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Pitchfork! Oh and NME is retarded.

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GG-Duo

Member
I agree.

It's a perfect album without having to be a consciously sublime.
I mean, there are always these albums that get high scores because "ohhh it's like a journey, man. it's like life and death....."

Ghost isn't like that. Everything is around the corner and can be taken as ironic. It's approaching mortality without the same ol dreary ruminations.

or something like that
 

Ill Saint

Member
The reviewer (Di Crescenzo) made some allegations in his review of "To the 5 Borroughs", which are explained in the retraction. He got rather personal in the review and basically gave something of a veiled middle finger to Pitchfork in the last paragraph or so. Pretty weird.
 

Lambtron

Unconfirmed Member
I haven't listened to Ghost quite enough to give my final judgement on it, but on my first listen, I was way more impressed than I was by any of their work. I prefer Summerteeth to YHF, and I'm not 100% I like Ghost quite as much as ST. We'll find out tomorrow, I guess. I plan on giving it quite a few listens once I actually have the disc in my hands.
 
It's all obviously some sort of stunt to hype up Brent's new endeavor.. and all the Pitchfork people are onto it.

And Pitchfork sucks.

And I find Wilco's music to be pretty boring, but I have a feeling I haven't given a fair shot the last twenty times, so I;m going buy A Ghost Is Born tomorrow.
 

Ollie Pooch

In a perfect world, we'd all be homersexual
pitchfork are the biggest bunch of pretentious, shitty reviewers on the face of the planet :p
 

Meier

Member
PFM is lame. I hope all the fucks who think just because something is mainstream it sucks realize how idiotic they are. There's plenty of them here at the board who have this mindset and its retarded.
 

Dead

well not really...yet
I dont mind pfm. It just depends on certain writers. for example i dont care for Chris Ott at all, so i just discard his reviews...
 

Ill Saint

Member
Meier said:
PFM is lame. I hope all the fucks who think just because something is mainstream it sucks realize how idiotic they are. There's plenty of them here at the board who have this mindset and its retarded.
You sound very bitter. How about qualifying that statement?
 

kablooey

Member
Meier said:
P.S. NME = best music site/magazine in the world.

Right. Remind me never to take your opinion seriously again. :)

As for PFM...they're just like any other reviewers out there (which means they usually manage to miss the point of the music entirely). The texts of their reviews are usually a pain to read through, but if they give an album a good score, it's most likely because it is a good album. End of story.

(Their bad reviews are obviously much less trustworthy.)
 

Dead

well not really...yet
NMEs not that bad, they just hype shit way too much, and besides theyre better than the majority shit rags that are available in america aside from a few (filter, under the radar and others)
 
Meier said:
P.S. NME = best music site/magazine in the world.

The same NME that was paid off to give The Vines cds good reviews? Ahahaha, NME is a complete fucking joke. And let's not forget the terrible reviews, and their intense bias in favour of British artists.

Edit: As for Pitchfork...their reviews are hit and miss IMO. Their personal bias, for and against certain artists, comes into play way too much (at the expense of discussion about the actual MUSIC on the cd), and often they just go off on a complete tangent. However, regardless of the accuracy of their reviews, I still find them quite entertaining to read - I just take the review with a grain of salt and make up my own mind.
 

Dead

well not really...yet
Optimistic said:
And let's not forget the terrible reviews, and their intense bias in favour of British artists.
maybe its becuase theyre a fucking british publication?
 
Oh gee, ya think? It's still a professional magazine written by (supposedly) professional music critics, and as such I expect their reviews to maintain some semblance of professionalism, and refrain from wearing their bias on their sleeves. They don't refrain. This is the same magazine that, in a review of a Bends era Radiohead concert, focused upon deriding Thom's appearance. Yeah, this a quality rag, *cough*...ahahahaha, now run along DeadStar...
 

Dead

well not really...yet
Optimistic said:
Oh gee, ya think? It's still a professional magazine written by (supposedly) professional music critics, and as such I expect their reviews to maintain some semblance of professionalism, and refrain from wearing their bias on their sleeves. They don't refrain. This is the same magazine that, in a review of a Bends era Radiohead concert, focused upon deriding Thom's appearance. Yeah, this a quality rag, *cough*...ahahahaha, now run along DeadStar...
Um if you think showing bias is limited to just the NME then youre flat wrong. period. And yeah because criticizing a singers fashion is limited to the NME as well. fucking retarded logic you have here. Pretty much every publication has a bias in some form or another, to say they dont is utterly moronic. What makes NME less of a publication than fucking Rolling Stone or Spin or even that piece of shit TP Blender? When did I say it was a "quality rag" all I said is its not as bad as some mongrels, such as yourself, make it out to be and is much better than the majority of ass backwards so called professional american magazines.

