Support NeoGAF

[Tigress]

Fucking hell. That's really disappointing. :/

Well, no one is perfect. I'm just waiting for the day that Jim Sterling (I think that's his name, does weekly video rants) rants about something I completely disagree with.

You can't agree with some one on everything. I like a lot of what Boogie has to say but can't say I'm disappointed here. That doesn't mean he doesn't have other stuff I don't agree with though.

 

[ArkkAngel007]

Guys, I don't think we should be focusing on Boogie's views unless it actually deals with the subject at hand. Otherwise this will start getting witch-hunty (slippery slope, I know I know).

 

[Oersted]

He is part of the discussion. And what else should we discuss at this point? Any suggestions?

 

[Gsak]

See it as satire, which actually made people laugh

Agreed. It could be viewed as such. How about some better satire then (though that's a matter of taste, I guess)? Or maybe something that doesn't relate to slavery and house slaves. I've seen that analogy used and it wasn't funny the first time.

 

[hidys]

Guys, I don't think we should be focusing on Boogie's views unless it actually deals with the subject at hand. Otherwise this will start getting witch-hunty (slippery slope, I know I know).

Both Boogie and Sommers have entered themselves as part of this discussion.

They are both relevant at this point.

 

[EmiPrime]

Well, no one is perfect. I'm just waiting for the day that Jim Sterling (I think that's his name, does weekly video rants) rants about something I completely disagree with.

You can't agree with some one on everything. I like a lot of what Boogie has to say but can't say I'm disappointed here. That doesn't mean he doesn't have other stuff I don't agree with though.

This is more than a disagreement over which is the best Zelda game, he has aligned himself with a very problematic campaign and an anti-feminist, beloved of MRAs (while dismissing actual feminists as being illogical) while trying to pass himself off as a moderate voice. I have given him a lot of leeway but it's impossible for me to take him seriously now.

 

[Gsak]

What does this art piece tell us about the 70's?

Sorry but I just had to (just a joke post to lighten the mood):

 

[ArkkAngel007]

Both Boogie and Sommers have entered themselves as part of this discussion.

They are both relevant at this point.

Boogie was relevant on his use of #GAMERGATE, which had nothing to do with Sommers and pretty much ended yesterday. He hasn't linked to Sommers work, just spoke in regards to feminism. However misguided/wrong he may be, until it actually ties in it's not much better than talking about Quinn's sex life.

Otherwise that pretty much gives us free reign to post anything and everything to make an issue of with anyone involved in the present or past, something we've been pretty critical with the #GAMERGATE blowup.

That doesn't mean I don't have a problem with his views; I do. Yet this isn't a 'point out every misogynist/racist/disagreeable person' thread, even if they as a person have had prior or current relation in a fashion.

So far none of Boogie's videos that have been linked here have indicated that he follows Sommers' views. If he didn't put that on Twitter, would we even have known? It's not like the video I was just discussing where someone is going "We're not misogynists" while having things like "sponsored by Quinn's vagina" and Five Guys being used as the blackout in the doxx.

 

[zeldablue]

^^^Hey...my great great great grandmother was a smexy house slave...



In today's society being labeled a bigot is worse than the n word for these people.

I think it's important to note that everyone has natural biases. Both racial and gender bias are ingrained in our culture and both men and women show these biases quite clearly. The feminists show very strong gender bias as well. Religious and political bias is also ingrained into many of our value systems. Bigotry is literally everywhere. If you show distrust or negativity towards ANY group, then you have bigotry in your heart.

All girls have inherent misandristic feelings and all men have misogynistic feelings. Those natural feelings are normalized and accepted and cultivated by our culture. BUT, they don't have to be. The important thing to do is be aware of those feelings instead of denying them. Of cooooourse these people are being misogynistic and of coooourse a lot of the feminists are being misandristic. The only smart thing to do is realize that those feelings are there and that they are not what defines anyone. It's just something no one is willing to own up to.

