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[Tommie Hu$tle]

NEW YORK (AP) -- As he tried to slip in a side door before a recent performance, Nelly got accosted by a fan waiting for his arrival.

Nothing unusual -- except the fan just happened to be uber-hip singer-songwriter John Mayer.

"Hey Nelly, can I come in with you?" Mayer asked the rap superstar after an embrace. Nelly gave security the O.K., and his posse -- which already included Murphy Lee, the rest of his St. Lunatics crew and Jermaine Dupri -- grew by one. Later on, P. Diddy joined Nelly onstage for the Webster Hall performance, broadcast live for America Online in front of hundreds of screaming fans.

Everyone wants to be part of Nelly's clique these days -- and who can blame them? The man who put St. Louis on the map has sold an astonishing 15 million copies of his first two albums, and on Tuesday released not one, but two separate albums -- "Sweat" and "Suit" -- on the same day. One is more of a party disc reminiscent of hits like "Hot in Herre," while the other has smoother songs that recall the smash success of "Dilemma."

Not only does he have musical success, his Pimp Juice energy drink is a hot commodity, he's got his own clothing lines and is filming his second film -- a remake of "The Longest Yard" with Chris Rock and Adam Sandler.

Q: These albums have so many collaborations, but the most unusual is country singer Tim McGraw. How did that come about?

NELLY: I used to see Tim a lot as far as like going around for awards shows, when "Country Grammar" first came out, him and his wife Faith. They would just tell me how they enjoyed my album, and everything I was doing. And you know how that old saying goes -- "Yo, we should do something."

Q: Could you ever do a country song?

NELLY: Nah, nah. It wasn't like that. It was just me being me, pushing the limits.

Q: What was your reaction when Spelman College students protested your appearance there to promote bone marrow donation because of your explicit "Tip Drill" video, in which you swiped a credit card through a woman's backside?

NELLY: To me, it was a personal attack. It couldn't have been about what they said it was, because if it truly was, and this is truly your view, you're basically cutting the grass at the top instead of diggin' up for the roots, because Spelman is 10 blocks from a strip club. You're not out in front of the strip club picketing. You wait until somebody comes in there and does something very dear to his heart, such as saving a life, and doing something that should be educating the community, to come in and talk about a video?

Q: Would you ever do another "uncut" video?
NELLY: If I wanted to, yes, because I don't see anything wrong with it. Like I said before, it was made for adults. I do stuff for the adults but I also do stuff that appeals to kids. So, I try to keep a fine line. Hopefully, parents raise their kids and don't let music raise their kids and entertainers raise their kids. How is it that I can keep my child from seeing a video that I did, but you can't keep your child (from seeing it) and you're there a lot more than I am? So you can't be serious.

Q: What everyone really wants to know is ... was that really your credit card?

NELLY: Yeah, that was my credit card! That's the thing. I think everybody is most upset about the credit card issue, but she said do it! This is a grown woman that told me, "Go ahead, do it." I never forced any of these girls to do anything. This is a job, they agreed to do it, they knew everything that was into it and these girls would be doing it whether Nelly was shooting a video or not.

Q: You recently joined BET founder Bob Johnson as part owner of the NBA's Charlotte Bobcats. Will you have clout to say, "Hey, you need to trade this guy?"

NELLY: (Laughs) Yeah, yeah -- I think in a minute he's going to be second guessing his decision, because you know, I'm a sports nut. I'm always in it. I'm aware, and I have many friends who are athletes. I think sports and entertainment go hand in hand. I definitely want to voice my opinion. But I'm just appreciative that I'm in this position.

Q: You got some criticism for naming your energy drink Pimp Juice.

NELLY: I don't think they understand. They hear the word, and they think, "Oh, my goodness," but you're not protesting Coke and Pepsi, and they have caffeine and stuff that is addictive and stuff that can harm you if you drink that. Pimp Juice has none of that. It's good for them. Sometimes you have to wrap it up in bad so they can get the good out of it. If you understand me, it's not even my angle. My son might come in and get two As and a B, and be like, "Man, I pimped that test!" ... It's just different these days, it's just lingo, it's just slang.

