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[Platy]

What does that even mean? Obviously breasts were not there from day one as in on an infant. But it also happened naturally, as in without the help of science and medicine. I'm happy that tran men and women have the ability now to have a physical body that matches their actual gender, even if their original one didn't, but that doesn't mean that everyone is going to or should be expected to be attracted to them as they would someone who was born in a body that did match their gender.

So you will not date a perfectly healthy cis women just because she had hormone problems in puberty and had to take pills to help developed correctly ?
How about people who take growth hormone because they were too small as children ?
Any single person who ever took medicine that naturaly would be dead ?

 

[collige]

I have yet to use the word gender other than when quoting people, when I am asking about someone's sex I ask for their sex, people are taking my words and trying to make it fit their agenda. When I can ask, What was their sex at birth, what would it be on their birth certificate. If you tell me it's going to be female when we both know it's male that is dishonesty and doesn't really go well with others. Most people will understand "I don't feel comfortable with the sex I was born with and I want to change" but they won't understand wordplay and beating around the bush.

Let me put it more bluntly. Saying

Please don't lie, He was born a male and went through hormone treatment to make himself appear more feminine.

is incredibly ignorant and disrespectful. Straight up. My post was about your usage of pronouns.

 

[Herpes Reasons]

So you will not date a perfectly healthy cis women just because she had hormone problems in puberty and had to take pills to help developed correctly ?
How about people who take growth hormone because they were too small as children ?
Any single person who ever took medicine that naturaly would be dead ?

Were they born in a body that was female from day one? As in, didn't start out a male with a penis, testicles, scrotum, and other male specific body parts? That didn't require surgery to form female specific parts? If a woman lacks the ability to have a child because she was raped and her womb was destroyed, that wouldn't restrict me from dating her and is different IMO than a person who went through the process and never had a womb to begin with. If a woman had a terrible accident and needed surgery to fix her vagina for whatever reason, that wouldn't stop be from dating them. Why? Because at a point in time they had all of this and didn't go from having a male body to a female one.

Now if you think that is bigoted, well, have fun with it.

 

[Soph]

This thread got cyclical overnight, huh?

Why yes it did, people rarely read all comments, before deciding to make sloppy statements.

 

[User 73706]

Are brains different between men and women? Serious question.

Yeah, but it has more to do with "lobe X does function Y" while "lobe A does function B" in terms of comparing the two. One of the easier examples relating to the evolutionary development of brains "adapting" to stuff, as in hunter-gatherer societies, is that on average men have more "processing power" dedicated to three-dimensional spatial awareness, while women have more dedicated to acute color differentiation.

 

[Mumei]

Saying "trans women aren't real women" is pretty offensive and fairly bigoted. Also, protip: if you've got to resort to definitions as your sole source of objective evidence, you're probably trying too hard to justify your own insecurities.

It's exactly the sort of thing that Julia Serano was describing in the excerpts I quoted in my previous post. And people arguing to the contrary are quite literally forty or fifty years out of date; the arguments Petrie is making would be more understandable if we were having this conversation in the 1960s or 1970s. But we're not, and it's outdated at best.

If anyone is interested in this history, the first chapter of Just One of the Guys?: Transgender Men and the Persistence of Gender Inequality is a good place to start:

In chapter I, I provided a historical overview of the shifting cultural understanding of transgender people. These cultural explanations attempt to account for the existence of transgender people within a system in which gender identity and genitalia are assumed to line up naturally in a binary of male and female. I merge life histories I collected with sociological research and newspaper accounts about transgender people to show these shifting cultural frames - mental pathology, gender diversity and fluidity, and, more recently, benign biological diversity. The most recent frame, biological diversity, provides a compelling justification for tolerance of transgender lives: gender-variant people are born this way rather than making an active choice. It does not, however, challenge deeply held beliefs about the naturalness - for most people - of the male/female binary. This binary continues to be institutionalized in governmental and legal practices, which means that transgender people must bring their legal gender in line with their new social gender to avoid not just societal stigma but potential consequences in employment, housing, and finances.

The chapter covers three distinct periods; an era of pathologization (the gender clinic era, from the 1960s to the 1980s), the rise of transgender activism (the 1990s), and the era of gender variance and political rights (the 2000s). When I read it, I discovered that some of my confusion about transgender issues actually stemmed from the fact that I had something of a mishmash of ideas from different eras, some of which were outdated.