I say this as someone who has recently stopped being unintentially homophobic and judgmental of other people. I might even be racist and sexist towards my own because of all the experiences I've taken in... I can't say that I can ever stop showing deeply ingrained biases, but I can at least catch myself for when I do display god awful judgements. I have a stronger awareness of how bad of a person I can unintentionally be, and I wish to see a day when everyone can own up to the bigotry they deny.

Prejudice leads to stereotypes, stereotypes leads to hatred.

Sorry but I just had to (just a joke post to lighten the mood):

Lol. This is perfect actually,

 

[Tigress]

This is more than a disagreement over which is the best Zelda game, he has aligned himself with a very problematic campaign and an anti-feminist, beloved of MRAs (while dismissing actual feminists as being illogical) while trying to pass himself off as a moderate voice. I have given him a lot of leeway but it's impossible for me to take him seriously now.

It will be impossible for me to take him seriously on this matter, I agree. And it's very disappointing. But it doesn't ruin other points not related to this. I dunno, I agree it's really disappointing. And it definitely makes me lose respect for him. I always dread learning some one I had good respect for has some thing that will make me lose respect.

But, alternatively, on stuff not related to this he still does have good points.

Well, at least it isn't Jim Sterling as so far he has excellent rants that speak better than I can about the subjects he does (I am seriously dreading the day he comes up with a rant that I completely disagree, heh). Actually, Sterling had a pretty good recent rant on this whole thing last week I think that was pretty moderate.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

In today's society being labeled a bigot is worse than the n word for these people.

I think it's important to note that everyone has natural biases. Both racial and gender bias are ingrained in our culture and both men and women show these biases quite clearly. The feminists show very strong gender bias as well. Religious and political bias is also ingrained into many of our value systems. Bigotry is literally everywhere. If you show less trust or positivity with ANY group, then you have bigotry in your heart.

All girls have inherent misandristic feelings and all men have misogynistic feelings. Those natural feelings are normalized and accepted and cultivated by our culture. BUT, they don't have to be. The important thing to do is be aware of those feelings instead of denying them. Of cooooourse these people are being misogynistic and of coooourse a lot of the feminists are being misandristic. The only smart thing to do is realize that those feelings are there and that they are not what defines you.

I say this as someone who has recently stopped being unintentially homophobic and judgmental of other people. I can't say that I can ever stop showing deeply ingrained biases, but I can at least catch myself for when I do display god awful judgements. I have a stronger awareness of how bad of a person I can unintentionally be, and I wish to see a day when everyone can own up to the bigotry they deny.

Prejudice leads to stereotypes, stereotypes leads to hatred.

Hatred leads to Fear, Fear leads to Anger, Anger leads to Suffering.

Spoiler

Sorry.

Incidentally how would you describe yourself as being unintentionally homophobic in the past? I'm just curious as to what you're using to reflect on your past transgressions or it's just something that came naturally?

Well, at least it isn't Jim Sterling as so far he has excellent rants that speak better than I can about the subjects he does (I am seriously dreading the day he comes up with a rant that I completely disagree, heh). Actually, Sterling had a pretty good recent rant on this whole thing last week I think that was pretty moderate.

Sterling is the guy who three years ago called the Mighty Jill-Off dev a 'femnazi cunt' during the Dickwolves fiasco.

I'm not using that to discredit him, but rather point out how much he's improved and developed some actual tact when discussing these issues without giving into his immediate reactions or feeling obligated to wholly choose a side. I'd also keep this sort of thing in mind when talking about boogie; be disappointed about some of his opinions or even go further to simply ignore him from now on due to it, but don't write him off since people change all the time.

 

[Gsak]

Lol. This is perfect actually,

My god, that face.

 

[EmiPrime]

It will be impossible for me to take him seriously on this matter, I agree. And it's very disappointing. But it doesn't ruin other points not related to this. I dunno, I agree it's really disappointing. And it definitely makes me lose respect for him. I always dread learning some one I had good respect for has some thing that will make me lose respect.

