Support NeoGAF

[NervousXtian]

Yeah but you're either choosing to pay for the content in the DLC, like every other game, or choosing to avoid it. The DLC doesn't say "also includes periodic patches, updates, etc between now and the next DLC."

If you look at it that way, you could say you're paying a sub by buying the actual game. If the game costs $60 and the next game comes out a year from now, you could just as easily say "well I paid $60, but really it was $5/mo until the next game came out... it's the same as a sub." I don't think that's a fair comparison.

It would have been better as a sub... honestly... then you'd have seen a more steady stream of content drop than we have now. They'd have to keep people on the cycle playing.. it was easy to say nope to drop $20 on the DLC and being done.. but if I had a steady stream of content I'd keep paying the $5 to experience it. Once I'm off the cycle though.. onto something else.. and not dropping $20 to play it.

There aren't enough bosses in the game to really make a substantial boss rush mode.....plus so many of the existing bosses are highly dependent on level geometry to frame the fight. Simply transplanting them into an arena with less distinctive architecture may not work.

Moreover though, who really wants a boss rush? None of the raid bosses would really work and most of the strike bosses suck donkey balls. Why would I get excited over a mode where a 5 minute Phogoth fight gets followed up by a 5 minute Valus T'Auric fight??

Yeah, the bosses in general suck.. I'd rather have just hordes.

 

[SonnyBoy]

http://www.gameondaily.com/destiny-house-of-wolves-a-masterclass-in-taking-the-piss/

Sums up the salt.

I wonder if Bungie will feel compelled to defend their stance...

 

[shanafan]

But most DLC does not lock you out of content from the original game. The week TDB launched, the nightfall was a TDB nightfall so people who did not purchase the DLC were locked out of content they paid for (nightfall). I haven't played in a while but when I was playing, the daily heroic missions were DLC only three times a week. So to me it is a subscription model

I still feel like locking people out of content they paid for is a shitty move and is anti consumer. If they want to have a subscription service, then they should advertise it as such. They're selling the game as a regular $60 AAA title with paid DLC.

If the Nightfall was Omnigul, then that was the paid DLC which people who paid for the DLC get. When Advanced Warfare releases a new map pack, even though I bought "Team Deathmatch", it doesn't mean that I should be able to play any map that I wanted to. I see your point, but that is how modern gaming has changed, just like every other game out there. Bungie hasn't locked anybody out of what they paid for. Heck, on PS4, I do not own TDB but I can still do Eris's bounties. That is a nice bonus of getting something that I did not pay for.

 

[Anton Sugar]

But most DLC does not lock you out of content from the original game. The week TDB launched, the nightfall was a TDB nightfall so people who did not purchase the DLC were locked out of content they paid for (nightfall). I haven't played in a while but when I was playing, the daily heroic missions were DLC only three times a week. So to me it is a subscription model

I still feel like locking people out of content they paid for is a shitty move and is anti consumer. If they want to have a subscription service, then they should advertise it as such. They're advertising the game as a regular $60 AAA title with paid DLC

Yup. This is why I sold the game.

If the Nightfall was Omnigul, then that was the paid DLC which people who paid for the DLC get. When Advanced Warfare releases a new map pack, even though I bought "Team Deathmatch", it doesn't mean that I should be able to play any map that I wanted to. I see your point, but that is how modern gaming has changed, just like every other game out there. Bungie hasn't locked anybody out of what they paid for. Heck, on PS4, I do not own TDB but I can still do Eris's bounties. That is a nice bonus of getting something that I did not pay for.

That's not a good comparison. A more accurate one would be "When Advanced Warfare releases a new map pack, 'Team Deathmatch' wasn't available for vanilla players for a week because all playlists were switched to the new maps."

Nightfall, Weekly, and Raids are the only PvE endgame content (Daily too, but to a lesser degree). Locking out two of those mosts from vanilla players, even for a week, is a blatantly shitty anti-consumer practice.

 

[shanafan]

That's not a good comparison. A more accurate one would be "When Advanced Warfare releases a new map pack, 'Team Deathmatch' wasn't available for vanilla players for a week because all playlists were switched to the new maps."

Nightfall, Weekly, and Raids are the only PvE endgame content (Daily too, but to a lesser degree). Locking out two of those mosts from vanilla players, even for a week, is a blatantly shitty anti-consumer practice.

Fair point, I can see what the OP meant. But still, why would someone NOT get the DLC? If you are investing time into your Destiny, might as well experience all that you can right?

