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[Mushroomer25]

And this is what drives me crazy. One person says -- okay, there are some real jerks who play games, and I call these people "gamers". other people say "no, everyone who plays games is a gamer, not all gamers are jerks" -- we're not necessarily disagreeing on the substance or anything that matters, we're just arguing over the meaning of a word, and it's driving me crazy. Call them flillyflops for all I care. It's just a word. The substance of the matter is that there seem to be a disproportionate amount of dickheads playing games. No, not all of you. But too many.

Exactly. I feel like half this debate just boils down to "This article had a headline saying gamers are shitheads, and I consider myself one of those! I didn't read the rest of the article, BUT I AM ENRAGED NONETHELESS."

If people want to "redeem" the term gamer, or at least the #GamerGate hashtag - don't shittalk developers or critics you disagree with. Shittalk the people who only troll those people, and make it clear they're not a part of this "movement".

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

This is exactly why I think the word "gamer" should be disposed of. It's a useless label that serves no purpose other than to group people into certain groups. And it's even more useless in situations like this where people don't even agree on what the damn label means. I mean hell even within 'gaming culture' there are people who are making other labels like 'casual' and 'hardcore' gamers. It's just stupid.

BS. We have a perfectly good word for...oh wait.

Threatening a woman's life over a youtube video makes you a misogynist psychopath who just so happens to like playing games. Labeling that group as "gamers" when we have a perfectly good label like "misogynist psychopath" just doesn't make sense to me.

 

[civilstrife]

So, I agree with essentially everything Anita Sarkeesian says in her videos.

I love games, but think they could be so much better and should hold themselves to a higher standard than a lot of the sexist, exploitative shit out there.

But I see no problem with the term gamer. If anything, I'd say most of the blame should be on developers. And I'm pretty sure that's what Anita has been saying all along.

And obviously I think the scumbags that are threatening her are the absolute lowest of the low.

So what's going on here? I'm not sure I understand it yet. Is Gamergate an anti Sarkeesian movement? Is it an anti games journalism movement (because they support her?) or is it just a reaction to that specific article calling for the end of gamers?

I'm legitimately confused.

I stand with Sarkeesian, with gaming and with gamers. Where does that put me on Gamergate?

 

[zero shift]

It really is amazing how defensive people get when minorities start voicing their opinions. So some women are complaining that there aren't enough games that involve female characters who don't dress outside of a spectrum that ranges from stripper at worst to college girl off to a Halloween party at best? So what? Is this not a valid complaint? Same with people of color. I can't even think of the last big AAA title I've played where I play as someone who is not white. I know Sony recently released Infamous Second Son and besides that there is... Again is this not a valid complaint?

Nobody is saying, "all gamers are bigots", but more so that there are some problems with the industry and the games we play that should get resolved. I don't see how these things are controversial. It seems perfectly reasonable to demand more strong female characters who don't dress like hookers. It would be nice to have more games where I don't play as a white 30 something year old male. People aren't criticizing the players but more so the games.

As others have said, I am very disappointed that this is coming from Boogie of all people. He seems like a very compassionate and likable guy.

 

[ExVicis]

I stand with Sarkeesian, with gaming and with gamers. Where does that put me on Gamersgate?

That's what I think is the problem, why should you need to feel like you need to align yourself with anything. You're you dude, agree with Anita and be whatever you want to be.

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

Nobody is saying, "all gamers are bigots",

Some people are saying this.

 

[Hot Coldman]

The problem is that the reason why this is such a big issue right now is specifically to distract people from the issues you say that this "isn't about." They want so very hard for people to not be talking about those things, so they've riled people up about corruption in games journalism, with the cornerstone being an allegation that wasn't even true to begin with (that Zoe Quinn slept with someone for a good review on her game).

I totally understand being upset with certain things in the industry, but the timing here is orchestrated as a distraction from stuff that was already going on, and now we have two groups at each others' throats when I'm sure plenty would actually see eye-to-eye if they'd stop and think about it for a bit.