 

[Platy]

Were they born in a body that was female from day one? As in, didn't start out a male with a penis, testicles, scrotum, and other male specific body parts? That didn't require surgery to form female specific parts? If a woman lacks the ability to have a child because she was raped and her womb was destroyed, that wouldn't restrict me from dating her and is different IMO than a person who went through the process and never had a womb to begin with. If a woman had a terrible accident and needed surgery to fix her vagina for whatever reason, that wouldn't stop be from dating them. Why? Because at a point in time they had all of this and didn't go from having a male body to a female one.

Now if you think that is bigoted, well, have fun with it.

So don't blame it on surgery or medicine ... blame it for not having cooties =P

 

[Herpes Reasons]

So don't blame it on surgery or medicine ... blame it for not having cooties =P

Still don't know what you mean. Cooties as in germs or are you trying to be funny by saying cooty instead of vagina.

 

[MUnited83]

What does that even mean? Obviously breasts were not there from day one as in on an infant. But it also happened naturally, as in without the help of science and medicine. I'm happy that tran men and women have the ability now to have a physical body that matches their actual gender, even if their original one didn't, but that doesn't mean that everyone is going to or should be expected to be attracted to them as they would someone who was born in a body that did match their gender.

"Science and medicine" is why people's life expectancy is so high those days. You know what happened "naturally" before that science and medicine were advanced and mainstream? People's life expectancy was around 30 years. Therefore, I hope you don't date people over 30 years, because, you know, people wouldn't live much more than that without science and medicine.

You see how the "science and medicine" argument is extremely ridiculous?

 

[Lemaitre]

You are willfully supporting the use of a gender pronoun that a person does not identify as. You are being ignorant.

The reality is that this poster in question hurts those that identify as trans by simply not using their preferred pronoun. Trust me my man, keep your disagreements but at least respect the gender pronoun people identify as. People have to be able to disagree but still respect one another at the end of the day.

 

[esms]

Why yes it did, people rarely read all comments, before deciding to make sloppy statements.

But I missed penis bits guy! Come on.

 

[Platy]

Still don't know what you mean. Cooties as in germs or are you trying to be funny by saying cooty instead of vagina.

I mean cooties in the sense of a fictional disease carried by girls.

Because you are doing a HUGE mental gymnastics just to avoid saying that.

Or that you are alergic to the Y chromossome, which would prove that you are a woman or have an anti-imune disease

 

[Anastasia]

I am going to be as honest yet regard your feelings as much as I can when I say this. Lets take Bailey for example, if I saw Bailey walking down the street, I would see Bailey as a woman. Unless I knew other information about her past Bailey would be a She for me. But since I have seen Bailey's genitals my brain is now going to see Bailey as someone who went a transformation to become a woman but who started off with their sex being male.

I think the problem is that you are using her sex to define her gender, and not her identity (her brain). It's your brain that determines it, not the other way around. She is a woman, but with a penis. Having a penis does not make her any less of a woman.

 

[Herpes Reasons]

"Science and medicine" is why people's life expectancy is so high those days. You know what happened "naturally" before that science and medicine were advanced and mainstream? People's life expectancy was around 30 years. Therefore, I hope you don't date people over 30 years, because, you know, people wouldn't live much more than that without science and medicine.

You see how the "science and medicine" argument is extremely ridiculous?

No, I don't. There is a difference in mine and many others views that providing antibiotics to fight germs, disease, or having surgery to remove a foreign object from your body, destroy mutations that develop into masses that extend the life of a person is different than creating an artificial organ in a body that was once masculine in order to have said body match the gender of the person who dwells in said body. You want to see reproductive organs, parts that are gender specific as being no different than an advil, tylenol, or going into surgery to clean out one's arteries after a heart attack and that is where we are different.

 

[Mumei]

I think the problem is that you are using her sex to define her gender, and not her identity (her brain). It's your brain that determines it, not the other way around. She is a woman, but with a penis. Having a penis does not make her any less of a woman.

"This sort of thinking is extraordinarily naive, as it denies a basic truth: We make assumptions every day about other people's gendres, without ever seeing their birth certificates, their chromosomes, their genitals, their reproductive systems, their childhood socialization, or their legal sex. There is no such thing as a "real" gender - there is only the gender experience ourselves as and the gender we perceive others to be."

 

[Platy]

I am going to be as honest yet regard your feelings as much as I can when I say this. Lets take Bailey for example, if I saw Bailey walking down the street, I would see Bailey as a woman. Unless I knew other information about her past Bailey would be a She for me. But since I have seen Bailey's genitals my brain is now going to see Bailey as someone who went a transformation to become a woman but who started off with their sex being male.

