How do Sony and MS have to mess up with Orbis/Durango to swing momentum to Nintendo

But since nothing has been shown their is no momentum either way so it's really hard to tell you without any Nintendo release dates for their software and not even seeing the other two. It's not even an educated guess at this point. I will say if Nintendo goes into holiday 2013 with Windwaker HD they might as well just pack it up.
 
Guerrillas in the Mist said:
Sony pulls off another E3 2006, although I think they're too humble to try and pull off something so lacklustre in such blasé fashion again.
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BluePigGanon said:
Yeah it would have to be a 3DO-level cluster for Sony or MS to hand the upcoming gen to Nintendo.
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I'd mention the obvious Sony punching bag to counter both arguments, but I think the poor thing has been smacked around enough by Sales-Age, as it is.


Price is the big one, and both are very vulnerable to that.

But honestly, expectations are so high for both of them that they're gonna screw something up without even thinking they've done something wrong. It's just a matter of what that'll be and how badly, since every mistake they could make can have varied degrees of suck.
 
Nemesis121 said:
Should have been the first reply, Price was the selling point for Wii, while other called Wii a fad saying Sony/MS would catch Ninty, Ninty continued to win the race, if MS/Sony wants to destroy the head start Wii u has the entry price has to be great...
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motion gaming was the selling point for the wii. the price was just a bonus. Casual news outlets like GMA weren't falling all over themselves to demo it on television because it was cheap, you know.

My two cents? there isn't realistically anything nintendo can do. Hardware launches come around once every 5 or 6 year and are an event unto themselves. this year we're probably looking at two reveals.

anything they bring out will be crushed under a flood of new hardware news. Even if there's a massive screwup and the PS4 is $600, that's *all you'll hear about.* even bad news for the ps4 or 720, along with the accompanying fanboy meltdowns will bury the best news nintendo can scrounge up. they're better off just coasting and waiting for the hype to die down for anything significant.
 
Trent Strong said:
We've seen footage from Watchdogs, that new Star Wars game and Ground Zeros. All those games look leaps and bounds above current gen games. I dont' know how people wouldn't be able to tell the difference.
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Is this a serious one? You can tell quite easily that's on current generation hardware with the hair dithering. I don't know how you thought that was for new platforms, as it doesn't really seem too huge compared to what we already get.
 
It's a no brainer the Wii U's entry price and the Wii's existing market will eventually lead to better sales for WeeYou without MS and Sony doing anything at all. It just won't be for a while and will likely lead to a repeat of the Wii experience, which may or may not be a bad thing for you.

Sony and MS would mess up by not securing enough third-party games by making development costs too high and recommending game prices that are too high for the economy. Neglecting to advertise as much as they should and also have many issues such hardware failures and buggy/low quality games early on.
 
They already have.

Besides a couple exclusives they are the same. They provide the same games, same content. Nothing unique.

So, I buy Nintendo to at least get some unique exclusives.
 
The market is so fragmented at this point, this entire thread (and the other one that inspired it) are kinda moot. A good many people are so set in their ways that it doesn't matter what happens at E3, they're going to buy what they're going to buy.

People who buy game machines because they like games and not tech will continue to find reasons to buy from each of the big three.

I guess the discussion here is pointed toward the mass market, who will buy whatever is shiniest and whatever their friend has. I don't see Wii U getting very much momentum with the masses before E3, so I guess that leaves Microsoft and Sony to fight over that market. I think that ship has sailed for the shores of Teablet Island, but there's definitely a brand recognition among the two that will reel some back in.
 
I don't know way all you poor people carry on about price. If you are an early adopter, you will probably already be a PS/Xbox fan. Which means you're probably going to pay more than most to get it. More than likely makes you are a Halo or GT fan, both are series certain to be exclusive. Also, you are getting a powerful computer that is going to run high end video games, which only cost around US$60 for up to 8 years..... Why is anything over 450 or so out of the question?

There is a thing called inflation, the fact that game prices haven't changed, means it's comparatively the cheapest it's ever been to play video games.
 
