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[RiggyRob]

Exactly. When I saw it live I thought something was incredibly weird with his animation. It does indeed look like someone is controlling him. Still that shadow does look too big for playability but it could also confirm one of my worst fears. Special playable boss battles.

What ever the case it does seem there is something more than just hazard boss Ridley.

That's not a terrible idea IMO - you could make whoever has the Gamepad be the boss that controls the stage (item distribution, stage hazard appearances, speed of battle etc) as a 4 v 1 battle, could work for Master Hand/Crazy Hand/Tabuu, but it's less likely for Ridley/Rayquaza/Petey Piranha etc.

Edit:

What are the chances that at E3 we get a trailer announcing Ridley, then Dark Samus comes in and blasts him off the stage. "Dark Samus Consumes the Competition"

Spoiler

I'd accept a small delay for the inclusion of Dark Samus

Zero since Dark Samus's an Assist Trophy (see below).

 

[R0ckman]

Can Dark Samus be attacked? She looked wounded before she used Phazon Shield on Rock.

 

[Toxi]

Seeing Dark Samus as an Assist Trophy makes me sad. They showed what would be a good Down Special or Smash, and what would be a great Neutral Special

What could have been. :'(

They've gotta leave someone for Smash 5.

Dark samus looks rad

I think it is very likely that Dark Samus is in the category of assist trophies made up of characters who didn't quite make the cut for playable status. Considering that Little Mac made the jump up to full playable status this time, maybe Dark Samus will get her chance in the next generation of Smash Bros.

I want her playable so bad. ='( But at least we know that if she ever does become playable, Sakurai won't necessarily make her a Samus clone!

Man, Dark Samus looks ridiculously cool.

Seeing all the Dark Samus support in this thread is awesome. Hope this means a better chance next game.

Also, Smash 4 needs her theme.

Can Dark Samus be attacked? She looked wounded before she used Phazon Shield on Rock.

If you're talking about the slouch, Dark Samus does that all the time.

However, it would be weird if the trailer showed someone attacking an assist trophy immune to damage, so I err on yes.

 

[Hyperactivity]

If MM had been as big as OoT, like the first 3d game, Fierce Diety Link would be a possibility. As it stands, Im willing to avatar bet that Link's final smash isn't Fierce Diety Link

 

[Pop-O-Matic]

What do you guys think Sheik and Zero Suit Samus' Final Smashes will be? The Light Arrow doesn't make much sense now that Sheik and Zelda are separated.

Zero Suit Samus gets Monotone Monologue, which bores opponents to death, while Sheik gets another Landmaster.

 

[PfantzyPantz]

maaaaaaaan WW Link hyped up on Grandma's soup is unstoppable. He's the real deal, no other Link can compare. If you do manage to hurt him, he'll just whisk you away into the ocean and you'll drown. Done.

Then he'll take control of seagulls and make them eat your corpse, hiding all the evidence.

Also I love Link's new up air, feels/ flows alot better than his old one.

 

[Scooter155]

If MM had been as big as OoT, like the first 3d game, Fierce Diety Link would be a possibility. As it stands, Im willing to avatar bet that Link's final smash isn't Fierce Diety Link

But wouldn't it be awesome?

 

[Kyzon]

What do you guys think Sheik and Zero Suit Samus' Final Smashes will be? The Light Arrow doesn't make much sense now that Sheik and Zelda are separated.

Zero Suit Samus will talk about the baby. It instantly takes all of your opponent's stock for the next week.

Sheik will most likely use Sheikah magic like Impa did in Skyward Sword except more offensive than defensive.

 

[theprodigy]

Zero Suit Samus gets Monotone Monologue, which bores opponents to death, while Sheik gets another Landmaster.

.....that is a really uncreative avatar someone gave you

 

[Beelzebufo]

What do you guys think Sheik and Zero Suit Samus' Final Smashes will be? The Light Arrow doesn't make much sense now that Sheik and Zelda are separated.

I would expect a laser lasso grab into a rocket-boosted throw from ZSS.

Or: Call in the ship

 

[Kyzon]

That's not a terrible idea IMO - you could make whoever has the Gamepad be the boss that controls the stage (item distribution, stage hazard appearances, speed of battle etc) as a 4 v 1 battle, could work for Master Hand/Crazy Hand/Tabuu, but it's less likely for Ridley/Rayquaza/Petey Piranha etc.