Q: How do you respond when people say you're not a role model?

NELLY: I don't see myself as a role model. I see myself as an inspiration. I can be an inspiration for someone who's been in the situation that I've been in and making good out of it. A role model should be someone who's close to you, someone who you can pick up and call when you're about to do something stupid or you have a question about life ... A role model should be some person who you can actually see the role of their life. You can't do that with athletes and entertainers, so I don't know why people just insist on making us role models. We're success stories.

 

[Neo_ZX]

Surprisingly ebonic-free.

 

[Tommie Hu$tle]

I don't expect Arnold to kill everyone that cuts him off in traffic like he would in the movies and I don't expect every rapper to behave like their on screen persona all the time.

 

[Saint Cornelius]

ayo, Dizzy Gillespie plays the sax

 

[KingGondo]

Too bad he doesn't choose whether to be a role model or not. He's in a role of cultural authority for young people, whether or not he likes it.

 

[Bruce Vilanch]

AH NEED UH TIP DRILL.

HYUK HYUK.

IT MUST BE HER ASS CUZ IT AIN'T HER FACE AH NEED UH TIP DRILL.

 

[Saint Cornelius]

Too bad he doesn't choose whether to be a role model or not. He's in a role of cultural authority for young people, whether or not he likes it.

That's silly. It goes to show that there's a serious deficency of role models these days.

 

[Incognito]

AH NEED UH TIP DRILL.

HYUK HYUK.

IT MUST BE HER ASS CUZ IT AIN'T HER FACE AH NEED UH TIP DRILL.

IS GETTN HOT IN HURRR

I THINK MY BUTT GETTN BIG

IS GETTN HOT IN HURRR

 

[Neo_ZX]

I don't expect Arnold to kill everyone that cuts him off in traffic like he would in the movies and I don't expect every rapper to behave like their on screen persona all the time.

I realize. It still did surprise me.

Although it is ultimately up to the parents and censors, the way he talks sounds like he's too is evading responsibility for his form of entertainment.

 

[mashoutposse]

He's evading responsibility because that responsibility should not be his in the first place.

 

[Loki]

Hopefully, parents raise their kids and don't let music raise their kids and entertainers raise their kids. How is it that I can keep my child from seeing a video that I did, but you can't keep your child (from seeing it) and you're there a lot more than I am? So you can't be serious.

Umm, maybe because most middle- and lower-middle class families don't get paid $3M to shoot a commercial and have to, oh I don't know...WORK long hours or two jobs? Or both parents have to work? Not everybody is rich like you, Nelly. That has to be the silliest comment I've heard in a while. "How am I there for my kids more than other parents are" :lol


That's common sense, alright. <thumbs-up>

 

[Incognito]

Umm, maybe because most middle- and lower-middle class families don't get paid $3M to shoot a commercial and have to, oh I don't know...WORK long hours or two jobs? Or both parents have to work? Not everybody is rich like you, Nelly. That has to be the silliest comment I've heard in a while. "How am I there for my kids more than other parents are" :lol


That's common sense, alright. <thumbs-up>

you realize that entertainers work long hours, too? or spend their time globe-trotting? i'd wager that nelly has less time to spend with his children than the average american family.

then there's also the whole childblock option you have on all tv's now.

 

[Loki]

you realize that entertainers work long hours, too? or spend their time globe-trotting? i'd wager that nelly has less time to spend with his children than the average american family.

then there's also the whole childblock option you have on all tv's now.

So then he's either lying (about being there a lot for his kids) or he has hired staff or has relatives who take care of his kids with explicit instructions from him as to what they are allowed to be exposed to in terms of TV or music.


You can't "work really long hours and spend all your time globe-trotting" and still spend all that time parenting. And I can almost guarantee you that, with the possible exception of when he's on tour or buttoning up a new album, Nelly does not put in 60+ hour work weeks. And if he does, he can't be spending 60 hours/week with his kids.


So you can say what you want in response to my comment, but then you'll be calling him a liar-- either that, or he's using his resources to hire people to do that job for him, which is a luxury not a lot of people have.

