Legend of Korra Book 4: Balance |OT| A Feast of Crows

Status
Not open for further replies.
It's not nostalgia goggles. There is not much to Ozai, he is a racist nutjob. A product and representation of what the Fire Nation has been changing into over a hundred years. His motivations are clear.

There's nothing indicating that Ozai was racist in any way. You're thinking of Sozin, who presumed that the lives of other nations were so inferior that invading and colonizing their territories would be a favor to them. Ozai is simply a sociopath who enjoyed and desired power. Any disdain for others he had was rooted in his spite for weakness of any kind (though I guess it's a bit racist of him to presume all airbenders were pacifists like Aang...but then again, it's not like we're shown at any point that to be untrue. I mean, none of the air bending tribes had a military. Anyway, he was intent on eliminating all weak people, and Air nomads being associated with pacifism fell under that catergory for him.)

It's amazing how many people write off Ozai as a 'simple character' yet so often get his character wrong in discussion. He's a sociopath. That doesn't mean he doesn't care for his children. It doesn't mean he's racist. It doesn't mean he's a hypocrite. He's a sociopath, meaning he lacks the ability to empathize and sees relationships in terms of power dynamics. That is a very destructive view that spearheads a lot of the grief that all the characters endure, but he's already a horrible enough of a human being on his own. There is no need to make stuff up about him to make him seem worse.
 
I'm always bugged by him being the dark avatar. Not just because he sucks, but he really kinda wasn't.

I mean, the avatar is defined by 3 things: The ability to bend all 4 elements, bringing balance to the world, and (as of the LoK retcon) the connection to Raava.

He can only ever bend water.

He brings chaos...but that's not really a unique role that ONLY the dark avatar can bring. Ozai was bringing chaos, Amon was bringing chaos...basically, any disruption of the balance can be attributed to chaos. You'd think that the role of chaos the dark avatar is supposed to bring would be something more unique to it.

Lastly, he is connected to Vaatu, Raava's opposite...which works, but it's such a recent addition to avatar that it's hard for me to buy that Unalaq was the Avatar's Antithesis just based on that. It's not established enough.

Zaheer would have made a much better Dark Avatar.
 
I'm always bugged by him being the dark avatar. Not just because he sucks, but he really kinda wasn't.

I mean, the avatar is defined by 3 things: The ability to bend all 4 elements, bringing balance to the world, and (as of the LoK retcon) the connection to Raava.

He can only ever bend water.

He brings chaos...but that's not really a unique role that ONLY the dark avatar can bring. Ozai was bringing chaos, Amon was bringing chaos...basically, any disruption of the balance can be attributed to chaos. You'd think that the role of chaos the dark avatar is supposed to bring would be something more unique to it.

Lastly, he is connected to Vaatu, Raava's opposite...which works, but it's such a recent addition to avatar that it's hard for me to buy that Unalaq was the Avatar's Antithesis just based on that. It's not established enough.
Yeah it would have been cool if he had gotten connected to Vaatu earlier and then went around the world learning the other elements and presented himself as the new avatar while Korra was nowhere to be found, until she ultimately had to appear to defeat his ass. That's how I would've done it.
 
Zaheer would have made a much better Dark Avatar.

Well, he'd have made a good Alternative Avatar. He sought Balance, like the normal Avatar, just through different means. Really, he'd be the kind of Avatar Yang Chen warned against, one who is so spiritual that he gives up his humanity for enlightenment, which leads to him being harmful to humans in the name of Balance. He'd be a dark avatar, but not The Dark Avatar, if you see my meaning... I mean, I guess, yeah, he'd work, but he wouldn't be the antithesis of the avatar like they tried to make Unalaq.

I don't know who'd make a good Dark Avatar. Their mission statement would probably be to try and start up another war, maybe with a different nation leading the charge this time, if they were seeking to unbalance the world.
 
I wonder if we'd still care about asami if she didn't make that really good season 1 impression due to being the only character with an actual arc.
 
There's nothing indicating that Ozai was racist in any way. You're thinking of Sozin, who presumed that the lives of other nations were so inferior that invading and colonizing their territories would be a favor to them. Ozai is simply a sociopath who enjoyed and desired power. Any disdain for others he had was rooted in his spite for weakness of any kind (though I guess it's a bit racist of him to presume all airbenders were pacifists like Aang...but then again, it's not like we're shown at any point that to be untrue. I mean, none of the air bending tribes had a military. Anyway, he was intent on eliminating all weak people, and Air nomads being associated with pacifism fell under that catergory for him.)
rac·ist
ˈrāsəst/
noun
1.
a person who believes that a particular race is superior to another.

You don't think he thinks the Fire Nation is superior to all?

