PadWarrior
Member
LOL I may go back, not really feeling this I think.
Super Smash Bros. for 3DS & Wii U Thread 10: Against the Odds, We Choose to Hype!
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
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LOL I may go back, not really feeling this I think.
What?
The Bankslammer
Member
i was just thinking about how many cool stages wonderful 101 could make for the other day
something like a stage inspired by operation 1C where you fight on ohrowchee's back would be super neat
but i mean that's not happening lol
Abandoning his fans! Appealing to children and to sell merchandise! Duh! /s
PadWarrior
Member
LOL!! OH Luigi.
NeonZ
Member
I think the idea is that if he were worried about balance and fairness above attempting something fun and unique, a character like Little Mac (which can apparently have vastly different effectiveness based on the stage), wouldn't be possible. You'd want something with more stable match ups.
Of course, this is the same person who said in the beginning of development that a big line up would cause balance problems. I don't get why he sometimes shows worry about balance and other times says something like that.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
Hmm, I'm trying to think of something.
ShockingAlberto
Member
Tune in next week, when JoeInky wonders aloud why he has the reputation he does and blames it on being too real for everyone else to handle.
*Rolls Eyes*
I think your pessimism is clouding both of your abilities to interpret. I'd read my previous post (#10734)
peanutbutterlatte
Member
Again, you continue to entertain with your ridiculous statements. Bravo/
Slightly.
He's like George in the same way that he doesn't seem to understand why the original two games were so great and has since gone in a direction of just trying to shove as much as he can in the game to appease people in the same way George just tries to shove as much CGI shit as possible into each scene so as to trick people into thinking that you aren't watching a fucking boring movie.
The Analogy falls apart though because unlike George, Sakurai was actually the reason why the original games were so good and the new games will actually have care and attention put into them rather than being just a cynical way to line his pockets.
I know exactly why I have the reputation I have, if you could even call it a reputation.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
The original two games were great because you could have wacky fights with Nintendo's All Star characters. Nothing has changed.
The most representative to me would be fighting on buildings and shit being flung mid air in the middle of a W101 geathjerk battle
Hot Coldman
Banned
and also jobbing on the first rung on the championship ladder
You know Sakamoto is responsible for more than Other M. Like Wario Ware, Rhythm Tengoku and Tomodachi Life to name some recent examples.
PadWarrior
Member
I don't think he ever intended for the first two games to be received the way they are. All of his smash bros games were created to be mascot fighting games that pay homage to their franchises while showing off how varied, diverse, and how interesting nintendo's history is. Never once did he make the first two games w/ competitive gamers in mind. I think that was more of a happy accident.
All of his smash bros games have been 'great', but they've been great for different reasons to different people. What makes smash 64 and melee great for me, I think, is VERY VERY different than what makes it great for you or for all those attending EVO. His target audience isn't, and has never been the competitive 'pro' player. He knows very well that they're a minority and doesn't make games for any one small group of people.
Unlike lucas, he hasn't really changed his reason for why and how he makes smash bros.
That's what the Wii U stage is.
I'm hoping this is in: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzzS2S1xbuQ
It is a stretch since it is only used once in the game, but it is better than the normal variant.
PadWarrior
Member
Wow, I like that one too. Man if we got both I'll never leave the Wii U stage.
Hyperactivity
Banned
Nope, not even Sakamoto
He's still a pretty good game designer,just not really for Metroid anymore
Still made Fusion, which was decent
Don't know if he made Zero Mission, but it was great
He made Tomadach Life, WarioWare games, Game&Wario iirc
obviously not really suited for metroid anymore but still makes good games
JediLink
Member
He may not have intended Melee to be competitive in the way that it is, but it's common knowledge by now that Brawl had a radically different mindset behind it. The man has said it himself several times.
kuroneko0509
Member
I'm lost. What's with this Sakurai=George analogy?
I find it hard to believe that Sakurai didn't intend 64 and Melee to be fun for both casual players and players who wanted to explore the depth of the game, there's definitely a shift of perspective with Brawl and to a lesser extent sm4sh.
I just can't see it when Z/L cancelling/Soft landing are in the games, it's an intentional input barrier to give people who put in the work to do it consistently an advantage, it does nothing for casual play but increases the potential of melee and 64's combo game.
Bjoern the Smexy
Member
How the hell is this thread 108 pages already?!?
Has the character reveal done so much damage?
Has the character reveal done so much damage?
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
I'm pretty sure that we are aware of that. I'm still think that we should wait until we have a final version before we are jumping into conclusion.