 

[Incognito]

well, who knows what he really means by "being there for the kids." it could mean, like you said, his posse watching over them while he applys more bandaids on his cheeks. or, while he's not doing his thing, he's actually there for them making sure they're not watching the oh so bad stuff and applying themselves concerning school.

i'm kinda leaning towards the first option...

either way, i was surprised by the interview.

 

[Loki]

That's all well and good, but all I'm saying is this:


If he IS there a lot, physically, for his kids-- taking an active role in their lives-- then that is either because A) he doesn't have to work nearly as many hours as most others do (likely), or B) he has staff, or his "posse", keep a watchful eye on them when he's away (this was the "first option" you were leaning towards, I assume).


In the former case, he is in no position to lecture the "average American family" about their parenting skill, or lack thereof, because he is not living a "normal American life", with all its attendant stressors. If the latter, he surely must realize that not every family has money to hire staff to watch their kids, or has a "posse" of seemingly unemployed people who do nothing but hang on their coattails all day and do their bidding since they're being subsidized for being in "the posse". Normal people don't have these resources. That's all I'm saying.


In either case, it's a demonstrably foolish comment, particularly phrased in the manner it was.

 

[Neo_ZX]

He's evading responsibility because that responsibility should not be his in the first place.

IMO when you're in front of a camera and you know that others will imitate you, that does give you *some* responsibility. I mean he doesn't have to swipe a card down someone's ass but he chose to. He makes money by doing such things so that's good for him. He doesn't have to give a damn what others will do because of his own actions but maybe he should.

 

[karasu]

That's silly. It goes to show that there's a serious deficency of role models these days.

It's not silly, it's the truth. Like it or not, when you're in the public eye, a portion of the population will worship and imitate you. Not even Muhammad Ali has any say on who models their behavior after his. It comes with the territory. You can tell a kid that his role model should be his mother or father, but do you think he gives a fuck? He's gonna idolize the guy who jumps high, or the fella that has all of the jewlery, or the bloke that gets all of the girls and sports cars, etc etc.

And just because the guy says his kid hasn't seen a video, it doesn't mean anything. It's not like the video is played on MTV, and it's not like he honestly knows wtf his kid has and hasn't seen. Then there's the chance that he's flat out lying to make a point.

 

[Saint Cornelius]

I just want to go on the record and say that I'm not actually defending a douchebag like Nelly, but he has a point, imfho, about the role model thing.

He's out in the public eye, so people need to idolize, right? "I want to be like Nelly"

I said that I wanted a fucking tracksuit like Run-DMC back in the day, and my fucking parents sent my ass to Valley Forge Military Academy*!

There's a point in here somewhere. kill yr idols.

*a really true and really sad story

 

[Teknopathetic]

Here's the thing, though, folks. This video wasn't played during primetime MTV or anything like that. Hell, the only show I know that played it was a show called "Uncut," which airs on BET at around 1-ish AM, I think? He didn't make this video for kids to be seen, period. He shouldn't have to restrict himself when kids shouldn't even be watching it. And before some nutbag comes in and screams "BUT KIDS DO!" It's not his responsibility to worry about what every kid in the world is doing at 1AM. It's (that's right, folks) the parents' responsibility.

 

[Saint Cornelius]

I even find myself agreeing with Tre! *marks calendar*

 

[kevm3]

uncut doesnt come on until like 1, 2 or 3 in the morning, so tre is pretty much right.

i mean it's ok to see mutilated bodies and explosions and all of that shit during the day, but some video showing booty shaking shouldn't be shown early in the morning when the kids should be asleep?

 

[mashoutposse]

Umm, maybe because most middle- and lower-middle class families don't get paid $3M to shoot a commercial and have to, oh I don't know...WORK long hours or two jobs? Or both parents have to work? Not everybody is rich like you, Nelly. That has to be the silliest comment I've heard in a while. "How am I there for my kids more than other parents are" :lol


That's common sense, alright. <thumbs-up>

???

Do you also think that ballplayers' only contractual obligation is to show up for two to three hours on gameday? Entertainers work a whole heck of a lot harder than you think. ESPECIALLY the successful ones.