Edit:
Zero since Dark Samus's an Assist Trophy (see below).

My reasoning be that Sakurai likes to mess with people.

ZSS is out................. Just kidding!
Palutena just a troph..... Nope Psuedo Palutena
Charizard and Mewt..... GRENINJA!

 

[RagnarokX]

I've already gone over many times why aLttP Link is the most superior Link of all. It's fact.

In terms of ability I'd give that title to Skyward Sword Link. He's got the most robust and agile moveset rather than TP Link's multiple win buttons.

In terms of story I'd pick Wind Waker Link because unlike almost every other Link he wasn't chosen by the gods. He was just some kid thrust into a bigger world and he earned his right to be the hero. Skyward Sword Link makes some pretty badass accomplishments, but his being manipulated by Zelda kinda knocks him down a bit.

I'd actually love to hear a debate on this subject.

Also I'd like to go all in and say that OG Link is the best, since he kills Ganon once and for all, and defeats his internal darkness in the sequel to lay claim to the full triforce. He's one of the few Links to appear in 2 mainline games (3 if he's the link from Link's Awakening too, which I believe he is), and he's got powers up the wazoo, with everything he gains in the first game, plus the items and spells from Zelda 2... guys is OP as heck.

Link's Awakening is ALttP Link.

OG Link: Zelda 1, Zelda 2
ALttP Link: ALttP, OoX, LA
OoT Link: OoT, MM
WW Link: WW, PH

 

[BGBW]

So it's combination of both then, more so TP. The colour palette for Smash 4 link is more vibrant than TP.

The vibrancy is because of the Smash 4 art style not inspiration from OoT Link. I mean you could say the colours were inspired by Four Swords Link with that logic.

I'd actually love to hear a debate on this subject.

Also I'd like to go all in and say that OG Link is the best, since he kills Ganon once and for all, and defeats his internal darkness in the sequel to lay claim to the full triforce. He's one of the few Links to appear in 2 mainline games (3 if he's the link from Link's Awakening too, which I believe he is), and he's got powers up the wazoo, with everything he gains in the first game, plus the items and spells from Zelda 2... guys is OP as heck.

Basically:

• Cleans up the mess left by the failure that is OoT Link.
• Beats a Triforce wielding Ganon with nothing but a packet of sherbet lemons and a bit of string. All other Links have required the assistance of the Triforce but this Link didn't.
• Goes off and saves two other lands and then defeats a newly resurrected Ganon. So he basically killed the bloke twice because he could. Should note that since it was the castle bound Triforce that sent him on these quests once again he did all this without it.
• Because he eradicated evil from the world the only thing left was to conquer the world of dreams.

 

[Toxi]

I was thinking, it'd be hilarious if there was a generic "retro" stage that had retro versions of the characters' themes and was filled with all sorts of 8 bit goodness, even for characters who were never 8 bit.

What are the chances that at E3 we get a trailer announcing Ridley, then Dark Samus comes in and blasts him off the stage. "Dark Samus Consumes the Competition"

Spoiler

I'd accept a small delay for the inclusion of Dark Samus

I'd accept a small delay for more characters period. I'm that sort of guy.

But since other people want this game to actually come out, I'm okay with anything. I have several decades left in me. I can play the waiting game for Smash 5.

 

[cosiant]

Can someone explain me the rules around betting avatars, it would be most appreciated.

 

[Troubled Bat]

Can someone explain me the rules around betting avatars, it would be most appreciated.

First rule: You have to be a member.

Spoiler

I'm just kidding.

 

[Pop-O-Matic]

Can someone explain me the rules around betting avatars, it would be most appreciated.

Rule 1: Never bet on DBZ

 

[RiggyRob]

Rule 1: Never bet on DBZ

Rule 2: Always bet on DBZ.

 

[RagnarokX]

The vibrancy is because of the Smash 4 art style not inspiration from OoT Link. I mean you could say the colours were inspired by Four Swords Link with that logic.


