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Ogre Battle 64 Appreciation Thread
- Thread starter GaimeGuy
- Start date
My Arms Your Hearse
Banned
March of the Black Queen was really easy, but maybe that is because I got a Ring of the Dead off some randomn enemy on like the third stage.
BudokaiMR2
Member
This is one of those games that is a must-buy on the VC.
I never got around to playing it in depth, or any of the ogre battle games for that matter. Here is hoping it shows up on the Rev VC.
I never got around to playing it in depth, or any of the ogre battle games for that matter. Here is hoping it shows up on the Rev VC.
Pellham said:
I understand, but it still appeared on a Nintendo system, which means Nintendo had to give its full okay for the language (which, notably, Nintendo never did during the SNES-era). Considering that Nintendo has made even more progress in that area since the N64 (getting a number of mature games on the GameCube, for instance), I can't possibly imagine the company would go back and censor a six year old game where they already approved the language once when it appeared on a prior Nintendo system.
NOA's come extremely close to publishing Ogre games three times, even up to the point of starting localizations inhouse (Tactics Ogre SNES, Ogre Battle 64, Tactics Ogre GBA). It's really a shame Nintendo didn't buy out Quest instead, we'd have definitely seen a console Ogre this gen then.
As is, the Quest development team is still around as Square Enix Division 4's dedicated handheld team (though they've been helping out with finishing up FFXII). They developed FFTA entirely and are rumored to be currently working on DS revivals of both Ogre Battle and Tactics Ogre now.
As is, the Quest development team is still around as Square Enix Division 4's dedicated handheld team (though they've been helping out with finishing up FFXII). They developed FFTA entirely and are rumored to be currently working on DS revivals of both Ogre Battle and Tactics Ogre now.
Galactic Fork
A little fluff between the ears never did any harm...
jarrod said:
By "revivals" you mean remakes right? Dangit, I want a new one (with online matches). Plus I could never get into Tactics Ogre. I always think of it as Ogre Battle's inferior cousin.
My Arms Your Hearse
Banned
I don't really think Ogre games would translate well online. Everyone would have the uber pwnsauce group setup... and whoever got to go first would win without fail.
Bizarro Sun Yat-sen
Banned
FFTA was made largely by the Knight of Lodis team. It's true that relatively few people from OB64 were involved, but that's simply because many of them had left Quest before KoL and so were never available for Square to acquire.
I actually liked the original Ogre Battle better. If I remember correctly, the characters moved faster on the map screen and did more damage in battle; it wasn't too uncommon to wipe out 60-100% of an enemy unit in a single encounter in OB, whereas in OB64 it usually took several fights.
But then again, maybe it got better. My copy got stolen when I was about halfway through the game, so yeah...
But then again, maybe it got better. My copy got stolen when I was about halfway through the game, so yeah...
Jiggy37 said:
I agree by the tiniest of margins the SNES OB game was superior in gameplay at least. Also Princesses weren't NEARLY as hard to aquire. I remember having 4 Princesses in the original OB and only aquired 1 in OB64 much later in the game than I had with the original. Still OB64 is my favorite console RPG of the past 8 years and is not that far behind Planescape Torment overall. I weep daily at the thought of never seeing another iteration.
sonarrat said:
I think the main distinctions in Jarrod's listing are these: those in the "tactics" style game contain mostly generic characters (with some story-specific characters) and high levels of customizability separate from the standard RPG method of simply leveling up. Additionally, there's a tactical element involved in facing/positioning and things such as height to take into account. The "simulation" games don't involve facing/positioning, height, generic characters, or high levels of customizability.
So, I think that's where Jarrod's making the distinction. It still seems a fairly minor one overall -- the games can still be classified as part of the same genre (RPG) and sub-genre (strategy RPG) because most of the core gameplay elements are the same and they play out and control in a mostly similar manner.
evilromero
Member
Don't own the game but I own the soundtrack. Beautiful. I'm typically ashamed to even admit that I own an RPG (ok so SRPG) soundtrack, but this one is actually well done. Just to clear up the air I don't own any FF/Square OSTs. Not a fan of the composition. But OB64 struck a chord with me.
Bizarro Sun Yat-sen
Banned
Whose composition aren't you a fan of? There are a lot of composers who've done work for Square (including OB64's Hitoshi Sakimoto of course) and they have very different styles, so...?
