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Overrated athletes

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I might take heat for this but what gives, to me Arod was a great player before got his contract during his days in Seattle. Unfortunately that money propelled him to an insane level of scrunity and meeting expectations, I know people gonna say " he used steriods bla bla" shit you gotta hit the ball regardless it's not like you turn into godlike super saiyan mode. But his years with the Yankees dude looked overrated.. * note he did win a World Series ring and a few mvps but he could've been so much more.. Oh well he got money and blonde chicks
 
Fiktion said:
He's had five chances at a ring and failed three times, that makes him pretty good but nowhere near all-time great. I'm sorry that hearing this upsets you so much that you feel the need to get personal.
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Apology accepted. It's clear there's no point in having a discussion on a topic someone is so misinformed about.
 
Kevin Love... All I hear about is how teams are willing to give their left nut to get him, yet he has still failed to make a single post-season appearance. If I'm playing NBA 2K's dynasty mode, then yeah, he'd be one of the first players I take. But in reality, he puts up huge numbers on teams that are ultimately irrelevant.
 
Love Deterrence said:
Kevin Love... All I hear about is how teams are willing to give their left nut to get him, yet he has still failed to make a single post-season appearance. If I'm playing NBA 2K's dynasty mode, then yeah, he'd be one of the first players I take. But in reality, he puts up huge numbers on teams that are ultimately irrelevant.
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The logic with some of you people.


mjlol.png
 
Love Deterrence said:
Kevin Love... All I hear about is how teams are willing to give their left nut to get him, yet he has still failed to make a single post-season appearance. If I'm playing NBA 2K's dynasty mode, then yeah, he'd be one of the first players I take. But in reality, he puts up huge numbers on teams that are ultimately irrelevant.
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Sorta like KG did if that's the case, except he had a better supporting cast than love which enable him to reach the first round at least. Tmac on the other hand wow great talent but never a second round really?! Don't wanna hear the spurs final appearance ;P
 
Hasphat'sAnts said:
Jerry West is 1-8 in the Finals in his career.
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Why is making the finals suddenly a criticism? Would LeBron be a better player if his team had never made the finals on those 3 other years and instead were bounced early in the playoffs since his "finals record" would look nicer? Is Tim Duncan a career underachiever because he only won the title 5 times in 17 seasons? He's 5-12 in championship attempts. That's pretty poor.

People using shit like Finals records to judge players are the same kind of people who think the pitcher with the most wins is the best one in baseball.
 
not a lebron fan but the guy is remarkably great in many ways and pretty unique for a superstar of his scoring capability in that he has a pass-first mentality.. he's also got many years to add to his accolades.

paul george. now he's overrated.
 
CD'S BAR said:
not a lebron fan but the guy is remarkably great in many ways and pretty unique for a superstar of his scoring capability in that he has a pass-first mentality.. he's also got many years to add to his accolades.

paul george. now he's overrated.
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People think lbj is jordan and Kobe when in reality he's a magic Johnson type player. He is a hybrid cause he can display great offensive abilities when he's on point
 
Love Deterrence said:
Kevin Love... All I hear about is how teams are willing to give their left nut to get him, yet he has still failed to make a single post-season appearance. If I'm playing NBA 2K's dynasty mode, then yeah, he'd be one of the first players I take. But in reality, he puts up huge numbers on teams that are ultimately irrelevant.
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If his team were in the garbage east he'd probably have a couple token playoff appearances under his belt that amount to nothing but likely first doing exits, would that magically make him a better player somehow? Garnett didn't win shit for years in 'Sota, making out of the first round only once, and the moment he got on a good team he beasts.
 
Ninja Scooter said:
Why is making the finals suddenly a criticism? Would LeBron be a better player if his team had never made the finals on those 3 other years and instead were bounced early in the playoffs since his "finals record" would look nicer? Is Tim Duncan a career underachiever because he only won the title 5 times in 17 seasons? He's 5-12 in championship attempts. That's pretty poor.
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lol i'm pointing out the nonsense that LeBron's 2-3 in the Finals is somehow an indictment of his achievement.