Basically:

• Cleans up the mess left by the failure that is OoT Link.
• Beats a Triforce wielding Ganon with nothing but a packet of sherbet lemons and a bit of string. All other Links have required the assistance of the Triforce but this Link didn't.
• Goes off and saves two other lands and then defeats a newly resurrected Ganon. So he basically killed the bloke twice because he could. Should note that since it was the castle bound Triforce that sent him on these quests once again he did all this without it.
• Because he eradicated evil from the world the only thing left was to conquer the world of dreams.

Well, if you're saying that the triforce being in the castle means Link did not have it in OoX and LA then by that same logic wouldn't Ganon also not have it because it was complete and outside his body? Skyward Sword Link by that same logic didn't use the triforce either, nor Wind Waker Link, nor Majora's Mask Link.

 

[Kyzon]

I was thinking, it'd be hilarious if there was a generic "retro" stage that had retro versions of the characters' themes and was filled with all sorts of 8 bit goodness, even for characters who were never 8 bit.

I'd accept a small delay for more characters period. I'm that sort of guy.

But since other people want this game to actually come out, I'm okay with anything. I have several decades left in me. I can play the waiting game for Smash 5.

Have hope for Nintendo's Free DLC, and/or Monster Expansion ala New Super Luigi U

 

[foxuzamaki]

Ah, makes sense, I've still not gotten around to playing it. (and yeah, I know everyone hates it, but I'll probably take it for a spin at some point anyway.)

Not everyone hates it, dont worry.

 

[Scooter155]

In terms of ability I'd give that title to Skyward Sword Link. He's got the most robust and agile moveset rather than TP Link's multiple win buttons.

In terms of story I'd pick Wind Waker Link because unlike almost every other Link he wasn't chosen by the gods. He was just some kid thrust into a bigger world and he earned his right to be the hero. Skyward Sword Link makes some pretty badass accomplishments, but his being manipulated by Zelda kinda knocks him down a bit.



Link's Awakening is ALttP Link.

OG Link: Zelda 1, Zelda 2
ALttP Link: ALttP, OoX, LA
OoT Link: OoT, MM
WW Link: WW, PH

The vibrancy is because of the Smash 4 art style not inspiration from OoT Link. I mean you could say the colours were inspired by Four Swords Link with that logic.


Basically:

• Cleans up the mess left by the failure that is OoT Link.
• Beats a Triforce wielding Ganon with nothing but a packet of sherbet lemons and a bit of string. All other Links have required the assistance of the Triforce but this Link didn't.
• Goes off and saves two other lands and then defeats a newly resurrected Ganon. So he basically killed the bloke twice because he could. Should note that since it was the castle bound Triforce that sent him on these quests once again he did all this without it.
• Because he eradicated evil from the world the only thing left was to conquer the world of dreams.

Wow, Oracle and Awakening are the LttP Link? I did not know that. Certainly a point in his favor.

 

[Fandangox]

Oh I just realized.

ZSS's new recovery is Wolf's Up B only in a single direction.

Hold me

Doesn't really mean much honestly. Sonic and Megaman seem to have virtually the same Up Special. Squirtle's Neutral was similar to Mario's F.L.U.D.D too.

 

[Cow Mengde]

Wait, Neogaf supports webm now!?

 

[foxuzamaki]

I think Mewtwo Y would be a better fit and it is the one that has been promoted more.

This is all I've talked about so far

Greninja: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=107506424&postcount=10392

Sheik (WebM only): http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=107547197&postcount=11614

Villager: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=107651777&postcount=13111

Pit: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=107549729&postcount=11681

Regarding fall speed (WebM only): http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=107563442&postcount=11933

New moves with it being straight foward:

DK's Dash Attack is now a Roll

Long overdue. Doesn't seem like it will change much. GIF is at 0.5x speed.

Is it just me or does DK's fur look really good here?

 

[Kyzon]

Doesn't really mean much honestly. Sonic and Megaman seem to have virtually the same Up Special. Squirtle's Neutral was similar to Mario's F.L.U.D.D too.

Pit's power of flight is now Fire Fox/Angel as well.

 

[Revven]

Does it twice in the Direct:

Jesus that looks awkward and the posture doesn't even make any sense. It seems as though it was changed arbitrarily -- I can't see how that makes the move have any more range than the old animation.