But, alternatively, on stuff not related to this he still does have good points.

Well, at least it isn't Jim Sterling as so far he has excellent rants that speak better than I can about the subjects he does (I am seriously dreading the day he comes up with a rant that I completely disagree, heh). Actually, Sterling had a pretty good recent rant on this whole thing last week I think that was pretty moderate.

If boogie has a change of heart and tries to make amends then I will give him another chance.

It's interesting that you bring up Jim Sterling as he used to be a bit of a nob (to put it mildly) but he did a lot of listening and soul searching and he became a much better person and writer/pundit as a result. I hope boogie can learn from Jim's example.

 

[hidys]

If boogie has a change of heart and tries to make amends then I will give him another chance.

It's interesting that you bring up Jim Sterling as he used to be a bit of a nob (to put it mildly) but he did a lot of listening and soul searching and he became a much better person and writer/pundit as a result. I hope boogie can learn from Jim's example.

I recently went back and watched some of his older stuff. It is phenomenal just how much better he is now.

 

[Oersted]

If boogie has a change of heart and tries to make amends then I will give him another chance.

It's interesting that you bring up Jim Sterling as he used to be a bit of a nob (to put it mildly) but he did a lot of listening and soul searching and he became a much better person and writer/pundit as a result. I hope boogie can learn from Jim's example.

Wouldn't hold my breath, sadly

https://twitter.com/Boogie2988/status/508170053360320512

@ProBearCub but since then its evolved well past zoe and her. their only role is as a prop to prevent real change at this point.

 

[TestOfTide]

boogie since you are awake now, I assume you want to explain your logic in getting yourself to the point where you are aligning yourself with the author of "Rape culture is a ‘panic where paranoia, censorship, and false accusations flourish’"

 

[JDSN]

Probably the most damning of his messages so far, its obvious that this is not some sober attempt to fix game journalist for him, that sounds extremely personal and with some baggage.

This sucks so bad, as a fan of the guy its a shame that someone that is capable of showing empathy ended up supporting people with the same kind of mentality of the ones that have abused of him in the past, a shame someone so sweet can post something so sour and still pretend that his message is of peace and love.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

Unless my memory sucks and that's not Django Unchained Jackson I'm pretty sure they're just calling Sommers an Uncle Tom.

That literally was the point of his character in the movie and I don't see how that's a racist point to make. May as well complain that Uncle Ruckus in Boondocks is racist (in terms of how the show uses him) if that's how you see that concept.

EDIT: Huh, Lime got banned for it so I guess the mod's didn't see it that way either? I'll shut up about it then.

 

[zeldablue]

Hatred leads to Fear, Fear leads to Anger, Anger leads to Suffering.

Spoiler

Sorry.

Incidentally how would you describe yourself as being unintentionally homophobic in the past? I'm just curious as to what you're using to reflect on your past transgressions or it's just something that came naturally?

Traditional household, I guess? I had a lot of gay friends in college and slowly began to understand why gay people suffer so much. And also, I learned that being indifferent isn't exactly okay either. :/ I would never deny a friendship because of someone being different, but I never went the extra mile to understand why being different shouldn't be a problem. Lol.

More importantly, I became really depressed after a good friend of mine and his girlfriend, kind of, demonized me. I wanted to be in the right, but I couldn't really grab onto anything to defend myself with. So I was just an angry emotional wreck instead.

I think I eventually realized I was in the wrong and was hiding repressed feelings from my parents divorce. It confused me at first, but then I realized a lot of my choices and faults were tied to that fear/trauma. So much so that I might have been slightly suicidal. So...now that I know where my anger/fear comes from, I can better articulate and understand others.

Right now, I see the parallel of "gamers" trying to defend themselves by throwing a defensive hissy fit. And I kind of just see a sad reenactment of my own transgressions.

We need to stop thinking this is about something else. This has everything to do with our fear of change and nothing else.

