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Legend of Korra Book 4: Balance |OT| A Feast of Crows

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I agree with the sentiment of A-V-B that saying "show must still be good or you wouldn't be watching" is a shitty argument. Sometimes people are too invested in a universe or characters from previous seasons to quit this late in the series. The show isn't by any means horrible, but just because we're watching doesn't mean it has to be good.

By that logic nobody would hate-watch movies/shows or watch/read "So bad it's good" media.
 
I agree with the sentiment of A-V-B that saying "show must still be good or you wouldn't be watching" is a shitty argument. Sometimes people are too invested in a universe or characters from previous seasons to quit this late in the series. The show isn't by any means horrible, but just because we're watching doesn't mean it has to be good.

By that logic nobody would hate-watch movies/shows or watch/read "So bad it's good" media.
It's still better than Dexters final season. I was like, "What the fuck, fuck this show!" after the conclusion. I just don't like how people see us criticizing the show and just assume that we hate the show. I don't hate Korra per say and I still like watching it, sometimes it just doesn't live up to its potential or does something annoying. That's what's usually being discussed around here, or it just does something far off the mark. Bolin's attempts at humor or the best examples because sometimes he just acts like he has a brain tumor, like how he can't really finish sentences. He has to physically act them out because he just can't verbalize it properly.
 
I don't even hate watch or go for the so bad it's good thing that much.

Sometimes I just watch bad shit because it's informative for understanding narrative.

The first season of RWBY is basically a college course for how not to do narrative pacing, combined with some notions of what makes and does not make the animu hijinks viable as comedy and how to choose voice acting.

Walking Dead teaches you how character stupidity can and cannot work to the satisfaction of the viewer. Also, how willing people are to accept improbabilities.

Legend of Korra shows, among other things, how long a fanbase can put up with bad shit provided it is a spin off from a good source, though the Prequel trilogy is an even better example of that.

All the stuff I've written up on it was as much as my benefit as for anyone else. Writing helps me identify the problems vs if I just had them in my head and didn't put them on paper.

For me, it's an autopsy.
 
Oh god RWBY. I couldn't after 2 episodes. It felt like it was going to be a less interesting Medeka Box...and I don't like Medeka box
 
Oh my goodness. Between this comic and the Kuvira/Suyin comics, fans are really showing me just how much potential these characters had.... This actually made me understand Baatar more.

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Oh my goodness. Between this comic and the Kuvira/Suyin comics, fans are really showing me just how much potential these characters had.... This actually made me understand Baatar more.
Stop showing me things I want to see animated, but will never get. These fan artists were better off writing some portions of the show...my god. Great comic. At least the fandom loves Kuvira and her potential stories.
 
You're assuming they even exist.
Good point. A writing meeting probably went like this:
Writer: "How do we get people to care about Kuvira? She seems to have an interesting backstory."
Bryke:
"Give her a Nazi train cannon!"
Writer:
"But that's...evil and makes her seem like a lunatic Nazi."
Bryke:
"Nazi. Train. Cannon."
 
I watched the season finale again a month ago, and I just realized that Bolin was still doing the bird calls when they were crashing down on the Bison. I thought that was amusing, but him bringing it up at the conference was still terrible.
 
I watched the season finale again a month ago, and I just realized that Bolin was still doing the bird calls when they were crashing down on the Bison. I thought that was amusing, but him bringing it up at the conference was still terrible.
Lol they added that in BECAUSE of the conference. They just reused the VA's lines before calling him in to do it again for it.

I thought the Zaheer sock gag worked a lot better on repeat viewings.
Eh. It kills the intensity a bit.
 
I don't mind the Zaheer sock gag thing so much. Maybe he shouldn't have gone all maniacal, but as powerful as he was, he didn't come off as really intelligent. He has basically 1 teacher he subscribed to wholly and unquestioningly, which is always fucking stupid to do. I don't know if he actually is stupid, but he was never put in a position where he actually had to defend his philosophy, which is a totally wasted opportunity.

I could respect Zaheer's power and determination, but I always thought he came off as kind of an idiot. Sock in mouth was warranted because he just wouldn't shut the fuck up.
 
I'd rather they just kill Zaheer. Reminds me of way too many people I've talked with that are all about that anarchy/ 5th of November stuff. Just shut up.
 
Worse (Is it? Your mileage may vary), it was about both Bolin's bird call gag and Zaheer sock gag.
I'm the person that wanted Tonraq to pimp smack Bolin out of a mid flight airship for the bird calls in the conference room. I was fine when he did it after the part where he lands on Kai's bison. Regarding sock in mouth...it was alright. Kind of one of those Scooby Doo moments. Though usually in Scooby Doo the main character isn't laying unconscious on the ground from mercury poisoning.
 