This sums up my feelings pretty well. Gonna quote Teddy Diefenbach here:

@TeddyDief: If u want to be heard clearly for positive change put your sword down, disassociate w #GamerGate hate mob, and start fresh in a month

@TeddyDief: Even if u stand behind #GamerGate it's a bad move to stick w it. Developers/press in positions 2 make change have NO respect for it trust me

 

[RMS Gigantic]

I can't say I have ever met anyone who was glad to be born with their disability and as someone with a developmental disorder(ADHD), I absolutely do view it as a disease that I would gladly see "cured" if possible. Just my two cents.

Well then it pleases me to be the first. I was diagnosed with PDD-NOS from a young age, and it gives me a strong sense of identity because it affects my entire way of seeing the world and processing information.

Something I do notice is that "neurodiversity" seems to be mostly promoted by people with autistic spectrum disorders more than any other disability, probably because it affects their thinking process at a fundamental level with the primary disadvantages mainly being things that can either be dealt with relatively simply or WOULD be if word could spread about how the disorders actually work.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

Some people are saying this.

In before, you should ignore those people, or that their opinions are meaningless.

 

[Jobbs]

It really is amazing how defensive people get when minorities start voicing their opinions. So some women are complaining that there aren't enough games that involve female characters who don't dress outside of a spectrum that ranges from stripper at worst to college girl off to a Halloween party at best? So what? Is this not a valid complaint? Same with people of color. I can't even think of the last big AAA title I've played where I play as someone who is not white. I know Sony recently released Infamous Second Son and besides that there is... Again is this not a valid complaint?

Nobody is saying, "all gamers are bigots", but more so that there are some problems with the industry and the games we play that should get resolved. I don't see how these things are controversial. It seems perfectly reasonable to demand more strong female characters who don't dress like hookers. It would be nice to have more games where I don't play as a white 30 something year old male. People aren't criticizing the players but more so the games.

As others have said, I am very disappointed that this is coming from Boogie of all people. He seems like a very compassionate and likable guy.

I think about this a lot more since having young girls in my family (who are now both in grade school). They like video games, and one of them shows real interest in game development. So far they mostly play minecraft, pokemon, little big planet, and a lot of creative/harmless stuff like that -- But I wonder and worry how it will affect them when they get a bit older and start becoming exposed to more games and more types of games. How will they internalize the common portrayals of women in video games (as outlined by anita's videos) when exposed to it over and over and over? How does this affect their self esteem?

I actually worry about this, because their love of gaming right now is so innocent and pure.

 

[LordJim]

Sadly, no matter what happens here, perception of gamers in my country is unlikely to change.
But it would be nice if less sweeping generalizations were made and Game press was a bit more professional and less enthusiast.

 

[FF Seraphim]

a) Are you talking about this article? http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/sep/01/how-to-attack-a-woman-who-works-in-video-games Because it sounds like you might be thinking of Leigh Alexander.

b) Even if you were thinking of Leigh Alexander, I am not particularly impressed with your response to someone being driven out of the industry due to harassment.

A. Are you honestly going to tell me that article isn't emotionally charged and would be helpful in making people see the error of their ways? It was written for a certain audience over another.

B. My post was mostly in jest (a poor one I admit due to the nature of context), anyone being run out of job for having certain beliefs* is deplorable and measures should be taken to enforce laws where such actions harm the harasser in such a way that there will be no net-gain in doing said acts.


*Beliefs: meaning thoughts that have no direct or indirect harm to a person's well being, be it physically or mentally. Got to define this point due to misinterpretation stemming from my crazy heritage.

 

[Averon]

Some people are saying this.

Those "Gamer's Are Over" articles just fueled the fire. It was probably the worse thing the press could have done in regards for having this whole situation cool down. Rightly or wrongly, it just got people more angry.

 

[HUELEN10]

Ok, but this is why I didn't bold "corruption." I already know what their stated aims are as far as conflicts of interest and yadda yadda. I'm asking about "drama" and "double standards" and the like because they're usually used by people who want to shut up the people who want more black characters or what have you.