Logo/Elgin/Wilt went up against Russell/Hondo/Jones and lost every single fucking time, but that doesn't make them any less great. It just means Russell was better.

Ninja Scooter said:
If his team were in the garbage east he'd probably have a couple token playoff appearances under his belt that amount to nothing but likely first doing exits, would that magically make him a better player somehow? Garnett didn't win shit for years in 'Sota, making out of the first round only once, and the moment he got on a good team he beasts.
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Duncan definitely would've gotten out of the first round even with that shittastic cast.
 
NoctisVsStar said:
Sorta like KG did if that's the case, except he had a better supporting cast than love which enable him to reach the first round at least. Tmac on the other hand wow great talent but never a second round really?! Don't wanna hear the spurs final appearance ;P
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KG took Minnesota to the conference finals.
 
Ninja Scooter said:
Why is making the finals suddenly a criticism?
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If you tend to shrink the most when the stakes are highest, you're going to get called an underachiever.

Also there is the fact that Lebron's team would never have made it out of the second round in the West this year. The finals are a fairer judgment of his record because he plays in the East. The East alone in fact is reason enough to asterisk his rings. He can thank Miami's geographical location for his inflated reputation.
 
Fiktion said:
If you tend to shrink the most when the stakes are highest, you're going to get called an underachiever.

Also there is the fact that Lebron's team would never have made it out of the second round in the West this year. The finals are a fairer judgment of his record because he plays in the East. The East alone in fact is reason enough to asterisk his rings.
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That's not a fact, just your opinion.
 
Hasphat'sAnts said:
lol i'm pointing out the nonsense that LeBron's 2-3 in the Finals is somehow an indictment of his achievement.

Logo/Elgin/Wilt went up against Russell/Hondo/Jones and lost every single fucking time, but that doesn't make them any less great. It just means Russell was better.


Duncan definitely would've gotten out of the first round even with that shittastic cast.
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No I'm agreeing with you. Magic is barely over .500 in Finals appearances for his career too, but I guess i just think it's amazing that those guys were great enough to take their teams to NINE NBA finals rather than call them losers because they didn't lose in the conference finals instead so that their "finals records" looked better.
 
Ninja Scooter said:
If his team were in the garbage east he'd probably have a couple token playoff appearances under his belt that amount to nothing but likely first doing exits, would that magically make him a better player somehow? Garnett didn't win shit for years in 'Sota, making out of the first round only once, and the moment he got on a good team he beasts.
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"If he was in the East..." If ifs and buts were candies and nuts, we'd all have a merry Christmas. Who knows if he would make the playoffs? Probably not. Not as the number one option, anyway. I don't think Kevin Love is bad, per se. I think he'd be an OK third option on a decent team. But as the "go-to guy," he takes an L like it's his job.
 
johnny_park said:
That's not a fact, just your opinion.
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The disparity between the records of the two conferences is a fact. That Lebron had the great fortune to sign in the lesser conference is a fact. That he has a losing record against the West in the playoffs is also a fact. He folds when he encounters real competition.
 
Love Deterrence said:
"If he was in the East..." If ifs and buts were candies and nuts, we'd all have a merry Christmas. Who knows if he would make the playoffs? Probably not. Not as the number one option, anyway. I don't think Kevin Love is bad, per se. I think he'd be an OK third option on a decent team. But as the "go-to guy," he takes an L like it's his job.
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Because that's a fair, objective way to look at things. Not all organizations and situations are created equal. Team success requires a great team. It's the pitcher wins thing applied to basketball. It's fairly lazy analysis. By plenty of metrics Kevin Love is one of the 5 best players in the world. Third option on a contender? Lol get real.
 
Ninja Scooter said:
Because that's a fair, objective way to look at things. Team success requires a great team. It's the pitcher wins thing applied to basketball. It's fairly lazy analysis. By plenty of metrics Kevin Love is one of the 5 best players in the world. Third option on a contender? Lol get real.
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So, what do you propose the Wolves do to help Kevin Love? That shit is going to start looking like the list of what's going to "save" the Wii U.
 
