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[NotLiquid]

That's exactly what it does though. We have screenshots (official ones) of more than 6 rooms.

My mistake then, I checked SmashWiki for the veracity of the stage layout and didn't see anything about it being randomized, only that there are six rooms available.

Though, again, that doesn't prove much of anything, since that detail makes it the easiest one to fake.

 

[Mr.Miyamoto]

Does anyone else think they'll revisit the Toon Zelda idea they had for Brawl, now that Zelda and Shiek are different characters and it'd be easier to pull off without having to also make some new Toon Shiek?

They'd pretty well have to have Tetra too then, so I still doubt it.

 

[jackal27]

Hahaha, what?! The 3DS is going to be as much of a full-fledged version of SSB, veteran stages or not. Smash run, the 1P mode, well thought out online mode, full roster... no idea how it could suddenly be demoted because some people don't like the stage selection.

Because handheld gaming is DEEEEAAAAAD. *eyeroll* I'm totally buying both versions, but I think I'm MORE pumped to play it on the go.

 

[Gonzo The Great]

Hahaha, what?! The 3DS is going to be as much of a full-fledged version of SSB as the Wii U version will, veteran stages or not. Smash run, the 1P mode, well thought out online mode, full roster... no idea how it could suddenly be demoted to "appetizer" because some people don't like the stage selection.

Who WOULD like the stage selection? Half of the stages are just recycled from Melee and Brawl. That's outrageous.

 

[Kriken]

The thread moved so fast yesterday

 

[akidnamededdy]

They'd pretty well have to have Tetra too then, so I still doubt it.

Ehhh not necessarily though (Spirit Tracks, which is also where Zelda's new Phantom Summon comes from).

 

[JoeInky]

Hahaha, what?! The 3DS is going to be as much of a full-fledged version of SSB as the Wii U version will, veteran stages or not. Smash run, the 1P mode, well thought out online mode, full roster... no idea how it could suddenly be demoted to "appetizer" because some people don't like the stage selection.

Because controls and no HD and a load of other stuff.

He didn't say that to mean that it was bad, but it was always going to be the lesser of the two, anyone who thought otherwise had their head in the sand or they just prefer the portability aspect of it which is fair.

 

[Deadstar]

For anyone that has been following this stuff more than me, do we know if Hyrule Temple is in with the same music from Zelda 2?

 

[Odie_Esty]

On the whole cross buy DLC thing I really doubt Nintendo, who has just recently unified eShop accounts, is going to be savvy enough to do something like that. But at the same time, I'm not sure you could. 3ds and WIi u smash have some pretty big differences so it might be weird to have shared content like that. Honestly I'd rather have a later rerelease with some fundamental tightening up and some more substantial additions.

 

[Blizzard]

So I've seen someone suggesting DLC would be free, and I've seen someone saying they would buy DLC for $100.

What would be a reasonable price? An evil Nintendo could make Snake really powreful again and make him cost $20, but hopefully they wouldn't. Or some DLC could be amiibo-only!

 

[User 73706]

Another argument towards G&W keeping his outlines in the long run:

Let's say they're gone like they were in Pac-Man's trailer. Here's vanilla, full-black Mr. Game and Watch against a dark backdrop.

Now here he is with outlines:

Or let's say he has a cyan alt and decides to fight with a watery backdrop:

And again with outlines:

I'm not shooting for either side, but G&W is more than likely keeping his outlines even if he gets an additional team-based one tacked on.

 

[emb]

For anyone that has been following this stuff more than me, do we know if Hyrule Temple is in with the same music from Zelda 2?

We don't know.

But I sure hope so. :3

Easily my favorite 'bad' stage.

 

[Weiner Whistle]

I'm still firmly in fake territory but I wouldn't be surprised at all if the final stage lineup for the 3DS Smash is mostly old stages like this. No matter how you shake it it was always sort of an "appetizer" for the Wii U version.

Keep in mind that Sakurai originally described the 3DS version as an individualized experience, which is why Smash Run is likely being advertised as the big feature of the game. It kind of makes sense that the 3DS's stage roster would have lower priority than the Wii U version, which will be the go-to version for local multiplayer.

 

[Fireblend]

Who WOULD like the stage selection? Half of the stages are just recycled from Melee and Brawl. That's outrageous.

I... don't care that much? I care way more about character playstyles and movesets rather than having new backgrounds, and the stage selection already has plenty of different gimmicks/layouts to play with. I'd appreciate new stages, but you would really say having veteran stages or stages that you dislike ruins the game? There's a FD variation for each stage too.

