Starphoenix
Member
1. Mewtwo
2. Ness
3. R.O.B
4. Meta-Knight
5. Ganondorf
6. Wolf
7. Wario
8. Mr. Game and Watch
9. Ice Climbers
10. Falco
11. Lucas
12. Squirtle
13. Jigglypuff
14. Ivysaur
15. Snake
Super Smash Bros. for 3DS & Wii U Thread 10: Against the Odds, We Choose to Hype!
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
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1. Mewtwo
2. Ness
3. R.O.B
4. Meta-Knight
5. Ganondorf
6. Wolf
7. Wario
8. Mr. Game and Watch
9. Ice Climbers
10. Falco
11. Lucas
12. Squirtle
13. Jigglypuff
14. Ivysaur
15. Snake
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
going to main the crap out of Robin ヽ(✿◕‿◕ﾉ
Same here. I'm very impressive how Sakurai made him very interesting character with Fire Emblem mechanic.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
Edited: Sorry about double post.
Same here. There would be so much potential if Smash have those features. I have a bad feeling that it might be 30 seconds, 45 seconds or 1 minutes.
Snake confirmed for CUT!
Same here. There would be so much potential if Smash have those features. I have a bad feeling that it might be 30 seconds, 45 seconds or 1 minutes.
Snake confirmed for CUT!
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
So these are some of the Project M alternates revealed so far. Hopefully, Sakurai can give us something similar for all characters!
This are pretty amazing. These are the kind of alts Sakurai needed to add, not the halfassed Link thing. No, seriously, the Link texture swap is hideous and looks more of amateur hour than professional. I would have prefered to don't have alts for Link altogether than have that thing.
theprodigy
Member
lol
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
The issue I have with trying to predict who is/isn't cut is that there's almost no measurable pattern of data from past titles in order to believable predict the next. There's only been three games, and the tiny roster of Smash 64 was perfectly replicated in each successor.
That leaves Melee -> Brawl. Several cuts were made: Dr. Mario, Mewtwo, Pichu, Roy, Young Link. Young Link was reforged as Toon Link. Dr. Mario, Pichu, and Roy were clones. Mewtwo is the only character in Smash history with a verifiable unique moveset that was totally cut from a roster. One character across three games.
With that in mind you're not left with much when trying to predict Smash 4. You can make somewhat educated assumptions that clone-like characters may see disruption, eg: Lucas and Ness may not return, but there's good reason to believe one of the two will or at the very least an identical counterpart will be introduced.
My head says that I can't see the team wanting to scrap characters that add wholly unique movesets, silhouettes, and diversity to the character roster. EG: Ice Climbers. Part of Smash's appeal is the huge variety of character play styles, not clones, hence why Brawl had so many unique characters and why (so far) Smash 4 appears to be the same. Characters like Mr. Game & Watch, Metaknight, Ice Climbers, and Jigglypuff are series staples that diversify the roster while representing their associate franchises. Seeing mass cuts in this area would be very new territory for the franchise. As said, it's really only happened with one character ever.
Snake is the only unique moveset that I could see going the way of Mewtwo.
That leaves Melee -> Brawl. Several cuts were made: Dr. Mario, Mewtwo, Pichu, Roy, Young Link. Young Link was reforged as Toon Link. Dr. Mario, Pichu, and Roy were clones. Mewtwo is the only character in Smash history with a verifiable unique moveset that was totally cut from a roster. One character across three games.
With that in mind you're not left with much when trying to predict Smash 4. You can make somewhat educated assumptions that clone-like characters may see disruption, eg: Lucas and Ness may not return, but there's good reason to believe one of the two will or at the very least an identical counterpart will be introduced.
My head says that I can't see the team wanting to scrap characters that add wholly unique movesets, silhouettes, and diversity to the character roster. EG: Ice Climbers. Part of Smash's appeal is the huge variety of character play styles, not clones, hence why Brawl had so many unique characters and why (so far) Smash 4 appears to be the same. Characters like Mr. Game & Watch, Metaknight, Ice Climbers, and Jigglypuff are series staples that diversify the roster while representing their associate franchises. Seeing mass cuts in this area would be very new territory for the franchise. As said, it's really only happened with one character ever.
Snake is the only unique moveset that I could see going the way of Mewtwo.
NeonZ
Member
I'll be surprised if it happens. He could get a few new attacks, like in Bowser's or Pit's case, but I don't see the moveset being completely dumped. Almost every single one of his attacks were differentiated from Falcon's in Brawl. Although he still was clearly based on C.Falcon, I don't think they'd throw everything away while keeping Ganondorf in the game.
I think my favorite part is him saying they should have switched to following Lucina instead of him in the second half, and then the quick cut to Micaiah and Sothe. It's so damn true.
He could even steal Zelda's new Down B, just summoning a phantom rider instead. Maybe even at a distance from himself.
Obviously his ground pound attack would be cool, too
Light ball is a must. It could even be charged up to go faster. It could also act like Dedede's Gordo and reflect on melee attack
And of course, his sword would be awesome.