Fiktion said:
If you tend to shrink the most when the stakes are highest, you're going to get called an underachiever.

Also there is the fact that Lebron's team would never have made it out of the second round in the West this year. The finals are a fairer judgment of his record because he plays in the East. The East alone in fact is reason enough to asterisk his rings. He can thank Miami's geographical location for his inflated reputation.
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Heat record against the West this year: 20-10.

Teams in the West having a .667 record against West teams: SAS, OKC, LAC.

Miami in 2012-13: 25-5 against the West

Miami in 2011-12: 13-7

Miami in 2010-11: 20-10

Miami would've been just as good in the West. Maybe they slip up once in the last 4 years, but they would've won those two rings regardless.
 
Fiktion said:
The disparity between the records of the two conferences is a fact. That Lebron had the great fortune to sign in the lesser conference is a fact. That he has a losing record against the West in the playoffs is also a fact. He folds when he encounters real competition.
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Those are all facts but the one I'm calling you out on is an opinion.
 
Hasphat'sAnts said:
Heat record against the West this year: 20-10.
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Playing in the West is not the same thing as playing against the West. The Raptors, Nets, and other third rate dregs of the East also had winning records against the West this year. The regular season means very little.

johnny_park said:
Those are all facts but the one I'm calling you out on is an opinion.
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If you agree that he folds whenever he faces real competition then I'm not sure how you can disagree that he's overrated.
 
Fiktion said:
The disparity between the records of the two conferences is a fact. That Lebron had the great fortune to sign in the lesser conference is a fact. That he has a losing record against the West in the playoffs is also a fact. He folds when he encounters real competition.
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Yup. Just like when he folded in Game 7 of the 2013 Finals. Or 4th quarter Game 2. Or Game 6 Boston. Or Game 5 Detroit.

He always folds!
 
Fiktion said:
Playing in the West is not the same thing as playing against the West. The Raptors, Nets, and other third rate dregs of the East also had winning records against the West this year. The regular season means very little.



If you agree that he folds whenever he faces real competition then I'm not sure how you can disagree that he's overrated.
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I was agreeing with all the things you said were fact. That was not one of them, that was your opinion again.
 
Bryce Harper would probably be my answer. Even this year the comparisons between him and Mike Trout continue despite that Trout has already established himself as the bar-none best player in the game. Meanwhile Harper can't even stay on the field and has not had anywhere near Trout's production when he has.
 
Fiktion said:
Playing in the West is not the same thing as playing against the West. The Raptors, Nets, and other third rate dregs of the East also had winning records against the West this year. The regular season means very little.
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Come again?

Miami tore the West a new asshole in 2012-13, so they would've not made the Finals if they had to play the juggernaut that is the Denver Nuggets/Golden State Warriors?

And yeah, the regular season means very little, that's why there are all these teams that won fewer than 55 games that have won the title. 2 in the last 14 years in fact.
 
Love Deterrence said:
So, what do you propose the Wolves do to help Kevin Love? That shit is going to start looking like the list of what's going to "save" the Wii U.
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Trade him to a good organization. Like most players who weren't fortunate enough to be drafted by great teams (like magic, Jordan, Kobe, Duncan) had to do before they had great success. If Duncan had been drafted by the mid 90s Clippers would we be talking about a guy with 5 rings right now?
 
NEOPARADIGM said:
His career was short as hell but I remember considering him the clear-cut #2 superstar running back behind only Barry Sanders at one point. He was nasty.



I'm not even a true fan of his but he was a big fucking deal. He scored a fuckton of TDs and is at least a top 10 QB from the era. Jared Lorenzen meets Tommie Frazier. He was really good imo.
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Tommie Frazier is on another fucking planet from Tebow. To include them in the same paragraph is an insult
 
evil solrac v3.0 said:
how is he overrated?
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captmcblack said:
Everyone posting Jeter should name 10 better shortstops with better all-time stats than him. Fuck it, name 10 SS better than Jeter all-time.