I just don't see how it warrants this enormous disappointment everyone's talking about, much less the "oh well, they weren't really trying with the 3DS version anyway" attitude.

 

["D"]

I'm on the fence with this leak business. The most damning evidence that seems somewhat difficult to prove is the new renders for Dr. Mario, Ness, Dog & Ducks, and Bowser Jr, also the Tomodachi stage angle.

I'm personally hoping its fake though, as I wanted to see Ridley and Mewtwo, maybe K. Rool at a longshot.

Putting Dr. Mario and Dark Pit in as clones instead of Alts just seems kinda weird but then again Sakurai doesn't make sense. And I would be lowkey upset that Dr. Mario can come back but I can't get Roy, as he was one of my mains in Melee.

 

[Blizzard]

Another argument towards G&W keeping his outlines in the long run:

Let's say they're gone like they were in Pac-Man's trailer. Here's vanilla, full-black Mr. Game and Watch against a dark backdrop.

Now here he is with outlines:

Or let's say he has a cyan alt and decides to fight with a watery backdrop:

And again with outlines:

I'm not shooting for either side, but G&W is more than likely keeping his outlines even if he gets an additional team-based one tacked on.

I dislike how hard to see Wireframe Mac already is. Are there any green backgrounds Wireframe Mac could fight against?

 

[akidnamededdy]

On the whole cross buy DLC thing I really doubt Nintendo, who has just recently unified eShop accounts, is going to be savvy enough to do something like that. But at the same time, I'm not sure you could. 3ds and WIi u smash have some pretty big differences so it might be weird to have shared content like that. Honestly I'd rather have a later rerelease with some fundamental tightening up and some more substantial additions.

Aren't there a handful of eShop titles that have crossbuy, though? Some indie games, I thought...I'm fairly certain I remember reading that not too long ago.

I really don't think Nintendo's account system woes stem from any kind of technical incompetence, at least. I'd bet that any paid DLC for this would be cross buy. But I'd also bet that there won't be much or any paid DLC in the first place.

 

[Green Mamba]

Another thing that sucks for the stage selection is that the 3DS's music is much more limited than the Wii U version so there's a chance there's no new Metroid/Donkey Kong/Star Fox/etc. music in the 3DS version at all.

 

[Vuapol]

I do hope, if this leak is legitimate, that there are more stages than have been shown on that selection screen. Really ridiculous that Mario got, what, five new stages and that Metroid, DK, and Star Fox have zero combined? Wow.

 

[Red Arremer]

I dislike how hard to see Wireframe Mac already is. Are there any green backgrounds Wireframe Mac could fight against?

Plenty of stages with green backgrounds - most of the Mario stages do. However, Mac has his gloves, pants, hair and shoes to make him stand out as well, unlike G&W who would be a single color.

 

[Odie_Esty]

Aren't there a handful of eShop titles that have crossbuy, though? Some indie games, I thought...I'm fairly certain I remember reading that not too long ago.

There is one single cross buy game, and it's only cross buy in Europe, and it doesn't look like Nintendo has any involvement with it. That was also only announced little more than a month ago.

 

[JavelinRobin]

Another argument towards G&W keeping his outlines in the long run:

Let's say they're gone like they were in Pac-Man's trailer. Here's vanilla, full-black Mr. Game and Watch against a dark backdrop.

Now here he is with outlines:

Or let's say he has a cyan alt and decides to fight with a watery backdrop:

And again with outlines:

I'm not shooting for either side, but G&W is more than likely keeping his outlines even if he gets an additional team-based one tacked on.

Not exactly sure putting a flat picture against a background is the same as having a model with depth against the same color. Yoshi's eyes don't completely disappear into the grass in the background. Just saying.

 

[Bamboo Boy]

Let's go #TeamReal!

 

[Myn]

The proportions on the face are all different, though. All you have is him putting his arms in a similar pose, and the posing of his arms isn't even the focus of the portrait (the arms being half outside the box).

I took the liberty to edit it a little bit to show how similar these two pictures are. It's not perfect but it gives an indication on how similar these two pictures are. And for anyone saying that it could be a model re-use, hop off, that's bullshit. Each character has a production-quality model for Smash that they pose for character portraits. There are no re-used assets from other games.