A zelda fan can dream ;_; He's the only character in smash who had a moveset entirely wrong and not inspired by abilities from his own games. He's unique. Captain falcon had nothing to go on, so his whole moveset was made up. Ganondorf had plenty of stuff to pull from, but they didn't do it. Rather than rework him and make him more like ganondorf, they just altered his melee movset to 'feel' more like something ganondorf would do... but it was still based off captain falcon. I know i'm dreaming, but I dream that he'll change, at least a little.
Obviously his ground pound attack would be cool, too
Light ball is a must. It could even be charged up to go faster. It could also act like Dedede's Gordo and reflect on melee attack
And of course, his sword would be awesome.
He's still going to be a CFalcon clone 
A zelda fan can dream ;_; He's the only character in smash who had a moveset entirely wrong and not inspired by abilities from his own games. He's unique. Captain falcon had nothing to go on, so his whole moveset was made up. Ganondorf had plenty of stuff to pull from, but they didn't do it. Rather than rework him and make him more like ganondorf, they just altered his melee movset to 'feel' more like something ganondorf would do... but it was still based off captain falcon. I know i'm dreaming, but I dream that he'll change, at least a little.
The dream is dead.
TheSlySoul
Member
He's still going to be a CFalcon clone
I fear this as well. The problem is he has the things set in place for a unique moveset. He can use a sword and katanas. It would be pretty cool if they mixed up all his moves from other Zelda games.
My dream roster contains Professor Layton and Steel Samurai (from Ace Attorney).
theprodigy
Member
There's been several posted in this thread already.
I was always afraid to mention mine because others seem pretty well-seated in reality.
Franchuzas87
Member
I just need:Here's something fun: now that Captain Falcon is confirmed, rank the remaining unconfirmed Brawl vets (plus Mewtwo, I guess) in terms of how much you care about them returning in Smash 4! My list:
1. Ness
2. Ice Climbers
3. Jigglypuff
4. Falco
5. Mewtwo
6. Mr. Game & Watch
7. Ganondorf
8. Lucas
9. Meta Knight
10. R.O.B.
11. Snake
12. Wolf
13. Squirtle
14. Ivysaur
15. Wario
Never could stand Wario or Waluigi as characters, sorry! Though to be honest, if only like my top seven unconfirmed vets up there made it into Smash 4 and the rest were cut, I wouldn't really be *too* sad about it. (Shots fired, I know.)
1. Wario (Wario Land & WarioWare representation)
2. Ness (EarthBound representation)
3. Ice Climbers (Ice Climbers representation and really diferent moveset)
4. Ganondorf (I like Zelda and I like villains in general, so...)
5. R.O.B. and/or Mr. Game & Watch (for the retro value)
6. Meta Knight (didn't know him before Brawl, but is a freaking cool character)
I could live without all the others. Not that I have anything against either of them, the more the merrier. Just give me some Xenoblade representation too.
HawthorneKitty
Sgt. 2nd Class in the Creep Battalion, Waifu Wars
So how about them Squirtle and Ivysaur?
He might not have a chance, but Capcom's involvement and that all-encompassing, logic-defying Rayman trophy might mean we can get his theme song.
theprodigy
Member
That switch made Radiant Dawn worse!
Ganondorf is one of Sakurai's favourite characters, I doubt (hope) he wouldn't change him, other than making his current moves better.
I'd hate to not be able to main Ganondorf and Ness anymore.
You made me sad. His moveset is great, I do not deny, but his moveset does not belong to ganondorf.
And also, what is your proof that ganondorf is one of sakurai's favorites, other than that one video where he picks him?
Every newcomer in smash 4 has a moveset that makes sense, that is something they can or SHOULD do in their own games. No character revealed so far has a moveset that doesn't make sense to the lore of the game they come from. I hope the trend continues and that ganondorf is revamped entirely (even though I know the chances are unlikely).
Heck, even Ike got BLUE FLAMES.
Part of me agrees because it made the storytelling incredibly inconsistent, but the other part of me can't really say I was too sad to leave the Dawn Brigade for the Greil Mercenaries.
Although, I could have done without them dropping Micaiah like a rock as soon as Yune showed up. It's a shame because I did like her.
theprodigy
Member
Probably don't have any proof, I'm sure I've heard it before but I might be wrong.
Personally, I fucking love the falcondorf moveset (when it's in the right engine) and the aggressive badass stuff you could do with him.
The idea of using a sword and some energy projectile that would probably be useless doesn't really sound appealing to me compared to punching the shit out of people with dark magic and the electric stomps.
And Ike may have blue flames but fox still doesn't have green lasers.
Once again, those moves? Super Rad. But they belong to someone like black shadow, not ganondorf. Zelda is (obviously) my favorite franchise and I've always felt betrayed that ganondorf had a falcon moveset. Made me never want to use him :/
theprodigy
Member
If they hadn't ditched the Dawn Brigade halfway through the game, perhaps they could have actually developed them instead of just falling back on the old characters.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
ShockingAlberto
Member
How mad would everyone be if the "CHALLENGER APPROACHING" silhouette came up in-game and it was Ivysaur
It's weird because Zelda is probably my second favourite nintendo franchise that isn't smash after Donkey Kong (as far as I can remember at the moment), but I've never had a problem with his moves not being referential.