I'd rather they just kill Zaheer. Reminds me of way too many people I've talked with that are all about that anarchy/ 5th of November stuff. Just shut up.

That's be fine if he actually said different things regarding anarchy, but it was just "CHAOS IS THE REAL ORDER, GURU LAHIMA GOAT" over and over on repeat. We weren't gaining any new insight or information, so he was just babbling. I would gladly take V for Vendetta dialogue (especially the comics) if that were the case.
 
That's be fine if he actually said different things regarding anarchy, but it was just "CHAOS IS THE REAL ORDER, GURU LAHIMA GOAT" over and over on repeat. We weren't gaining any new insight or information, so he was just babbling. I would gladly take V for Vendetta dialogue (especially the comics) if that were the case.
They do like to keep their villains one note. It would've been fucking hilarious if the Z Team went out for some food immediately after killing the Earth Queen. "Earth Queen's dead, let's go get some fries guys."
 
That's be fine if he actually said different things regarding anarchy, but it was just "CHAOS IS THE REAL ORDER, GURU LAHIMA GOAT" over and over on repeat. We weren't gaining any new insight or information, so he was just babbling. I would gladly take V for Vendetta dialogue (especially the comics) if that were the case.
At the very least give him COMIC VfV dialogue.

But like a lot of numbskulls, he's just on about anarchy/no governments and chaos. For fuck's sake.
 
I'd rather they just kill Zaheer. Reminds me of way too many people I've talked with that are all about that anarchy/ 5th of November stuff. Just shut up.

Zaheer's philosophy was flawed. But he's a lot more likable than Kuvira. Sorry breh. Way better character. He's bad ass. Loved that scene with him and Korra.

Kuvira is squandered potential. Honestly, while Zaheer had a very flawed philosophy, the only issue with his character was them not fleshing out his beliefs more. Like how he came to believe them. What his past was like, that shaped who he was today, and why he was so driven. They alluded to an interesting past (especially with him and his Girlfriend).

But in terms of personality, and just overall as an antagonist. I would take him any day over Kuvira.

I wanted to love her, but I can't. She has such a punchable face, and they haven't done enough with her that she's starting to dip into Unalaq territory (she's not that bad, but starting to feel like it).

EDIT: I think Zaheer's views only seem like your typical anarchist, because Bryke didn't want to flesh out the plot enough. So it's like, all you ever get is surface level representation. When you have surface level rep of a political view, it comes off as the typical people that casually spout off shit, without ever really going deeper then that. I want to think that, Zaheer had more depth to what he believed in and wasn't just a typical surface level Anarchist. But again, writers dropped the ball. Still, I liked him a lot more than Kuvira and Unalaq.
 
EDIT: I think Zaheer's views only seem like your typical anarchist, because Bryke didn't want to flesh out the plot enough. So it's like, all you ever get is surface level representation. When you have surface level rep of a political view, it comes off as the typical people that casually spout off shit, without ever really going deeper then that. I want to think that, Zaheer had more depth to what he believed in and wasn't just a typical surface level Anarchist. But again, writers dropped the ball. Still, I liked him a lot more than Kuvira and Unalaq.

I'd find that easier to believe if there were other belief systems other characters espoused that did go in depth. The only reason I believe my theory about the planet moving the rock in TLA is that every other instance of spirituality was allowed growth and depth and other aspects of the show like psychology or politics were also depicted with surprisingly authenticity. Not so with LoK.

I think we're being amon'd again. He sounds like he has more depth than he does because he hasn't had a meaningful challenge in his belief system, so he's never had to dig deeper than surface level. While it's possible there is more to him, I doubt it.
 
I'd find that easier to believe if there were other belief systems other characters espoused that did go in depth. The only reason I believe my theory about the planet moving the rock in TLA is that every other instance of spirituality was allowed growth and depth and other aspects of the show like psychology or politics were also depicted with surprisingly authenticity. Not so with LoK.

I think we're being amon'd again. He sounds like he has more depth than he does because he hasn't had a meaningful challenge in his belief system, so he's never had to dig deeper than surface level. While it's possible there is more to him, I doubt it.

I suppose. It's totally possible that Zaheer is just an idiot and shallow. Totally. But the only reason I'm willing to think there was more to his beliefs, is because they allude a lot to this supposed past. And unlike Amon, he seemed really passionate about thinking it was the right thing to do.

Ultimately, whether a character has depth to his views or not, is kind of pointless if it's not written. If it's not in the show, it's not in the show. So trying to speculate there could be more, based on things that don't exist...is well silly.