My point about all of this is how a leaker has the potential take a picture and modify it heavily, tweaking the proportions so that it can be differentiated from other existing art. Especially this leaker, all he needed to do was a minor job because his low quality cell phone photos are able to mask any imperfections. As I was modifying this it was really suspicious as to how these two faces matched up so well with each other. The fact that their poses in both photos are hands-on-hip photos also raises some questions.

 

[Village]

The argument is that it's a modified Mario art and obviously fake. Not that it's taken from official Doc Art, as none such official renders exist for Doc at all.

Your argument was that since the palutena art looked like model it could be real, my argumentt is that, where is the famous official dr.mario art that has this pose. If they did pick a pose why wouldn't they choose the one where his han is out welcoming you to his game.or the one where he is givving you a thumbs up with one of those clipboards. Why would they modify mario art, for dr mario a different mario.

 

[Aβydoς]

I do hope, if this leak is legitimate, that there are more stages than have been shown on that selection screen. Really ridiculous that Mario got, what, five new stages and that Metroid, DK, and Star Fox have zero combined? Wow.

WiiU superior version confirmed if true. Stage selection on 3DS may end up pretty damn bad.

 

[The Great Gonzales]

Because controls and no HD and a load of other stuff.

He didn't say that to mean that it was bad, but it was always going to be the lesser of the two, anyone who thought otherwise had their head in the sand or they just prefer the portability aspect of it which is fair.

I don't see how this means the 3DS version is the "lesser" one.

Controls: it's no GCN controller, but plenty of people have said that the 3DS controls are fine.
No HD: That has nothing to do with the actual content of the game. Not to mention it still looks fantastic, even if it doesn't look quite as good as the Wii U version.

On the other hand, we have a promise of roster parity, a plethora of single-player modes, and thus far we've seen even more 3DS stages than Wii U ones. I can't think of a single bit of evidence to support the fear that Smash 3DS is the lesser version. Everything we've seen indicates that these are sister games - i.e., each one is a fully-realized Smash game - not that the 3DS is the appetizer and the Wii U is the definitive version.

 

[PadWarrior]

I took the liberty to edit it a little bit to show how similar these two pictures are. It's not perfect but it gives an indication on how similar these two pictures are. And for anyone saying that it could be a model re-use, hop off, that's bullshit. Each character has a production-quality model for Smash that they pose for character portraits. There are no re-used assets from other games.

My point about all of this is how a leaker has the potential take a picture and modify it heavily, tweaking the proportions so that it can be differentiated from other existing art. Especially this leaker, all he needed to do was a minor job because his low quality cell phone photos are able to mask any imperfections. As I was modifying this it was really suspicious as to how these two faces matched up so well with each other. The fact that their poses in both photos are hands-on-hip photos also raises some questions.

Nice find!!

 

[Red Arremer]

Not exactly sure putting a flat picture against a background is the same as having a model with depth against the same color. Yoshi's eyes don't completely disappear into the grass in the background. Just saying.

Are you seriously arguing that Mr. Game & Watch has a model with depth?

 

[Myn]

Nice find!!

Thanks. But thank Macka for bringing the image to my attention in the first place.

 

[Aβydoς]

I took the liberty to edit it a little bit to show how similar these two pictures are. It's not perfect but it gives an indication on how similar these two pictures are. And for anyone saying that it could be a model re-use, hop off, that's bullshit. Each character has a production-quality model for Smash that they pose for character portraits. There are no re-used assets from other games.

My point about all of this is how a leaker has the potential take a picture and modify it heavily, tweaking the proportions so that it can be differentiated from other existing art. Especially this leaker, all he needed to do was a minor job because his low quality cell phone photos are able to mask any imperfections. As I was modifying this it was really suspicious as to how these two faces matched up so well with each other. The fact that their poses in both photos are hands-on-hip photos also raises some questions.

We haven't seen the rest of the render. I think the right arm has a pill in his hand, and the left arm is just on his back like that. Palutena's render is almost identical to her appearance in Uprising to the point that it almost still looks fake to me. I swear.

 

[JoeInky]

I took the liberty to edit it a little bit to show how similar these two pictures are. It's not perfect but it gives an indication on how similar these two pictures are. And for anyone saying that it could be a model re-use, hop off, that's bullshit. Each character has a production-quality model for Smash that they pose for character portraits. There are no re-used assets from other games.

My point about all of this is how a leaker has the potential take a picture and modify it heavily, tweaking the proportions so that it can be differentiated from other existing art. Especially this leaker, all he needed to do was a minor job because his low quality cell phone photos are able to mask any imperfections. As I was modifying this it was really suspicious as to how these two faces matched up so well with each other. The fact that their poses in both photos are hands-on-hip photos also raises some questions.