Lets say in terms you can understand :

If you said "he" for Bailey she would have kicked you in the balls and she would be right

 

[Petrie]

Uh, they are literally not synonymous. Nobody calls them "gender chromosomes" or uses "gender dimorphism" or "secondary gender characteristics". And popular usage doesn't mean anything: you can call a spider an insect, and most people would think you're right, but it doesn't change that you'd be completely wrong.

No. I am accepting that merriam webster lists them as synonyms of one another. They also have alternate definitions. You don't get to decide what definition of the word gender people use any more than they get to decide what gender you identify as.

You are willfully supporting the use of a gender pronoun that a person does not identify as. You are being ignorant.

I don't recall doing that. My argument comes down to telling someone they need to use the word "sex" instead of "gender" makes no sense because the words are synonyms.

 

[block tower]

hey if theyre hot ill smash or date. as long as the transition is 100% complete.

 

[Herpes Reasons]

I mean cooties in the sense of a fictional disease carried by girls.

Because you are doing a HUGE mental gymnastics just to avoid saying that.

Or that you are alergic to the Y chromossome, which would prove that you are a woman or have an anti-imune disease

I am attracted to women who identify as women and dwell in bodies which from birth didn't require a transformation from male specific organs to female specific ones. If that is being bigoted, then sue me.

 

[Newt]

Not to detail, but peoples life expectancy being 30 years is a total myth.

 

[collige]

Why? Because at a point in time they had all of this and didn't go from having a male body to a female one.

Now if you think that is bigoted, well, have fun with it.

Of course it's bigoted. You haven't given a practical reason why you wouldn't date a trans woman apart from the fact that she's trans. Most everyone else in this thread that wouldn't date a trans woman have given reasons that would have a real, concrete effect on how the transsexuality of their partner would affect their relationship (giving birth, vagina functionality, etc). You're openly admitting that these problem wouldn't be an issue for you if they were cis but not trans for no reason. That's bigotry.

 

[Petrie]

I am attracted to women who identify as women and dwell in bodies which from birth didn't require a transformation from male specific organs to female specific ones. If that is being bigoted, then sue me.

There is nothing wrong with not wanting to put your penis into a modified penis.

There is nothing wrong with putting your penis inside a modified penis.

Of course it's bigoted. You haven't given a practical reason why you wouldn't date a trans woman apart from the fact that she's trans. Most everyone else in this thread that wouldn't date a trans woman have given reasons that would have a real, concrete effect on how the transsexuality of their partner would affect their relationship (giving birth, vagina functionality, etc). You're openly admitting that these problem wouldn't be an issue for you if they were cis but not trans for no reason. That's bigotry.

Not wanting to put your dick in a modified dick is not bigotry.

 

[khamsinvera]

See, this is why we can't have nice things. I know some of you are going to take objection to this and tone police me to avoid addressing the message, but let's just call it what it is. This thread is a monument to pervasive cisgender male privilege from a group of people who won't acknowledge it exists and don't understand how fucking evil it is to live in this world full of oppressive, ignorant people as a trans individual. So many people in this thread, speculating about what it's like to be transgender, projecting all of their misguided preconceptions and prejudices into it, just having a huge privileged circlejerk, trying to take the role as the gatekeepers to our humanity. Desexualizing us, ignorantly defining us, ignorantly attempting to speak to our experiences, going off outdated stereotypes. This thread is completely fucking littered with uneducated opinions from people who dare to tell trans-identified individuals that their perspectives and experiences have no place in this conversation. People calling for things that are a 'little bigoted' to be glossed over rather than called out. Even the cisgender people who seem to mean well are, largely, not educated on the subject and feeling free to speak to the trans experience as if they are. It's disgusting and disturbing. Cissexism and transphobia (particularly transmisogny) are problematic, bigoted societal norms, and so many of you are perpetuating them and acting as if it's legit to be an oppressive asshole.

Today I learned that despite all my views on equality for all, I'm still an oppressive asshole.

/s

Sorry that my penis is such an oppressive, sexist and racist facist - but yeah, he knows what he likes.

 

[Platy]

I am attracted to women who identify as women and dwell in bodies which from birth didn't require a transformation from male specific organs to female specific ones. If that is being bigoted, then sue me.

Have you already tested such organs ?

Because the Merriam-Webster disctionary definition of bigoted

" a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intoleranc"

Part one is specialy important since includes PREJUDICES which is saying about stuff you don't know.