In any case, fuck magazines, if I had to rely on that shit for my music needs, I wouldnt have gotten very far.
 
DeadStar said:
Um if you think showing bias is limited to just the NME then youre flat wrong. period. And yeah because criticizing a singers fashion is limited to the NME as well. fucking retarded logic you have here. Pretty much every publication has a bias in some form or another, to say they dont is utterly moronic. What makes NME less of a publication than fucking Rolling Stone or Spin or even that piece of shit TP Blender? When did I say it was a "quality rag" all I said is its not as bad as some mongrels, such as yourself, make it out to be and is much better than the majority of ass backwards so called professional american magazines.

In any case, fuck magazines, if I had to rely on that shit for my music needs, I wouldnt have gotten very far.


Oh please -

1. I never said anything about any magazines being unbiased, don't suggest I did

2. There are degrees of bias, some magazines are clearly much more biased than others though, NME being an example. The implication being that while every magazine has an element of bias, they try and minimise this bias in their reviews - NME clearly has an agenda to promote British artists.

3. NME wasn't criticisng his fashion, in the article the writer flat out called Thom ugly.

4. I never claimed Rolling Stone or any other magazine was better, they're all shit, but NME is among the worst offenders. And at least most other magazines aren't on the payrolls of recording companies.
 

Dead

well not really...yet
Optimistic said:
Oh please -

1. I never said anything about any magazines being unbiased, don't suggest I did

2. There are degrees of bias, some magazines are clearly much more biased than others though, NME being an example. The implication being that while every magazine has an element of bias, they try and minimise this bias in their reviews - NME clearly has an agenda to promote British artists.

3. NME wasn't criticisng his fashion, in the article the writer flat out called Thom ugly.

4. I never claimed Rolling Stone or any other magazine was better, they're all shit, but NME is among the worst offenders.
You worded the other post way too vitriolically. In any case:

1. no you didnt, but I made a point of it anyway.

2. I agree with this to some extent.

3. Its mean spirited, but a mangled visage such as thoms is pretty funny and im a radiohead fan. ;P

4. I dont think theyre one of the worst offenders. just opinion.

bleh regardless, just a difference of opinion, no need to get strung out on a damn magazine anyway. :)
 

Diablos

Member
PFM pisses me off so bad. I think every PFM reviewer should get together and record an album, then have the gifted artists they always put down review it. Since PFM knows everything about a good record, they know how to record one too, right? I do not take many of their reviews seriously anymore. Broken Social Scene is the first one in a long, long time that I actually enjoyed reading and agreed with.

But for the most part, Pitchfork Media consists of a bunch of pretentious llamas that need to get a clue.

As a Neil Young fan, I'm no anti-soloist, but for an artist as lyrically and vocally gifted as Tweedy to resort to expressing emotions through age-old bombast and pyrotechnics, something must be gumming up the songwriting works.

What a loser. There's nothing wrong with guitar solos. If anything indie rock is LACKING that, and it's nice to know Tweedy is trying something different. But he blames it on lack of songwriting. Idiot.
 
Diablos said:
What a loser. There's nothing wrong with guitar solos. If anything indie rock is LACKING that, and it's nice to know Tweedy is trying something different. But he blames it on lack of songwriting. Idiot.

Opinion =/ fact. I hold the opinion that excessively long guitar solos are the product of artists who just want to show off their l33t skills without expressing any emotion, painting a convincing landscape or interesting content to the music. It's pointless in that it shows off nothing more than an individual's skill. I don't get anything out of it that I wouldn't get minus the pretentious airs. In life, I'm not fond of pretentious people. In music, I'm not too fond of it too. (There are exceptions like Led Zeppelin though)

I think the rating was a bit harsh on "Ghost". But, I do agree with the thrust that songs like Less Than What You Think, and Spiders/Kidsmoke are too long.
 

Matrix

LeBron loves his girlfriend. There is no other woman in the world he’d rather have. The problem is, Dwyane’s not a woman.
Diablos said:
Blah blah shut up wannabe aussie boy.


lol


oh and pitchshit sucks the big one.
 

Zilch

Banned
PFM is lame. I hope all the fucks who think just because something is mainstream it sucks realize how idiotic they are. There's plenty of them here at the board who have this mindset and its retarded.