(yes I'm aware this is the Melee animation but they're the same in both games, the only differences are the sword length -- Link's Master Sword in Brawl is slightly longer which gives it more range)

The only reason I can think of changing it is to give it more horizontal range, around where his shoulders/head his just as he's thrusting the sword upwards. But even still, the purpose of the move was for juggling characters in the first place. It doesn't need any horizontal range at all. I guess you could argue hitbox duration as well but look at the above .gif of the old up aerial for Melee, it already lasts more than 30 frames! And I'm pretty sure it's the same duration in Brawl.

Just seems like a really unnecessary aesthetic change and frankly, it looks ugly. It's on-par with some Smash 64 attack animations like Donkey Kong's back air -- it's soooo static and everything. It's like the up air is trying to be both a sex kick and a regular aerial.

I hope it changes, but if they're this far in development and they have to release this summer it seems really unlikely though.

 

[Pop-O-Matic]

Wait, Neogaf supports webm now!?

No, but a lot of people have been making plug-ins/scripts for it.

 

[Toxi]

This music had better be somewhere in the 3DS version.

Have hope for Nintendo's Free DLC, and/or Monster Expansion ala New Super Luigi U

I'd love that.

 

[RiggyRob]

Wait, Neogaf supports webm now!?

No, people are embedding gifs into the link for a webm though.

 

[Boomstick (Coffee Crazy)]

Man I really would have loved to see Dark Samus as playable. I mean we have like a few of her moves down already, the rest are fairly easy to derive.

Neutral B- Phazon Burst- Pretty much exactly what is shown by DS as her first attack.
Side B- Phazon Missle- Just the normal missle that samus has but flies slower and does more damage.
Up B- Phazon Pillar- DS summons a pillar of phazon below her which she uses to lift herself up. If on the ground, the pillar stays there for a few seconds before being destroyed. It can also be destroyed by other fighters. DS can't use this ability while more than 1 pillar is already out.
Down B- Phazon Shield- Pretty much acts like as shown in the trailer.
Final Smash- Either transform her into Metroid Prime Final Form, or have her go into her final phase in MP-Echoes

Spoiler

in which she becomes translucent and can't be hurt by anything except Phazon.

 

[Kyzon]

This music had better be somewhere in the 3DS version.


I'd love that.

Speaking of which, who here would be for Nintendo upgrading this core game throughout the lifetime of the Wii U and 3DS?

I don't want to say like Capcom does with SSFIV, butttttttttt kinda like Capcom does with SSFIV. Of course I'm talking about content. Not the nickel and diming that they do. So don't let that throw you off the idea. They shouldn't keep making new versions of the game and splitting up the fanbase, but continue contributing to what they have. I can understand maybe paying a few bucks for a roster expansion, and I wouldn't mind it as long as they do it like Neatherrealm does. You just won't be able to use the new guys unless you buy them.

Though in my fantasy world it would all be free, Nintendo is a company and new characters cost money and resources, so free isn't always the best option.


Thoughts? Thots?

 

[thechristoph]

Capcom item to summon Simon Belmont, Phoenix Wright, Amatastu, Ryu and Arthur is something I would love to see.

Unsure if subtle joke....

There haven't been ANY hints about Konami, correct? I'd really love for Simon or Alucard to be playable, with the other as an assist along with various Castlevania critters.

 

[theprodigy]

Speaking of which, who here would be for Nintendo upgrading this core game throughout the lifetime of the Wii U and 3DS?

I don't want to say like Capcom does with SSFIV, butttttttttt kinda like Capcom does with SSFIV. Of course I'm talking about content. Not the nickel and diming that they do. So don't let that throw you off the idea. They shouldn't keep making new versions of the game and splitting up the fanbase, but continue contributing to what they have. I can understand maybe paying a few bucks for a roster expansion, and I wouldn't mind it as long as they do it like Neatherrealm does. You just won't be able to use the new guys unless you buy them.

Though in my fantasy world it would all be free, Nintendo is a company and new characters cost money and resources, so free isn't always the best option.


Thoughts? Thots?

maybe one upgrade like UMvC3?
lol

 

[Toxi]

Man I really would have loved to see Dark Samus as playable. I mean we have like a few of her moves down already, the rest are fairly easy to derive.