May I have your address so my lawyer can contact you ? ;D

 

[Herpes Reasons]

There is nothing wrong with not wanting to put your penis into a modified penis.

There is nothing wrong with putting your penis inside a modified penis.



Not wanting to put your dick in a modified dick is not bigotry.

I never said there is anything wrong with it, I simply am not interested in it. And apparently it is bigoted as you can view the post above yours which says as much.

 

[Mumei]

Of course it's bigoted. You haven't given a practical reason why you wouldn't date a trans woman apart from the fact that she's trans. Most everyone else in this thread that wouldn't date a trans woman have given reasons that would have a real, concrete effect on how the transsexuality of their partner would affect their relationship (giving birth, vagina functionality, etc). You're openly admitting that these problem wouldn't be an issue for you if they were cis but not trans for no reason. That's bigotry.

Yep.

How can they consider a physical body to be attractive or innocuous when it is assumed to be cissexual, then suddenly find it to be horrific or threatening upon the discovery that it is transsexual. And if such dramatically different responses can be elicited by the same human being under different circumstances, doesn't that indicate that the real difference resides in the cissexual mind and not in the transsexual body?​

 

[Soph]

But I missed penis bits guy! Come on.

Seems one of the posters above me already answered to your prayers.

 

[User 73706]

I think the problem is that you are using her sex to define her gender, and not her identity (her brain). It's your brain that determines it, not the other way around. She is a woman, but with a penis. Having a penis does not make her any less of a woman.

Adding on to this, using Bailey "the porn industry has some of the most outdated and offensive practices / denominations in modern day" Jay as an example of a run-of-the-mill transgender woman is pretty ridiculous. There are plenty of (mostly up-and-coming) pornstars that don't get complete gender reassignment surgery to cater to that "shemale" audience, so using her as an example really isn't the best counter-argument. Of course you're going to think she's "still male" or "not a real woman" - from a sexual perspective, I mean, she's got a dick. She could very well identify as entirely female in terms of gender, but going the Bailey Jay route is like defending your right to call people of color "ebony" by citing Booty Talk.

 

[collige]

Not wanting to put your dick in a modified dick is not bigotry.

He said:

f a woman had a terrible accident and needed surgery to fix her vagina for whatever reason, that wouldn't stop be from dating them.

So a surgically created vagina on a cis woman is okay but a surgically created vagina on a trans woman isn't? He's discriminating solely on the basis of the woman being trans.

 

[Lesath]

Were they born in a body that was female from day one? As in, didn't start out a male with a penis, testicles, scrotum, and other male specific body parts? That didn't require surgery to form female specific parts? If a woman lacks the ability to have a child because she was raped and her womb was destroyed, that wouldn't restrict me from dating her and is different IMO than a person who went through the process and never had a womb to begin with. If a woman had a terrible accident and needed surgery to fix her vagina for whatever reason, that wouldn't stop be from dating them. Why? Because at a point in time they had all of this and didn't go from having a male body to a female one.

Now if you think that is bigoted, well, have fun with it.

Well, thank you at least for being honest. I think working it out like this helped me get over it and boil the problem down to being myself. What sort of standard would I be holding a transgendered woman to, this standard is arbitrary and something I wouldn't apply to cisgendered women under some of the conditions you outlined? An invisible karyotype? I wouldn't even discriminate against a complete androgen insensitive XY woman in this way, so...

And the only reason I would be uncomfortable with the history of a transgendered woman is that deep down it was a reflection of my own insecurities: well, isn't that sort of gay if she's a biological male? And that's all it really was for me. I found that reason to be stupid, and so I changed my stance.

 

[Zen_Arcade]

Of course it's bigoted. You haven't given a practical reason why you wouldn't date a trans woman apart from the fact that she's trans. Most everyone else in this thread that wouldn't date a trans woman have given reasons that would have a real, concrete effect on how the transsexuality of their partner would affect their relationship (giving birth, vagina functionality, etc). You're openly admitting that these problem wouldn't be an issue for you if they were cis but not trans for no reason. That's bigotry.

By this logic gay men are bigoted towards women, and straight men are bigoted towards gay men because they won't date a man.

Not wanting to have sex with someone doesn't mean you're intolerant of them. You can not want to date a woman who is fat, but that doesn't mean you're intolerant of fat people.

 

[Herpes Reasons]

By this logic gay men are bigoted towards women, and straight men are bigoted towards gay men because they won't date a man.