I was going to make a detailed response about how you're making a stupid generalization, and there are plenty of "mainstream" and "major label" artists that receive good scores (Beastie Boys, just recently), but then I realized the only reason you're so bitter is this: http://www.pitchforkmedia.com/record-reviews/o/oasis/heathen-chemistry.shtml.

But yeah, I like A Ghost Is Born a lot, it's a shame it got such a low score from PFM, but that score is just the writer's opinion... why should I bitch about it? It's not going to make me enjoy it less.

Also, has anyone noticed that AllMusic is totally re-rating a lot of major artist's albums? Weird.
 

White Man

Member
Allmusic does that. Back last year, they changed the Mars Volta score from 2 to 4 stars after it attracted a dedicated following. The text of the review wasn't changed however.

Anyway, 6.6? Goddamn, I adore the album. Then again, I have a thing for soulful guitar solos. That 'at least that's what you said' solo is absolutely stunning. That said, a couple songs do overstay their welcome. The album isn't a Summerteeth, but it is a YHF.

I just think it's publicity stunt week at Pitchfork or something. I've never liked Brent, and the new crop of writers is sub-Pfork par. I'm all about Stylus these days. Pitchfork is still tops for learning about new bands, though.

(+1 for their Fabulous Muscles review, though. I was sure they were going to label it as Xiu Xiu trying too hard to gain a bigger audience)
 

Particle Physicist

between a quark and a baryon
"This process has become unexciting and routine, which is why I bid the world of music writing farewell. Explaining why I love a record in the confines of its production, lyrics and instrumental "tightness" without detailing the first time I heard the band's song drifting from bowling alley in Poland or whatever confounds me. More power to those who discover new music from this site. I've figured out where I stand at this point, as have the readers. Like the Beastie Boys, I could continue to crank out divisive pieces of writing here until I go gray. I have more interesting stories to tell.

-Brent DiCrescenzo, June 15th, 2004"


haha.. thats great .
 

Guzim

Member
Read Pitchfork's review of Rilo Kiley's 'Take-Offs & Landings'. The reviewer gave it a bad score because two Rilo Kiley songs were in Dawson's Creek even though those songs are not on the album.
 

Teddman

Member
I bolded the cut portions.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Beastie Boys
To the 5 Boroughs
[Capitol; 2004]
Rating: 7.9
June, 1999

Viale Vittorio Veneto, Corso Venezia, Corso Buenos Aires, Viale Piave,
and Viale Luigi Majno converge into a clogged traffic circle on the
northeastern corner of the Giardini Pubblici in northeastern Milan.
Flanked by my overpriced hotel and the park's Planetario, I punch a 26-
digit number into the red Italian payphone which looks like an EMT
heart resuscitator. Fiats and scooters drown the faint, distorted
ringing. I check my watch. Is New York five or six hours behind? I have
two hours until Clinic goes on before Radiohead.

"Hello, Nasty," the girl on the phone says.

I ask for the cellular number to Steve Martin, head of Nasty Little Man
public relations. I'm supposed to meet him now at Villa Reale for a
Radiohead story. They won't give me the number. It's private. Right, I
know. I flew to another continent to meet him. I need that number.
Villa Reale, a Renaissance mansion, hides a couple copses behind me,
and there's no sign of Steve Martin, or Radiohead, or bleachers, or
white semis, or fans, or any other expected Radiohead concert
signifiers. They will call Steve and call me back. Look, I'm on a
payphone in Milan, Italy, can you give me the goddam number? They will
call Steve for me.

I hang up and watch skaters wipe out on bench grinds. I call back.

"Hello, Nasty."

Right. Brent D. Milan. Steve. Radiohead. What the fuck.

"Oh, Steve forgot to tell you that the concert was moved to Monza."
Monza is a suburb 30 minutes north of Milan. I had passed it on the
train from Frankfurt.

I hang up.


* * *
June, 1998

In one of the first "concept" reviews at Pitchfork, and one of my first
for the site in general, I review Hello Nasty. I make some stupid Tibet
joke, give it an 8.5, and say:

Hello Nasty is a New York salad-- diced beats, trans- oceanic
influences, traffic, noise pollution, construction, b-ball speak, bold
pop- culture billboards and neon, tossed well in braggadocio.

I always hated that review. I held back. Eventually, Hello Nasty would
become my favorite Beastie Boys record because, for a band who had sold
tens of millions, it seemed overlooked. As I age I become more and more
fascinated by records by artists in the autumn of their careers. I
reach for Holland and Lodger before Wild Honey and Hunky Dory.