AkIRA_22 said:
I don't know way all you poor people carry on about price. If you are an early adopter, you will probably already be a PS/Xbox fan. Which men's you're probably going to pay a lot to get it. It. Ore than likely makes you a Halo or GT fan. Also, you are getting a powerful computer that is going to run high end video games, which only cost around US$60 for up to 8 years..... Why is anything over 450 or so out of the question?
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Due to the scorn of the Wii and taking the Wii U along the low-tech route again. Not only will it not deliver next gen (future worth), it isn't able to deliver next-gen (current price). Their launch was also too weak to justify a purchase now for most people.

edit - obviously misread your post a bit, $450 would be how much the wii U costs in sterling.
 
Price is big, as other people have said. Honestly, if MS did the $99 payment plan/2 year live contract thing that would be huge. Yeah, the consumer would end up paying more in the end, but if you have a $99 financing option next to Sony's likely $400-$500 PS4 that would be really interesting. At least in NA. We love debt, interest and multi-year contracts. Maybe the 360 version was a test run? MS seems like the only console manufacturer that could take that hit out of the gate. Then again, knowing MS, it would probably be the less expensive/crippled storage SKU/i.e. an “arcade” version of Durango with like 8gb of flash memory.
 
No one should doubt that Sony has the ability to fuck up hardcore.

For MS, it's hard to see a situation that they don't steamroll the next generation, bringing along Sony through 3rd party games.

The whole used games issue is the one thing where Sony and/or MS could fuck up everything and possibly collapse the industry
 
1. Charge $600 for each console.
2. Both console are full of defects.
3. Not enough "western-style" games during first year.
4. Games increase to $80 each.
5. Anti-used games.
6. No games at launch.



If all that happened, I can see the momentum shifting back to Nintendo.
 
There is a plethora of ways in which a launch can underwhelm and go wrong. And make no mistakes: all launches from now on will have incomplete system feature sets and somewhat lacking libraries even in the best case scenarios.

Gamers need to have some patience and understand what a huge undertaking this things are. It will be at least 2 years before we see this new systems true colors and personalities.
 
Huff said:
No one should doubt that Sony has the ability to fuck up hardcore.

For MS, it's hard to see a situation that they don't steamroll the next generation, bringing along Sony through 3rd party games.

The whole used games issue is the one thing where Sony and/or MS could fuck up everything and possibly collapse the industry
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What are you on about?
 
Skyzard said:
What are you on about?
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I don't think he understands that the only market 360 did well in was the USA. Basically you had a rich country become poor over night, an expensive PS3 was decimated by the GFC. Add a 12 month head start.

360 is in a great position, but it's still no better than Sony's. They have identical market share. Sony just has to make sure it doesn't release a console that is twice as expensive. Because you babies and poor Americans can't afford a super computer that costs more than 500 US dollars. Considering what the US dollar is worth now days believe me.... That's a bargain!
 
No games / Shitty launch lineup
No backwards compatibility
$599
Target Renders and promises
Lots of useless ports they will remove in later models
Trojan horsing a new media format increasing the price of the console
Difficult to program for

stuff like that.

BearPawB said:
They need games you can't play anywhere else.
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Doesn't matter if they're not 1st party, digital or will get a PC release 12 months later apparently.
 
Honestly the only thing I can think of that would actually swing momentum to Nintendo is if Sony and MS both launched at some ridiculous price point like $600-700. Which isn't happening.
 
They should just come out and say, "look, you've gotta buy one of us suckers, so deal with it" and it would be true. Nintendo has once again shown it doesn't want to be on equal footing when it comes to third parties, and if Wii didn't lure some gamers over, Wii U won't either. The question is, "between Sony and Microsoft, who will mess up enough to give the other an easy advantage."
 
$5,999

1 launch game, Funky Barn 2.

Xbox Live and PSN segregated into DLC. $40 friends list, $50 cross game chat, $30 messaging system, $60 demos. All monthly subs.

No controllers. Just Kinect and an advanced Move camera.

Each console comes with a guaranteed anual RRoD and YLoD chip inside which activates once a year at random and is irrepareable when it does. You can pay $100 to deactivate for 12 months and then $200 when those 12 months are up.

Microsoft use a proprietary cartridge for games while Sony re-invest in UMD.

Graphics and power equivalent to a Gamecube duct taped to a Wii.

If all those things happen, the favour might swing back in the favour of Nintendo. Might.
 
Huff said:
For MS, it's hard to see a situation that they don't steamroll the next generation, bringing along Sony through 3rd party games.
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It was hard to see a situation where Sony couldn't do the same back in 2006. Then E3 happened.