Anyway, going by the most common work and school schedules, parents and children leave home and come back at similar times, thus leaving sufficient time for proper parenting. The "average" family doesn't have an excuse in this regard.

 

[Loki]

???

Do you also think that ballplayers' only contractual obligation is to show up for two to three hours on gameday? Entertainers work a whole heck of a lot harder than you think. ESPECIALLY the successful ones.

Anyway, going by the most common work and school schedules, parents and children leave home and come back at similar times, thus leaving sufficient time for proper parenting. The "average" family doesn't have an excuse in this regard.

I'm not saying that entertainers don't "work hard"-- particularly in the situations I mentioned (while on tour or recording a new album). But for an artist who has achieved some measure of success like Nelly has, believe you me, he is not putting in 60+ hours at work every week. If he is, then that means that he was either lying about how much time he spends with his kids, or has staff/posse to help him out in that regard. Either way, it's a bit disingenuous of him to make such comments (as correct as they may be-- and I think we can all agree that good parenting is necessary and that ultimate responsibility lies with the parents; I'm not arguing that at all).


And your professional athlete analogy is a bit misguided, because obviously they're always hopping around for games-- then again, I don't think I've ever heard one of them maintain that he "spends a lot of time with his family"...at least not during the season. That's the point-- that you can't have it both ways.


So let's say that I grant you your point: Nelly and other artists constantly work long hours. Then how can he say that he's "there for his kids more than" other parents are? There are only so many hours in the week, you know. One of the two scenarios I proposed has to be the case. In one, he's telling a white lie about how much time he spends parenting in order to make a social statement; in the other, he's blind to the luxuries (nannies, posse etc.) which his wealth affords him as compared to most people.


So which is it? Was he being disingenuous, or just blind?



Cyan:

I'm not sure what you disagree about, because I was never really calling his premise into question (re: the virtue of parenting), but rather whether he's really qualified to be weighing in on such a matter. In the broadest sense, obviously, everyone has every right to say anything they like-- I was speaking more in the "can this person truly understand what he's speaking of?" sense. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong-- but I really don't think that Nelly has to deal with many of the same stressors that normal families do. Correct me at your leisure.

 

[MetatronM]

Umm, maybe because most middle- and lower-middle class families don't get paid $3M to shoot a commercial and have to, oh I don't know...WORK long hours or two jobs? Or both parents have to work? Not everybody is rich like you, Nelly. That has to be the silliest comment I've heard in a while. "How am I there for my kids more than other parents are" :lol


That's common sense, alright. <thumbs-up>

Maybe you should read again. He said he's NOT there for his kids more than other parents, not the other way around.

How is it that I can keep my child from seeing a video that I did, but you can't keep your child (from seeing it) and you're there a lot more than I am?

 

[Loki]

Maybe you should read again. He said he's NOT there for his kids more than other parents, not the other way around.

Hmmm... <rubs chin>

DOH!


Man, what an idiot I am.


So my first post in the thread was in error, as I misunderstood what he said (how could I have read that so wrong? Tom probably edited it ). Still, however, how can he say that he is able to do such a good job of parenting with so little time, then? Likely because he has the aforementioned staff etc. helping him out.


Wow, I'm still dumbfounded at my own moment of appalling....braindeadedness. (is that even a word? Who cares, I seemingly can't read, so I'm already screwed )


Loki = Owned

 

[andthebeatgoeson]

He's evading responsibility because that responsibility should not be his in the first place.