Bizarro Sun Yat-sen said:
Just to be clear, Hitoshi Sakimoto didn't do very much at all for OB64. He contributed very few tracks, and all of those he contributed were originally composed and used in Ogre Battle. The bulk of OB64's soundtrack came from Hayato Matsuo and Masaharu Iwata (who co-composed FFT and TO with Sakimoto).
Yeah, I realize that. However, OB64 and PM are two of my favorite RPGs of the entire 32/64 bit gen of gaming. Granted, there were a veritable shit-ton of RPGs on the PSOne as well (hell, I own most of them, I think), but I hold a special place in my heart for OB64, PM, Grandia, and Valkyrie Profile, above all.
CO_Andy said:
That's one of the reasons an RPG player yust has to buy a PS2... Wich really sucks.
I mean, piece of crap Sony hardware (hehe), I own a gamecube and the only reasonable RPGs there are ToS, Baten Kaitos, Paper mario 2, Skies maybe and Fire Emblem. if you look at the review list on ps2.ign.com it's like seven times that size...
*sigh*
But it had the best version of Grandia.Mejilan said:Not in my humble opinion, it didn't. Shining Force III was good, but not THAT good. Panzer Dragoon Saga was horribly overrated.
Also, it had Tactics Ogre, Ogre Battle, Black Matrix, Shining the Holy Ark, Lunar remakes, Dragon Force, Tengai Makyo Apocalypse, Legend of Oasis, Sakura Taisen 1-2, Rayearth, Dracula X, Devil Summoner 1-2, Princess Crown, Langrisser III-V, Genso Suikoden, Baroque, Samurai Spirits RPG, SRT F, Wachenroder and a ton of other games. Saturn was definitely an RPG powerfhouse, it's just that we missed most of it here.
Imagineer made Quest 64. They also had original rights to release Ogre Battle (SNES) in America, but Enix sublicensed it.mdm said:
jarrod said:But it had the best version of Grandia.
Also, it had Tactics Ogre, Ogre Battle, Black Matrix, Shining the Holy Ark, Lunar remakes, Dragon Force, Tengai Makyo Apocalypse, Legend of Oasis, Sakura Taisen 1-2, Rayearth, Dracula X, Devil Summoner 1-2, Princess Crown, Langrisser III-V, Genso Suikoden, Baroque, Samurai Spirits RPG, SRT F, Wachenroder and a ton of other games. Saturn was definitely an RPG powerfhouse, it's just that we missed most of it here.
The Saturn fucking sucked for RPGs in the West, which is all that's relevant to me.
Mejilan said:
No, it really didn't. Shining Force III was an excellent game, even though it's a damned shame that America never got the second and third games in the SFIII series. Shining the Holy Ark was great, too (very challenging and it did a great job presenting a first-person perspective, which is a true rarity in RPGs and hadn't been done so well since Phantasy Star on the Master System), and you're just flat-out wrong on your remarks about Panzer Dragoon Saga, which was one of the most revolutionary, influential, and groundbreaking RPGs ever in terms of its narrative and graphical style. The American Saturn also had Dragon Force (still one of the best SRPGs of the generation), Albert Odyssey (old-school goodness), Magic Knight Rayearth, Mystaria/Blazing Heroes, The Legend of Oasis (fantastic action RPG, and better than almost any on the PSX), Shining Wisdom (which, despite its age, *still* manages to be better than Neo and Tears), Dark Savior... come on. This is not a system that sucked for RPGs, by any stretch of the imagination.
RPG, ARPG, SRPG, when talking in generalities (such as comparing system libraries), I lump them together. When speaking specifics (such as comparing entries across the sub-genres), then I separate them out. Besides, the N64 didn't really have enough, so you kinda HAD to lump 'em together! ;p
Panzer Dragoon Saga - crap on a stick with a tiny print run that instantly guaranteed "cult hit" with the Sega fanatics of the time. Still crap on a stick, however.
Shining Force III - best of the Shining Forces, but the Shining Forces aren't exactly brilliant.
Shining of the Holy Ark - great successor to Shining in the Darkness. No arguments there. Nice and hardcore.
Shining Wisdom - crap crap crap. Saying it's better than Shining Tears is like saying that getting your thumb lopped off is better than losing the entire hand. True... but still grisly and should be avoided at all costs.