You can't count on ANYTHING when you move into a new generation, nothing is nailed to the ground, it's all up for grabs a 2nd time. So it's best that the hardware makers know they can't afford any unaddressed or permanent mistakes.

EDIT:

VVV

sant said:
The whole spectacle of next gen with improved graphics, new tech, etc is what Sony and Microsoft have going for them. What could they possibly do to fuck that up?
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Not be next-gen enough to satisfy the expectations of fans, for one.
 
The whole spectacle of next gen with improved graphics, new tech, etc is what Sony and Microsoft have going for them. What could they possibly do to fuck that up?
 
lack of exclusives. if both systems are sharing the same games it will be easy to take a wait-and-see approach. it won't swing momentum to Nintendo, just slow sales down until people get settled.
 
Hey You said:
Not release them.
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73V3N said:
No appealing exclusives
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Darryl said:
no games
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These, mostly these. Consoles could be delayed and not ready, games could be delayed as well. Games are going to be more complex and need more time to polish.


I don't think price matter that much in the first year. Obviously $599 is a bad idea, but everything below should be fine for the first few months. It's the lack of price cut which makes things stay in the shelf (mid term).
 
Bumhead said:
$5,999

1 launch game, Funky Barn 2.

Xbox Live and PSN segregated into DLC. $40 friends list, $50 cross game chat, $30 messaging system, $60 demos. All monthly subs.

No controllers. Just Kinect and an advanced Move camera.

Each console comes with a guaranteed anual RRoD and YLoD chip inside which activates once a year at random and is irrepareable when it does. You can pay $100 to deactivate for 12 months and then $200 when those 12 months are up.

Microsoft use a proprietary cartridge for games while Sony re-invest in UMD.

Graphics and power equivalent to a Gamecube duct taped to a Wii.

If all those things happen, the favour might swing back in the favour of Nintendo. Might.
Click to expand...
I lol'd
 
If Microsoft or Sony doesn't offer some unique 'hook' as the touchscreen is for the Wii U or motion controls was for the Wii, then I believe Wii U will dominate for the new gen. I just don't see Microsoft or Sony getting really creative or innovative in that area, but who knows.

Pricing will be a huge factor. Microsoft and Sony can have a price advantage over Wii U but I think it is given Wii U will be the least expensive of the bunch.

So basically Microsoft and Sony need a innovative 'hook' and competetive pricing. But I don't think they can deliver on either.
 
JDamiso said:
If Microsoft or Sony doesn't offer some unique 'hook' as the touchscreen is for the Wii U or motion controls was for the Wii, then I believe Wii U will dominate for the new gen. I just don't see Microsoft or Sony getting really creative or innovative in that area, but who knows.
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If that hook were as important as you're suggesting then the Wii U wouldn't be off to the slow start that it is. Nintendo has had to decrease their sales expectations for the Wii U twice already. That's the problem with basing your console around something like that. If it doesn't work then you're potentially in a lot of trouble. Right now third party devs are already brushing off the Wii U because of the control method. That really didn't matter with the Wii because the Wiimote was such a big deal that nearly everything Nintendo released for the console headed straight to the top of the charts worldwide. That's not happening with the Wii U.

Anyway, it looks like both consoles will have some sort of alternative controller. But i'd be surprised if either were the main input method.
 
I see a big problem for Microsoft and Sony bringing 'on par' devices to the market at the same time.

I don't think Kinect is enough to differentiate MS from Sony; especially among the early adopters. Even each companies first party offerings tend to balance each other out (eg Killzone vs Halo, GT vs Forza) in terms of being system sellers.

I really think that they are going to be after the same market and I think that may translate to slower sales. People are going to wait (I am not talking early adopters anymore) to see how things pan out, to see which system gets the best version of games, and wait for price drops.

Neither company is carrying that much momentum into the next generation. Even looking at Xbox 360 right now, it appears its sales strengths are its vast library and affordable price point - Xbox 720 won't be able to capitalize on those two strengths.

I don't know that Nintendo can necessarily assert dominance with the Wii U but I don't really see a clear winner yet either. Maybe, with a price drop and a couple of core system sellers, Nintendo is able to get a sale out the consumer who is tired of his current system(s) and is not yet decided on MS or Sony's next console.
 
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