Ah, gotcha. Honestly, I can't say what the"voice" of /v/, for lack of better terms, thinks of that. Went back to read your other post about you saying that they seem to mean that they are against things like better representations of "women, gays, and minorities" and that they want Anita to stop making vids because it makes games they like look sexist and things like that, but from what I can tell, I don't think that things like that (those things being being against better representation or wanted Anita shit down) are ideals behind this by most of these people. Again, I could be completely wrong, I can't speak for a group, but I don't think this is the case.

Once again, this does not mean I endorse their views; I want to be better informed on all these things.

 

[Hot Coldman]

In before, you should ignore those people, or that their opinions are meaningless.

I was going to say "well, shouldn't you?" but I have a better answer: the people that full of hatred for what amounts to a stereotype... maybe there's a reason they end up that way. Probably one you could plausibly be empathetic about.

Getting beat with the short end of the stick is a good way to leave people pissed off and irrational.

 

[charlequin]

So what's going on here? I'm not sure I understand it yet. Is Gamersgate an anti Sarkeesian movement?

GamersGate is a Swedish digital distribution platform.

#gamergate is a hashtag spun out from the Zoe Quinn fiasco, nominally as a way to demand accountability in gaming journalism, but in practice as a way to relentlessly harass freelance writers and indie developers about tiny exchanges of money until they break down and disengage.

The "Gamers Are Over" thing is four or five people connected to the hobby in some way getting so fed up at how this type of misogynist, destructive behavior has become so prominent that they're expressing their disgust and shame with the hobby and identity by saying they're unsalvageable.

Nobody could reasonably draw the conclusion that what's happening here is that these writers, who are themselves gamers and who associate heavily with other gamers in their personal and professional lives, are actually saying that every self-proclaimed gamer ever is objectively a bigot and a monster -- at least without being willfully obtuse.

 

[LordJim]

I'd be happy to have a proper enthusiast press. Something like music or comics zines. Total fans, bringing a true fan perspective.

What we have isn't that. We have non-journalists pretending to be serious writers, and figuring out how to balance that with the clickbait tone their bosses ask for. Most of these guys come off as though they couldn't care less about most of the games they cover.

You do have a point.
Most 'comics' press is quite clear about who they support and what they like. Either way, a transition must be made

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

I was going to say "well, shouldn't you?" but I have a better answer: the people that full of hatred for what amounts to a stereotype... maybe there's a reason they end up that way. Probably one you could plausibly be empathetic about.

Getting beat with the short end of the stick is a good way to leave people pissed off and irrational.

And the angry gamers, what's the reason they end up the way they are?

 

[RMS Gigantic]

The problem is that the reason why this is such a big issue right now is specifically to distract people from the issues you say that this "isn't about." They want so very hard for people to not be talking about those things, so they've riled people up about corruption in games journalism, with the cornerstone being an allegation that wasn't even true to begin with (that Zoe Quinn slept with someone for a good review on her game).

I totally understand being upset with certain things in the industry, but the timing here is orchestrated as a distraction from stuff that was already going on, and now we have two groups at each others' throats when I'm sure plenty would actually see eye-to-eye if they'd stop and think about it for a bit.

I can definitely see this being the case. For a long while, I saw this debate as one side saying they don't like what games journalism has become while the other side called them misogynists, but I can definitely see an opening for simply a mutual miscommunication, with the other side viewing it as a debate where they say that it's wrong for a depressed female video game developer to be harassed, irrespective of the recent corruption claims, while the opposing side calls them overzealous white knights.

Neither attack against the other side really fits, and that would mainly be because the two sides are essentially sides of two entirely different debates.

 

[Dio]

Ah, gotcha. Honestly, I can't say what the"voice" of /v/, for lack of better terms, thinks of that. Went back to read your other post about you saying that they seem to mean that they are against things like better representations of "women, gays, and minorities" and that they want Anita to stop making vids because it makes games they like look sexist and things like that, but from what I can tell, I don't think that things like that (those things being being against better representation or wanted Anita shit down) are ideals behind this by most of these people. Again, I could be completely wrong, I can't speak for a group, but I don't think this is the case.

Once again, this does not mean I endorse their views.

