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[Arttemis]

It's weird how nobody plays the "someone's sexuality is not important" card when it's for a straight character.

There were complaints about Jaqui and Takeda's romance being unnecessary and not important for the story in other MKX threads.

 

[Majukun]

It's weird how nobody plays the "someone's sexuality is not important" card when it's for a straight character.

?_? I really don't understand what you are talking about now

 

[Toxi]

MK already had someone long before Kung Jin

"IMSOGAAAAAAAAAY"

 

[Kusagari]

I think a lot of the "in your face" stuff is more talking about how so many gay characters in games fit all the obvious stereotypes.

Mortal Kombat is the last place I'd expect to see a gay character not fall into obvious tropes, so good on them for not doing so.

 

[Krejlooc]

I think a lot of the "in your face" stuff is more talking about how so many gay characters in games fit all the obvious stereotypes.

Mortal Kombat is the last place I'd expect to see a gay character not fall into obvious tropes, so good on them for not doing so.

not only that, kung jin is played off as a natural born leader in the game.

 

[Fury451]

I think that's the point. His sexuality doesn't doesn't matter.

This is what I liked about it.

 

[RM8]

I think this is an important point. As I mentioned previously, there are many ways to show diversity, but the amount of "I'm glad it was subtle/not shoved in our faces" responses in here is a bit off-putting.

If they did decide to make it a larger part of the storyline, that would of been a fine way to go about it too. Overt displays of homosexuality are not a problem anymore than straight ones are.

I'm glad it was done in a subtle way not because I didn't want gay romance in MK, but because it could have been done pretty badly. Both making it a big part of the story and making it a subtle detail are good outcomes, IMO.

because nobody makes a big deal about it.

But why? Why nobody has ever made a big deal about it?

 

[Kevyt]

Funny how most people missed it. Yet those of us LGBT+ picked up on it really fast.

I think that's somewhat sad tbh, it tells a lot about how we are conditioned to be subtle and pick up on clues so that others don't pick up on.

I applaud Netherrealm for doing this and not making it a big deal to his character in a game with a shitload of shirtless, hulking, sweaty men too. But that won't stop me from making a big deal out of it with the $1 million question: what is the right ship for Kung Jin?

Erron Black? (cause of his shirtless alt)
Sub-Zero? (only Kung Jin can melt Sub-Zero's cold, lonely, muscly silver fox heart)
Ermac? (one of those souls inside him gotta be gay)

I think I shall ship Kung Jin x human Scorpion. He's human now and nothing can ever replace the love for his wife and kid, so he might as well fill that love with some D.

I would ship him with Johnny Cage. lol.

 

[reminiscingLemon]

I don't think that's how creativity and expression works.

People will keep wanting to express things about love and sexuality, and the hope of gay acceptance is not that those topics will become boring, but that people will treat those expressions fairly.

Sorry I think theres been a mis communication here, just to clarify I dont think people should stop writing gay characters, far from it infact.

What I was trying to say was, we as an audience, as forum goers, bloggers, writers journalists etc need to stop glorifying (and obviously condemning but those that would condemn homosexual characters are probably going to do so regardless) gay characters and the people who write them simply for the fact that they are gay. What we need more of is fantasticly written gay characters that we can talk about for being deep and complex and interesting as well as being gay and not purely because they are gay and that is their strongest character defining attribute

 

[Deified Data]

No they haven't..not even close. Their last game showed as much.

I see that you're banned but can anyone tell me what this guy was talking about? Inquisition was a treasure trove of diversity.

 

[Krejlooc]

Funny how most people missed it. Yet those of us LGBT+ picked up on it really fast.

i am straight and picked up on it right away.

 

[Karkador]

I think a lot of the "in your face" stuff is more talking about how so many gay characters in games fit all the obvious stereotypes.

Mortal Kombat is the last place I'd expect to see a gay character not fall into obvious tropes, so good on them for not doing so.

It seems to me like a lot of the ridiculous stereotyping of homosexuals in games is coming from Japan, who tend to treat the subject like a huge joke.

