Zerodoppler
Member
Francois the Great said:
The loading screen has great looking water. The ingame water looks like shit. I hope Revolution will be able to recreate the Spaceworld FMV sequence of Waverace in realtime. I was floored when I saw that.
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What does a "truly next-generation" Nintendo game look like?
- Thread starter Speevy
- Start date
The loading screen has great looking water. The ingame water looks like shit. I hope Revolution will be able to recreate the Spaceworld FMV sequence of Waverace in realtime. I was floored when I saw that.
Ninja Scooter
Member
i don't get where the concern is coming from. Nintendo has stuff that looks just as good as some of the best looking games this gen, or is at the very least in the same ballpark. Zelda TP, Wind Waker, Smash Bros, Metroid Prime 1 and 2, Pikmin are all fantastic looking games graphically. Like any of the other huge companies out there (Konami, Sony, EA, MS, Capcom, Midway, ect...) that output a ton of games, you're going to get varying levels of graphic quality. Some look dated (pokemon GC titles), some look middle of the road (1080, waverace, Mario Kart, Mario sports) while some look fantastic (Metroid Prime, Zelda)
Okay, so everyone was all psyched because of all those Toy Story level graphics we were supposedly going to be seeing. They were not exactly delivered as the hardware apparently just hasnt gotten there yet, or devs have yet to utilize this power. I've heard many say it won't be until next gen.
What I'm getting at is that I'm finding this all odd because here we have people saying we have reached Nintendo's graphical style pinnacle. The thing is that many Nintendo games run in the same vein of style as Toy Story. So while some think we've reached the limit, others seem to think it won't be coming for quite awhile. I'm one of the later.
What I'm getting at is that I'm finding this all odd because here we have people saying we have reached Nintendo's graphical style pinnacle. The thing is that many Nintendo games run in the same vein of style as Toy Story. So while some think we've reached the limit, others seem to think it won't be coming for quite awhile. I'm one of the later.
APF said:Or alternately, goes for the exact opposite. Okami isn't impressive, graphically?
Monsters, Inc. wasn't impressive on a technical level? IMO there's still a lot of things artists and programmers can do with cartoony or otherwise non-photorealistic settings. I think what's necessary (to "impress") is not striving for realism per-se, so much as trying to express the richness of the real world in other ways, in order to keep the un-real visually interesting and compelling.
I agree a game like Okami is impressive, yeah, but in that case we can just make it easy and say "games with great art direction" and be crazy subjective like that. I was trying to make a case about using realistic visuals, because we have a reality to compare it to, as well as realistic games in the same genre. Not that Metroid Prime is set in our world and a prime example of realism, but it was the best example I could think of.
MrAngryFace
Banned
Okami is only impressive if you like that style of art, which is why art direction isnt a good representation of whats impressive for a system.
I think it looks dumb. So there ya go.
I think it looks dumb. So there ya go.
monchi-kun
Member
realism is just one direction graphics can go....style is the other (ie Okami). With games like Gears of War, FF7 tech Demo I can always say "Oh, i see how they did this. better lighting and higher resolution models. But with a game like Okami i go "How the fuck did they pull this off?"
realism doesn't bring about the sense of wonder anymore as much as stylistic games are doing in this generation (and hopefully the next).
realism doesn't bring about the sense of wonder anymore as much as stylistic games are doing in this generation (and hopefully the next).
Whichever way Nintendo decide to go you can bet your ass that their fanboys will do everything possible to defend the companies decision.
You can kind of see it now, Like when USA today stated that the Rev. would only be 3X as powerful than the GC, Ninty fans heralded them for being the only company that truly cared about gaming and the spitaling costs and development time it would take to produce these next gen games. And how they were ecstatic that Nintendo was making games that were all about the gameplay instead of superficial things like graphics.
But once they heard that the "3X the power of the GC" statement may not have been true, and that the Revolution may indeed be in the same ballpark, in power, as its competition. Their view suddenly changed to, "Nintendo understands the importance of graphics and will invest just as much money to insure that their console is not left behind as far as power is concerned".
One thing is for sure though, Nintendo has by far the most loyal fanbase around and will stick by them no matter what decision Nintendo makes. The only problem is that maybe that's not always teh best thing for a company. If the companies feedback is almost always positive from its fans no matter what they do, be it good or bad. That can often lead a company continuing down a destructive path that it could have altered had it had some real constructive criticism.
But then again, i'm an idiot so what do i know.
You can kind of see it now, Like when USA today stated that the Rev. would only be 3X as powerful than the GC, Ninty fans heralded them for being the only company that truly cared about gaming and the spitaling costs and development time it would take to produce these next gen games. And how they were ecstatic that Nintendo was making games that were all about the gameplay instead of superficial things like graphics.
But once they heard that the "3X the power of the GC" statement may not have been true, and that the Revolution may indeed be in the same ballpark, in power, as its competition. Their view suddenly changed to, "Nintendo understands the importance of graphics and will invest just as much money to insure that their console is not left behind as far as power is concerned".
One thing is for sure though, Nintendo has by far the most loyal fanbase around and will stick by them no matter what decision Nintendo makes. The only problem is that maybe that's not always teh best thing for a company. If the companies feedback is almost always positive from its fans no matter what they do, be it good or bad. That can often lead a company continuing down a destructive path that it could have altered had it had some real constructive criticism.