Fusion, Zero Mission and Super Metroid were all projects undertaken with oversight from other producers, whereas Other M's downfall was his complete monopoly on all aspects of the script, translation, music, voice acting and direction. If we're using the Lucas analogy, he's definitely capable of creating something worthwhile, but he absolutely needs heavy external restraint.
PadWarrior
Member
This is one of favorite tracks, Don't know why. Makes me think of nice Saturday afternoon drive with my wife.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7wdsha-1rI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7wdsha-1rI
You guys make it sound like he made Brawl specifically to spite some of you and is doing it all over again. I don't think you guys are his target audience. I don't think you guys have ever been his target audience. Unless something radical happens in the next 5-ish years, I don't think you guys will be the target audience for the next smash bros, either.
He wants this game to appeal to as many people as possible. This means it has to be accessible, have a lot of content, have a lot of popular characters, and be fun to play for as many people as possible. If the FGC can find something in the game to make it competitive, he'll see that as a bonus (because it makes more players happy), but I don't think he ever set out to make a smash brothers game that could be played at a pro level.
There's plenty of depth in brawl, too, but people didn't care for its layer of depth because it was slower, floatier, and forced you to play defensively, so it was boring to some, and definitely more boring to watch. Sakurai isn't against adding depth into his fighter, but I don't think he's doing it so that pro players can master the game. He's doing it so that people who want to invest time can learn how to get better at it because it offers a more rewarding experience (Hey look, i learned this cool new thing, let me try it out on my friends, see if it helps!). He's still making a fighting game, he's still going to add depth, this can still be played competitively. It's just not his focus.
If his attitude hasn't changed since brawl and he thinks that you have to sacrifice unique characters and fun for balance then that doesn't exactly fill me with hope.
The thing that's most disappointing is that you don't have to sacrifice all of that to have a good competitive game, he's done it twice before and since Brawl it seems like he wants to insist on the idea that you can't and not want to explore what's going to make 64 and Melee be remembered for much longer than Brawl.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
Unique characters? Wii Fit Trainer and Villager are pretty darn unique...
Vampirolol
Member
I don't get it. Melee wasn't a balanced game too, it's just more fun for competitive players.
User 73706
Banned
Guys, guys. Sakurai isn't the George Lucas of Smash Bros.
He's the Andrew Hussie.
He's the Andrew Hussie.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
And then he herded two of every Pokemon onto a boat and beat the living crap out of them!
And that's why to this day whenever you get a collection of mascot characters in one place you called it MASHEDPOTATO SAMURAI
peanutbutterlatte
Member
UNLESS ITS A SMASH
Re: balance as an afterthought: I totally agree!
The game should be fun to play in the first place, above all else. If this leads to imbalance, it doesn't really matter. If only one character is viable, the community can ban it. If 2 or more are viable, then that's enough variety for me.
It'd be exciting to see some of my favorite characters on the upper end of the balance, but there's no way to get everything perfect. Making the characters fun and exciting first is absolutely the more important thing to worry about.
Bjoern the Smexy
Member
Unless it's a Final Smash!
...You can read right?
Sakurai said that if you worry about balance or fairness then you can't have unique characters, I said that you don't have to sacrifice unique characters like WFT and Villager (apparently) are to have a balanced game.
What you just said doesn't mean anything in any context.
Hoagmaster
Member
Star KO's have always been one of my favorite ways to beat someone in a fighting game. Goes right back to seeing and getting a kick out of them in Smash 64.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
I mean what do you define balance as exactly?
ShockingAlberto
Member
I'm trying to see where he said unique characters are bad.
Are we saying Masked Man mistranslated this and what Sakurai really meant was that it's the most fun if all the characters are the same?
Are we saying Masked Man mistranslated this and what Sakurai really meant was that it's the most fun if all the characters are the same?
kuroneko0509
Member
Based Samurai, creating a game that's so Mashed
peanutbutterlatte
Member
Until that skinny little bastard jumps.
Valjean Lafitte
Banned
Because all it takes is one bad game to become the George Lucas of videogames...right.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
If he don't really care about balance, then why did they buff some characters by making their moves better or revamped their move sets? Those happened, along with unique newcomers that we have been getting.
Yoshi, Pit, Charizard, Sheik, Zelda, Bowser, etc
Hot Coldman
Banned
...that's the point
on FD, you don't need to jump
hence why everyone bans FD vs Marth because he can do the tech chase grabs all day long
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