So, while Mortal Kombat is a huge joke of a series, it's still coming from a place that typically hasn't done those kinds of things (in games) (in recent decades).

 

[Hours Left]

I'm glad it was done in a subtle way not because I didn't want gay romance in MK, but because it could have been done pretty badly. Both making it a big part of the story and making it a subtle detail are good outcomes, IMO.

I agree.

 

[Majukun]

But why? Why nobody has ever made a big deal about it?

because it is seen as normal
much like to reach equalty we need to reach that point where homosexuals couples are seen as normal

 

[Krejlooc]

It seems to me like a lot of the ridiculous stereotyping of homosexuals in games is coming from Japan, who tend to treat the subject like a huge joke.

So, while Mortal Kombat is a huge joke of a series, it's still coming from a place that typically hasn't done those kinds of things (in games) (in recent decades).

what about the ballad of gay tony?

 

[mr teaspoon]

Funny how most people missed it. Yet those of us LGBT+ picked up on it really fast.

I think that's somewhat sad tbh, it tells a lot about how we are conditioned to be subtle and pick up on clues so that others don't pick up on.

Disagree that LGBT are somehow better equipped to pick up on pretty obvious clues.

 

[Karkador]

what about the ballad of gay tony?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't people cite that as "representation done right"? I haven't played that game (expansion?), no clue what to say about it, other than the general impression that Rockstar's work is often not...great.

 

[Linconan]

spin.gif

I seriously don't think that's what was implied.
The flashback was just about Theft and Raiden trying to help him and set him on the right path.

“They care about only what is in your heart; not whom your heart desires.”

In context of the Game and Story.
Why spin this to something unrelated to the subject at hand.

smh, seems weird either way.

 

[Krejlooc]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't people cite that as "representation done right"? I haven't played that game (expansion?), no clue what to say about it, other than the general idea that Rockstar's work is often not...great.

oh, i didn't mean as an example of a gay person done right or wrong, i was just contesting your point that it hasn't been explored very much in western gaming.

 

[Wreck-It Ralph]

Can we really state for certain that he's definitely the first gay MK character? I don't think we know most characters' sexualities. I mean Baraka could be gay. You never know.

 

[Krejlooc]

I seriously don't think that's what was implied.

i seriously think the developers already confirmed it. keep spinning.

Can we really state for certain that he's definitely the first gay MK character? I don't think we know most characters' sexualities. I mean Baraka could be gay. You never know.

baraka marries mileena in many endings throughout the series.

 

[RM8]

because it is seen as normal
much like to reach equalty we need to reach that point where homosexuals couples are seen as normal

And in your opinion, we'll reach that by not talking about it? People talk about straight romance all the time and make a big deal about it. I also think it's odd that you deny that exposure can lead to acceptance, it happens all the time in different situations.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't people cite that as "representation done right"? I haven't played that game (expansion?), no clue what to say about it, other than the general impression that Rockstar's work is often not...great.

Yup, you should really play it. It's pretty damn great in representation.

 

[Linconan]

i seriously think the developers already confirmed it. keep spinning.

So they came out, and said that.

Or were they just be observant of how their fan base can relate to things?

 

[DOWN]

No they haven't..not even close. Their last game showed as much.

It's one of the most diverse AAAs I've played. Care to elaborate?

 

[Kusagari]

spin.gif

I seriously don't think that's what was implied.
The flashback was just about Theft and Raiden trying to help him and set him on the right path.

“They care about only what is in your heart; not whom your heart desires.”

In context of the Game and Story.
Why spin this to something unrelated to the subject at hand.

smh, seems weird either way.

And what could whom your heart desires possibly be referencing in terms of theft?

I mean I read the scene as he was resorting to theft as a way to lash out at the fact he thought he was being shunned because of his homosexuality.

 

[Krejlooc]

So they came out, and said that.

Or were they just be observant of how their fan base can relate to things?

and the other character-specific pre-match quotes that more explicitly indicate he's gay?