* * *
June, 2004

After booking an airline and a TriBeCa hotel blocks from the Beastie
Boys' studio on Canal Street, I call my editor at Mean magazine. We
discuss the cover story I am to write. The editor envisions an
insightful, personal look into the lives of the Beastie Boys that goes
beyond the obvious press kit-based fluff pieces. Fantastic, I refuse to
take typical approaches, and Mean magazine is run by people from the
defunct, excellent Grand Royal magazine, so what better chance? One
problem: After six weeks of planning the story, Steve Martin, the Boys'
publicist, has not gotten back to us about the interview. Mean even
delayed their publication to accommodate Steve Martin's procrastination.

The interview is set to take place the next business day, and I've
cleared two days in New York for the story. I've also booked meetings
for my film endeavors, but those will just be for five or six hours on
Tuesday. Nasty Little Man will call Steve who will call Nasty Little
Man back who will call my editor who will call me. Well, I leave for
New York tomorrow, so could you work that out? Also, could I get the
new album? When writing a cover story about an album, hearing the album
typically offers important insight.

Steve Martin, presumably between bites of a Shea Stadium hotdog,
initiates his chain of communication. No, the album is under tight
security and could Brent please be on call this Tuesday? I'll call him
an hour before he needs to show up at the Canal Street studio. He'll
get an hour. With two of the three members.

I cancel the story. The Beastie Boys are a 23-year-old rap group.
Despite the fact that my entire adolescence revolved around their first
three albums, I could care less about squeezing out a mundane magazine
piece about their new paean to New York. The city puts its garbage on
the sidewalk. "In a World Gone Mad" sucked. The publicist- and press-
controlled structure of the entire music industry only allows for trite
magazine fluff as ad revenue; access to major artists are dangled like
carrots to the media in an attempt to blackmail press for features on
nothing bands like Matt Pond, PA and Ultimate Fakebook.


* * *
June, 1999

My night's schedule cleared, I wander the city of Milan. I shop for a
watch in Gucci. I eat gnocchi under the great iron and glass atrium of
the Galleria Vittorio Emanuele. After the meal, I climb to the top of
the gargantuan Duomo, a cathedral that appears to have been built by
the hand of God reaching down and drizzling wet sand from his fist. In
the piazza below, a large concert stage is being constructed. I descend
the cathedral and mill about with Italians with prams and cellphones.
As twilight spreads, Caetano Veloso, one of my heroes, comes on stage
and performs a free set under the stars.


On walks around Manhattan, even on sun-scorched days, mysterious precipitation falls on your head. Whether this comes from urinating birds, air conditioning condensation, observation deck spitting, or suicide jumpers breaking down into their constituent beads of bloody moisture over the long 145-story leaps from skyscrapers, I've yet to determine. The Times Square subway station has been under construction for at least four years. The majority of Village eateries I frequent do not accept credit cards. The city tobacconists all spell the first letters of "Smoke Shop" with two pipes, making the storefront signs look more like "Jmoke Jhop." Garbage is laid out on the sidewalks, as real estate shortages allow for no alleys. The Mormon Temple across from the Lincoln Center has fantastic free peanut butter cookies, if you sit through one of their thinly veiled brainwashing video tours.

None of these elements of New York, which I find more indicative of the town, are mentioned on the Beastie Boys' To the 5 Boroughs. Instead, Adrock, MCA and Mike D offer obvious demographic and transit information on their "Open Letter to NYC". "Asian, Middle Eastern, and Latin/ Black, White, New York/ You make it happen," they croon together on the chorus to the centerpiece of their sixth album. "Brooklyn, Bronx, Queens, and Staten/ From the Battery to the top of Manhattan," they read like a free hotel map. What, nothing rhymed with Inwood? The song makes fantastic use of a Dead Boys sample (who were from Cleveland), but fumbles the execution with their Up With People chants.

Lyrically, the Beastie Boys fail to make a convincing justification for their hometown pride beyond slogans that could fit on a t-shirt. The answering machine message of Paul's Boutique conveyed more giddy pride in the nuances and uniqueness of the metropolis. In a trademark (or typical, or tired, depending on your perspective) deep pop culture reference, Adrock mentions Gnip Gnop, a 1970s Parker Brothers game that was like a cross of Pong and Hungry Hungry Hippos. "Jmoke Jhop" would have rhymed perfectly. In their attempt to point out the details of their city, the Beastie Boys offer little more than the view from the top of a sawn-off double-decker tour bus.

