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[IntelliHeath]

Stock is considered a tournament option?

For tournament scenes, yes. Have you seen any time matches (without stocks) or coin matches at tournament scene? I seriously doubt it. I'm pretty sure that the players at tournament scene would have huge meltdowns when they found out that they removed the stocks options out of the game.

 

[emb]

For tournament scenes, yes. Have you seen any time matches (without stocks) or coin matches at tournament scene? I seriously doubt it. I'm pretty sure that the players at tournament scene would have huge meltdowns when they found out that they removed the stocks options out of the game.

That's like saying that if they removed jumping from the game, it would be done to nerf competitive play. It would be an active decision to make the game all around worse. Yes tournaments use stocks. So do all the casual players I've ever met (including me from the moment I found the options, long before I ever wanted to be really competitive).

 

[User 73706]

Just food for thought: while I know SSB4 isn't shaping up to be a "swan song" for the series or anything similar (see other franchise "endgame" titles like Halo Reach, GTAV for the 360/PS3, debatably Ghost Trick for the DS, etc.), the fact that it'll probably be Sakurai's last game for a while so he must can recover has me thinking it's going to affect the roster. Not in a bad way by any means - but all of the newcomer's we've seen so far are just shaping up to be so damn refined, and there have already been a lot of unexpectedly awesome heavy-hitters from both a gameplay and community standpoint. The fact that it might be a while (again) before we see another Smash Bros. has me thinking: just who the hell are they going to add in SSB5? It seems to me like they're dedicating a lot of time to refining clones and newcomers alike this go-around, so I have no idea where they'd even begin getting in new roster choices for the next installment.

I'm almost expecting a Pokemon situation where the even-numbered gens focus on revolution and expansion while the odd-numbered gens focus on evolution and refinement, just reversed.

For tournament scenes, yes. Have you seen any time matches (without stocks) or coin matches at tournament scene? I seriously doubt it. I'm pretty sure that the players at tournament scene would have huge meltdowns when they found out that they removed the stocks options out of the game.

I think what he's saying is that Stock matches are such a quintessential part of Smash that it'd be unlikely they be removed in any way - and if they did, it probably wouldn't be just to remove a sense of competition, considering Stock matches are just as popular in causal groups as they are competitive.

 

[R0ckman]

That sounds more like the case. They did say they wouldn't use Classic Sonic again after Generations, if I recall correctly. Which is a damn shame :/

Where did you get your avatar from? I'd like to see the whole piece. Thanks.

I was always surprised they didn't do this in Brawl. Such a missed opportunity.

Not possible. His death would need to be immediate when he hits the "dead zone" so it would need to be once the animation triggers for him. Mega Man's death animation is just an attachment to the crash effect. Sonic's would be prolonging it before he would return to the stage, so it would be an extension. The dying sound would work, but would get drowned out by the crashing effect most likely.

EDIT: Actually there is like a 0.0001% chance that Pit will say "I'm done for..." when he is KO'd in Brawl but you can barely hear it. So I guess the Sonic death tune could work.

 

[Dr. Buni]

Where did you get your avatar from? I'd like to see the whole piece. Thanks.

Not sure who the artist is.

 

[emb]

Just food for thought: while I know SSB4 isn't shaping up to be a "swan song" for the series or anything similar (see other franchise "endgame" titles like Halo Reach, GTAV for the 360/PS3, debatably Ghost Trick for the DS, etc.), the fact that it'll probably be Sakurai's last game for a while so he must can recover has me thinking it's going to affect the roster. Not in a bad way by any means - but all of the newcomer's we've seen so far are just shaping up to be so damn refined, and there have already been a lot of unexpectedly awesome heavy-hitters from both a gameplay and community standpoint. The fact that it might be a while (again) before we see another Smash Bros. has me thinking: just who the hell are they going to add in SSB5? It seems to me like they're dedicating a lot of time to refining clones and newcomers alike this go-around, so I have no idea where they'd even begin getting in new roster choices for the next installment.

I definitely don't think they'll ever run out of characters. At worst they'll just have to lower some standards for how important the playable characters had to have been. I think starting with Brawl and going forward, the first place to look for potential roster additions is going to be the assist trophies. We've already seen Little Mac rise up. Skull Kid would make a great character. Waluigi, Ashley, even Starfy could work. Isaac, Samurai Goroh from Brawl too, all good starting points. The same would apply to Melee trophies, where we saw Pit, Meta Knight, Wario, Diddy Kong (among others I'm sure) get promotions. Beyond the notable trophies, they could even reach down deep and start making random Mario/Zelda/Metroid enemies into characters. Dozens and dozens of Pokemon could work if only they mattered. Same for FE characters. Etc etc.