Dragon Force - couldn't get into it. Seemed very stupid. Admittedly, I didn't play it much.
Legend of Oasis - great follow up to the Genny original. ANCIENT! KOSHIRO!! REPRESENT!
As to the rest... YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWN.
The Saturn's best pales utterly in comparison to the PSOne's amazing RPGs. In the West, of course. And while the N64 had a paltry showing in the West, it's best trumped the Saturn's too. Easily.
All IMHO, of course.
Panzer Dragoon Saga - crap on a stick with a tiny print run that instantly guaranteed "cult hit" with the Sega fanatics of the time. Still crap on a stick, however.
Shining Force III - best of the Shining Forces, but the Shining Forces aren't exactly brilliant.
Shining of the Holy Ark - great successor to Shining in the Darkness. No arguments there. Nice and hardcore.
Shining Wisdom - crap crap crap. Saying it's better than Shining Tears is like saying that getting your thumb lopped off is better than losing the entire hand. True... but still grisly and should be avoided at all costs.
Dragon Force - couldn't get into it. Seemed very stupid. Admittedly, I didn't play it much.
Legend of Oasis - great follow up to the Genny original. ANCIENT! KOSHIRO!! REPRESENT!
As to the rest... YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWN.
The Saturn's best pales utterly in comparison to the PSOne's amazing RPGs. In the West, of course. And while the N64 had a paltry showing in the West, it's best trumped the Saturn's too. Easily.
All IMHO, of course.
Mejilan said:
So totally disagree. And while I've always been a fan of Sega, I'm definitely not a fanatic, and my appreciation of the game's quality isn't tied to its small print run. It was just a really amazing experience. I think it still stands out as one of the most immersive RPGs, simply because of how fully realized the world it created was -- the fact that every character spoke entirely in an invented (and wonderfully-sounding) language? Awesome touch that blows away every similar effort (Al Bhed? Get real.
). Panzer Dragoon Saga pioneered the idea of using an RPG to tell a story with a cinematic feel and narrative style and immersiveness (with amazing visuals that still hold up and a great soundtrack) way before any other game even tried. It was hugely influential in this regard. And thankfully, the cinematic story it was telling holds up extremely well, too.Mejilan said:
Brilliant, no -- though Shining Force III had a very fun story with some charming characters and nice twists. The game wasn't trying to tell a deep, complex, theme-heavy store like the Ogre Battle games, just an entertaining story pushed forward by good characters, similar to the Fire Emblem series. And the gameplay was fun. Again, not particularly deep, but fun. I've replayed the game a ton just because of how flat-out enjoyable it is to play.
Mejilan said:
Definitely glad we agree there.
Mejilan said:
Fair point. I found it decently enjoyable, thanks mainly to the funny WD localization.
Mejilan said:
You need to give it more of a chance, though. The writing is fantastic, but more importantly, it's just a seriously fun game with a shit-ton of stuff to accomplish. It did some really original stuff for the strategy RPG subgenre.
Mejilan said:
So totally wrong.
Mejilan said:
Oh, you'll get no argument from me that the Saturn pales before the PSX RPG library -- I mentioned just the other day in one of the other RPG threads that I think the PSX RPG library is easily the best ever, and only the SNES comes close in terms of sheer quality. The Saturn doesn't touch it. But failing to eclipse the PSX's RPG greatness does not a sucky RPG system make.
As to the N64, no, sorry. While OB64 is outstanding and phenomenal, and Paper Mario is great (though definitely bested by its successor), the N64's abyssmal RPG library is miles beneath the Saturn's. Aside from OB64 and PM, all it has is Hybrid Heaven, Quest 64, and Aidyn Chronicles. That's a serious shit-pile right there. Things get better if you factor in the Zeldas as action RPGs, but still...
My Arms Your Hearse
Banned
CO_Andy said:
Further evidence (as if it were needed) of IGN's irrelevance?
My Arms Your Hearse
Banned
Zelda isn't an action RPG.
I don't get the obsession with trying to label it as such.
My favorite genre of games... RPGs, by far.
Zelda is my second favorite gaming franchise of all-time.
Zelda is NOT an RPG.
I don't get the obsession with trying to label it as such.
My favorite genre of games... RPGs, by far.
Zelda is my second favorite gaming franchise of all-time.
Zelda is NOT an RPG.