All this proves really is that Mario looks like Mario, the fact that he's in that pose could either be because it's photoshopped or it could just be because that's the Dr. Mario pose.

 

[Odie_Esty]

Are you seriously arguing that Mr. Game & Watch has a model with depth?

Fun fact! Game & Watch IS actually a polygonal model shaded and animated to look 2 dimensional, not an actual sprite. Whether that would help differentiate him from the backgrounds I don't know.

 

[Stoze]

I really don't think Nintendo's account system woes stem from any kind of technical incompetence, at least. I'd bet that any paid DLC for this would be cross buy. But I'd also bet that there won't be much or any paid DLC in the first place.

I think someone posted the right idea a while ago; They'll advertise new characters before the Wii U release that will be included in the Wii U version to drum up hype and sales, and put them as DLC for the 3DS.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Your argument was that since the palutena art looked like model it could be real, my argumentt is that, where is the famous official dr.mario art that has this pose. If they did pick a pose why wouldn't they choose the one where his han is out welcoming you to his game. Why would modify mario art, for dr mario a different mario.

Why couldn't they use a Mario pose for Doctor Mario? His pose in Melee isn't anything from Doctor Mario, it's more akin to Mario fist bumping the air, with a pill in his hand.

Also he could have his hands behind him and we can't see them, in which case it's a reference to his NES Sprite

 

[JoeInky]

I don't see how this means the 3DS version is the "lesser" one.

Controls: it's no GCN controller, but plenty of people have said that the 3DS controls are fine.
No HD: That has nothing to do with the actual content of the game. Not to mention it still looks fantastic, even if it doesn't look quite as good as the Wii U version.

On the other hand, we have a promise of roster parity, a plethora of single-player modes, and thus far we've seen even more 3DS stages than Wii U ones. I can't think of a single bit of evidence to support the fear that Smash 3DS is the lesser version. Everything we've seen indicates that these are sister games - i.e., each one is a fully-realized Smash game - not that the 3DS is the appetizer and the Wii U is the definitive version.

Sorry, can't see the 3DS version as anything but the "Smash Bros. Lite" version.

Just the fact that local multiplayer is much harder to do for me is enough to make it that in my eyes.


That and the fact that I'm going to drop it and never play it again (because smash to me is a multiplayer game, I'm not interested in the single player content) when the WiiU version releases makes it much less appealing to me.

 

[Red Arremer]

Fun fact! Game & Watch IS actually a polygonal model shaded and animated to look 2 dimensional, not an actual sprite. Whether that would help differentiate him from the backgrounds I don't know.

No, he is not a model that's shaded to look 2-dimensional. It's a 3D model, yes, but that then is flattened by the engine, much like every character gets flattened into 2D by the Flat Zone stage in Brawl.

 

[Watch Da Birdie]

So Pac-Man's Up Special isn't the trampoline?

 

[JavelinRobin]

Are you seriously arguing that Mr. Game & Watch has a model with depth?

0 to aggressive in a single post.

Didn't he have some depth in Brawl? Enough to give him a pop from background colors, I thought at least. I was just making a comment. Not taking an outline side (which, that's a pretty silly fight to begin with) or trying to shit on the poster's pictures.

 

[Game Guru]

See I thought little Mac was the western bone he give us. I be very surprised if he gave us the dog

Well, if you consider the pattern, it makes some sense.

Melee:
Retro NES Character: Ice Climbers from Ice Climber.
Retro Hardware Character: Mr. Game & Watch, representing the Game & Watch line.

Brawl:
Retro NES Character: Pit from Kid Icarus.
Retro Hardware Character: R.O.B. representing the R.O.B. accessory.

Smash 4:
Retro NES Character: Little Mac from Punch-Out!!.
Retro Hardware Character: Duck Hunt, representing the Zapper accessory through the most famous of Zapper Games.

Not exactly sure putting a flat picture against a background is the same as having a model with depth against the same color. Yoshi's eyes don't completely disappear into the grass in the background. Just saying.

Game & Watch doesn't have depth. He's a 2D character designwise.

 

[Village]

Why couldn't they use a Mario pose for Doctor Mario? His pose in Melee isn't anything from Doctor Mario, it's more akin to Mario fist bumping the air, with a pill in his hand.

You are the one who made the argument about renders taking things from art.

