Have you read the part where the GPU is actually 4 to 5 Tflops without even accounting for the twice multiplier becausen hey why not?
PES 2015 : 1080P 60 FPS on PS4 - 720P 60 FPS on X1
- Thread starter Sweep14
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Have you read the part where the GPU is actually 4 to 5 Tflops without even accounting for the twice multiplier becausen hey why not?
Is it going to be during this gen?
But it is accurate. PS4 is demonstrably significantly more powerful in every conceivable way. And I've provided a trillion links throughout this topic to support the view. You know, facts. And, as I said, almost every dev up until his comment has said PS4 tools are much better, including 4A recently on the development of Metro.
Sorry it offends you BruiserBear, but that's no surprise.
Jimmyfenix
Member
Sponsored by Major Nelson facts.
None of them, obviously, but again, that's a meaningless abstraction that has no practical value for the people asking the question. No one cares what the results would be in some bizarro universe, they care about the practical results we have seen, and will do for the next five years.
BibiMaghoo
Member
For what little it's worth, a quick google does clearly bring back results for different people with that same name.
Not that I believe that is the case here, but it is possible.
Cthulhu_Steev
Member
Maybe with their console OSs, but you say they are also slow updating their development tools as well? How do you know this?
No, you are absolutely entitled to have your favorites, but by the same token we are allowed to evaluate your posts while taking into account your biases (more than just your avatar, most of your posting history is in MS related threads).
This thread really is amazing in so many ways.
I want to believe, but Mattrick, Mehdi, Harrison and partly Spencer were talking so much bullshit about the "cloud" and whatnot Azzure could deliver. I mean, if you are a developer you have my respect and all, but to counter the power difference with the "cloud" is something... well, I guess the story is known.
The thing is, the Fox engine runs perfectly fine on the PS4, and, let's be honest, that's the console this game is going to sell most on.
To spend time and resources to build a new engine for PES just so the PS4 and X1 versions can run identical is a waste, especially since those X1 only owners who happen to also be PES fans will probably be content with what they get.
Are you the same mrb1972 from AVForums?
BruiserBear
Banned
No, I'm not going to provide you quotes and links, but I've definitely seen/heard a few developers say things suggesting the XB1 tools have gotten much better over the course of this year. Maybe even to the point where they're easier to work with than the PS4.
That's what Kampfheld comments suggested.
And no, none of this offends me. Unlike half of the people in this thread I bought both consoles the day they came out, and I've bought every third party game so far on my PS4. It's lovely having my objectivity questioned by people who only own one console though, but thisisneogaf.gif.
Vroadstar
Member
Exposed!
So if I said the PS4 is 50% more powerful rather than slightly everyone would have been cool, but because I have my own theory/opinion people try and hound me off the site
Codes4Food
Banned
It's not about a weaker part preforming better. It could be the weaker part performing weaker than it should. It could be a stronger part performing weaker than it should. You can throw all the power in the world at something, but that doesn't mean it will run well, if it's not coded well
Cthulhu_Steev
Member
Can you run a 1080p deferred renderer on the cloud at 60fps?
I want you to stick around to see if you can escape the curse of '72.
Well if you can't provide links, it doesn't do anyone any good.
By that logic you cannot compare Nvidia to AMD because they run different software drivers and have different hardware, that is blatantly nonsense though.
From a pure hardware perspective the PS4 is around 50% faster than the Xbox One when the ESRAM is optimally utilised, the API, OS, SDK etc etc will have a small impact on this difference but not enough to explain the difference in Fox Engine games which leads back to the ESRAM being the limiting factor for this specific engine.
Yes, but to my point Sony is not writing poorly optimized code.
I'm not "Gaf", but i will never jump on something artificially increasing the latency, using my bandwith and creating the perfect DRM system where i own nothing.
All for something i could do locally.
What is it that the XB1 architecture has that the PS4 is lacking that makes it more efficient?
Yes, pretty much because that is the way it is. That would be a factual statement.
You could have said that the PS4 is 50% faster but you do not see a 50% difference in the final image quality and that would move from factual objective statements to a subjective statement you can have an opinion on. For some people 900p vs 1080p makes no real difference, for others it does and that is down to each individual.
Google mrb1972, I suppose everyone of those is me too, right?
Who did that? I must have missed it.
The PS4 is effectively 40-50% more powerful. There is nothing wrong with having a different opinion but don't act surprised when people correct you.
Codes4Food
Banned
Is it the ESRAM or how it's being used? This engine has yet to be optimized for the Xbox one.
He's referring to the fact that I said I'm not surprised he's offended by this. But I was referring to his habit to concern troll in every topic he is apart of for the last six months.
Cthulhu_Steev
Member
BruiserBear spotted in the bushes outside Redmond HQ with his Bell & Howell SK-8 and his hand-drill.
Mostly the ones very much interested in the topic at hand I would assume.
You've stated your opinion without proof. People have refuted what you said with quotes.
You have given no evidence to back up your "theory/opinion", you have been asked multiple times to give evidence but you get offended.
This is a discussion forum, you're entitled to your opinion but if you don't back things you state as fact then you'll rightly be contested.
Doctor Hades
Member
That is undoubtedly true because at launch there were quotes from Microsoft's top bods saying things like the difference between 720p and 1080p is not that noticeable, etc, etc, but, of course, that was before the media and sites like Digital Foundry started doing detailed Face-offs of PS4 and Xbox One games!
I strongly believe that had there not been so much focus on 1080p console games and how the PS4 version of multi-format titles were usually better that Microsoft would not have helped out on Destiny and Diablo 3 but would have been fine with them running at 900p or whatever they were before they were patched. I mean they were fine with releasing the underwhelming (IMO) Titanfall, a much hyped Xbox console exclusive, at 792p and running at an inconsistent framerate with screen tearing but that game obviously doesn't have a PS4 version to compare to!