Reason why this is one of the best verses I've EVER heard:

Since I'm in a position to talk to these kids and they listen
I ain't no politician but I'll kick it with 'em a minute
Cause see they call me a menace; and if the shoe fits I'll wear it
But if it don't, then y'all'll swallow the truth grin and bear it
Now who's these king of these rude ludicrous lucrative lyrics
Who could inherit the title, put the youth in hysterics
Usin' his music to steer it, sharin his views and his merits
But there's a huge interference - they're sayin you shouldn't hear it
Maybe it's hatred I spew, maybe it's food for the spirit
Maybe it's beautiful music I made for you to just cherish
But I'm debated disputed hated and viewed in America
as a motherfuckin drug addict - like you didn't experiment?
Now now, that's when you start to stare at who's in the mirror
and see yourself as a kid again, and you get embarrased
And I got nothin' to do but make you look stupid as parents
You fuckin do-gooders - too bad you couldn't do good at marriage!
(Ha ha!) And do you have any clue what I had to do to get here I don't
think you do so stay tuned and keep your ears glued to the stereo
Cause here we go - he's {*Jigga joint Jigga-chk-Jigga*}
And I'm the sinister, Mr. Kiss-My-Ass it's just the

I actually agree with Nelly. Which is scary. Now that I'm finally coming around to liking 'Get Your Eagle On' or whatever it's called, I might have to change my opinion that his music is pure unadulterated pop candy. Naw, his music hasn't changed.

But he has a point. I think his work is more of a reflection of society instead of the other way around. I don't think people will stop disrespecting women or dragging their credit card thru women's asscrack if rap/popular culture evaporated. I think it has as much influence as nothing. I played 'catch a girl-freak a girl' way before I got into music/movies/popular culture (7-8 years old and I only had a passing interest in TV other than Transformers). All 'Porky's' did was play to emotions that were already present. If Bill Clinton didn't get a blow job, I'd still love em and wouldn't give them up or wouldn't stop begging for them.

My point is that many things we blame on the media/popular culture should be blamed on ourselves. Hormones and inherited attitudes are to blamed, not Nelly. JFK was crushing Marilyn Monroe and probably swiping a few things between her asscrack way before rap, rock and the proliferation of 'scandolous' TV and movies. What's his fuckin excuse?

 

[Die Squirrel Die]

It's not just a question of how many hours he works. He may work less hours but whereas most people get off work they go home to their kids, he finishes for the day and its off to his hotel in a completely different city or even continent than his kids.

 

[dskillzhtown]

My take is that people have record deals to make money. If they didn't they would be satisfied with playing in local clubs and parties. No one forces anyone to sign a record contract. Nelly is making money. I never have read an interview with Nelly and I can say he has his head on straight and playing the game. While I am not a fan of his music, I can respect the man.

A role model should be a dad, mom, uncle, something you can actually learn from. Not some fool on a video.

 

[andthebeatgoeson]

My take is that people have record deals to make money. If they didn't they would be satisfied with playing in local clubs and parties. No one forces anyone to sign a record contract. Nelly is making money. I never have read an interview with Nelly and I can say he has his head on straight and playing the game. While I am not a fan of his music, I can respect the man.

A role model should be a dad, mom, uncle, something you can actually learn from. Not some fool on a video.

I actually think most role models are but there is a vocal minority and a push to sell newspapers that overhype these stories. If it was such a big problem, you would see massive marches. 12 chicks from Spelman don't represent a large problem. 100,000 people protesting the RNC...now that is an issue.

 

[OmniGamer]

A role model should be a dad, mom, uncle, something you can actually learn from. Not some fool on a video.

Just to play a lil devil's advocate...we all know that "should" be the case, but the reality is it isn't. Kids aren't in the cafeteria or playground talking about their parents or local community volunteer worker. Nelly and co. shouldn't act like role models because like he said, they aren't, BUT, those in the public eye have to be aware of the fact that they do wield a certain power(cue great power/great responsibility schtick)...the have a power to impact young impressionable minds. Kinda hard to go around rockin' 2 average yearly income's worth of clothes and "bling", rapping about "bling" and hoes etc, and then spit out generic fluff like "stay in school" "Read books" "Education is key" etc. It's contradictory and children know it.

 

[Mason]

Wow, for someone who makes such poor, trashy music, I'm really surprised he seems halfway intelligent.

 

[Shinobi]

you realize that entertainers work long hours, too? or spend their time globe-trotting? i'd wager that nelly has less time to spend with his children than the average american family.

then there's also the whole childblock option you have on all tv's now.

:lol Ah yes, the V-Chip...what, people forget how to use it now?

Maybe you should read again. He said he's NOT there for his kids more than other parents, not the other way around.