Also, I think it's quite misleading to keep referring to /v/'s "opinion" or "voice" when hundreds of thousands of people post there, of all colors, races, sexualities and demographics. It's like how people outside NeoGAF think this site is a Sony fanboy heaven where people are banned for liking Nintendo or Xbox.

In fact, the threads with posts that people keep linking elsewhere, including this very topic, are not 100% supported by people who browse that board. Even on 4chan, I'd say the people involved with those threads are a minority, and I'd say the large majority of the board just wants to ignore this entire fucking monstrosity of a debacle.

 

[ExVicis]

Ah, gotcha. Honestly, I can't say what the"voice" of /v/, for lack of better terms, thinks of that. Went back to read your other post about you saying that they seem to mean that they are against things like better representations of "women, gays, and minorities" and that they want Anita to stop making vids because it makes games they like look sexist and things like that, but from what I can tell, I don't think that things like that (those things being being against better representation or wanted Anita shit down) are ideals behind this by most of these people. Again, I could be completely wrong, I can't speak for a group, but I don't think this is the case.

Once again, this does not mean I endorse their views; I want to be better informed on all these things.

You're right, those things aren't what drive them. /v/ and/or 4chan isn't one mind on anything. To imply all of them are stirring the pot to make trouble is wrong, but to say all of them are doing it with good intention is also wrong too. There's a lot of diverse opinions and I'm sure they fall into every possible combination.

It's likely some are out there trying to distract for whatever reason with gamersgate. It's also likely some think gamersgate and everything else that's been going on are all a part of the same fight. I don't think it's necessarily right how they're doing it and I wish they could find a better way to get across what they want, but when there's so many voices and it's easy for any ol' Joe to attach themselves and become one some of the cohesiveness and direction is of course going to get tripped up.

 

[GutZ31]

So, being overly pessimistic, lets say we only have 200 million gamers(No accuracy).
You have 271 million active Twitter accounts.
Out of those 271 million twitter accounts, you have maybe 20 "SJW"(not at all accurate).
The amount of "gamers" posting horrible things to "SJW" and a few "Feminists" are in the hundreds.
SJW post back in the hundreds.
Gamers see the news articles, and now they are in the thousands upset that they are now "dead".

There are still millions of people not taking part in this mess, and hopefully they never do.
If things change, I hope its for the better.
No one in gaming wants to alienate a race/gender/creed. Gamers are probably the most open minded in a lot of cases, as older gamers tend to have grown up in an age when bullying the nerd was cool.
The 20 something "neckbeards" grew up being picked on. Being the last guy picked.
It isn't so easy hearing all the negative bullying all over again for stuff most of us are not even part of.
Everyone has opinions, and some even agree with one side over the other, but that doesn't make us all rapist/mosyginst/murderers.

The point of all this has been derailed because Zoe's sex life was brought up. The problem is, that is only a tiny bit of information that doesn't mean much.
The real stuff is much deeper, and we can't even be sure of all the info just yet.
It really is just a waiting game for people that don't want to be a part of all this, and I REALLY don't want to fight, I have done enough of that.

 

[Mr. Enigma]

As much as I like Boogie, lately, it feels like he's just been making videos to cash in on hot topics with opinions that aren't really important or relevant to the issue.

 

[Lazyslob]

boogie seems like a cool guy

 

[Señor Coyote]

I'd be happy to have a proper enthusiast press. Something like music or comics zines. Total fans, bringing a true fan perspective.

What we have isn't that. We have non-journalists pretending to be serious writers, and figuring out how to balance that with the clickbait tone their bosses ask for. Most of these guys come off as though they couldn't care less about most of the games they cover. Which, sadly, leads to the focus on social issues that they clearly aren't nuanced enough writers to tackle in the first place. I think they mean to do well, but their drive to write "meaningful articles" tends to outpace their abilities.

I agree with this 100%. I also think it's linked to a larger problem with journalism as a whole, where what used to be categorized as an opinion piece is now just 'the news'.

 

[PsychoSoldier]

I was going to say "well, shouldn't you?" but I have a better answer: the people that full of hatred for what amounts to a stereotype... maybe there's a reason they end up that way. Probably one you could plausibly be empathetic about.

Getting beat with the short end of the stick is a good way to leave people pissed off and irrational.

