Yeah, it needs a fix so bad. Nerfing the gold support items is one part of it, but they really need to change the speed/XP situation in the jungle and rework trinkets altogether. Trinket use should have an 8 point prerequisite in the support tree. Have a mastery that puts a trinket in your inventory at the start of the game that's upgradable like Viktor's staff. Make it compete with the buff extension mastery for jungles, longer buffs vs. the ability to ward/sweep. Supports would keep their trinkets, and everyone else would still have the option as a trade-off for with their offense/defense. Also, bind it to 7, not 4 god dammit.
There's a healthy balance somewhere between putting it all on the support and giving everyone a shit ton of vision everywhere. Jungles are fine putting points into utility, and plenty of tops can get away with it too. The amount of vision sharing now has butchered ganking opportunities, counter-jungling, and invades. Even if you just nerfed Targon and made double top lanes less viable, those problems would still be there. Giving trinkets a mastery prerequisite would cut down on them while still allowing vision to be shared amongst the team.
A single sixty second ward makes a big difference out of the gate. Especially when you can pretty much count on the enemy jungler not ganking until you hit ~3. It's very easy to time its placement to deny gank opportunities. You can say there are multiple routes, but realistically it isn't worth taking the risk to fail on that gank and pass through partial vision, because gank routes are pretty limited unless you are really looping around and committing to the gank.
No more Lvl 3 after both buffs, by the time you finish both of them chances are solo laners are already at level 4 or almost there.
a big issue with ganking right now is that it's super easy to punish. no matter what once you see a gank top or bot you know you can invade and there will be at least two camps up for you to safely steal while you grab their big buffs or the timers for them. opportunities to deny vision are pretty much non-existent, which can make it very safe to invade when you can just ward up the enemy jungle to give yourself good escape routes, or vision on people trying to stop you.
brain! said:
dimb said:
I mean if you're going to win the 2v2 countergank. If there's no hope it'd be better to just be proactive and farm.
Confirmation bias.
It winds up being multiplicative. With experience and smite changes junglers are dissuaded from early aggression, but the free vision can stack on top of that fast. In practical application the ward clearing trinket is shit on the junglers themselves. It's a waste of time to go clear it, and you are playing a huge guessing game on where the ward is planted in most cases. It also pretty clearly states your intention to gank that lane, meaning those players will be on the defensive.
Agreed.
that's because it wasn't really a nerf. adcs normally have like 50+20 or something ad at level 1. q damage before was 60+22, now it's 25+50, give or take.
nice farm.
You gotta show those laners you're the boss.
