SpaceBridge
Member
Wait there's gay characters in Borderlands 2?
Gay community - "Why you will not see a gay lead character in a triple-A title".
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Daffy Duck
Member
How do you explain that story properly though to give it meaning other than leaving the majority players thinking "well that was awkward!".
Sexual preference has already been brought into gaming. The overwhelming majority of (AAA) games are designed for straight guys as the main audience.
"I don't see sexual orientation!"
Bedameister
Member
Well my Femshep was always homosexual.
I wouldn't mind a gay lead charakter in a AAA game but I think publishers a scared of any controversy so I think it will not happen to soon
I wouldn't mind a gay lead charakter in a AAA game but I think publishers a scared of any controversy so I think it will not happen to soon
akidnamededdy
Banned
And before him, Vamp.
If they're trying to push narrative then it can matter if they want to develop a game with that as a key character detail.
For something that doesn't give a damn about story they can be asexual robots for all it matters. As Probotector ended up showing.
I think there are a lot of protagonists who don't have defined sexualities simply because it's not a core component of the story/exposition, but they're assumed (and probably correctly so, more often than not) to be heterosexual. (Edit: And yes, there are a lot that are highlighted via love interests etc., which are not in the set I'm discussing).
And I think part of the "problem" with making a character gay "just because" is that we'll probably only know they are if attention is drawn to that fact simply because characters are given a default sexuality (we don't normally point out that characters/protagonists are straight, after all), which is what gets backlash from idiots/media 'controversy' brewing in the first place. As much as I'd love to see something subtle like a romantic interest I just don't think we'll get anything that 'subtle' for a long time because people will want to wave the marketing/image pom-poms about how 'progressive' they are by saying "SEE!? SEE WHAT WE DID WE'RE SO GREAT!!!" for years.
I personally don't give two shits about a character's ethnicity or sexuality or <other trait> unless it is part of the story, because that's the only point when it should matter, but it does matter otherwise because of the state of our society.
cj_iwakura
Member
Underplayed(and kind of used as marketing), but Hana Tsu-Vachel was, yes.
Far from AAA, though.
Garrett Hawke
Member
Yeeep. And sexuality is brought in a LOT as quite a few of these straight male characters have female love interests.
There are ways to say a character is straight without someone saying "wow, you're straight! :O"
Even if it's just the little things like one of their companions teasing them about a girl, or one of their friends trying to hook them up etc.
I can understand your response but you shouldn't make assumptions like that, you don't know him.
As for your response you me, your point seems valid but I also think that gay people should be presented properly on the medium, the "overly-gay extremely extravagant" character must not have a place in AAA games for people to recognize gay people as normal.
Same could be said about minorities, see the afro American woman in Deus Ex, ugh. She's not a lead character but it's still horrible.
Hades Hotgun
Banned
I don't see why we need gay/black/female characters in games.
I don't see why we need gay/black/female characters in movies.
I don't see why we need gay/black/female characters in books.
I don't see why we need gay/black/female characters on television.
If you would be uncomfortable with someone saying even one of these things, then you should be uncomfortable with someone saying any of these things.
I don't see why we need gay/black/female characters in movies.
I don't see why we need gay/black/female characters in books.
I don't see why we need gay/black/female characters on television.
If you would be uncomfortable with someone saying even one of these things, then you should be uncomfortable with someone saying any of these things.
Father_Brain
Banned
Well, it's not like we see any gay lead characters in $200 million Hollywood blockbusters, or even many gay characters at all. For similarly cynical reasons.
akidnamededdy
Banned
Like their videogame protagonists?
Garrett Hawke
Member
I think the issue here is less about making gay characters clearly gay and more about writing well-written, interesting stories/narratives with characters who just so happen to be gay. Maybe instead of their wife that's kidnapped, it's their husband. Etc.
Most characters are just blank slate cyphers anyways, there's no reason why Jimmy Action Hero can't be gay/straight/asexual/somewhere in between. It's up to you a lot of the time and is the magic of video games as an art form.
velociraptor
Junior Member
The overwhelming majority of AAA games play no attention to the sexuality of the character. You just shoot and kill people and call it a day.
Ol No Bones
Banned
I honestly don't care either way.
StalkerUKCG
Banned
My renegade Shepherd is gay
Garrett Hawke
Member
I hope you're joking
Considering the overwhelming majority of videogames feature straight protagonists, it's not too much to ask for one fucking game where the protagonist isn't straight. God.
For sure, and I actually just edited to touch on that a little more.
I don't think it'll happen for a long time because some out of touch exec will want to seem like such a visionary for OKing that decision and it'll have to be heavy-handed and forced.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
GhostTrick
Banned
This. Totally. I think that if you want to make it interesting, you don't have to make it as it was something special, but something casual. The main problem I think isn't the gay/hetero lead character in triple A titles, but more like the lack of well written characters. A good character is defined by how well written he is
Deadlysword
Banned
Most games I've played don't advertise one way or the other what the main character's sexual orientation is. Hell, Sam Fisher or Marcus Felix could be gay for all I know, their games don't feature their hetero/homosexuality as a story point. If I happen to play a game featuring a protagonist who is shown to be gay, it doesn't faze me one way or another.
Do they? I'd imagine it doesn't come up all that often in most games. There's also far more than one game where the protagonist is flat out not straight.