But I guess my perception of Zaheer was kind of shaped by some of these factors, that made me feel there was something going on more than Unalaq or Amon. Or even Kuvira (who doesn't seem to have any conviction at all). I am by no means trying to defend Zaheer or say he's a well written character. Rather, I just think the whole shallow anarchist view, was in a lot of ways, Bryke just unwilling to flesh out plot. But maybe I'm wrong. Zaheer could just be a shallow idiot.

Still, I personally liked Zaheer a lot more than Kuvira and Unalaq. Just on a shallow level, his fights were a lot more fun to watch. And I still think his conviction and passion about trying to accomplish his goal (even if we think that goal was really stupid), made you a bit more invested in what he was trying for, and made him more menacing. Even if it was shallow, a character seeming to give a damn can go a long way. Whereas with Kuvira, I really don't understand or know why she's doing the things she'd doing, outside of being a power hungry asshole. And even on that level, I never get a sense of passion or conviction for wanting that. She's just kind of there. And I find her stoic/personality to be quite annoying. I just want to punch her in the face.

EDIT: Kind of funny how, someone can have a really dumb goal. But just having a real drive to achieve it, can make it more interesting as opposed to someone with a more practical/understandable goal, who doesn't seem to have any conviction or motivation for doing it. I think Zaheer will always have the benefit of having that drive. But I can agree that Zaheer is lazy writing. He's pretty much the "illusion" of someone caring or with depth. At least, in terms of actual writing (since there was no writing).

I still cringe over how in the finale, they have that moment where Zaheer and his lover talk. It's like HEY GUYS, WE HAVE THIS INTERESTING BACK STORY WE WILL TELL YOU ABOUT IN 20 SECONDS, BUT YOU WILL NEVER ACTUALLY KNOW ABOUT IT. BUT PLEASE, FEEL SOMETHING FOR US. WE HAVE DEPTH.

That's how the scene came off to me. And I'll never understand why they focused on Kai and other BS instead of Zaheer and his gang (they actually were interesting. I liked that scene with Bolin talking to Zahee'r gang, and the gang's banter between each other).
 
I never even bother typing my reply out to you (Azula) anymore unless I see an "Edit" halfway across the page.

Yeah, all the villains stories have basically been info dumps. Amon's was an episode long one with a really dumb twist, Unalaq didn't really get a backstory at all, Zaheer only got it so we could feel a tiny bit bad when P'Li sparky sparky boomed herself, and now....

well, givne the (potentially) personal nature of Kuvira's relationship with Su, I think I'd welcome an info dump on her character history, as long as they didn't try to fit some stupid twist in there that changed her character entirely for no reason. These comics have been hitting it out of the park with her, so it'd be easy for the show to do it. Seriously, gimme chibi Kuvira like we got chibi Korra and that alone would make me like Kuvira more.

I'm still not buying your afrika bombaata Planet Rock(outcropping) theory, Veelk.

You don't need to. I'm the only one who does. It's still the best explanation that I've seen for what happens as far as I know. It's supported within the world, it makes sense, and adds a nice layer of irony that what stopped Ozai from destroying the Earth Kingdom is the Earth Kingdom itself, plus it's thematically consistent with how the actual ocean that saved the water tribe when it was in danger. It works for me and it's valid within the world. That's all it needs to do.
 
Zaheer's philosophy was flawed. But he's a lot more likable than Kuvira. Sorry breh. Way better character. He's bad ass. Loved that scene with him and Korra.

Kuvira is squandered potential. Honestly, while Zaheer had a very flawed philosophy, the only issue with his character was them not fleshing out his beliefs more. Like how he came to believe them. What his past was like, that shaped who he was today, and why he was so driven. They alluded to an interesting past (especially with him and his Girlfriend).

But in terms of personality, and just overall as an antagonist. I would take him any day over Kuvira.

I wanted to love her, but I can't. She has such a punchable face, and they haven't done enough with her that she's starting to dip into Unalaq territory (she's not that bad, but starting to feel like it).
We are done, bro.

Just you wait. Next episode will make her even better.

JUST WAIT😤
 
While I get that a lot of you are frustrated with how fanfiction seems to draw a much more compelling backstory for some of the characters, or at least show it more clearly than the show, I think it's unfair to bash the writers for "failing to tell their character's stories", since most of this fanfiction exist because the show has also hinted or flat out said many of these things. And possibly will continue to do so more.

I mean, the majority of these artist aren't drawing their Kuvira and Baatar Jr. fanart out of spite for how LoK doesn't tell their story. A lot of you guys make it seem like there's nothing but disappointment out there for the show, when just the opposite is true, in general. Yeah it has it's flaws and most fans themselves aren't blind to them, but it's not as bad as some of you make it out to be.