I'll even give you hater throw-ins of Barry Larkin and A-Rod (who has played roughly as many games at 3B as he has at SS now). I'll even give you the all-defense Ozzie Smith pick too, so there's 3 of 10. Clearly they aren't better than Jeter, but I just want to see where the argument goes.
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Jeter has won 4 Gold Gloves with Negative Defensive WAR stats. That is so phenomenally hilarious, it is vomit inducing. Great hitter, but things like that just prove he is definitively overrated.
 
Ninja Scooter said:
Trade him to a good organization. Like most players who weren't fortunate enough to be drafted by great teams (like magic, Jordan, Kobe, Duncan) had to do before they had great success. If Duncan had been drafted by the mid 90s Clippers would we be talking about a guy with 5 rings right now?
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What? So, I mean... What's the point of the Wolves even being in the association if they are just some sort of farm for NBA talent to pass through and leave after "X" amount of time. Why doesn't Kevin Love just make his team better? Dude, I'm not even talking championships. The guy as never made THE PLAYOFFS.
 
NoctisVsStar said:
Sam cassell, sprewell, Wally among others.. Now compare that supporting cast to Kevin love's current supporting cast
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Are you telling me Garnett's teams always had such good players? He started making the playoffs since his 2nd year in the league. I'm just saying if Kevin Love is so great, he should've been able to take his team to the playoffs at least once.
 
johnny_park said:
Are you telling me Garnett's teams always had such good players? He started making the playoffs since his 2nd year in the league. I'm just saying if Kevin Love is so great, he should've been able to take his team to the playoffs at least once.
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Of course not I was answering about that conf finals appareance that team was actually good and kg earlier years he indeed put that team on his back. However, min currently constituted is a team of scrubs sadly I had high hopes for Rubio but nevertheless it's no excuse either.
 
Love Deterrence said:
What? So, I mean... What's the point of the Wolves even being in the association if they are just some sort of farm for NBA talent to pass through and leave after "X" amount of time. Why doesn't Kevin Love just make his team better? Dude, I'm not even talking championships. The guy as never made THE PLAYOFFS.
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They are a feeder system because they have been run like shit. They kept woefully incompetent David Kahn in their employ for multiple years. They just rehired the same retread coach they had 10 years ago (lol scratch that he hired himself). They passed on Steph Curry TWICE in the same draft. They used a top 6 lottery pick in 2009 on a guy in Johnny Flynn who is not even in the league anymore. They used their max contract slot on Ricky Rubio before he had proven he was worth it, which also prevented them to giving that contract to Kevin love which would have kept him under their control for an extra year and provably would have given them more leverage in deciding on when/if they should trade him. But nah life is just unfair for the poor little twolves.
 
Ninja Scooter said:
They are a feeder system because they have been run like shit. They kept woefully incompetent David Kahn in their employ for multiple years. They just rehired the same retread coach they had 10 years ago (lol scratch that he hired himself). They passed on Steph Curry TWICE in the same draft. They used a top 6 lottery pick in 2009 on a guy in Johnny Flynn who is not even in the league anymore. They used their max contract slot on Ricky Rubio before he had proven he was worth it, which also prevented them to giving that contract to Kevin love which would have kept him under their control for an extra year and provably would have given them more leverage in deciding on when/if they should trade him. But nah life is just unfair for the poor little twolves.
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Yeah, I totally said that life is unfair for the poor little T'Wolves. OK, dude. Clearly, they are not without fault, but the whole thread topic is OVERRATED athletes. My point is that Kevin Love is OVERRATED. I read a report earlier suggesting that the Warriors are willing to give up Klay Thompson and David Lee, two proven commodities, for this guy who has done... what, exactly? That's all I'm saying is that I don't get why teams are ready to go all-in for a guy who hasn't achieved very much, at all. I don't think he's bad. I just don't think he's a number one option.
 
Ljwinter said:
Shaq, Wilt Chamberlain
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I need elaboration on Wilt, because that seems crazy to me. Shaq too but I can bullshit ways to make a point of it.

Anyway, Peyton Manning. Great regular season QB, disappears when it matters. LeBron catches so much shit for doing the same thing, but Manning in the media is almost untouchable in that regard. Don't understand.
 
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