The only thing that springs to mind for this conversation is when you change an established moveset to a more referential one, you get shit like the fludd, I don't want a fluddondorf.
But Ivysaur is great? They might even give her solar beam like PM.
I totally agree with this. The Dawn Brigade got screwed due to the game not having real support convos.
Radiant Dawn was a weird game. It was ultimately fan service. Oh well, I wanted more Tellius and I got more Tellius.
The one change to give Ganondorf a more accurate moveset so far has been Flame Choke. Considering it's one of the only moves people generally think fit him, I don't think it's anywhere near FLUDD-tier.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
Honestly, I wouldn't be mad. Less veterans cut are very welcome.
What makes it hurt the most is how EVERYBODY ELSE has moves that can be traced to their own games or clearly fit into their franchise/history/lore. EVERYONE ELSE. Even Lucina being a marth clone MAKES TOTAL SENSE with regard to the lore.
Ganondorf doing a falcon kick? BLAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH. It makes Ganondorf the odd man out.
Anyway, this is all just me dreaming, I don't expect it to happen. I do expect him to get some bowser-level tweaks, but that's it.
These are my thoughts, aswell. And even with that, Mewtwo was planned. So much that there is data left on the disc from him.
I'm not a gambling man, but I'd bet Lucas won't be back. The rest from Brawl; Ness, G&W, Meta Knight, Ice Climbers, and Jigglypuff will be back. And I am more than confident Mewtwo will make his return too. And his Final Smash will include his Mega forms, somehow.
Not sure about 'dorf and Snake.
NeonZ
Member
Well, If Ivysaur is left in, I'm pretty sure it's getting solar beam, considering how it was already animated for Triple Finish.
I'm kinda reserved to the idea of Snake, Ivysaur, & Squirtle being gone. With the Gematsu leak not being completely accurate, I'm more hopeful for the return of Lucas. Other than the doomed 3, the rest I think are coming back.
As for remaining newcomers, as I said in my write-up, I still believe in Shulk & the Chorus Kids, I just think we're also getting Dark Pit alongside those two.
As for remaining newcomers, as I said in my write-up, I still believe in Shulk & the Chorus Kids, I just think we're also getting Dark Pit alongside those two.
I'd lol and then prepare for the easiest unlock of my life.
The Doomed Three and the Forbidden Seven. Are terrible nicknames like cake analogies for the Smash fanbase?
I preferred Ivysaur and Squirtle to Charizard so I would be the opposite of mad.
ShockingAlberto
Member
Has the Gematsu leaker explained the Chrom thing yet? I'm mostly curious.
I'm never gonna give out hope for Snake. With as many veterans from Brawl we're getting, I don't see why they'd pass up the opportunity.
I've resigned myself to losing Squirtle and Ivysaur just because they don't stand on their own as single characters as well as Charizard does. But if we're getting Rayman of all things represented, I don't see why they wouldn't go through the trouble for Snake.
I've resigned myself to losing Squirtle and Ivysaur just because they don't stand on their own as single characters as well as Charizard does. But if we're getting Rayman of all things represented, I don't see why they wouldn't go through the trouble for Snake.
We have to have our thinly constructed patterns and hold a lot of grudges.
That's far less of a change compared to mario tornado -> fludd though, that was a tweak of an existing move, people want entirely new moves that control differenly.
And the ganondorf change was actually better considering the grab activates on shield, fludd was worse than the tornado..
I generally see moves in terms of how useful they are rather than how uhh... I guess 'canon' they are?
The wizard foot is a great tool for getting through projectiles due to it's armour and an easy finisher after a grounded flame choke, the good horizontal knockback sets you up for edgeguard opportunities if it doesn't kill and the move itself is a good edgeguarder with it's spike properties in the air and the fact that it refreshes your second jump.
I use it a lot as ganondorf, the move being good means more than the move being referential to me.
theprodigy
Member
I'd be pretty excited, but mostly because it would give me hope that Squirtle is also back. He was my favorite of the three to play as.
I know you do. We have differences of opinion on smash bros. From what I gather, you'd like good fighters, and if they're referential, that's a bonus. For me, I'd like referential fighters, and if they're good, that's a bonus. I play smash to have fun and because it lets me use my favorite characters in video games, not because of how good of a fighter it is. That's why ganondorf being a falcon clone makes me sad
The desire to alter Ganondorf doesn't necessarily mean that people want him to have completely "canon" moves that stem directly from his in-game abilities, but rather that they'd just prefer him to be unique in his moveset and general playstyle; rather than remain as a clone of a completely unrelated character. Even in terms of competitive viability, you're not losing much from cutting Brawl Ganondorf and replacing the character with a new version.
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