 

[R0ckman]

Not sure who the artist is.

This pic is AWESOME, thanks. Two of my favorite characters in the game squaring off.

 

[Dr. Buni]

This pic is AWESOME, thanks. Two of my favorite characters in the game squaring off.

They are my two favorite newcomers as well. Really hoping Villager has a female alt, I would love to main her (but if there is no alt, I will still likely play as him).

 

[theprodigy]

How do y'all felt if Sakurai decided to nerf competitively matches/tournaments by removing stock matches from the options? (It's unlikely to happens but just what if?)

why would Sakurai remove the most common game type again?

 

[NeonZ]

I disagree. If I tend to get killed four times before I can kill them four times, I'll still probably lose a time match. SD counting helps a bit, but I think the skill gap would still carry over.

That's true for 1 vs 1 matches, but in 4p melee free for all timed matches seem to allow much more variation than stock ones. At least that's what I've noticed.

 

[Shadow Hog]

Clean (well, other than lewd Pikachu):

Leave BBA Mega man out of this, Shun

Oh man, Bad Box Art Mega Man has to be an alt color now. It'd be so awesome. Don't bother changing his face or giving him a pistol, just give him the goofy shoulder pads and such.

Does this means that Megaman will not die bouncing on the screen or turning into a star ?

I'm pretty sure both he and Bowser just do a death flash off the top of the screen simply because turning into a star in a closed space like this would look pretty awful.

Most indoor stages which still have that are implied to be gargantuan expanses, like Brinstar/Brinstar Depths, second phase of Castle Siege, etc., so there's ample space back there for the character to fly off into. The walls enclosing this Punch-Out!! arena seem very close to the foreground, in comparison, so seeing characters pull a Team Rocket and blast off again would similarly look too close to the foreground to be believable.

(Actually it looks pretty dumb in Castle Siege, too, looking at it. Then again, never did really care for that stage, if only because the transitions from phase to phase were pretty lazy.)

I think Sonic should have an unique "dying" animation too (maybe when is vertical K.O'd), Something like this:

I was just thinking this, too. Only from falling off the bottom of the arena, though.

 

[IntelliHeath]

why would Sakurai remove the most common game type again?

I was trying to spark a BIG IF discussion about it, but not as I would expected it to be gone.

 

[theprodigy]

I was trying to spark a BIG IF discussion about it, but not as I would expected it to be gone.

well let's see:

For tournament scenes, yes. Have you seen any time matches (without stocks) or coin matches at tournament scene? I seriously doubt it. I'm pretty sure that the players at tournament scene would have huge meltdowns when they found out that they removed the stocks options out of the game.

as if these meltdowns would be exclusive to tournament players, or even that proportionally more complaints would come from them
if anything, it would hit casual players harder, since tournaments could just enforce a "first to x number of deaths loses" rule, or play 1v1 time matches that make SDs -2 points

That's true for 1 vs 1 matches, but in 4p melee free for all timed matches seem to allow much more variation than stock ones. At least that's what I've noticed.

ehhhh kind of
if you would be last in stock matches, you'd still be last in time matches, but 2nd/3rd could conceivably score some timely kills and take 1st instead

of course, this only really applies if the players are relatively close to begin with

 

[Ezalc]

When does Yoshi's Island for 3DS come out again? I'm guessing we'll see Yoshi again during that time.

 

[Fandangox]

EDIT: Actually there is like a 0.0001% chance that Pit will say "I'm done for..." when he is KO'd in Brawl but you can barely hear it. So I guess the Sonic death tune could work.

Oh man didn't know that. That's neat.

 

[DJIzana]

When does Yoshi's Island for 3DS come out again? I'm guessing we'll see Yoshi again during that time.

Next week. The 14th.

 

[Tan]

When does Yoshi's Island for 3DS come out again? I'm guessing we'll see Yoshi again during that time.

Next Friday... and.. I can't find a japanese release date?

 

[DJIzana]

Next Friday... and.. I can't find a japanese release date?

They don't get it until summer or something ridiculous.

 

[DaBoss]

Next Friday... and.. I can't find a japanese release date?

Summer 2014

 

[Kriken]

I think Sonic should have an unique "dying" animation too (maybe when is vertical K.O'd), Something like this:

That would be awesome for a falling off the stage death

 

[BGBW]

Maybe Little Mac could go pink as he is KO'd?