"You're weak, just like the rest of your people! They did not deserve to exist in this world ... in my world! Prepare to join them. Prepare to die!"

I am not denying he had a lust for power, that is clear from him trying break the line of succession and eventually creating new title for himself in the end. You can have more than one motivation. I am combining Sozin and Ozai's characters, but I don't think it's exactly wrong to think that his influence isnt there. He was about to wipe out the entire Earth Kingdom before saying that before that. Cause hey, that's what grandpa did.
 
random pic post

Young_Noatak_and_Tarrlok.png
 
She is no Yoshikage Kira either...also

Kira>>>>Dio, yeah I said it.

(Kira is part 4 villain)
I haven't read the manga, but I heard Part 4 is really good with some crazy ass stands in it. I can't wait for them to finish Stardust Crusaders. Jotaro is such a step down from Joseph and we don't get enough evil sexy Dio-Sama. Just saw what Yoshikage Kira looks like, he looks boss as fuck and FABULOUS!
 
I haven't read the manga, but I heard Part 4 is really good with some crazy ass stands in it. I can't wait for them to finish Stardust Crusaders. Jotaro is such a step down from Joseph and we don't get enough evil sexy Dio-Sama. Just saw what Yoshikage Kira looks like, he looks boss as fuck and FABULOUS!

Part 4 and 7 are easily the best parts in the entire series. Jouske is such a good JoJo with a great ability, and he also has the best group of friends compared to any other JoJo.
 
All the love for Injustice Korra, but none for Red Son Korra? Ya'll need to re-read Superman: Red Son.
Could revive the equalist uniforms and shite for the New Common Avatar Order:

ih.jpg

Just replace amon's face with something like dis
tumblr_m1dnioPDT61r129kwo7_400.png

Dear Leader is always watching you.
 
Part 4 and 7 are easily the best parts in the entire series. Jouske is such a good JoJo with a great ability, and he also has the best group of friends compared to any other JoJo.
They're better than Part 2? Fuck! And that was my favorite so far too. I don't mind Jotaro's friends with Kakyoin being my favorite so far, but man Jotaro is stoic. I can't believe he's like the most famous one or something.
 
They're better than Part 2? Fuck! And that was my favorite so far too. I don't mind Jotaro's friends with Kakyoin being my favorite so far, but man Jotaro is stoic. I can't believe he's like the most famous one or something.

Part 4 is very slice of life ish, in a weird way. It all takes place in one town, and unlike the world ending events from Parts 1-3. It's just about stopping a serial killer. (Though he's fucked up)

The characters and situations make it shine though, at one point they fight mice with turrets as their stand.
 
The Dark Avatar as an ideal was never well represented, but, in The Legend of Korra I feel like the Avatar is viewed differently. In The Last Airbender, it's viewed as hope, salvation, inspiration, balance and the villains view the Avatar as a threat for those reasons (that and the physical bending threat). In LoK, everybody in the series, save for Tenzin (I would presume it's because he's old-fashioned) and the old characters (Toph, Katara, Iroh, and Zuko), seems to view the Avatar as a symbol of power. Even Korra during Book 1 and the beginning of Book 2.

Amon sees the Avatar as the ultimate bender, and the Equalists equate (hah) that to ultimate oppression. Zaheer sees the Avatar as a sign of balance as well, but also a sort of ultimate authority figure, (which he opposed) and even tells Korra her power is limitless. Kuvira sees the Avatar as an outdated notion and really nothing more than a weapon. Tarrlok also saw the Avatar as a tool and weapon. Unalaq especially saw the Avatar as a symbol of power, probably more than anyone else.

Unalaq, I always saw as a pure megalomaniac. Everything was a means to an end: He got his brother banished because he wanted the throne. At some point he joined the Red Lotus, a group of powerful benders with ties to a powerful group (The White Lotus) and learned about Vaatu and Raava and the spirits (he probably learned Spiritbending during that time as well). he then bands with Zaheer's group to kidnap Korra to open the portals (which last I checked, Zaheer wanted as well), but that doesn't work and he saves his own skin. He then took the Southern Tribe, not for unity, but because he wanted the portals open. He claimed it was for spiritual balance, but it was just to get to Vaatu, which is why he needed Korra to open the portals. Unalaq only mentored her so she could do just that.

Unalaq then, at some point, makes a deal with Vaatu, but why? Vaatu sees bending as his downfall and needs a way to combat it. Unalaq sees the Avatar as the ultimate power. If they merge into one, Unalaq gets access to Vaatu's power and Vaatu now has bending and a way to fight it. Use that power to get rid of the current Avatar, and now there is no means of opposition (until ultimate cosmic power and magic Jinora bullshit gave us a cool fight). In fact, if I recall correctly, didn't Unalaq tell Korra she was a garbage Avatar? He was jealous of her because of her power and it probably didn't help that she was his brother's kid, someone he already took power from once. Unalaq effectivey steals Tonraq's power twice, and then takes his daughter's. Vicious asshole, that one.