 

[Mindlog]

Agreed to the 1000%. Never seen so many people jump ship from a trailer and a statement from Bungie before they revealed anything substantial of what we will see in HoW.

Then blame the information drip feed.
"Hey this is what we're doing. Prison of Elders. May 16. Randomized Arena Combat. Check out this video. Free Raid later this year."
Hey this...
is...
a...
preview of...
something...
we might...
be doing...
at some point...
in the future...
Stay tuned...
Next week...
For the full...
countdown reveal...
of our...
teaser...
announcement...
"We got 4 weeks of coverage on IGN for this information. Mission Accomplished! Shit, where did everybody go?"

I'm happy that they're going to tell us ahead of time how they plan to change the upgrade process. Their last go around was awful as some of us wasted good resources on upgrades that were undone a day later.

 

[Sword Of Doom]

If the Nightfall was Omnigul, then that was the paid DLC which people who paid for the DLC get. When Advanced Warfare releases a new map pack, even though I bought "Team Deathmatch", it doesn't mean that I should be able to play any map that I wanted to. I see your point, but that is how modern gaming has changed, just like every other game out there. Bungie hasn't locked anybody out of what they paid for. Heck, on PS4, I do not own TDB but I can still do Eris's bounties. That is a nice bonus of getting something that I did not pay for.

You are locked out of content. When you purchase the game, you are purchasing a weekly nightfall activity, a weekly heroic strike and daily heroic missions. When those missions become DLC only, non DLC owners can not play those missions. When a nightfall is omnigul, a non DLC owner has no nightfall/weekly heroic to play that entire week. When the daily is a DLC mission, a non DLC owner has no daily heroic mission to play. This is not common practice in modern gaming like you suggested. If I don't buy a COD map pack, that means I can not play those maps but I can still play the MP modes that I payed for.

 

[squidhands]

Moreover though, who really wants a boss rush? None of the raid bosses would really work and most of the strike bosses suck donkey balls. Why would I get excited over a mode where a 5 minute Phogoth fight gets followed up by a 5 minute Valus T'Auric fight??

plus we've already killed those turdburglars a zillion times, it would be kind of weird to see them in jail

 

[Anton Sugar]

Fair point, I can see what the OP meant. But still, why would someone NOT get the DLC? If you are investing time into your Destiny, might as well experience all that you can right?

Because it's a shitty value proposition that I didn't feel like spending money on? All IMO, of course.

Just because I invested time into Destiny doesn't mean I should be expected to eat up everything they release. It's possible to enjoy the game and acknowledge its many faults, including Bungie's shitty business and design decisions.

 

[pj]

You are locked out of content. When you purchase the game, you are purchasing a weekly nightfall activity, a weekly heroic strike and daily heroic missions. When those missions become DLC only, non DLC owners can not play those missions. When a nightfall is omnigul, a non DLC owner has no nightfall/weekly heroic to play that entire week. When the daily is a DLC mission, a non DLC owner has no daily heroic mission to play. This is not common practice in modern gaming like you suggested. If I don't buy a COD map pack, that means I can not play those maps but I can still play the MP modes that I payed for.

This part is not new though. I'm quite sure bungie did the same thing with Halo map packs (H2? H3? I don't recall how far back it went). You couldn't play some playlists without DLC.

 

[Latvian Hitman]

Fair point, I can see what the OP meant. But still, why would someone NOT get the DLC? If you are investing time into your Destiny, might as well experience all that you can right?

 

[PrivateWHudson]

This part is not new though. I'm quite sure bungie did the same thing with Halo map packs (H2? H3? I don't recall how far back it went). You couldn't play some playlists without DLC.

You are incorrect. If I didn't buy the DLC I could always still play Team Slayer. Never was that not an option. I couldn't play the DLC playlists that also had a team Slayer, but could always play the modes that the game shipped with.

 

[Wind's Howling]

Two expansions and no new worlds or regions. I thought it was impossible to fuck up something so simple... but they did it.

 

[lt519]

I love how we all are just assuming it's a horde mode even though nothing/zero/nada/zilch has been gleaned otherwise.

So can we stop calling it a horde mode until we actually know what it is?

So a sequence of big tough enemies instead of waves of smaller enemies. It's essentially the same thing. People are using Horde Mode as a blanket statement for "Arena fighting that doesn't have mechanics other than shoot something." Whether that is the case, we don't know, but the removal of the word "raid" implies no fancy mechanics. If they said boss rush mode people would have been equally disappointed as the horde mode we've made up. it's about not having that 6 person co-op adventure through the Vault of Glass or Crota's End that is disappointing. All I've done is shoot things other than raids, I want a little more than just shooting the same reskinned things but bigger in size with modifiers.