Garrett Hawke
Member
Agreed. That's why I was very happy with how a certain DLC for a certain title last year handled it's characters. It was perfect, casual, and still touching.
I'm not talking about the sexual orientation of the main character, per se, I'm talking about the fact that a lot (perhaps not most, I dunno) of games are designed with specifically straight men as the core audience. You only have to look at things like character design to see that, with the amount of cleavage on show across gaming in general.
The fact is that it's so ubiquitous and obvious that it's not even noticed or considering pandering. But if a game featured as high a level of sexualisation aimed at gay guys as is considered 'not even aimed at a straight male audience', it would be considered a niche game that panders slightly cringeily towards gay men.
[edit] For instance, even in Mass Effect, which lets me play as a dude who bones dudes, I still have to 'put up with' Samara's constant ultra-cleavage, and various shots of Miranda's ass. Honestly, I'm not sure if these things are swapped at all if you pick a female character (i.e. whether you get shots of Jacob's wondrous rump instead), so I can't comment on that. But you certainly don't get anything like that if you pick Male Shepherd.
But how often does a character do anything in a game to suggest their sexual orientation? Why would a character suddenly talk to their same-sex partner back home, when currently they don't usually do that at all in the first place?
The reality is that most games don't address it directly one way or another. Which is a decent reflection on society at large. Is that Army Guy straight or gay? How about that janitor? Or that male nurse? We usually don't know, so isn't 'not addressing it in video games' actually addressing it?
And why does there need to be a fixed answer anyway? Why can't Gordon freeman be straight to player 1, and gay to player 2?
Excluding games that let you choose (sorry), what games are there?
Honestly the only one I could think of was Gone Home, and I know Trevor in GTAV is more than a little bit bisexual.
and why is that? because its not flamboyant/eccentric enough?
the worst thing to do is stereo type the characters.
also this is an interesting wiki page.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_LGBT_characters_in_video_games
some I never knew about.
rocketskates
Member
Lol y so angry
Not until they break into a strong, passionate kiss like in SR4.
Though I'm pretty sure the protagonist can and would do anyone and anything, so that's really more a case of an omnisexual character.
GhostTrick
Banned
Will that really change things up? One character?
There are lots of famous people around the world who are openly gay, and there is still lots of hate towards the gay community. I don't think one game will change that.
Weltall Zero
Member
I really don't see the AAA industry making a gay main character anytime soon, either. For the same reason I don't see them making a main character that's a middle-aged women, a non-attractive woman, or an older character of any gender. It's going to sound sad and/or cynical, but most player avatars in AAA games can be divided between "characters a straight male wants to be", and "characters a straight male wants to bed".
I had no clue and, although this might be a spoiler (since I've not seen it mentioned elsewhere), this made me that much more intrigued and interested in playing it.
I'm usually allergic to first person games in general, and I'm typically not terribly fond of 3D indie games (I'm a 2D fan and that one of my main draws to the scene) which is the main reason I haven't got to getting/playing it yet despite raving reviews. I'll make a point to, however.
Villains aren't exactly the best characters to use for increasing acceptance of character traits, now are they? (Vamp was also a villain, as mentioned above)
I had no clue and, although this might be a spoiler (since I've not seen it mentioned elsewhere), this made me that much more intrigued and interested in playing it.
I'm usually allergic to first person games in general, and I'm typically not terribly fond of 3D indie games (I'm a 2D fan and that one of my main draws to the scene) which is the main reason I haven't got to getting/playing it yet despite raving reviews. I'll make a point to, however.
Villains aren't exactly the best characters to use for increasing acceptance of character traits, now are they? (Vamp was also a villain, as mentioned above)
Very little is not the same as none. If orientation had zero presence in games I might agree with you, but it simply isn't the case.
In Uncharted Drake is pretty unmistakably straight. He is either in a relationship with or has sexual history with several women. In God of War Kratos had a wife with whom he had a child. In Infamous: Second Son Delsin has a tryst with a female character. Even in Halo they've paired Master Chief with Cortana, which is clearly not a physical relationship but establishes a pretty blatant heterosexual comfort zone (just picture Cortana as a buff half-naked guy for contrast.)
Relationships are a pretty central aspect of being human, so they tend to be established as part of rounding out any interesting character. It is hardly unreasonable to expect representation of human diversity in our artistic media.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
Well they wrote a character as literally "The Gay Character".
That didn't really help things.
lel.
Red Chocobo
Banned
Most AAA games are aimed at male middle-teens.
Anyone who is, or has been, a 14 year old male can tell you that a gay main character would not go down well with the majority of that demographic.
Sure, when we get older we learn to respect other people. But when you are a young straight guy, being called "gay" is an insult.
Just play COD online for five minutes and count how many times you hear the word "Faggot" as an insult.
Anyone who is, or has been, a 14 year old male can tell you that a gay main character would not go down well with the majority of that demographic.
Sure, when we get older we learn to respect other people. But when you are a young straight guy, being called "gay" is an insult.
Just play COD online for five minutes and count how many times you hear the word "Faggot" as an insult.
Garrett Hawke
Member
Because I'm passionate about equal representation and I'm fed up of ignorant white/straight male gamers bitching about possibly adding a gay person to their favourite franchises in case they have to see a gay person :O
Garrett Hawke
Member
Well stated. There are much more subtle ways that heterosexuality is expressed in video games than just "well you never see them have sex with a woman so..."