I was wondering when someone was going to correct him on that :lol...not sure how anyone could misread it.



I didn't grow up using athletes as role models for anything, save for how to play the various sports. If parents are using the TV to do their job, they get what they deserve.

 

[Loki]

I was wondering when someone was going to correct him on that :lol...not sure how anyone could misread it.

Hey, we all have our moments. And I'm still not sure how I misread that so badly...I still maintain that Tom edited it afterwards. It's all about plausible deniability.


Still, like I said, he can't be taking such an active role in his kids' lives if he's never there, unless he's utilizing his resources to provide them with adequate supervision when he's away; this is a luxury that most people don't have. I'm not arguing that a lot of parents that DO have the time just DON'T parent well regardless, and I'm also not questioning the ultimate responsibility of the parents in terms of keeping an eye on what their kids are watching/doing. My posts were only directed at his comment (the first post was obviously in error in light of my misunderstanding ).

 

[Tommie Hu$tle]

Hmmm... <rubs chin>

DOH!


Man, what an idiot I am.

Classic!

So my first post in the thread was in error, as I misunderstood what he said (how could I have read that so wrong?

+1 to Loki for realizing his mistake you don't get that often on the internet

Tom probably edited it ).

+2 for realizing my dastardly plan. The Slick one wins again!

Still, however, how can he say that he is able to do such a good job of parenting with so little time, then? Likely because he has the aforementioned staff etc. helping him out.

That's part true but, how much staff do you need to keep a small child asleep at 1 to 3 in the morning. His child does have a mother you know and he and the mother probably discuss what they think should be good habits for their childern to have. Just like other families.

Still, like I said, he can't be taking such an active role in his kids' lives if he's never there, unless he's utilizing his resources to provide them with adequate supervision when he's away; this is a luxury that most people don't have.

Would you say the same thing about pilots, truck drivers, military personnel, police? There are several occupations that have people away from their childern for extended periods of time. My Dad was on a ship 6 to 9 months out of the year. Does that mean that he didn't take an active role in my life?

 

[Loki]

Would you say the same thing about pilots, truck drivers, military personnel, police? There are several occupations that have people away from their childern for extended periods of time. My Dad was on a ship 6 to 9 months out of the year. Does that mean that he didn't take an active role in my life?

I'm not saying that parents with those occupations are necessarily not there for their kids-- just that they're not there as much as they would otherwise be if they worked more limited hours. Whether you feel your dad was there for you or not (which has NOTHING to do with how much he loves you etc.) is a personal matter; my father worked 85-95+ hours/week until I was about 7 years old, and I've never consciously felt like he was an absentee father or anything. Then again, after that time, though he still worked a lot, he also started coaching my sports teams etc. on the weekends, so that helped to counteract whatever neglect I might have felt earlier.


My point was not to criticise those who have to work long hours at ALL-- people have to make ends meet, just as my parents did. Certainly no fault can be found with parents who have to do such things to provide for their families. I was just taking issue with his statement, which (I mistakenly thought) was asking how he's there for his kids much more than other parents are. Even after realizing my error, however, the point still stands that he is either using his resources to provide care for the kids while he's away working, or the mother may stay at home with the kids (very likely, considering his income)-- both of these are luxuries which a lot of people don't have. So I was merely attacking his basis for saying what (I thought) he did; even despite my error, it should be clear that he is not leading the life of a "normal" American family.


EDIT: Also, did you really edit that afterwards? That would help to explain how I could be so foolish.

 

[Doth Togo]

Quote:

Q: You recently joined BET founder Bob Johnson as part owner of the NBA's Charlotte Bobcats. Will you have clout to say, "Hey, you need to trade this guy?"

NELLY: (Laughs) Yeah, yeah -- I think in a minute he's going to be second guessing his decision, because you know, I'm a sports nut. I'm always in it. I'm aware, and I have many friends who are athletes. I think sports and entertainment go hand in hand. I definitely want to voice my opinion. But I'm just appreciative that I'm in this position.

- - - - -

Yea, you won't find me less than 1,000 miles from a Bobcat game. Give me Shinn's Hornets any day of the week.