 

[Zalman]

I think Sonic should have an unique "dying" animation too (maybe when is vertical K.O'd), Something like this:

I like the idea, but I don't think it would flow well with the gameplay. Even a few seconds can get irritating in the long run, I think. Mega Man's death animation doesn't slow things down, at least.

 

[PaperFlame]

It comes back to that friendly for everyone thing, right? In a time match, everybody gets to play to the end, no matter their skill level and regardless of if they're just spawning and getting killed dead right away. On a stock-based modes, lesser players may be out in the first 2 minutes and may have to sit for another 3 or 4 waiting for the match to finish - they'd spend more time watching than playing.

You can also camp in stock battle, as in you can run away and let other people fight each other, this would give you a high chance to win because to win in stocks is to be the last one standing.

In time match you're forced to kill each other because to win in time match it's about how many kills you do instead of how long you last.

Stock Match is great for 1 vs 1, but time match is way better and more fair if it's more than 2 players playing the game.

 

[Dr. Buni]

I like the idea, but I don't think it would flow well with the gameplay. Even a few seconds can get irritating in the long run, I think. Mega Man's death animation doesn't slow things down, at least.

I understand the concern, but I think it could work perfectly without interfering with the flow of the gameplay. They would just have to make the animation a bit faster than in the Sonic games.

 

[Fidelis Hodie]

Stock is considered a tournament option?

I've never played anything but stock since 64. No way it could ever leave.

 

[georly]

Oh man didn't know that. That's neat.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgQcC9p9hP4 holy crap it's true

 

[CriterionDog]

Man you guys, don't joke about my precious stock option being removed. My brother, best friend and I use stock all the time. We almost never do timed matches. lol

 

[Shadow Hog]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgQcC9p9hP4 holy crap it's true

Shame there's no better example video of this than that off-camera, barely-audible garbage.

No offense meant to you, of course; I checked, that's literally the best there is. This is a colossal failure on the YouTube community's part.

 

[Green Mamba]

Thankfully now that Nintendo's localizers have been reacquainted with Kid Icarus with Uprising it should be properly translated as "I'm finished." That always bugged me in Brawl.

 

[theprodigy]

You can also camp in stock battle, as in you can run away and let other people fight each other, this would give you a high chance to win because to win in stocks is to be the last one standing.

In time match you're forced to kill each other because to win in time match it's about how many kills you do instead of how long you last.

Stock Match is great for 1 vs 1, but time match is way better and more fair if it's more than 2 players playing the game.

it changes playstyles, but it doesn't affect results as much
especially if items are already on

 

[Kriken]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgQcC9p9hP4 holy crap it's true

That's pretty cool, but there needs to be a better video of this made

 

[georly]

Shame there's no better example video of this than that off-camera, barely-audible garbage.

No offense meant to you, of course; I checked, that's literally the best there is. This is a colossal failure on the YouTube community's part.

That's pretty cool, but there needs to be a better video of this made

Yup, found the best I could. I dont have capture equipment, or i'd do it myself, i guess. I can try doing it w/ dolphin, but I don't know what software to use to capture it. I remember Fraps back in my Wow playing days of like... 2005. Don't know what's used now.

 

[Dr. Buni]

That's pretty cool, but there needs to be a better video of this made

I play Brawl on Dolphin, so I could try to make a better video, if someone tell me the name of a decent (free or at least with trial) software to record videos.

 

[Fidelis Hodie]

You can also camp in stock battle, as in you can run away and let other people fight each other, this would give you a high chance to win because to win in stocks is to be the last one standing.

In time match you're forced to kill each other because to win in time match it's about how many kills you do instead of how long you last.

Stock Match is great for 1 vs 1, but time match is way better and more fair if it's more than 2 players playing the game.

No way, no how. In any 4 player free for all I've played, if someone is blatantly camping like that, everyone swarms to the player to make them stop. It's a part of the game. Timed has never done it for me in any sense and never will. Stocks foreva.

 

[SmithnCo]

No way, no how. In any 4 player free for all I've played, if someone is blatantly camping like that, everyone swarms to the player to make them stop. It's a part of the game. Timed has never done it for me in any sense and never will. Stocks foreva.

Yeah, usually people keep an eye on the stocks and will go after who has the highest and take them out.

 

[georly]

No way, no how. In any 4 player free for all I've played, if someone is blatantly camping like that, everyone swarms to the player to make them stop. It's a part of the game. Timed has never done it for me in any sense and never will. Stocks foreva.