Neutral B- Phazon Burst- Pretty much exactly what is shown by DS as her first attack.
Side B- Phazon Missle- Just the normal missle that samus has but flies slower and does more damage.
Up B- Phazon Pillar- DS summons a pillar of phazon below her which she uses to lift herself up. If on the ground, the pillar stays there for a few seconds before being destroyed. It can also be destroyed by other fighters. DS can't use this ability while more than 1 pillar is already out.
Down B- Phazon Shield- Pretty much acts like as shown in the trailer.
Final Smash- Either transform her into Metroid Prime Final Form, or have her go into her final phase in MP-Echoes

Spoiler

in which she becomes translucent and can't be hurt by anything except Phazon.

Swap Phazon Missile for the Hyper Boost Ball (She uses it in both the Prime 2 elevator battle and in the final Aurora battle in Prime 3) and we're good. Maybe add a corruption mechanic of some kind.

I love the image of a Phazon Pillar just lifting her up imperiously above the rest of the cast.

 

[RiggyRob]

Speaking of which, who here would be for Nintendo upgrading this core game throughout the lifetime of the Wii U and 3DS?

I don't want to say like Capcom does with SSFIV, butttttttttt kinda like Capcom does with SSFIV. Of course I'm talking about content. Not the nickel and diming that they do. So don't let that throw you off the idea. They shouldn't keep making new versions of the game and splitting up the fanbase, but continue contributing to what they have. I can understand maybe paying a few bucks for a roster expansion, and I wouldn't mind it as long as they do it like Neatherrealm does. You just won't be able to use the new guys unless you buy them.

Though in my fantasy world it would all be free, Nintendo is a company and new characters cost money and resources, so free isn't always the best option.


Thoughts? Thots?

Sounds awful tbh - if they told you you were getting the complete Smash experience and then ended up making e.g. Bayonetta a DLC character but unusable to everyone who bought the base game, people would get mad. It's a cheap tactic to get more money out of people and it's very un-Nintendo.

Besides, there's probably 2-3 years left before the successors to 3DS and Wii U come out, I'd rather they spent that time making different games or preparing for the new consoles.

 

[Berordn]

Besides, there's probably 2-3 years left before the successors to 3DS and Wii U come out, I'd rather they spent that time making different games or preparing for the new consoles.

That could go both ways, probably. Sakurai leaves the team at Namco and they spend some time designing characters and assets for DLC that they use to hone their ideas for Smash... 6?

 

[SenorArdilla]

So with Tomodachi Life coming out in the US, how does everyone feel about Mii?

 

[Mariolee]

Rule 2: Always bet on DBZ.

Rule 3: Both of these rules are false.

Rule 4: All false rules are true.

 

[Boomstick (Coffee Crazy)]

Swap Phazon Missile for the Hyper Boost Ball (She uses it in both the Prime 2 elevator battle and in the final Aurora battle in Prime 3) and we're good. Maybe add a corruption mechanic of some kind.

I love the image of a Phazon Pillar just lifting her up imperiously above the rest of the cast.

Oh yeah that actually sounds pretty good. My only concern would be if it would too closely resemble Jigglypuff's Rollout attack. Otherwise, that sounds awesome.

 

[BGBW]

Well, if you're saying that the triforce being in the castle means Link did not have it in OoX and LA then by that same logic wouldn't Ganon also not have it because it was complete and outside his body? Skyward Sword Link by that same logic didn't use the triforce either, nor Wind Waker Link, nor Majora's Mask Link.

I don't recall the OoX games ever saying the Triforce went with Link. The intros show it being in a castle and warping him to his destination. I mean the fact that he will have to go back to said castle again to do the second adventure (depending on the order you do it in) and the Triforce is still there means I assume it stays there for the duration of both games. In essence he never actually owns the Triforce. At most he has a mark on his hand to say he is the hero, but he never needs the essence of courage to be courageous. And we can't rewrite the stories here, Ganon in aLttP is the owner of the full Triforce thus technically in the most powerful state he has ever been in. Big difference between it being in a castle in a different land who knows how many miles away and it being in the back room of your base which for all we know only appeared there with the death of Ganon.

 

[Kyzon]

maybe one upgrade like UMvC3?
lol

I could do one massive update.

Sounds awful tbh - if they told you you were getting the complete Smash experience and then ended up making e.g. Bayonetta a DLC character but unusable to everyone who bought the base game, people would get mad. It's a cheap tactic to get more money out of people and it's very un-Nintendo.