I always liked the idea of Unalaq manipulating Noatak to remove benders, so as to limit Vaatu's positiion. Then, after Noatak would steal Korra's bending, Unalaq would help her reconnect with Raava and open the portals. Instead, he settled on training Korra in her spiritual abilities. Different method, same result. Would have been a nice way to connect the books. Sadly, I'll never get that connection.
 
They're better than Part 2? Fuck! And that was my favorite so far too. I don't mind Jotaro's friends with Kakyoin being my favorite so far, but man Jotaro is stoic. I can't believe he's like the most famous one or something.

I think Part 3 is the most well known because it was the one adapted in the OVAs, but most people, especially in the West, like Part 2 the most.
 
Part 4 is very slice of life ish, in a weird way. It all takes place in one town, and unlike the world ending events from Parts 1-3. It's just about stopping a serial killer. (Though he's fucked up)

The characters and situations make it shine though, at one point they fight mice with turrets as their stand.
I like how Jojo isn't afraid to slow it down and let the characters be characters a bit. Granted it's still an action show and Part 3 is pretty much a monster of the week show, but it's still all in good fun. Part 4 sounds pretty interesting and it sounds like they actually pay attention to the antagonist. Is he fucked up like Sensui from Yu Yu Hakusho?
I think Part 3 is the most well known because it was the one adapted in the OVAs, but most people, especially in the West, like Part 2 the most.
I will always like Part 2 for these two scenes. Made me a Jojo fan right there:
wzpkcudw

zglrqq5o
 
I like how Jojo isn't afraid to slow it down and let the characters be characters a bit. Granted it's still an action show and Part 3 is pretty much a monster of the week show, but it's still all in good fun. Part 4 sounds pretty interesting and it sounds like they actually pay attention to the antagonist. Is he fucked up like Sensui from Yu Yu Hakusho?

I will always like Part 2 for these two scenes. Made me a Jojo fan right there:
wzpkcudw

zglrqq5o

He is the ultimate contradiction.

He wants a peaceful life where no one notices him, he ranked third place in every competition he has on purpose. He's a genius on the highest level. But he has a hand obsession, and he kills people cut off their hands and keeps them until they rot.

The reason he is the ultimate contradiction is that he doesn't want to be in the spotlight, yet he does things that would naturally draw attention to himself (Being a killer) He is paranoid and narcissistic.

The reason he works is because his goal is so small. He just wants a peaceful life, not ruling anything. Just a peaceful life where he can kill people when he wants. Just a killer trying to stay hidden.
 
rac·ist
ˈrāsəst/
noun
1.
a person who believes that a particular race is superior to another.

You don't think he thinks the Fire Nation is superior to all?

"You're weak, just like the rest of your people! They did not deserve to exist in this world ... in my world! Prepare to join them. Prepare to die!"

I am not denying he had a lust for power, that is clear from him trying break the line of succession and eventually creating new title for himself in the end. You can have more than one motivation. I am combining Sozin and Ozai's characters, but I don't think it's exactly wrong to think that his influence isnt there. He was about to wipe out the entire Earth Kingdom before saying that before that. Cause hey, that's what grandpa did.

He said as much about Iroh, and zuko when he turned on him, and they're not just fire nation but fire nation royalty. Even in that quote, he talks about it being 'his' world rather than the fire nations. I mean, fine, I guess you can say that he would hate the air nomads, but that hatred is rooted in their personal philosophies. He's a social darwinist, they're pacifists. He doesn't hate them because they're air nomads, but he hates things like compassion and that's what the air nomads promoted. I imagine he'd be more respectful of zaheers more violent methodology, even though he follows air nomad beliefs otherwise. So no, I don't think he thinks the fire nation is inherently better. His line of thinking is "The fire nation is the most powerful, therefore it is better" rather than "The Fire Nation is better, therefore it has the most power." which is the line of thinking a real racist would have.

I just don't see him caring about race that much. Racism is a lack of empathy for a specific race or ethnicity. Sociopaths don't need an excuse since they lack empathy for everyone. A racist sociopath is like a human murderer(that is, a murderer of humans). It's an unnecessary specification.
 
I wonder if we'd still care about asami if she didn't make that really good season 1 impression due to being the only character with an actual arc.

i wouldn't since she would be purely shipping fodder.

hell her current trajectory in that case would be seen as an fucking improvement.

Just keeping it real, she's practically invisible after this season started.

true but it still sucks seeing that unfold.