 

[Homeboyd]

Two expansions and no new worlds or regions. I thought it was impossible to fuck up something so simple... but they did it.

A new planet would be soooooo welcomed at this point. Don't even care if it has the same enemies... just some new terrain. Oh and patrol bounties.

 

[Primethius]

This still has PS exclusive content right? Poor XB1 season pass owners.

 

[JoshHood]

A new planet would be soooooo welcomed at this point. Don't even care if it has the same enemies... just some new terrain. Oh and patrol bounties.

I can't believe they're not even adding a new planet in Comet (if that's still the plan).

 

[Stanng243]

I should really play some Destiny again. I've never done any of the raids though. Way too low a level for them.

 

[tebunker]

There aren't enough bosses in the game to really make a substantial boss rush mode.....plus so many of the existing bosses are highly dependent on level geometry to frame the fight. Simply transplanting them into an arena with less distinctive architecture may not work.

Moreover though, who really wants a boss rush? None of the raid bosses would really work and most of the strike bosses suck donkey balls. Why would I get excited over a mode where a 5 minute Phogoth fight gets followed up by a 5 minute Valus T'Auric fight??

Who says they would be reusing any bosses? That is short sighted thinking. The prison of elders houses bad dudes from across the galaxy. Enemies we've never seen.

They can simply design a sequential series of fights and set pieces with randomized elements.

Yes it is similar to a horde mode, but not the same.

So maybe I am seeing it more as a series of end of strike battles that culminate in fighting one ultimate badass. Hopefully they mix up the arena some by loading in different set pieces and having changing rules.

 

[squidhands]

I should really play some Destiny again. I've never done any of the raids though. Way too low a level for them.

You totally should, best content in the game hands down. Be sure to visit the OT threads and look for some groups, most folks there are super helpful and are wiling to sherpa newbies through their first raid.

 

[pj]

You are incorrect. If I didn't buy the DLC I could always still play Team Slayer. Never was that not an option. I couldn't play the DLC playlists that also had a team Slayer, but could always play the modes that the game shipped with.

https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/...aq/7dcb6fe7-29c8-47ed-ba29-a0f417004a5a/posts

Ranked Playlists / DLC required
Q: Why can’t I play in the Team Doubles playlist?
A: All DLC is required to play in the Team Doubles playlist.
Q: Why can’t I play in the Team Snipers playlist?
A: All DLC is required to play in the Team Snipers playlist.
Q: Why can’t I play in the MLG playlist?
A: All DLC is required to play in the MLG playlist.
Q: Why can’t I play in the SWAT playlist?
A: All DLC is required to play in the SWAT playlist.
Social Playlists / DLC required
Q: Why can’t I play in the Rumble Pit playlist?
A: All DLC is required to play in the Rumble Pit playlist.
Q: Why can’t I play in the Social Skirmish playlist?
A: All DLC is required to play in the Social Skirmish playlist.
Q: Why can’t I play in the Action Sack playlist?
A: All DLC is required to play in the Action Sack playlist.
Q: Why can’t I play in the Team Mythic playlist?
A: All DLC is required to play in the Team Mythic playlist.
Q: Why can’t I play in the Social Big Team playlist?
A: All DLC is required to play in the Social Big Team playlist.
Q: Why can’t I play in the 7 on the 7th playlist?
A: All DLC is required to play in the 7 on the 7th playlist.

Seems like there was a lot of playlists that required DLC. Did none of those ship with the game?


Edit: And it is a bit unfair to equate the team slayer playlist in halo with 1/6 weekly strikes in destiny. It sucks in both cases but again, this is not new, and I actually think it was worse in Halo

 

[Naminator]

Good thing that Bungie left that greed ass Microsoft to explore their artistic freedom!

/s

 

[FunkyPajamas]

Somehow people got in their head (even after playing the alpha and beta) that they were getting some warcraft/borderlands/diablo/mass effect/halo hybrid.

Yeah I wonder whose fault that was.