But then again, i'm an idiot so what do i know.
Musashi Wins!
FLAWLESS VICTOLY!
So...should they just go the way of the other 2 companies? I mean, I'm always first in line (maybe second) to criticize N for not doing things that would make me happier but now that Sega is gone (I don't care what you say, their gone) their the only big player left somewhat intact from the pre-Playstation era of gaming. They should be different, even when it bothers me.
UltraMarioMan
Member
I'd like it to be known I NEVER believed the 3X power thing.Any1 said:Whichever way Nintendo decide to go you can bet your ass that their fanboys will do everything possible to defend the companies decision.
You can kind of see it now, Like when USA today stated that the Rev. would only be 3X as powerful than the GC, Ninty fans heralded them for being the only company that truly cared about gaming and the spitaling costs and development time it would take to produce these next gen games. And how they were ecstatic that Nintendo was making games that were all about the gameplay instead of superficial things like graphics.
But once they heard that the "3X the power of the GC" statement may not have been true, and that the Revolution may indeed be in the same ballpark, in power, as its competition. Their view suddenly changed to, "Nintendo understands the importance of graphics and will invest just as much money to insure that their console is not left behind as far as power is concerned".
One thing is for sure though, Nintendo has by far the most loyal fanbase around and will stick by them no matter what decision Nintendo makes. The only problem is that maybe that's not always teh best thing for a company. If the companies feedback is almost always positive from its fans no matter what they do, be it good or bad. That can often lead a company continuing down a destructive path that it could have altered had it had some real constructive criticism.
But then again, i'm an idiot so what do i know.
Azure Dream
Member
I thought HAL had an excellent interpretation of how many of the Nintendo properties should look _this_ generation, with Super Smash Bros. Melee. I was very disappointed afterward when Nintendo seemed to disagree, and pushed for a very simplistic look for several of their properties, most notably the Mario series.
Recent games seem to have improved on that (Twilight Princess absolutely), but I remain wary, to be honest. I know gameplay is king, but I wish Nintendo would spend more time on the polish like they are with Twilight, it really makes all the difference sometimes. When Mario looked down at FLUDD in a _pre-rendered_ cinema sequence in the ending of Sunshine, and you could see the gap in his neck where polygons were missing that they didn't even bother to just temporarily patch for that one major shot, even though it did not have to affect the in-game polymodel... that's just kind of what a lot of Nintendo games have felt like this gen, sometimes.
Recent games seem to have improved on that (Twilight Princess absolutely), but I remain wary, to be honest. I know gameplay is king, but I wish Nintendo would spend more time on the polish like they are with Twilight, it really makes all the difference sometimes. When Mario looked down at FLUDD in a _pre-rendered_ cinema sequence in the ending of Sunshine, and you could see the gap in his neck where polygons were missing that they didn't even bother to just temporarily patch for that one major shot, even though it did not have to affect the in-game polymodel... that's just kind of what a lot of Nintendo games have felt like this gen, sometimes.
John Harker
Definitely doesn't make things up as he goes along.
MetaKnight
Banned
And to think that dink Speevy banned me for supposed stupidity.
Nintendo will be fine. The Rev should be about as powerful as the 360, in about the same way the GameCube is about as powerful as the regular Xbox.
I can say this with some confidence because history has shown us that both Microsoft and Sony "inflate" their preliminary numbers, and Nintendo has always given out lowball or more realistic numbers. When the initial specs came out for the GC compared to the PS2, it looked at first glance like the GC would be blown out of the water (if I recall, something like 12mil polys vs 100mil polys), but in the end the GameCube was obviously the more powerful system.
It also helped that the GC came out a year after the PS2. No matter how powerful the Xbox 360 or the Revolution turns out to be, the 360 will be almost a year old by the time the Revolution gets here, and newer hardware always has some sort of advantage over older hardware.
The GameCube proved that Nintendo knows how to design powerful hardware. It's just the media format restricted how developers could use it. (Also, there were some shit developers who couldn't program for GameCube if their lives depended on it. Believe me, I know.) I just feel that if the controller is the "revolutionary" in the way that I think it's going to be, then we're all going to like the system anyway.
I can say this with some confidence because history has shown us that both Microsoft and Sony "inflate" their preliminary numbers, and Nintendo has always given out lowball or more realistic numbers. When the initial specs came out for the GC compared to the PS2, it looked at first glance like the GC would be blown out of the water (if I recall, something like 12mil polys vs 100mil polys), but in the end the GameCube was obviously the more powerful system.
It also helped that the GC came out a year after the PS2. No matter how powerful the Xbox 360 or the Revolution turns out to be, the 360 will be almost a year old by the time the Revolution gets here, and newer hardware always has some sort of advantage over older hardware.
The GameCube proved that Nintendo knows how to design powerful hardware. It's just the media format restricted how developers could use it. (Also, there were some shit developers who couldn't program for GameCube if their lives depended on it. Believe me, I know.) I just feel that if the controller is the "revolutionary" in the way that I think it's going to be, then we're all going to like the system anyway.