 

[Oersted]

Probably the most damning of his messages so far, its obvious that this not some sober atempt to fix game journalist for him, that sounds extremely personal.

Read my post. He was a couple of damning ones. Its quite worrisome.

Edit:

Agreed. It could be viewed as such. How about some better satire then (though that's a matter of taste, I guess)? Or maybe something that doesn't relate to slavery and house slaves. I've seen that analogy used and it wasn't funny the first time.

I know you got banned, but I want you to know that didn't really like the joke (?) either. It was just ridicule for your "satire".

 

[TaroYamada]

Classy.

Why don't you just come right out and call her a house nigger you hypocritical piece of shit.

You're a fucking piece of shit.

Holy shit, wow.

So given your reactions this was rather rude? But whatever the implication is of that photograph is lost on me, so can someone please explain?

 

[Earl_Grey]

So given your reactions this was rather rude? But whatever the implication is of that photograph, is lost on me so can someone please explain?

The character depicted is what's called an Uncle Tom. A black man who collaborated with slave owners in exchange for special privileges.

Sommers is considered somewhat of an anti-feminist by a lot of her critics. Hence the comparison.

 

[HyperBitHero]

Fuckin' A. Too far.

Edit: was replying to that image but I guess quoting it has been disabled

 

[BennyBlanco]

So given your reactions this was rather rude? But whatever the implication is of that photograph is lost on me, so can someone please explain?

Google Sam Jackson in Django Unchained. Not gonna explain it here but the implication was rather ugly.

 

[TaroYamada]

The character depicted is what's called an Uncle Tom. A black man who collaborated with slave owners in exchange for special privileges.

Oh, I know what an Uncle Tom is I just didn't realize that's what the photo represented. Thank you.

Google Sam Jackson in Django Unchained. Not gonna explain it here but the implication was rather ugly.

That explains it, haven't seen that film.

 

[EmiPrime]

I recently went back and watched some of his older stuff. It is phenomenal just how much better he is now.

It really is night and day. He's even more cutting now and he still has his saucy sense of humour but this time everyone is in on the joke and his rants. He proved a lot of people wrong.

 

[Toshi_TNE]

So given your reactions this was rather rude? But whatever the implication is of that photograph is lost on me, so can someone please explain?

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_Negro

That picture, in that context, is one of the most horrible things I've seen posted here.

 

[TestOfTide]

So given your reactions this was rather rude? But whatever the implication is of that photograph is lost on me, so can someone please explain?

Lime was explaining that CHSommers is a as much a "feminist" as Samuel L Jackson's character in django was a civil rights leader. Went a bit far though.

 

[drproton]

Lime was explaining that CHSommers is a as much a "feminist" as Samuel L Jackson's character in django was a civil rights leader. Went a bit far though.

Explaining... Right. That's what it's called.

 

[Señor Coyote]

It's disturbing to see users like Lime trying to manipulate Boogie into agreeing with them and then turning quite nasty when it doesn't work out. Boogie is a good guy but it's this sort of dismissive bullying that leads people like him to go further to the right.

 

[ArkkAngel007]

Probably the most damning of his messages so far, its obvious that this is not some sober attempt to fix game journalist for him, that sounds extremely personal.

This sucks so bad, as a fan of the guy its a shame that someone that is capable of showing empathy ended up supporting people with the same kind of mentality of the ones that have abused of him in the past, a shame someone so sweet can post something so sour and still pretend that his message is of peace and love.

Ok, I change my mind (since it came around back to it...why boog?). I mean, is that how you should carry through with the hurt you received? You have a bunch of followers on a channel, a lot of communities that respect you...why not turn there instead of 'why didn't these women/people stand with me who had a lot more going on and no relation to me?'

Unlike them and others, he wasn't drawn into or directly targeted through #GAMERGATE. He put himself into it and somewhat made it about him, and not necessarily in the best fashion.

 

[Earl_Grey]

It's disturbing to see users like Lime trying to manipulate Boogie into agreeing with them and then turning quite nasty when it doesn't work out. Boogie is a good guy but it's this sort of dismissive bullying that leads people like him to go further to the right.