I'm just aking, if they did why not use a Dr.mario pose

Also that was melee this is smash 4 , maybe sensibilities change

 

[User 73706]

I dislike how hard to see Wireframe Mac already is. Are there any green backgrounds Wireframe Mac could fight against?

They were actually pretty smart with his wireframe design because his points of articulation that can actually deal damage (head and fists, possibly legs?) are still fully visible. The wireframes might become an issue because they're turquoise and would naturally have an easier time blending in with green and blue backgrounds (at least as far blue as cerulean, anyway), but the most important parts of his model that you're fighting are still going to be at the forefront.

Not exactly sure putting a flat picture against a background is the same as having a model with depth against the same color. Yoshi's eyes don't completely disappear into the grass in the background. Just saying.

I know, but Game and Watch is more of an exceptional case given he moves and reacts to physical elements in a sprite-like fashion, meaning he can't as easily be percepted with depth the way, say, Yoshi can against that grassy background.

 

[PadWarrior]

Well, if you consider the pattern, it makes some sense.

Melee:
Retro NES Character: Ice Climbers from Ice Climber.
Retro Hardware Character: Mr. Game & Watch, representing the Game & Watch line.

Brawl:
Retro NES Character: Pit from Kid Icarus.
Retro Hardware Character: R.O.B. representing the R.O.B. accessory.

Smash 4:
Retro NES Character: Little Mac from Punch-Out!!.
Retro Hardware Character: Duck Hunt, representing the Zapper accessory through the most famous of Zapper Games.



Game & Watch doesn't have depth. He's a 2D character designwise.

Hmmm good points. My gut still says fake but good points

 

[Loco4Coco]

Pink Gold Peach should be added to one of these leaks one of these days.

 

[Ryce]

So Pac-Man's Up Special isn't the trampoline?

It is, but it's called "Pac'N-Jump" for some reason... which is apparently the name of an iOS game released in 2011. I suppose the move could have been inspired by this Mappy level.

 

[-Horizon-]

Didn't really give my impressions yesterday about this.

I still don't know how to feel about these "leaks".
Bowser Jr? Meh.
Duck Hunt Dog? I'm ok with that. He's pretty iconic. I didn't expect him to be suggested as playable though. Felt like an assist trophy was more likely.
Doctor Mario? Meh.
Pitoo? Makes sense that he appears in some form since he was teased in Palutena's trailer. I expected him to appear on a stage though.
Shulk with Gaur Plains stage? I'm very ok with that.

Any of the characters being cut is lame even if its for DLC later on. If they are DLC, I can expect like 1 character and 1 stage a month.
If there is DLC characters, I do not think Sakurai will make it exclusive to one version (Wii U). Although each game may have unique stages, I do not think this will apply to characters and that he will make all versions of the game have the same characters. 3DS can do DLC anyway, wouldn't make sense why it can't be done.

No opinion on the validity of the "leaked images" or not. I'm not the kind of person that can cross examine this stuff. Character placements are kind of weird and certain lines being larger and darker than others or unevenness I can tell though. Other than that, it looks fine I guess.

Wow.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

You are the one who made the argument about renders taking things from art.

I'm just aking, if they did why not use a Dr.mario pose

Also that was melee this is smash 4 , maybe sensibilities change

Doc with his arms behind his back is a classic pose from his NES Sprite.

 

[Myn]

We haven't seen the rest of the render. I think the right arm has a pill in his hand, and the left arm is just on his back like that. Palutena's render is almost identical to her appearance in Uprising to the point that it almost still looks fake to me. I swear.

You think he's posed a certain way and yet you have no proof of that. And yes, Palutena is posed like her Uprising art, but her Smash render could be paying homage to that particular artwork. Now explain why Dr. Mario is positioned the same as a random Mario render.

All this proves really is that Mario looks like Mario, the fact that he's in that pose could either be because it's photoshopped or it could just be because that's the Dr. Mario pose.

This proves that with some adjustments in Photoshop I was able to recreate the proportions of the Dr. Mario leak off that photo. It's way more than coincidence when two photos can match up so well with tweaking.

 

[Odie_Esty]

It is, but it's called "Pac'N-Jump" for some reason... which is apparently the name of an iOS game released in 2011.

It's the little things that make me love smash.

 

[JavelinRobin]

I know, but Game and Watch is more of an exceptional case given he moves and reacts to physical elements in a sprite-like fashion, meaning he can't as easily be percepted with depth the way, say, Yoshi can against that grassy background.

That's fair. Woo, good dialogue! No one got angry!