More empathy all the way around would be a good thing.

People react the way they do for a reason. Doesn't mean they're right just means it comes from somewhere.

When people feel attacked they tend to act badly and attacking is all twitter is good for.

 

[andymcc]

How often do hipsters get teased for their "dedicated interest" in indie music? Certain nearly militant sports fans about liking teams? Trekkies?

People tend to make generalizations of groups dependent on level of enthusiasm for hobbies. Liking video games and deciding the level in which you interact with video games is a personal choice and it doesn't seem like just because you're a self-described "gamer" you will receive the same level of prejudice or discrimination as, uh, serious lifestyle choices. While I think sometimes people are harsh on "gamers" (especially when it comes to terms neck beards, fedoras, etc.), people don't really let up on hipsters (look at posts on GAF) for making the choices they do.

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

I can definitely see this being the case. For a long while, I saw this debate as one side saying they don't like what games journalism has become while the other side called them misogynists, but I can definitely see an opening for simply a mutual miscommunication, with the other side viewing it as a debate where they say that it's wrong for a depressed female video game developer to be harassed, irrespective of the recent corruption claims, while the opposing side calls them overzealous white knights.

Neither attack against the other side really fits, and that would mainly be because the two sides are essentially sides of two entirely different debates.

I think this is an astute take. The most critical problem is that there's just no one (really no group of people) with the standing or the intellectual heft to put a stop to it, or at least to give structure to the debate. Games pop critical theory is at an extremely primitive stage of development, games journalism is an intellectual wasteland, and games Twitter is far, far worse.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

You should, and they are. If they are jerks venting in general on twitter with #GamersSuck hashtags or whatever it is, ignore it. If they are attacking you or someone you know directly with this crap, block them or report them or... well, unfortunately Twitter doesn't have very good countermeasures for harassment, as we've seen over and over again in recent years. :/

It doesn't make it any easier, there is a very specific reason why I have (I would wager some feel the same) hidden this hobby. Back when I was younger I had zero issue telling people I was a gamer. Hell, I told everyone, always trying to get more and more people to come over for some Mario Kart.. These days, I don't tell anyone that I know in my normal life. Self classifying myself as a gamer carries a certain stigma, it isn't positive.

 

[Superflat]

I think about this a lot more since having young girls in my family (who are now both in grade school). They like video games, and one of them shows real interest in game development. So far they mostly play minecraft, pokemon, little big planet, and a lot of creative/harmless stuff like that -- But I wonder and worry how it will affect them when they get a bit older and start becoming exposed to more games and more types of games. How will they internalize the common portrayals of women in video games (as outlined by anita's videos) when exposed to it over and over and over? How does this affect their self esteem?

I actually worry about this, because their love of gaming right now is so innocent and pure.

If it's any comfort, I see gaming actively getting better as far as representation and diversity. Just in the past two years there's been a huge shift moving towards a multi-cultural, diverse gaming world, in both community and development. What's happening now is growing pains, and it'll eventually lead towards better representation.

As more people who grew up loving and being inspired by games end up making games, the less we're going to see of the typical made-by-committee-and-statistics big budget games that use tired tropes and poor representations.

 

[Scofield94941]

Gamers are not bigots, I liked this video but to say we are at war I dont quite agree with. We are only at war if we say we are. We have nothing to prove to these sites who are trying to get hits calling us bigots. Whenever you have someone attack something someone loves (games) they are going to lash out. The thing is Anita is not attacking anything. I don't understand what these "gamers" are trying to defend against her? What war are we exactly fighting?

 

[Hot Coldman]

And the angry gamers, what's the reason they end up the way they are?

Read the last three pages. Watch the Boogie video.

My point was that Gamergate has inspired lots of sympathy, but there's veerrry little sympathy for those that felt so stressed they did the unthinkable and attacked "gamer".

 

[Imru’ al-Qays]

If it's any comfort, I see gaming actively getting better as far as representation and diversity. Just in the past two years there's been a huge shift moving towards a multi-cultural, diverse gaming world, in both community and development. What's happening now is growing pains, and it'll eventually lead towards better representation.

As more people who grew up loving and being inspired by games end up making games, the less we're going to see of the typical made-by-committee-and-statistics big budget games that use tired tropes and poor representations.

Yeah, I think the industry is maturing quite quickly. I'm optimistic for the future, in spite of this whole debacle.

 

[civilstrife]

GamersGate is a Swedish digital distribution platform.

#gamergate is a hashtag spun out from the Zoe Quinn fiasco, nominally as a way to demand accountability in gaming journalism, but in practice as a way to relentlessly harass freelance writers and indie developers about tiny exchanges of money until they break down and disengage.

The "Gamers Are Over" thing is four or five people connected to the hobby in some way getting so fed up at how this type of misogynist, destructive behavior has become so prominent that they're expressing their disgust and shame with the hobby and identity by saying they're unsalvageable.

Nobody could reasonably draw the conclusion that what's happening here is that these writers, who are themselves gamers and who associate heavily with other gamers in their personal and professional lives, are actually saying that every self-proclaimed gamer ever is objectively a bigot and a monster -- at least without being willfully obtuse.

Thanks! This is illuminating.

 

[unbias]

Goddamnit, I've seen war used so much this last week. Sigh, all it takes is one article and BAM, twitter goes crazy and now there are "armies". Is there an OT where we can take bets on who will get their life threatened 1st, due to fantasy football? Or a way to burn twitter servers down? I'm good with either, honestly I am.

 

[IncandescentPrecept]

It doesn't make it any easier, there is a very specific reason why I have (I would wager some feel the same) hide this hobby. Back when I was younger I had zero issue telling people I was a gamer. Hell, I told everyone, always trying to get more and more people to come over for some Mario Kart.. These days, I don't tell anyone that I know in my normal life. Self classifying myself as a gamer carries a certain stigma, it isn't positive.

I think you need to hang out with better people. Those who won't judge you based on your hobby.

And again, did people miss the comments from the people who came across that bug in Kim Kadarshian's game and starting insulting and threatening her? Are those people not "gamers"?

 

[Rats Off To Ya]

I totally understand being upset with certain things in the industry, but the timing here is orchestrated as a distraction from stuff that was already going on, and now we have two groups at each others' throats when I'm sure plenty would actually see eye-to-eye if they'd stop and think about it for a bit.

This is what frustrates the hell out of me. Games journalism is an echo chamber. Writers are too close to their subjects. They act holier than thou. Many of them habitually express disdain for their audience. All these things are true.

But this time they're right. And this is the time there happens to be a populist uprising that makes all the rest of us look bad. Where was GamerGate when all the journalists were laughing at #PS4noDRM? Where was it when we were called entitled for voicing displeasure at Mass Effect 3's ending? Why does it suddenly spring up when SJWs are conveniently in the crosshairs?

Games journalism has a lot of problems. Fighting for inclusivity ain't one of 'em. And as far as corrupting influences go, indie devs are pretty fuckin' far down on the list. Anyone thinking they're joining a noble cause by supporting GamerGate needs to wise the fuck up.

 

[IcyStorm]

I think you need to hang out with better people. Those who won't judge you based on your hobby.

And again, did people miss the comments from the people who came across that bug in Kim Kadarshian's game and starting insulting and threatening her? Are those people not "gamers"?

I think you're confusing "someone who plays games" with "someone who defines themselves with and strongly identifies with games and the culture that comes with them".

 

[ExVicis]

I really feel a lot of this is just whatever journalism pieces gets disagreed well just get suddenly hit mob justice. I feel like if that whole aspect were gone a lot of this could be much more civil. Yes, there should be less clickbaity titles like "Gamers are Over" but even so there shouldn't be a goddamn concentrated effort to run someone out of the industry. Getting one poor person kicked isn't gonna change anything. If we could just have a less inflammatory response from everyone this would be a lot smoother and less antagonistic issue.

But I don't think we can since at this point everyone is emotionally charged and since those who dispense mob justice really feel like they have no voice as well this might well just keep happening. If we could all stop and take a collective breather for like a day or a week somehow and just look around it would go a long goddamn way for us all and save everyone a ton of grief and allow clearer heads to prevail.

 

[Scofield94941]

gamers had way more abuse back in the day. You couldnt even call yourself a gamer when I was in school without being bullied. This is nothing.

 

[LordJim]

snip

People were mad at ME3 and they were called entitled.
People were annoyed because DmC or whatever game run at 30 FPS and obvious downgrades happened and they were called losers.
People obviously did not stand for being told they were foolish for bot buying in the Xbone narrative.
The pot at some point comes into the boil

 

[nomis]

 

[Steel]

I think you need to hang out with better people. Those who won't judge you based on your hobby.

And again, did people miss the comments from the people who came across that bug in Kim Kadarshian's game and starting insulting and threatening her? Are those people not "gamers"?

And celebrities constantly get death threats and the like over their opinions, hell the real press does too. The internet at large is a cess pool, news at 11.

 

[IcyStorm]

People were mad at ME3 and they were called entitled.
People were annoyed because DmC or whatever game run at 30 FPS and obvious downgrades happened and they were called losers.
People obviously did not stand for being told they were foolish for bot buying in the Xbone narrative.
The pot at some point comes into the boil

I think it's largely how many people seem to voice their disapproval, outrage, and criticisms. I don't think it's a stretch to see how pathetic a lot of it can become. And remember that writers see a lot more of that vile shit directed straight at them for the dumbest of things on a more regular basis; they tend to have a different perspective.

 

[UrbanRats]

GamersGate is a Swedish digital distribution platform.

#gamergate is a hashtag spun out from the Zoe Quinn fiasco, nominally as a way to demand accountability in gaming journalism, but in practice as a way to relentlessly harass freelance writers and indie developers about tiny exchanges of money until they break down and disengage.

The "Gamers Are Over" thing is four or five people connected to the hobby in some way getting so fed up at how this type of misogynist, destructive behavior has become so prominent that they're expressing their disgust and shame with the hobby and identity by saying they're unsalvageable.

Nobody could reasonably draw the conclusion that what's happening here is that these writers, who are themselves gamers and who associate heavily with other gamers in their personal and professional lives, are actually saying that every self-proclaimed gamer ever is objectively a bigot and a monster -- at least without being willfully obtuse.

Ok this clarifies things somewhat, i wasn't sure what or where GamerGate thing originated.

Where does that "4WordsToDescribeaGamer" thing fits into all this? Or is it unrelated?

I can say that the astroturfing campaign is working pretty well in making even people who would've possibly agreed with some of the progressive points made, very much confused and puzzled and defensive, while abusing that confusion to further harass (and drive away) women (and perceived """SJW""" writers) amidst the general chaos.

Possibly one of the most embarrassing moments for the gaming sphere I can remember.

 

[MartyStu]

I...am not entirely sure what is going on. I...am not sure I want to know...

Just in case, is there a summary somewhere?

 

[GutZ31]

Ok this clarifies things somewhat, i wasn't sure what or where GamerGate thing originated.

Where does that "4WordsToDescribeaGamer" thing fits into all this? Or is it unrelated?

I can say that the astroturfing campaign is working pretty well in making even people who would've possibly agreed with some of the progressive points made, very much confused and puzzled and defensive, while abusing that confusion to further harass (and drive away) women (and perceived """SJW""" writers) amidst the general chaos.

Possibly one of the most embarrassing moments for the gaming sphere I can remember.

 

[UrbanRats]

^^^ I know that image, since it gets posted a lot.
Yeah i found those tweets asinine, but where it originated from? And how is it related to this whole debacle?

I...am not entirely sure what is going on. I...am not sure I want to know...

Just in case, is there a summary somewhere?

Charlequin's post explains things a bit.

 

[andymcc]

haha some of these are pretty good, i admit.

 

[Metal Gear?!]

Those 2 people in question are a part of this, but it's not just about them. Right now, it's more about just talking about corruption in the industry. There is a man on YouTube named the Internet Aristrocat, and he has made 3 videos in a series titled "Quinnspiracy Theory". whether you agree with him or not, I still think these 3 videos are worth a view, specially the 2nd one title "In-N-Out".

Not the whole story, but a decent primer on one of the sides of the issue to help one get up to speed.

Have you heard about Loose Change? Not the whole story, but a decent primer on one of the sides of the issue to help one get up to speed.

Again, I am still trying to check and double check things for research as, truthfully and this is me and my own personal opinion here, there is a lot of stuff going around and happening, and it can be overwhelming. The stuff I have read from some of the points raised checks out with what I've checked. Does this mean I agree with this, or any other guy or groups views all the time/none of the time? Of course not, I am trying to learn more from as many sources as I can. Some of this stuff is serious, and it's the reason why I haven't done any stuff like tweet these hashtags or sign petitions or whatnot: I want to be as informed with this as I can.

What do you recommend as a primer to those who are just learning about some of these happenings? I think it would be great if someone could post a catch-up vid series that might be a little less emotional.

http://stream.aljazeera.com/story/201409032102-0024126

https://archive.today/l1kTW

this is the one he linked to on his last video about the subject. the word bigot isn't used in it specifically but the tone is pretty clear. i don't agree that anyone is outright CALLING gamers bigots but the few articles that i've read from the gaming media about this debacle certainly implies that it's either one way or another; one being that you're super progressive and fully support Anita/Zoe/etc or you're a dirty basement dwelling gamer whose time is running out.

all that said, boogie's reaction is probably more based on the social aspect of it i.e. the tumblrs, twitters,etc as there has been A LOT of shit thrown the way of "gamers".

quote from the article i linked

Yes, the article you linked which is all about how a small and defensive contingent of people who play games want ownership who is considered a gamer and what are considered games (Gone Home? NON GAME) are really angry and lashing out and you know what we should just leave the term behind and use something like "players" to describe the superset of everyone who plays games... is secretly implying all gamers (YES YOU) are dirty bigots. BETTER GET MAD ABOUT IT!!!

That's really what hit home for me. It's one thing to be ridiculed/thought less of/teased by outsiders because you identified yourself (or were identified as) a gamer. I caught a bit of crap from family, too. Being a gamer was considered lame or bad for a long time. I never hid it, but I largely kept to myself-- or with small groups of friends-- for years because it wasn't "cool" to be a gamer. It was for kids. It was for nerds. It was for people who weren't me, but there I was.

Then I thought we made progress as games got more popular and started hitting the mainstream. Playing video games wasn't just a nerdy thing to do anymore; lots of people did it. As the industry really took off in the 2000s, being a gamer was a good thing. It was pretty cool to watch, from my perspective.

It began to regress in 2012 as members of gaming press started in with the generalizations. "Entitled babies". "Gross." Now the negatives were being cast not by outsiders, but by the very same people that I relied on to get gaming info from. It's continued on and off since, and Ms. Alexander's piece admittedly struck a nerve with me.

And then her colleagues circled the wagons. And then battle lines were drawn, many of which I didn't see as relating to why I was personally upset. I managed my personal displeasure by unfollowing a mass of gaming press personalities and websites on social media.

And then came the conspiracy theories, the bile, the constant oneupsmanship.

Now? Now it's just a binary mess. With us or against us. Alexander's piece-- despite its apparent intention-- was the powder keg that exploded, and now the fire is out of control.

Gee I wonder what happened that gave "gamers" bad PR? Can you think of anything?

Well no, but a community doesn't have to be objectively having a super hard time in order to feel oppressed and put-upon by society at large. In the US a lot of Christians feel that there's a society-wide conspiracy to marginalize and ostracize them, which is why they get so worked up about stupid bullshit like the "War on Christmas." Gamers are certainly more oppressed than Christians are

Hahahahahahahaha

Opens with a huge straw man. And he's better than that. He's usually very smart.

I'm baffled that people are still using the "You play Crandy Crush? You're a gamer, and they just insulted you!" line of reasoning. Most of the "anti gamer" stuff clearly has a very specific audience. People like his character of Francis. And I think he knows that. God I hope he does at least. I don't know how someone that owes his career to satirizing the typical fanboy could not.

Yes, Francis is a very good example of what people mean when they use "gamer" in a negative way.