 

[kidko]

It was wise to get the no-raid news out of the way right off the bat. By the time the expansion rolls around, it will be such old news that the shock will have long since worn off and the impotent nerd rage subsided, and everyone will happily soak up whatever new tidbits are actually in the DLC

 

[Roldan]

We should have been thankful when Bungie revealed The Dark Below's content. There's always a way to screw up even more. lol

 

[squidhands]

https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/...aq/7dcb6fe7-29c8-47ed-ba29-a0f417004a5a/posts



Seems like there was a lot of playlists that required DLC. Did none of those ship with the game?


Edit: And it is a bit unfair to equate the team slayer playlist in halo with a 1/6 weekly strikes in destiny. It sucks in both cases but again, this is not new, and I actually think it was worse in Halo

You're also looking at a 2013 FAQ from a game that released in 2007. It was very different back in the day

 

[Homeboyd]

I can't believe they're not even adding a new planet in Comet (if that's still the plan).

Where'd you hear/see that? I 100% expect to see at least 1 new planet in Comet.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Where'd you hear/see that? I 100% expect to see at least 1 new planet in Comet.

Bungie has done everything short of announce new destinations for Comet. They're coming in it, for sure.

 

[amar212]

Where'd you hear/see that? I 100% expect to see at least 1 new planet in Comet.

Even the Hubble would struggle there.

 

[PrivateWHudson]

https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/...aq/7dcb6fe7-29c8-47ed-ba29-a0f417004a5a/posts



Seems like there was a lot of playlists that required DLC. Did none of those ship with the game?


Edit: And it is a bit unfair to equate the team slayer playlist in halo with 1/6 weekly strikes in destiny. It sucks in both cases but again, this is not new, and I actually think it was worse in Halo

I think these were the only shipped game modes:

Non-DLC Required Playlists
Q: Which playlists do not require DLC?
A: Lone Wolves, Team Slayer, Social Slayer, and Multi-Team do not require DLC.

It could have been that more restrictions came on-line as the community became too small to support DLC and Non-DLC playlists.

It's been a while, but I also remember DLC1 being free when DLC2 came out, and DLC2 was free when DLC3 came out, ect. Honestly, most of the games I played were Custom, and a year or so into it I had tons more content to play than what shipped. Without buying DLC.

 

[Evilmaus]

This might sound like a strange question, considering this thread is mostly full of people displeased with the direction of this latest expansion, but would now be a good time to buy Destiny?

I have a fairly powerful gaming PC, Wii-U, PS3, 3DS and my precious Vita, so I've been in no rush at all to pick up a PS4 (I have no real interest in getting an XBone anytime soon). That being said, I feel like getting a PS4 in the coming months, and while Destiny seemed to lack content at launch, there's a fair chunk on the horizon. So would now be a good time to jump in and start playing for the first time?

 

[Trickster]

http://www.gameondaily.com/destiny-house-of-wolves-a-masterclass-in-taking-the-piss/

Sums up the salt.

Seems premature to me. We don't really know what else will have changed in HoW afaik. Could be the HoW delay is because they are actually trying to incorporate what they've learned since release into their new content. Which would be damn great if you ask me.

 

[IxmagicmanIx]

If you sell out to Activision you're gonna have a bad time.

 

[Kill3r7]

Yeah I'm sure having the best selling new IP of all time must be awful.

 

[Audible Phonetics]

This might sound like a strange question, considering this thread is mostly full of people displeased with the direction of this latest expansion, but would now be a good time to buy Destiny?

I have a fairly powerful gaming PC, Wii-U, PS3, 3DS and my precious Vita, so I've been in no rush at all to pick up a PS4 (I have no real interest in getting an XBone anytime soon). That being said, I feel like getting a PS4 in the coming months, and while Destiny seemed to lack content at launch, there's a fair chunk on the horizon. So would now be a good time to jump in and start playing for the first time?

When House of Wolves releases, destiny will have a ton of content to keep you busy for a good while. If I was to judge Destiny on what it would like with all the expansions, I'd give it a solid B+/A-. I don't know if I'd buy a PS4 for that game, but if you find a bundle with it at a good price it may be worth to dive in.

 

[border]

Who says they would be reusing any bosses? That is short sighted thinking. The prison of elders houses bad dudes from across the galaxy. Enemies we've never seen.

Expecting them to create new art assets is probably expecting too much. They don't even make new character models for the raids.

 

[Kodros]

Seems premature to me. We don't really know what else will have changed in HoW afaik. Could be the HoW delay is because they are actually trying to incorporate what they've learned since release into their new content. Which would be damn great if you ask me.

Then they really need to come out and say it. It's massively fucked up to drop a bomb like that to the community and then say "Hey, even though we just made you really upset, come back every few days for a very slow trickle of information!".

 

[Deadstar]

Yeah I'm sure having the best selling new IP of all time must be awful.

It's not awful but it could be a WHOLE lot better. No recycled enemies, have the strike bosses not just be giant versions of other enemies. A lot of Destiny is lazy especially coming from Bungie. It's a huge let down but of course when you see major people leaving the company you know something bad is happening there. If the new mode is just a coop horde mode I'm going to be pretty angry. Strikes are already a "horde" mode basically. You're fighting wave after wave to get to a boss.

 

[Evilmaus]

When House of Wolves releases, destiny will have a ton of content to keep you busy for a good while. If I was to judge Destiny on what it would like with all the expansions, I'd give it a solid B+/A-. I don't know if I'd buy a PS4 for that game, but if you find a bundle with it at a good price it may be worth to dive in.

I mean, my system-seller is Person 5. As soon as that game drops I'm buying a PS4, but I've considered picking one up sooner anyway to give Destiny and Bloodborne a go in the meantime. If I play my cards right I can probably get a decent bundle for around £300, which is say is fairly reasonable.
Thanks for your input though. It's good to know I should have plenty to do as a newcomer.

 

[ZiggyST]

Expecting them to create new art assets is probably expecting too much. They don't even make new character models for the raids.

That really pisses me off.., same monster again on different sizes and alphas .

 

[Anton Sugar]

Edit: And it is a bit unfair to equate the team slayer playlist in halo with 1/6 weekly strikes in destiny. It sucks in both cases but again, this is not new, and I actually think it was worse in Halo

I couldn't care less that it happened before or was worse in Halo. It felt severe in Destiny, considering its dearth of content. It might have only been 1/6 of the playlist, but it was 2/3 modes that my friends played each week. It sucked/sucks.

 

[Innolis]

I'm having a hard time understanding how anyone can still be giving these people money. I enjoyed the base game for what it was, but the expansions and updates so far have been so bad, so against what everyone in the community wanted....it just baffles me.

 

[tebunker]

Expecting them to create new art assets is probably expecting too much. They don't even make new character models for the raids.

True but they could have been working on this and probably have been for a long time.

I more or less expect tweaked models and amped up existing models. That doesn't mean they will be reusing old bosses, maybe repurposing or just tweaking assets. Like new skins and scripting.

I figure we will see 1 or 2 unique enemies.

 

[Anton Sugar]

Expecting them to create new art assets is probably expecting too much. They don't even make new character models for the raids.

I can't wait to see what bipedal or geometric enemies we'll face next!

 

[mhayze]

I hope it's more of an adapted MOBA-like mode than a straight up horde mode. The former would be innovative (i.e. adapting MOBA-lite to a FPS / or action-TPS mode), and the latter has been done to death, but honestly, I will give whatever Bungie comes up with a try.

 

[Trickster]

Yeah I'm sure having the best selling new IP of all time must be awful.

It's probably not fun to work at a place with Bungie's legacy and then have Destiny happen, tons of bad reviews, press, fan feedback, trolls etc. Especially if your not one of the people at the top making millions of the sales of destiny.

Then they really need to come out and say it. It's massively fucked up to drop a bomb like that to the community and then say "Hey, even though we just made you really upset, come back every few days for a very slow trickle of information!".

Agree 100% with you there. They already made the mistake of being to secretive/cryptic once before with Destiny.

 

[Fatehehhhh]

The former would be innovative (i.e. adapting MOBA-lite to a FPS / or action-TPS mode),

 

[doomquake]

If destiny had Moba style maps that could be cool. Maybe those factions would finally matter.
Sigh. I dont even know what to say anymore. Its just something to log into twice a month to shoot some low level enemies. All my gang lost interest long ago and I would rather have something worthwhile to tell them and convince them the dlc is worth it. Crota was NOT.

 

[LifEndz]

Still holding out hope, but damn am I bummed about the arena being three player only.

 

[Diablohead]

Still holding out hope, but damn am I bummed about the arena being three player only.

It's weird because we know the game can support 6 players against 20+ mobs easily, and matchmaking can already pair 6 v 6 rather fast, dropping it to 3 player fireteams is strange.

Fair point, I can see what the OP meant. But still, why would someone NOT get the DLC? If you are investing time into your Destiny, might as well experience all that you can right?

I bought destiny brand new on disc for £40, the DLC pass in the UK is £35, I am NOT paying that kind of money for these small add-ons from bungie.