Besides, there's probably 2-3 years left before the successors to 3DS and Wii U come out, I'd rather they spent that time making different games or preparing for the new consoles.

I see your point though you seem to be thinking that Nintendo would do it like other companies. The very thought of DLC was said to be very un-Nintendo. Now they do it as they see fit, and it's for a fair price. Well other than New Super Mario Bros 2, but they take baby steps with everything.

Hell, they could do something like the newest Killer Instinct and have a free character per week so you could try them all out. First week that it's released though everyone is tryable for a trial so you can use who you want and if you like just get who you want.

There's so many ways to do it without being unfair to consumers. I'd trust them with that.

 

[Neiteio]

Just want to say how STOKED I am for Greninja. I raised two of them in Pokémon XY (including a Protean specimen with perfect IVs, thanks to the help of my fellow Gaffers), and not only is he one of the most versatile and fun Pokémon to use in XY (hence why something like one in five teams use him), he's just so COOL.

I love his color scheme -- navy blue and crème, with a dash of azure and a swirl of pink. He has a distinct silhouette with the Shinboi-style "tongue scarf," the squatting stance, bulky thighs, angular head, and splayed fingers and toes. And I love the way he can shape water into shurikens and swords. They walk that fine line between "badass" and "cute" (see the waterspout taunt and ninja pose he strikes up on the pole in the trailer). So hyped!!

 

[sonto340]

My reasoning be that Sakurai likes to mess with people.

ZSS is out................. Just kidding!
Palutena just a troph..... Nope Psuedo Palutena
Charizard and Mewt..... GRENINJA!

The first two sure.

Not once the whole time did I think that was mewtwo.
If it had been a purple glow, sure, but as soon as I saw it was blue, and doing ninja stuff it was incredibly obvious it wasn't Mewtwo.

 

[DisconnectD]

You edited your post, but thanks for saying "Wario-Man". I completely forgot.

It wasin't and yes.

It is a combination of WebMs and GIFs. It will show GIFs to those who don't have embedding WebMs and show WebMs to those who do.

I saw your tutorial for embedding webms but didn't notice anything about android? I did a Google search and didn't find anything. Do you know how to properly embed them on an android tablet perchance?

 

[Terrell]

The first two sure.

Not once the whole time did I think that was mewtwo.
If it had been a purple glow, sure, but as soon as I saw it was blue, and doing ninja stuff it was incredibly obvious it wasn't Mewtwo.

For me, when I heard soft water sound effects in the first visual, I knew it wasn't Mewtwo. But I'm not up on my Pokemon, so I wasn't sure who it could be.

Oh I just realized.

ZSS's new recovery is Wolf's Up B only in a single direction.

Hold me

Which stage of grief are you on? Cuz you should hale easy be grieving.

1 more down.

 

[emb]

The first two sure.

Not once the whole time did I think that was mewtwo.
If it had been a purple glow, sure, but as soon as I saw it was blue, and doing ninja stuff it was incredibly obvious it wasn't Mewtwo.

I kept thinking it was Mewtwo, but also noticing that the shape of the leg was off. For some reason I was thinking the model was just bad, rather than ever entertaining the thought that it could be any other character.

I think I'm desperate. ;_;

 

[foxuzamaki]

The first two sure.

Not once the whole time did I think that was mewtwo.
If it had been a purple glow, sure, but as soon as I saw it was blue, and doing ninja stuff it was incredibly obvious it wasn't Mewtwo.

Majority were pretty postive it was mewtwo until a certain point.

 

[Neiteio]

The first two sure.

Not once the whole time did I think that was mewtwo.
If it had been a purple glow, sure, but as soon as I saw it was blue, and doing ninja stuff it was incredibly obvious it wasn't Mewtwo.

He could've been charging up Swift (something Mewtwo was depicted doing in the movie), and blue and purple seem to be interchangeable colors for "psychic powers." Along with the alien-eseque appearance of his skin, still veiled in shadow, and the fact Mewtwo and Charizard squared off in the XY anime, it's easy to see how people were fooled, and how it may have been a Mewtwo bait-and-switch.

 

[SuperSah]

Who are we most and least excited to play as?

My most excited is Little Mac. His combos look satisfying and he's very techincal.

My least is Mega Man, he just seems so boring to use.