I honestly don't think he needs much help in that regard. Earlier, he was arguing that he was a moderate, but a lot of the things he's tweeting and retweeting aren't moderate at all.

 

[Oersted]

It's disturbing to see users like Lime trying to manipulate Boogie into agreeing with them and then turning quite nasty when it doesn't work out. Boogie is a good guy but it's this sort of dismissive bullying that leads people like him to go further to the right.

Manipulate into agreeing with them? What manipulation and who is them?

 

[antigoon]

Damn, Boogie.

It wouldn't bother me as much if he didn't keep posting in here like he was being a moderate voice of reason or whatever. JUST PREACHING KINDNESS.

so misguided.

 

[Mumei]

The correct analogue for Christina Hoff Sommers is Shelby Steele.

Steele believes that the use of victimization is the greatest hindrance for black Americans. In his view, white Americans see blacks as victims to ease their guilty conscience, while blacks attempt to turn their status as victims into a kind of currency that will purchase nothing of real or lasting value. Therefore, he claims, blacks must stop "buying into this zero-sum game" by adopting a "culture of excellence and achievement" without relying on "set-asides and entitlements."

 

[Toxi]

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_Negro

That picture, in that context, is one of the most horrible things I've seen posted here.

I don't think that's what Lime was getting at.

But holy shit was that a bad comparison.

 

[TestOfTide]

It's disturbing to see users like Lime trying to manipulate Boogie into agreeing with them and then turning quite nasty when it doesn't work out. Boogie is a good guy but it's this sort of dismissive bullying that leads people like him to go further to the right.

People weren't manipulating boogie. They were trying to help reason with boogie before he let himself associate with this movement too much.

It's like trying to convince someone to stop following the Tea Party after all the data about their non-independent views are revealed before they start saying something like "man, we should listen to alex jones he's such a progressive."

 

[Alex_Mexico]

I thought I was up to date with this whole #notallmen #gamergate #notyourshield fiasco but then I came here and begin reading the last pages and I decided I give up. Isn't anyone else out there just tired of this already? I swear I thought I was caught up with this but who the hell is Boogie? And in the name of all that is holy; who is this Sommers!?

Why were ppl still debating whether this Zoe, who I didn't know who she was at all before this scandal, did or did not slept with people?

Why are "celebrities" like Adam Baldwin, who you'd think he'd had something else to do with his time than being a complete douchebag and tweet about this #GamerGate nonsense and even tweet directly to Anita Sarkeesian making fun of her "scary threats" callIng into question her statements with no evidence at all?

Why do we have a woman being threatened, harassed and calling her thing like "con artist", "thief", "liar" and my personal favorite "professional victim" without any evidence whatsoever but conjectures and wild conspiracy theories just because she dared to make her opinions public! And she's the head of a non profit organization well established and regulated by US law! She ain't maiming money off of this whole Tropes vs women on Videogames! She isn't even accepting ads being ran on her videos! The people that gave her those $160,000 Kickstarter money gave them to her because they wanted to. No one conned them or pickpocketed them.

Remember that "Sex Box" Mass Effect-Fox News scandal where there was this book author Cooper Lawrence spewing factual lies about a videogame she openly admitted, when asked on live basic cable, she had never played the game before? And then gamers proceeded to downvote and post bad reviews about her book on Amazon saying ingenius things like "I never read the book, but someone told me it was pornography and that it was bad so it must really be bad. 1/5 stars"? Remember that? That was a case worth fighting for, goddammit! That kind of crap on mainstream media can hurt gaming. Not whether or not an indie developer slept around or that some woman wants to "take our videogames from us" because she's argumenting games could be more inclusive!

I have never truly ever in my life felt so ashamed, nauseated, and disgusted of out gaming subculture than I am today. If only we could let people state their opinions without death threats. It should be THAT simple.