Not wanting to have sex with someone doesn't mean you're intolerant of them. You can not want to date a woman who is fat, but that doesn't mean you're intolerant of fat people.

yep.

 

[King Cobra]

I think the problem is that you are using her sex to define her gender, and not her identity (her brain). It's your brain that determines it, not the other way around. She is a woman, but with a penis. Having a penis does not make her any less of a woman.

"A penis is the primary sexual organ that male and hermaphrodite animals use to inseminate sexually receptive mates "

I am sorry but you are asking too much. Honestly you can't resonably expect so much from society when people are just beginning to be more accepting.

Let me put it more bluntly. Saying


is incredibly ignorant and disrespectful. Straight up. My post was about your usage of pronouns.

Maybe I was a little cold, but I don't see how ignorant could apply to my statement.

 

[Petrie]

He said:

So a surgically created vagina on a cis woman is okay but a surgically created vagina on a trans woman isn't? He's discriminating solely on the basis of the woman being trans.

One is a modified penis.

The other is a modified vagina.

Those 2 things are not the same.

His entire reason can be not wanting to put his dick in a modified dick. That's ok.

 

[Mumei]

By this logic gay men are bigoted towards women, and straight men are bigoted towards gay men because they won't date a man.

Not wanting to have sex with someone doesn't mean you're intolerant of them. You can not want to date a woman who is fat, but that doesn't mean you're intolerant of fat people.

yep.

... I think you two are confused about exactly what the argument we're making is. If you did, you wouldn't think that our argument means that straight men are bigoted towards gay men because of their lack of interest in having sex with us, or that gay men are bigoted towards women because of our lack of interest in having sex with them.

 

[Herpes Reasons]

One is a modified penis.

The other is a modified vagina.

Those 2 things are not the same.

His entire reason can be not wanting to put his dick in a modified dick. That's ok.

EXACTLY.

... I think you two are confused about exactly what the argument we're making is. If you did, you wouldn't think that our argument means that straight men are bigoted towards gay men because of their lack of interest in having sex with us, or that gay men are bigoted towards women because of our lack of interest in having sex with them.

So you're saying that if I'm willing to have sex with a woman who has a surgically repaired vagina that I should be willing to have sex with a woman who had a penis turned into a surgically created vagina or else I'm a bigot. Ok.

 

[collige]

By this logic gay men are bigoted towards women, and straight men are bigoted towards gay men because they won't date a man.

Not wanting to have sex with someone doesn't mean you're intolerant of them. You can not want to date a woman who is fat, but that doesn't mean you're intolerant of fat people.

The difference is that being fat is a physical characterization is a physical characteristic that affects one appearance. Being trans isn't. Yes, being trans comes with other physical side effects that one may find objectionable, but if those side effects aren't a problem when the woman is straight, then you're just discriminating.

 

[CapitalismSucks DonkeyBalls]

This is too much. There are so many people in this thread claiming they are not bigots, racists, or transphobic with no hint of irony. That is literally what Erin is talking about. Cisgendered (wow I love that word) individuals, especially in this thread, cannot see why they are being offensive despite being repeatedly told why.

And you probably don't like the word cisgendered because it makes you feel alien and unusual. Wow I wonder what that's like.

Nah. But nice try. Keep assuming.

 

[Tesseract]

Yep.

How can they consider a physical body to be attractive or innocuous when it is assumed to be cissexual, then suddenly find it to be horrific or threatening upon the discovery that it is transsexual. And if such dramatically different responses can be elicited by the same human being under different circumstances, doesn't that indicate that the real difference resides in the cissexual mind and not in the transsexual body?​

this and several previous posts tread too deep sociological waters for me, pulled off shore by a flimsy wave of metaphysical how, thens

seems a little bigoted, haughty

 

[User 73706]

By this logic gay men are bigoted towards women, and straight men are bigoted towards gay men because they won't date a man.

Not wanting to have sex with someone doesn't mean you're intolerant of them. You can not want to date a woman who is fat, but that doesn't mean you're intolerant of fat people.

I think you're looking at this the wrong way. The problem is that trans women inherently line up with heteosexual interests - being attracted to women - so being attracted to women, but immediately being unattracted when you find out they're trans evidently has to do with being unattracted to trans women and by extension not considering them real women.

Let's use another example:

Tobi only likes pineapple upside-down cake. This is the only specification he's noted. He eats pineapple upside-down cake, and doesn't eat any other type of cake. This is not disingenuous.