 

[Tommie Hu$tle]

EDIT: Also, did you really edit that afterwards? That would help to explain how I could be so foolish.

No I didn't that is how the text has always been. Check the link at the top of the original post. Oh, make no mistake that this guy is not leading the life of a normal American I think that what he is saying is normal Americans should be BETTER at it than he is. Regardless how many servents you have and all that it still good for your child to have a good realtionship with you.

 

[Loki]

I think that what he is saying is normal Americans should be BETTER at it than he is. Regardless how many servents you have and all that it still good for your child to have a good realtionship with you.

Yes, but he was speaking not necessarily of a "relationship" with his children, but rather in terms of being mindful of the content they're exposed to on TV. Now, that doesn't require his physical presence there, as it could be done by the mother and/or staff or his "posse". Due to these luxuries, he can, in fact, be a better parent IN THAT REGARD (limiting their exposure to adult material), because those other people can do the job just as well, especially with explicit instructions from him. Nobody is saying that a healthy relationship with one's children is not mutually beneficial-- but if he's spending so much time away, then he can't really have as healthy a relationship as he otherwise could, correct? Nobody is saying that he doesn't care, or doesn't try with what time he has-- but, all other factors being equal, someone with more time to devote to their children will be a better, more involved parent than would someone with less time.


His comments were not about the sort of "relationship" one has with one's children, but rather specifically about policing what they're exposed to via the media; that job is likely done in his case by his wife or his staff/associates, since he can't possibly work these ridiculous hours that he claims to and still personally keep an eye on what they're doing. It's logically contradictory-- that's all I was pointing out.

 

[Tommie Hu$tle]

Now, that doesn't require his physical presence there, as it could be done by the mother and/or staff or his "posse".

Again why do people assume that rappers have a "posse" around everywhere they go. You don't assume Mark Hammil carries a lightsaber around with him everywhere he goes or that Arnold has an arsonal of heavy weaponry in his backyard just incase he has to take it to the local drug cartel boss and his thugs. I am always bewildered by the fact that people don't see that rappers are actors and their on screen behavior is not necessarily their at home behavior.

Due to these luxuries, he can, in fact, be a better parent IN THAT REGARD (limiting their exposure to adult material), because those other people can do the job just as well, especially with explicit instructions from him. Nobody is saying that a healthy relationship with one's children is not mutually beneficial-- but if he's spending so much time away, then he can't really have as healthy a relationship as he otherwise could, correct? Nobody is saying that he doesn't care, or doesn't try with what time he has-- but, all other factors being equal, someone with more time to devote to their children will be a better, more involved parent than would someone with less time.


His comments were not about the sort of "relationship" one has with one's children, but rather specifically about policing what they're exposed to via the media; that job is likely done in his case by his wife or his staff/associates, since he can't possibly work these ridiculous hours that he claims to and still personally keep an eye on what they're doing. It's logically contradictory-- that's all I was pointing out.

It seems to me that you are making an attempt to make this guy out to be a bad or incompentent parent because he is an entertainer? Do you make the same assumptions with Robert De Niro or Mel Gibson or Kate Winslet or Garth Brooks, or Tim Mcgraw or whatever rock and roll guy there is out there. Regardless if he is there to do it or not he has rules about how his children are to be raised. It seems silly to him (and I) that if he can get the job done from Japan why can't you get the job done from down the street. I think what he is saying is be consistent. You don't like they way he treats women in his video? Fine. You want to protest him? Fine. Well go protest at the strip club down the street. That was there before he came on the scene and will be there when he leaves. So who is the bigger problem.

 

[Loki]

Again why do people assume that rappers have a "posse" around everywhere they go. You don't assume Mark Hammil carries a lightsaber around with him everywhere he goes or that Arnold has an arsonal of heavy weaponry in his backyard just incase he has to take it to the local drug cartel boss and his thugs. I am always bewildered by the fact that people don't see that rappers are actors and their on screen behavior is not necessarily their at home behavior.