But she somewhat made up with her father , right, right, right...
 
I'm with Veelk, Ozai wasn't a racist, but a sociopath/psychopath (sorry Veelk, to lazy to look up what you called him earlier). He didn't give a damn about ideology really, just his idea of "there's only power and those to weak to seek it" mantra.

For good or bad, The Last Airbender wasn't really about ideology, we've discussed this a dozen million times. LoK tries to be, but ATLA never was or tried to be that.

We loved the world because it also included such things, but the real reason ATLA exist was to tell the story of a world with four elements and a boy that could control all of them at once, and his journey to fulfill his destiny and how that dynamic affected the people in the world.

Ozai was just really about one element trying to be better than the rest through power (a trait of firebenders) and the Avatar putting him down.
 
\
He brings chaos...but that's not really a unique role that ONLY the dark avatar can bring. Ozai was bringing chaos, Amon was bringing chaos...basically, any disruption of the balance can be attributed to chaos. You'd think that the role of chaos the dark avatar is supposed to bring would be something more unique to it.

Here's one. He brings balance by enslaving the entire world and creating order. No more evil! Only the constant hunger for brains. And thankfully, there's a steady supply and no one goes hungry! At last, peace.

Total zombie peace.
 
Just out of curiosity -- if there was a show about the next avatar, what kind of person would you want this earth nation man or woman to be?

I always thought it would be interesting to see a show start not knowing who the Avatar is, but building the Avatar's team nonetheless, and you find out who it is from among them after they've had one or two adventures. Not even the person who is the Avatar knows they are. And then it's the person you least expect... but if you go back and watch earlier episodes, you can actually see the little hints that were thrown in, and follow them up to the twist. The reveal could be halfway through the first season.

Then to make that work, Team Avatar would have to be comprised of really well-written characters. That way people have many different favorites, and would have fun wondering who it is. Then when they find out, it's not a big dropkick because the characters are still awesome.
 
Just out of curiosity -- if there was a show about the next avatar, what kind of person would you want this earth nation man or woman to be?

I always thought it would be interesting to see a show start not knowing who the Avatar is, but building the Avatar's team nonetheless, and you find out who it is from among them after they've had one or two adventures. Not even the person who is the Avatar knows they are. And then it's the person you least expect... but if you go back and watch earlier episodes, you can actually see the little hints that were thrown in, and follow them up to the twist. The reveal could be halfway through the first season.

Then to make that work, Team Avatar would have to be comprised of really well-written characters. That way people have many different favorites, and would have fun wondering who it is. Then when they find out, it's not a big dropkick because the characters are still awesome.

Off the top of my head?

Idea 1: I suppose an Avatar that's also the Earth King would be interesting. He'd have torn between his duties to his nation and the world at large.

Idea 2: With the invention of radio's telephones, the dawn of instant mass communication isn't far off. The diplomatic role of the avatar is now greatly reduced since nations can now communicate with each other. They understand each other at a level unprecedented and now the avatar may be unnecessary.

Idea 3: War with Spirit world.

Idea 4: Zombies

Idea 5: A new series

I prefer 5. I don't want to bother with the avatar universe anymore if we're just going to get LoK level of quality. Even at it's utmost peak, it fell short of TLA. I'd rather they just do a new series and leave the legacy of TLA intact.
 
I had an idea and I had it all written out, then I realized it sounded too much like a "If Zuko was the avatar" situation so I deleted it and burned it from my mind.
 
Legacy of TLA will always be strong. Over time, quality survives.

But obviously this isn't current-day Nickelodeon running this show. I dunno if they'd even consider having another one.

This is more like.. what if Amazon or Netflix bought the rights, and Aaron Ehasz came back as head writer.
 
Legacy of TLA will always be strong. Over time, quality survives.

But obviously this isn't current-day Nickelodeon running this show. I dunno if they'd even consider having another one.

This is more like.. what if Amazon or Netflix bought the rights, and Aaron Ehasz came back as head writer.

The problem (and this is why I consider LoK to be non-canon) is that LoK introduced a lot of changes to the fundamental nature of the universe that no longer makes coherent sense when seen as a continuity of TLA. If LoK somehow removed the way Korra received airbending, and the avatar state, and energy bending, and just removed Season 2 as a whole, then I could just accept it is just a shitty sequel. It would still have major problems but nothing would necessarily be wrong with belonging to the TLA universe.

That's not so with inclusion of the things I mentioned. It's poisoned goods, and while good stories are still possible in even LoK, the universe has still been compromised, and that hangs onto the series like a scar. No matter what else happens, the series is damaged goods if you accept LoK as the legitimate continuation of the series. So I would rather just leave the series as is.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom