which rune you're camping so mid can try to get the other if they're a bottle user.
1) If you're trilane support and the lane isn't in danger, camp the rune
2) If you're a jungler at a moderate amount of HP and enemy lanes are mostly there, camp the rune
3) If you're a solo suicide and you're being bullied out of exp range, camp the rune
4) If you're duo lane support and your carry has the space he needs to farm, camp the rune
And make sure to call out which rune you're camping so mid can try to get the other if they're a bottle user.
Can you explain what you mean by this? I figured it made that type of strategy even more reliable since you can just spam out the wave with whatever and be guaranteed a rune spawn if you got there in time.
SecretMoblin
Member
that was a damn mess
Old Mid - Push before rune spawn, force the opponent to either
1) Last hit under tower and lose the rune
2) Contest rune and lose a wave of gold/exp
Either way, you're out ahead.
New Mid - Push before rune spawn, opponent has one clearly superior choice here
1) Last hit under tower, then go for whatever rune you didn't get while you're returning from the opposite rune
Without supports contesting the runes, both mids are guaranteed runes and the hero with the inferior wave clear loses only a few last hits. This is why winning mid is now heavily decided by the ability of supports to contest runes.
I think the Charm works until January, so don't fret. Unless you lost and got fireworks, then you can fret.
The fireworks are amazing, I'm going to buy a ton of them once they are marketable
Dreams-Visions
Member
what do you get from that potentially? more account-bound sets?
Oh hmm, because I didn't see the prompt anymore that lets you predict you'll win, on the left side.
Just a set from the current chest, Defender's Vision I believe? Got the Necro set so far. Tradeable/marketable after xx date, in my case, Feb.
You get a Treasure of the Defender's Vision. For $.79, its a good value if you are able to win 3 games. Items are tradable starting mid February.
Odd. It clearly has an expiration date and is still purchasable so I think you would be able to use it. Maybe Valve turned it off early by mistake.
Dreams-Visions
Member
oh that's a nice deal.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Fuck.
I think my "team" broke up. There's always been kind of a mutually abusive vibe, we all give each other tons of shit, but I've seen it flowing in a couple directions more strongly than others lately, particularly towards this one guy, just in his teens, who while often a dumbass also is usually well intentioned.
Well over the weekend while I wasn't playing apparently shit finally hit the fan and it finally got to him how much the others were insulting him and now he's "quit Dota" and I have no idea what the others are up to
I think my "team" broke up. There's always been kind of a mutually abusive vibe, we all give each other tons of shit, but I've seen it flowing in a couple directions more strongly than others lately, particularly towards this one guy, just in his teens, who while often a dumbass also is usually well intentioned.
Well over the weekend while I wasn't playing apparently shit finally hit the fan and it finally got to him how much the others were insulting him and now he's "quit Dota" and I have no idea what the others are up to
Niceeeeeeeee
If they are as bad as you imply, then good for him. If he doesn't wanna play solo and those are his only option for stacking, why not leave.
Dreams-Visions
Member
dreams not gonna take shit from nubz nemore
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
I mean, he always dished it as good as he got it, but I think the fact that he was, well, not as good as us combined with the fact that he was younger than the rest of us finally got to him. He was actually trying to improve, and I don't blame him for finally getting fed up either. Trying to remain friends with him
:/
Technosteve
Banned
I am quiting dota, jk I need gaming laptop recommendations.
came back from 2 lanes of rax down and won!
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1079329836
I really like PA but I don't usually win with her. would someone like to watch this match and give me some tips (PA tips, overall play) to help a 3k mmr noob out?
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1079329836
I really like PA but I don't usually win with her. would someone like to watch this match and give me some tips (PA tips, overall play) to help a 3k mmr noob out?
Fucking idiots.
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1079362985
I know I didn't have the greatest game, but then we have a chance to win a fight at mid while Invoker is gone, but my team just sits around and plays with their dicks. I get initiated on, forcing me to BKB. Then my team waits til AFTER it's over and Invoker shows and we lose it. What a fucking joke.
Nothing pisses me off more than losing a game because of my teams inaction during a game. I'm now below 4k because of this and some other games, one of which was an Axe that abandoned 10 minutes in because he raged.
Like I said, I realize I made some mistakes, but then my ENTIRE TEAM does nothing at the rax when we could have turned it around.
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/1079362985
I know I didn't have the greatest game, but then we have a chance to win a fight at mid while Invoker is gone, but my team just sits around and plays with their dicks. I get initiated on, forcing me to BKB. Then my team waits til AFTER it's over and Invoker shows and we lose it. What a fucking joke.
Nothing pisses me off more than losing a game because of my teams inaction during a game. I'm now below 4k because of this and some other games, one of which was an Axe that abandoned 10 minutes in because he raged.
Like I said, I realize I made some mistakes, but then my ENTIRE TEAM does nothing at the rax when we could have turned it around.
manfestival
Member
there is nothing quite like winning a game against 4 carries with 3 supports 1 axe and 1 carry. games end in like 25 minutes and that feels so good
Dota drama. Even casual dota drama sucks. We had a solid 5 stack going. Then you go on a bad streak. Feelings get hurt. And people quit. I even stopped playing for like a month. Sucked me back in though. We still have a solid 3, but I miss the 5 stack days.
did i find my answer to my visage struggles?
girl let me tell you
so i had no idea what like... the "rules" of random draft were because i literally never play that mode so i was just waiting to pick and then i got randomed techies ??? i thought i'd just end up with the gold penalty like u do in all pick but nope, out of all the heroes in this shit game, it randoms me techies. and then i had to go mid against death prophet? like what kind of aids is this? i did ok mid though tbh having never done it before. i got some last hits with his shitty starting damage and some cute denies too. if i had a real hero i would have slayed, but c'est la vie
also salty satch came out and i told steve to kill himself
I heard there was an impromptu GAF vs. GAF game today.
How'd it go?
girl let me tell you
so i had no idea what like... the "rules" of random draft were because i literally never play that mode so i was just waiting to pick and then i got randomed techies ??? i thought i'd just end up with the gold penalty like u do in all pick but nope, out of all the heroes in this shit game, it randoms me techies. and then i had to go mid against death prophet? like what kind of aids is this? i did ok mid though tbh having never done it before. i got some last hits with his shitty starting damage and some cute denies too. if i had a real hero i would have slayed, but c'est la vie
also salty satch came out and i told steve to kill himself
NormalFish
Banned
It's fucking awkward is what it is. He was playing Bounty Hunter and the reaction time when he was tracking or throwing out shurikens was ridiculous. It explains a bit about the heroe's he does decently with. I don't even know how you can have over 1k hours in this game and still play that way.
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