That's not to say the villains can't be better, duh. I'm with Veeik that all that needs to happen for Kuvira to be a much better character is some simply flashbacks or exposition, and hope there's no stupid twist like "she's Su's illegitimate daughter" or that she got plastic surgery and is actually Azula or something.
 
I don't think their relationship was ever as sweet as these fanarts are showing. Looks to me like it was more of a mentor/apprentice relationship and she recognized her potential. Not a mother/daughter relationship.

Suyin explicitly stated she took Kuvira in when she was 8 years old and regarded her as a daughter.
 
While I get that a lot of you are frustrated with how fanfiction seems to draw a much more compelling backstory for some of the characters, or at least show it more clearly than the show, I think it's unfair to bash the writers for "failing to tell their character's stories", since most of this fanfiction exist because the show has also hinted or flat out said many of these things. And possibly will continue to do so more.

I mean, the majority of these artist aren't drawing their Kuvira and Baatar Jr. fanart out of spite for how LoK doesn't tell their story. A lot of you guys make it seem like there's nothing but disappointment out there for the show, when just the opposite is true, in general. Yeah it has it's flaws and most fans themselves aren't blind to them, but it's not as bad as some of you make it out to be.

That's not to say the villains can't be better, duh. I'm with Veeik that all that needs to happen for Kuvira to be a much better character is some simply flashbacks or exposition, and hope there's no stupid twist like "she's Su's illegitimate daughter" or that she got plastic surgery and is actually Azula or something.
I'm only asking for flashbacks and exposition, not more Nazism allusion.
 
While I get that a lot of you are frustrated with how fanfiction seems to draw a much more compelling backstory for some of the characters, or at least show it more clearly than the show, I think it's unfair to bash the writers for "failing to tell their character's stories", since most of this fanfiction exist because the show has also hinted or flat out said many of these things. And possibly will continue to do so more.

I mean, the majority of these artist aren't drawing their Kuvira and Baatar Jr. fanart out of spite for how LoK doesn't tell their story. A lot of you guys make it seem like there's nothing but disappointment out there for the show, when just the opposite is true, in general. Yeah it has it's flaws and most fans themselves aren't blind to them, but it's not as bad as some of you make it out to be.

That's not to say the villains can't be better, duh. I'm with Veeik that all that needs to happen for Kuvira to be a much better character is some simply flashbacks or exposition, and hope there's no stupid twist like "she's Su's illegitimate daughter" or that she got plastic surgery and is actually Azula or something.

I think it's fair to criticize, since they had so much time they wasted. They keep adding more and more characters and more and more plot, and fail to properly flesh out these villains (who should be their focus). So really, it is on them for not telling these stories. When these stories help strengthen the plot, and the characters and their motivation.

The writers can say they want a 13 episode season, and yet keep writing like they have 22 episodes. I would only agree with you, if every season was really tight, and they used all the episodes to the best of their ability. But I can point to each season, and look at episodes that really had no business being there if they weren't going to have enough time to flesh out the main bad guy. Now, I agree that you can't expect them to go into insane depth like fan fiction (who have a lot of time on their hands, and have limitless ability to write as much as they want).

I don't think anyone is expecting that kind of depth. But give us something.
 
With a world as rich as Avatar's, I have no idea why the creators wanted less episodes to work with. Boggles my mind.

Yeah, agreed. But it really just boggles my mind that, they get the 13 episode format THEY WANTED....and then continue to write like they have 22 episodes. The more they stack on characters, and side plot...the more I just do not understand. Like, you have main characters and a bad guy you aren't spending enough time on. WHY are you adding more new characters and side plot.

Insane.
 
Yeah, agreed. But it really just boggles my mind that, they get the 13 episode format THEY WANTED....and then continue to write like they have 22 episodes. The more they stack on characters, and side plot...the more I just do not understand. Like, you have main characters and a bad guy you aren't spending enough time on. WHY are you adding more new characters and side plot.

Insane.
At least they dropped Kai early on. I'll give them credit for that.
 
To be fair there isn't a lot of flavor dialog situations and other things for the characters. We barely understand their likes and dislikes. We don't know what kind of food Korra likes...which might not see important but it's helpful for painting the characters as real.

Of course they don't have enough time for that like the first series, at least that what I thought. Yet we have two episodes in season 1 devoted to shipping. 5 In season 2 devoted to garbage and 4 had completely wasted episodes.

As a result the characters just feel like piece moving the plot to the conclusion. There isn't enough slow moments, but far too many absolutely dull or boring moments instead. Then again they only had 13 episodes, which would be fine if it was one giant story. But each season is self contained with a new villain. Making it very hard for characterization.
 
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