I didn't assume that he had a posse with him (or his family) at all times; my first mention of the word was in quotes, and was in response to Lonestar, who used the word "posse" to describe the "staff" that I mentioned might help take care of Nelly's kids. I said staff (as in "paid nanny" etc.), he, in response, said "posse"; so I used it from then on and it just stuck.


He may or may not have a "posse" on retainer. I'm almost certain, however, that he has staff who helps take care of the kids, or that the mother stays home with them (i.e., doesn't work).

It seems to me that you are making an attempt to make this guy out to be a bad or incompentent parent because he is an entertainer? Do you make the same assumptions with Robert De Niro or Mel Gibson or Kate Winslet or Garth Brooks, or Tim Mcgraw or whatever rock and roll guy there is out there. Regardless if he is there to do it or not he has rules about how his children are to be raised. It seems silly to him (and I) that if he can get the job done from Japan why can't you get the job done from down the street.

I never said that he was an incompetent parent at all. To lay it out in stepwise fashion, I said:


1) That assuming he works these long hours and is always away (as he asserts), then he has a support structure in place that helps to raise the kids in the manner which he deems proper.

2) This "support structure" consists of either the mother (who wouldn't be working), or hired staff. Neither of these two are things which the average family can afford (in light of the modern necessity for two incomes in many cases).

3) In light of the above, it is somewhat disingenuous of him to attack "normal" parents for their inability to keep their kids from seeing certain content. This is because:

3A) Though many parents might be home with their children a bit more than he is, in Nelly's situation, someone is likely always with the kids, keeping an eye on them as per his instructions, even if HE personally is away. Again, most people don't have such a luxury. Remember, this is about keeping an eye on the kids, not "building a relationship" with them-- because, all other things being equal (caring, effort etc.), obviously the person who has more TIME to spend with their kids will develop a better relationship with them. Had Nelly said "how can you parents who are there more than I am not have a better relationship with your kids than I do?"-- THAT would not have been a problematic statement. But he wasn't talking about his "relationship" with them, but rather one specific aspect of "parenting" which can be just as easily done by others while one is away, which is likely done in his case.


My point was that he's really not in a position to be saying such things, even though his overall message (that parents should be more responsible and take an active role in their children's lives) is a sound one. I was attacking his basis for saying it-- not its soundness in principle. Is that clearer? Never did I say that he was an "incompetent parent"-- he has to do what he has to do for his job. There were times when I didn't see my father for a week or more, and you can certainly relate to that; that doesn't make them incompetent parents at all. If he would have said "hey, I have to work long hours and be away for long stretches", never would I have called him an "incompetent parent", because we can't make that judgment-- he does have some sort of support structure there for when he's not around, so that right there bespeaks responsibility on his part.


And just so you know, I would have said this same exact thing if you just swapped out the name Nelly and replaced it with Billy Ray Cyrus or whoever, so long as they were in a similar situation and had made the same comment.

 

[Neo_ZX]

Hopefully, parents raise their kids and don't let music raise their kids and entertainers raise their kids. How is it that I can keep my child from seeing a video that I did, but you can't keep your child (from seeing it) and you're there a lot more than I am? So you can't be serious.

Perhaps he means that the parents are there more often than they see him on the TV. However unlikely he could possibly be referring to the kids of the general public rather than his own.

 

[Shinobi]

:lol

+1 to Loki for realizing his mistake you don't get that often on the internet

It isn't like he had a choice. :lol

 

[Loki]

It isn't like he had a choice. :lol

Au contraire, my hot-tempered ninja friend-- I could have simply beat a hasty (and stealthy) retreat from the thread, like others do when they're irrevocably mistaken.

 

[mrkapawutzis]

ayo, Dizzy Gillespie plays the sax

Huh?!? Nice & Smooth?

 

[effzee]

where is the real argument here? i mean really...he has a point on both accounts. he went to a school for a bone marrow drive...which i believe is more important that a vid full of strippers doing what they do that is shown only at 3am. it was for adults. that doesnt mean he doesnt care about saving lives and the bone marrow drive


and about kids....there is no way or shape a kid should be able to see a vid that is aired only at 3am. its not his responsibility.