Yup. I agree. Time also has the issue of being robbed of kills. I hate doing all of the damage on someone only to have someone throw an item from across the screen and get a hit, or shoot an arrow and it hits the person as they're flying off, and then THEY get the kill even though they didn't deserve it. I much prefer to play w/ self preservation in mind than landing the last blow.

Edit: THAT SAID, time is *REALLY* good when you play against people who are not so good at smash, especially little children. That way, nobody gets bored when they kill themselves 4 times in a row and are just sitting there waiting for the match to end. A 5 year old does not have the patience to wait for the match to end after they lose all their stock.

 

[Kriken]

I play Brawl on Dolphin, so I could try to make a better video, if someone tell me the name of a decent (free or at least with trial) software to record videos.

I don't really remember how good it is, but Hypercam 2 is free and without that annoying "Unregistered Hypercam 2" watermark you'd see in bad YT videos

I would be tempted to try it myself when I get Brawl back, but the odds are low and my recording device bloats the size of the capture footage

 

[Fidelis Hodie]

Yup. I agree. Time also has the issue of being robbed of kills. I hate doing all of the damage on someone only to have someone throw an item from across the screen and get a hit, or shoot an arrow and it hits the person as they're flying off, and then THEY get the kill even though they didn't deserve it. I much prefer to play w/ self preservation in mind than landing the last blow.

Edit: THAT SAID, time is *REALLY* good when you play against people who are not so good at smash, especially little children. That way, nobody gets bored when they kill themselves 4 times in a row and are just sitting there waiting for the match to end. A 5 year old does not have the patience to wait for the match to end after they lose all their stock.

Dang, that's true. I never thought about that. When I have new players playing (which is happening a lot more with the advent of Project M) I may give that a try until their acclimated to the mechanics at least.

 

[theprodigy]

Dang, that's true. I never thought about that. When I have new players playing (which is happening a lot more with the advent of Project M) I may give that a try until their acclimated to the mechanics at least.

oh yeah
kill stealing arguably makes better players more able to dominate everyone

 

[DaBoss]

oh yeah
kill stealing arguably makes better players more able to dominate everyone

Really?

I can't tell if you're being serious.

In case you're not, kill stealing > losing all stocks and having to wait.

Only for the scenario you're not playing with other experienced players.

 

[theprodigy]

Really?

I can't tell if you're being serious.

In case you're not, kill stealing > losing all stocks and having to wait.

Only for the scenario you're not playing with other experienced players.

having to wait has no bearing on my comment, I don't know why you brought it up
unless domination now includes forcing other players to sit out

 

[DaBoss]

having to wait has no bearing on my comment, I don't know why you brought it up
unless domination now includes forcing other players to sit out

Your previous post seems to indicate that stocks is the better format than timed for people who don't play Smash much.

 

[emb]

I think there's two different ideas kinda going around here. One is the contention that timed matches makes weaker players better able to win. The other is that time let's worse players have more fun, because you don't have to sit out once you lose your stocks. I think the former is what theprodigy meant, the latter is what DaBoss is thinking. I could be totally off base here though. (Actually I think the confusion is just coming from what part of the quoted post theprodigy is responding to)

 

[JCX]

Removing stock isn't even worth discussing because it won't happen. The outrage would be tripping x 1000000

 

[Ezalc]

So we've been getting like two characters each month right? Usually two vets, guess Yoshi will be next week and then after that somebody else. Any other game or anniversary in the month of March that could lend itself to a vet?

 

[Loco4Coco]

As the only person on Earth that plays Coin matches, I'll be a bit disappointed if they removed that game mode unless they replace it with something else.

 

[emb]

So we've been getting like two characters each month right? Usually two vets, guess Yoshi will be next week and then after that somebody else. Any other game or anniversary in the month of March that could lend itself to a vet?

Wait, do people really think Yoshi is coming back? I think it's pretty clear at this point that he's been cut.

 

[Loco4Coco]

So we've been getting like two characters each month right? Usually two vets, guess Yoshi will be next week and then after that somebody else. Any other game or anniversary in the month of March that could lend itself to a vet?

Conker Bad Fur Day was released 13 years ago today, Conker to be confirmed playable tonight.

Spoiler

I wish

 

[Shadow Hog]

As the only person on Earth that plays Coin matches, I'll be a bit disappointed if they removed that game mode unless they replace it with something else.

Coin Mode cut, Bonus Mode revived

 

[Kriken]

As the only person on Earth that plays Coin matches, I'll be a bit disappointed if they removed that game mode unless they replace it with something else.

I must be from Mars then, us Martians would be severely disappointed if Smash 4 removes that feature