I am here as a gamer. And I have my very own tastes - just like you. My personal main console is Xbox. This is obvious and has to do with Halo and friends only. This does not mean I don't like Playstationnation. If you find a single statement here where I bashed Playstation in any form, ban me. I didn't. It's simply not the platform I game much on. It's simple as that. I just try to seperate my daily work from my own opinion. Sometimes I try to give interesting insights into game developement. This is all.
And I totally understand you. At least right now. People are tired of this, I am not dumb. All I can say is: wait.
I asked earlier if it's 2016 yet
Ricky Ricardo
Member
These links, when are they dated? Because it is very common knowledge that the XB1's software dev suite was terribly hobbled at launch and very recently, we've seen commentary about the speed at which MS has worked to get the XDK running again.
This demo is AMAZING. Everything about it feels worlds better than PES2014. Of course, I'll have to wait for the retail version to see how annoying the licensing issues and rest of the UI are, but from a pure gameplay standpoint this feels vastly superior to FIFA15. Loving it.
Well it looks like the cloud talk is back.
I just can't see in what conceivable way this cloud thing is going to help with XB1's performance compared to PS4. Hardware is hardware. Magical tricks from the sky can't change that.
Unless I'm missing something. In which case somebody please enlighten me....
I just can't see in what conceivable way this cloud thing is going to help with XB1's performance compared to PS4. Hardware is hardware. Magical tricks from the sky can't change that.
Unless I'm missing something. In which case somebody please enlighten me....
As much as we know, Sony dev tools allow for (more) direct access to the hardware... unlike MS tools. I think MS has pledged to make new API accessible to do the same, but I dont think thats available yet.
When it comes to the PS4, they really did a great job with SDK and overall implementation.
You are probably confusing things with something else.
Could be either at the moment. More optimisation might help improve the situation but it could just be that with their engine the g-buffer is too large to fit into ESRAM at anything greater than 720p and the performance penalty for putting the render target in the main memory pool makes higher resolutions impossible.
I would expect something can be done on the software side but it might come at the expense of some other effects, we just have to wait and see.
Do you have experience with the PS4 SDK ? Are your comments based on a first-hand comparison? Or are you echoïng things you've heard ?
gundamkyoukai
Member
So i see last set of pages have gone crazy and now we have dev saying how cloud going to a make a difference .
Side note what is stopping Sony from doing the same thing .
Any way back on topic X1 must not work good with Fox engine and i guess they have more work to do with it .
Of course that is if they willing to put extra work in for the ROI.
Side note what is stopping Sony from doing the same thing .
Any way back on topic X1 must not work good with Fox engine and i guess they have more work to do with it .
Of course that is if they willing to put extra work in for the ROI.
As I said, 4A developers just said the PS4 tools were better on the development of Metro. That's the most recent comment any dev has made on the tools up until this thread. So I'm asking someone to define what has changed in those two months since the comment, and provide links showing other devs who have agreed to it.
So far, as far as I can find (and trust me, I've been searching vigorously this whole time), almost every dev that has commented to date has suggested PS4 is ahead of tools, up until that last comment two months ago. So unless we can define what has changed, I have to go with the overwhelming evidence before us.
Edit: Actually, the comments were made 8/27/2014. So only one month!
It is unacceptable to hunt down poster's accounts in different places and drag them into GAF to be used as an attack. Detective GAF at your own risk, knowing that the line between it and just flat out harassment is thin.
If you have an issue with a poster, you contact a mod, rather than take it into your own hands to hunt down details of their wider life and publicize them.
If you have an issue with moderation, feel free to PM a moderator or send an email to support@neogaf.com.
If you have an issue with a poster, you contact a mod, rather than take it into your own hands to hunt down details of their wider life and publicize them.
If you have an issue with moderation, feel free to PM a moderator or send an email to support@neogaf.com.
Misterxmedia is a troll/wind-up blog. Nobody with a sound mind would actually believe the insane things he posts. Maybe there was a question of power differences immediately post-launch but at this point we all know where both consoles stand in terms of power.
Misterx is probably a Sony fan getting a kick out of winding everybody up with his "moon landing truthers" level of crazy.
Xbox one has 100% more external power supplies than PS4. And 100% more HDMI sockets.
Codes4Food
Banned
People in the industry don't really consider APIs/SDKs to be "tools". Tools usually refer to development tools (visual studio, debuggers, example projects, code examples). A dev codes against a SDK and/or API. This may be an solution provided by Sony/Ms or not. These usually aren't referred to as tools. Another degree of separation which is most used is a game engine. This is saves a lot of time, money and complications, but is by nature less optimized. In the case of pes they used an engine to create their game. This of course limits your ability to optimize to the metal.
Well, how would you feel if any time you made a statement, someone went back through just your GAF history to show that you had a history of lying as a way to discredit you? I think you and I both know that would not be hard argument to make, given your history at GAF. Does that sound like a reasonable thing for me to do to prove that you're wrong about the percentage of power available for a console? Because, to me, it seems like it would be a pretty shitty thing to do over a dumb console war argument.
If you'd like to discuss it further, feel free to PM me.
BruiserBear
Banned
Absolutely nothing I say around here is insincere. I do enjoy knocking down misinformation and hyperbole, and there seems to be a lot of it around here these days, much of it directed at the XB1. So I guess you view that as concern trolling?
I actually said this to you in another thread, and it was 100% sincere. I don't know if everyone around here has the same definition of "concern trolling" in their head. It's not like there is a dictionary somewhere you can look it up.
Yes, you are right. Not the correct place for that here. I also don't know why I am even trying ...
I am out here, no more questions to me in this thread pls.One last comment to the misterx thing: he does not know anything.