At this point in time, no measure of analysis regarding cadence, meter or goofy references will sway the pros and cons of the Beastie Boys' lyrics. They do what they do, and even my mother knows their M.O. What To the 5 Boroughs offers, contrary to naysayers who mock aging bands, are three voices showing intriguing texture from wear and experience. MCA sounds like the Harry Nilsson of hip-hop after a lost weekend. Adrock, especially, shows greater range in style. From his leisured easy-speaking on "Crawlspace" to the Eminem-like syllable play on "Hey Fuck You", he puffs his chest with laid-back economy and moves away from the stereotypical nasal whine of their younger days.

Where the true influence of New York exerts itself on To the 5 Boroughs is in the stark rhythms, which filter the cold continental-sampling breaks of rap pioneers like Jimmy Spicer and The Treacherous Three through Apple processors. The streamlined foundations both pay tribute to the crews that influenced the Beastie Boys to put down their Bad Brains and Reagan Youth aspirations and lays a hard digital direction for the Bush Youth to follow.

Unlike all previous Beastie Boys albums (with the possible exception of Licensed to Ill), To The 5 Boroughs sounds homogenous and singular in purpose-- dark, steel, and dirty like that incomplete Times Square station. Ill Communication and Hello Nasty reveled in genre-dipping, from hardcore and salsa to dub and disco. Their decision to settle into a focused hip-hop direction here seems like a sage move. The album succeeds in its seeming spontaneity. "Seeming" in that they possibly spent years making it. But whatever length of gestation, the album's easy air speaks to veteran, nothing-to-lose attitude of both the city and the group.

* * *
June, 1992; June, 2005

Still, my interaction with music goes well beyond simple, academic analysis of sound. Nostalgia, emotional context, the continued story and history behind the artist, the packaging, and everything else matters in my love and fascination with music. This is why writing for Pitchfork, which prides itself on discovering unknown underground artists, means so little to me anymore. Listening to music as some form of continued, insular experiment with recording driven by faceless, MP3-based rock bands bores me. I was immediately prepared to love To the 5 Boroughs from my history with the band-- from listening to Ill while playing Atari with Andy Eberhardt, to mowing neighborhood lawns with Gregg Bernstein and Paul's Boutique in a walkman, to holding my portable CD player off the front cushion of my Buick Century to keep Check Your Head from skipping as I passed over the speed bumps in the Marist parking lot every day after my Junior year, to shooting bottle rockets from poster tubes at passing trucks on 400 off the roof of the AMC multiplex I worked at when Ill Communication came out. It is not mentally possibly for me to switch on apathy towards the group-- and immediately hate this record because the Beastie Boys associate themselves with pricks like Steve Martin and his sycophantic fleet of product pushers who fail to see the benefit of funny, creative magazine pieces.

When all is said and done, I have spun To the 5 Boroughs at least 30
times while working on some of the most rewarding and enjoyable
creative work of my life in the past couple weeks, while visiting a
city I love, and seeing people I missed. The album has become
intrinsically linked to these experiences-- from my movie premiere this
week to the surreal tour of the Manhattan Mormon Temple last week. The
little number at the top of this piece reflects little of personal
relation to the record. It's an arbitrary guide to how I would expect
people to gauge the intent of this review. I will listen to this album
for years to come. You might. Or not. It depends on your own complex
web of past interaction with the Beastie Boys, linked memories to the
music, or preconceived notion of how hip or not it is to listen to them
in 2004.

Though I would fail to quantify the comparative "quality" of such
albums, as I said before, I love Carl & The Passions as much as Pet
Sounds. Divorcing the lives and backstory from the recorded product of
a musical artist equates to making movies without characters. The sixth
Beastie Boys album holds much more intrigue than some young dudes with
bedhead thinking they're going to evolve rock and roll. I've ended up
listening to it more than any other release this year. (Hey, that would
make a great pull-quote for the Nasty Little Man presskit. You can add
an exclamation point, Steve.)


This process has become unexciting and routine, which is why I bid the
world of music writing farewell. Explaining why I love a record in the
confines of its production, lyrics and instrumental "tightness" without
detailing the first time I heard the band's song drifting from bowling
alley in Poland or whatever confounds me. More power to those who
discover new music from this site. I've figured out where I stand at
this point, as have the readers. Like the Beastie Boys, I could
continue to crank out divisive pieces of writing here until I go gray.
I have more interesting stories to tell.

-Brent DiCrescenzo, June 15th, 2004
 
Guzim said:
Read Pitchfork's review of Rilo Kiley's 'Take-Offs & Landings'. The reviewer gave it a bad score because two Rilo Kiley songs were in Dawson's Creek even though those songs are not on the album.
[edit] Never mind.[/edit]
 
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