Veronica only likes chocolate ice cream cake. This is the only specification she's noted. She eats chocolate ice cream cake, and doesn't eat any other type of cake. This is not disingenuous.

Glen only likes red velvet cake. This is the only specification he's noted. But, he's presented with two slices of red velvet cake. They're functionally identical, from taste to texture to appearance. You could easily switch the two slices and he couldn't tell the difference. He begins eating one slice of cake. But, as he's eating, he's been told that the slice he's eating was made with a box of cake mix and not natural ingredients. He spits out the cake, and says he doesn't like it anymore. "I only eat cake with homegrown ingredients," he replies. And yet, he never specified this initially. Is it the baker's fault for not warning him, even though he was never told he'd only eat natural cake? Or is it Glen's fault for immediately denouncing it as soon as he was told it was made with cake mix?

 

[Platy]

By this logic gay men are bigoted towards women, and straight men are bigoted towards gay men because they won't date a man.

Not wanting to have sex with someone doesn't mean you're intolerant of them. You can not want to date a woman who is fat, but that doesn't mean you're intolerant of fat people.

Gay men have preferences like muscular build, square jaw, hairy body and stuffs like that

Straight men have preferences like big breasts, round butt and shaved legs.

If a gay men LOVE a build that is muscular, hairy AND has the squarest jaw ever and find a dude that is mulcular as swazenneger in his glory days, hairy as the yet, has the jaq of The Chin from Dexter lab AND it is mixed race and he is not atracted AT ALL than this gay men is bigoted.

 

[Trojita]

I don't recall doing that. My argument comes down to telling someone they need to use the word "sex" instead of "gender" makes no sense because the words are synonyms.

You don't remember something less than 2 hours ago?

Please don't lie, He was born a male and went through hormone treatment to make himself appear more feminine.

So we're back to this shit, huh?

This "shit" is factually correct, because science can't yet get us beyond that. Hopefully one day it can.

 

[Lesath]

No. I am accepting that merriam webster lists them as synonyms of one another. They also have alternate definitions. You don't get to decide what definition of the word gender people use any more than they get to decide what gender you identify as.

You know, you're right: assholes have as much right to be assholes as transgendered individuals have a right to decide what gender they identify as. Racists get to use racial epithets, sexists should get to use sexually demeaning language, and it's all okay because by golly it's their birthright! I don't get to decide what they think of these people!

 

[SquiddyCracker]

I think the problem is that you are using her sex to define her gender, and not her identity (her brain). It's your brain that determines it, not the other way around. She is a woman, but with a penis. Having a penis does not make her any less of a woman.

Indeed, that's the thing that's probably causing undue amounts of disagreement in this thread.

You can view transgender women as female, without having to be attracted to them due to part of their physiology (e.g., a penis, or a constructed vagina you believe to be less appealing to you than a non-constructed vagina.) There's nothing bigoted about having such sexual preferences.

The bigotry arises from when you deny that a transgender woman is a woman, and call her a male that's had his dick modified.

 

[Platy]

One is a modified penis.

The other is a modified vagina.

Those 2 things are not the same.

His entire reason can be not wanting to put his dick in a modified dick. That's ok.

A Penis and scrottum ARE a modified vagina.

Modified clitoris and ovaries , to be more exact

 

[dubq]

One is a modified penis.

The other is a modified vagina.

Those 2 things are not the same.

His entire reason can be not wanting to put his dick in a modified dick. That's ok.

Actually, since we're all technically female when we're first conceived in the womb, aren't all penis' modified vagina's?

A Penis and scrottum ARE a modified vagina.

Modified clitoris, to be more exact

This.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

I'm trying to catch up on the thread but I need to ask now: if I respect the decision, I'm willing to be friends and will defend your honor from intolerant individuals but I wouldn't date you due to reasons I admit are wrong/silly but can't help, am I a bigot?

If so then damn. I hope at the very least we can remain friendly because I can't really help it.

 

[Tesseract]

A Penis and scrottum ARE a modified vagina.

Modified clitoris, to be more exact

they're also a collection of atoms

 

[Petrie]

You don't remember something less than 2 hours ago?

By one definition of gender, that poster is 100% correct.

 

[Herpes Reasons]

I'm trying to catch up on the thread but I need to ask now: if I respect the decision, I'm willing to be friends and will defend your honor from intolerant individuals but I wouldn't date you due to reasons I admit are wrong/silly but can't help, am I a bigot?

If so then damn. I hope at the very least we can remain friendly because I can't really help it.

Yes, you're a bigot.