And this, I hope, the last time I let myself do down this road. It never goes well for me and it only puts me on a bad mood.

 

[zeldablue]

The correct analogue for Christina Hoff Sommers is Shelby Steele.

Wouldn't it be smarter to promote the parts of feminism that makes sense, (equal pay, parental leave, better representation, objectification, educational assurance) while arguing against the grey stuff? (Abortion, rape, insurance, divorce, victim-complex)

It never makes sense to me to just stupidly deny something entirely...

 

[JDSN]

It's disturbing to see users like Lime trying to manipulate Boogie into agreeing with them and then turning quite nasty when it doesn't work out. Boogie is a good guy but it's this sort of dismissive bullying that leads people like him to go further to the right.

Do you feel people him where manipulating him or attacking him? If so, with him being a member of this community you should contact a moderator and point out at the abuse, and honestly, if your take on things can be easily turned into a more radical one because some people are telling you might be mistaken the problem might not be about what you say it is.

Dont imply that people on the opposite side of the issue are responsible for making his views turn more radical, there is no conspiracy going on.

 

[Toxi]

The correct analogue for Christina Hoff Sommers is Shelby Steele.

This reminds me a lot what I read about Booker T. Washington. Seems almost like his philosophies played to their extreme.

Wouldn't it be smarter to promote the parts of feminism that makes sense, (equal pay, parental leave, better representation, objectification, educational assurance) while arguing against the grey stuff? (Abortion, rape, insurance, divorce, victim-complex)

It never makes sense to me to just stupidly deny something entirely...

Every single one of those things you put as "makes sense" is often considered "grey stuff".

Also, I would consider abortion rights and rape extremely important issues to focus on that shouldn't be dismissed just because you know people are uncomfortable about them.

 

[EmiPrime]

Wouldn't it be smarter to promote the parts of feminism that makes sense, (equal pay, parental leave, better representation, objectification, educational assurance) while arguing against the grey stuff? (Abortion, rape, insurance, divorce, victim-complex)

It never makes sense to me to just stupidly deny something entirely...

You've made a few questionable points in this thread but this is quite something. Care to explain how rape and access to abortion as issues are distinct from the parts of feminism you think "make sense"?

 

[The Silver]

Damn, Boogie.

It wouldn't bother me as much if he didn't keep posting in here like he was being a moderate voice of reason or whatever. JUST PREACHING KINDNESS.

so misguided.

When you look at Boogie's Francis character and how he uses it to overcome his personal struggles of being seen as a sterotype, it's easy to see how this issue would affect him so much. It's sad to see his judgement get so clouded like this, oh well.

 

[zeldablue]

This reminds me a lot what I read about Booker T. Washington. Seems almost like his philosophies played to their extreme.

Every single one of those things you put as "makes sense" is often considered "grey stuff".

Also, I would consider abortion rights and rape extremely important issues to focus on that shouldn't be dismissed just because you know people are uncomfortable about them.

I mean...
Wouldn't it be better to agree with certain aspects and disagree with other aspects without saying the whole thing is rubbish?

Because for me, there are points with Anita, I agree with and other points I'm not so crazy about. All of her points are important to think about, but as you say, they are all subjective depending on your values.

You've made a few questionable points in this thread but this is quite something. Care to explain how rape and access to abortion as issues are distinct from the parts of feminism you think "make sense"?

There are anti feminists who stand against everything that has to do with feminism. I'm asking why they refute the whole thing.

I live with the fear of rape culture and everything too, but not everyone agrees that it exists. (Which is concerning)

 

[Oersted]

Wouldn't it be smarter to promote the parts of feminism that makes sense, (equal pay, parental leave, better representation, objectification, educational assurance) while arguing against the grey stuff? (Abortion, rape, insurance, divorce, victim-complex)

It never makes sense to me to just stupidly deny something entirely...

How is rape a grey-area?

 

[ArkkAngel007]

I thought I was up to date with this whole #notallmen #gamergate #notyourshield fiasco but then I came here and begin reading the last pages and I decided I give up. Isn't anyone else out there just tired of this already? I swear I thought I was caught up with this but who the hell is Boogie? And in the name of all that is holy; who is this Sommers!?

Of course we're tired of it, but it's not going away. It almost did but then blew up again and has been the pattern since the initial Quinn stuff.

Boogie aka Francis operates as a YouTube personality that many find endearing. If you want to know who he is.

Sommer has been mentioned in the past page or two with apt summarization that you should have little trouble finding. In short, anti-feminist posing as a new-age feminist.

Why were ppl still debating whether this Zoe, who I didn't know who she was at all before this scandal, did or did not slept with people?

Welcome to the club, though I had heard of Depression Quest prior to it's highlight following the passing of Robin Williams. To answer your question, it isn't who she slept with but why is what people are focusing on with their own agendas behind that question.

Why are "celebrities" like Adam Baldwin, who you'd think he'd had something else to do with his time than being a complete douchebag and tweet about this #GamerGate nonsense and even tweet directly to Anita Sarkeesian making fun of her "scary threats" callIng into question her statements with no evidence at all?

There are far more knowledgable people than I on this. I've heard things from IRC chats conspiring to bring him in due to his conservative nature to that he's just using it for free attention.

Why do we have a woman being threatened, harassed and calling her thing like "con artist", "thief", "liar" and my personal favorite "professional victim" without any evidence whatsoever but conjectures and wild conspiracy theories just because she dared to make her opinions public! And she's the head of a non profit organization well established and regulated by US law! She ain't maiming money off of this whole Tropes vs women on Videogames! She isn't even accepting ads being ran on her videos! The people that gave her those $160,000 Kickstarter money gave them to her because they wanted to. No one conned them or pickpocketed them.

Because it's fun to a lot of people and brings in more attention than just the tired old topics of press junkets. Hell, the IGF stuff that is being brought up again wouldn't be looked at if it wasn't about Quinn and Fish.

They know it's easier to sell a scandal, especially regarding sex, than just names and concepts.

I have never truly ever in my life felt so ashamed, nauseated, and disgusted of out gaming subculture than I am today. If only we could let people state their opinions without death threats. It should be THAT simple.

And this, I hope, the last time I let myself do down this road. It never goes well for me and it only puts me on a bad mood.

It should be that simple, but keep in mind that it's a problem with people in general, not just the community. It just seems more prominent here because that's where our interests lie and thus what we see, and that this is recent.

Unfortunately, there's no real solution but in hopes that these people get bored and move on with their lives, and those that truly believe in the issues they prop up can do it without harassing or acting in a bigoted manner.

 

[Cuyejo]

#NotYourShield - We Are Gamers

 

[EmiPrime]

I mean...
Wouldn't it be better to agree with certain aspects and disagree with other aspects without saying the whole thing is rubbish?

Because to do so sometimes represents a massive misunderstanding about what the movement is about. Someone can't chuck out things as intrinsic to contemporary feminism as bodily autonomy and violence against women as issues and still claim to be a feminist.

 

[ReaperXL7]

ok so i'm trying to educate myself on this whole thing and to be honest i'm having a hard time swimming through the sea of nasty. I listened to this video that was sent to me and i'm curious how it would be viewed in the situation?

http://youtu.be/O-rnW8XjQnE

I honestly did not even know who Zoe and Anita were until today so i'm way behind on the details but there are a lot of views and opinions on the subject (i'm also reading through this thread and some stuff on reddit).

 

[zeldablue]

How is rape a grey-area?

It's sometimes hard to prove. And people fear false accusations.

I think teaching people more about it and liftng the stigma would be much better so that men, women and children don't have to feel that shame or fear of lying if they become a victim. I know people who suffer quietly from it, and it makes me very angry when others deny it's a problem. but in terms of laws, I would have no clue where to go. I have friends who laugh at the concept of rape culture, so you'll have to forgive me if I feel it is hard to argue against.

Yikes!