 

[Majukun]

And in your opinion, we'll reach that by not talking about it? People talk about straight romance all the time and make a big deal about it. I also think it's odd that you deny that exposure can lead to acceptance, it happens all the time in different situations.

look,there are only so many words i can use to tell you how I think about the whole subject matter..if you don't agree that's right..but i think you already figured out what my opinion is...it's good to have gay characters and gay relationships,it's even better if nobody makes a big deal about it,both in-story and in real life.
the moment we will see homosexuality being treated like it's not something to talk about,it's the moment we will have reached true "equality" between straight people and homosexuals

 

[RM8]

look,there are only so many words i can use to tell you how I think about the whole subject matter..if you don't agree that's right..but i think you already figured out what my opinion is...it's good to have gay characters and gay relationships,it's even better if nobody makes a big deal about it,both in-story and in real life.
the moment we will see homosexuality being treated like it's not something to talk about,it's the moment we will have reached true "equality" between straight people and homosexuals

But in your opinion, why do people make a big deal about it? Do you really think it has nothing to do with, uh, this being the first gay character Mortal Kombat?

 

[Nzyme32]

Yeah I picked up on this, but they never make it clear (so I'm still not sure if this is the case - could just be someone he shouldn't be with in some sort of old caste / class system) or make it something overly important to the way the game plays out which I really liked. Nice and subtle, but since it had no other connection to the story at this point, it wasn't forced to be a bigger point of contention. It would be cool to see how it could play out in the greater story to come

 

[TheChillyAcademic]

But in your opinion, why do people make a big deal about it? Do you really think it has nothing to do with, uh, this being the first gay character Mortal Kombat?

Are you under the impression there will be more? lol

 

[SolicitorPirate]

spin.gif

I seriously don't think that's what was implied.
The flashback was just about Theft and Raiden trying to help him and set him on the right path.

“They care about only what is in your heart; not whom your heart desires.”

In context of the Game and Story.
Why spin this to something unrelated to the subject at hand.

smh, seems weird either way.

Man I love watching people desperately try to spin gay couples as anything but. Reminds me of

Spoiler

the Korra ending

, where people were basically yelling, "No! Straight people totally hold each others hands and stare longingly into each others eyes while romantic music plays!"

Back on topic, between Inquisition and now MKX, it's wonderful to see AAA finally starting to mature about representation while remaining commercially successful. Gamergate might be trying its hardest to drag gaming back to their mother's basement, but we're still moving forward, one step at a time.

 

[IvorB]

Wow that's pretty crazy and unexpected. This is clearly awesome and salute Netherrealm for this. Though I can't help but find the juxtaposition of the politics of human sexuality and the world of Mortal Kombat quite bizarre. I guess the times they are a'changing.

 

[Shizuka]

Are you under the impression there will be more? lol

I think there is a good chance they'll introduce another gay character in the future at some point, probably a woman. Frost, Sareena, I'm not familiar with the franchise that much, or it could be a new character like Kung Jin.

 

[RM8]

Are you under the impression there will be more? lol

Not what I implied at all :[ But if for some reason we do get a second gay character, it would be less of a big deal automatically.

 

[Majukun]

But in your opinion, why do people make a big deal about it? Do you really think it has nothing to do with, uh, this being the first gay character Mortal Kombat?

yes it is..and your point is??

 

[Weltall Zero]

and why should we improve minorities' visibility?
what would that accomplish exactly..making aware people that gay exist?i think they already know that.
make being homosexual a normal thing,not something to underline...that is the challenge.

You crack me up. How do you plan to make people see gay people as normal by pretending they don't exist? Your entire post is a textbook example of what I was referring to.

on the contrary

makes thing being perceived as something different,something important.

someone's sexuality is NOT important

But sexuality (or rather, romantic inclination) IS important. That is the entire point. You don't reach harmony by saying "I don't care that you are gay, keep it to yourself". You reach it by saying "tell me about you, including what it means to be gay". And crucially, this includes stories in every media. I don't see you complaining about the 99% of explicitly heterosexual romances in media, so why do you otherwise expect gay romance to be invisible?

if you keep telling the majority that they should threat the minority better,all you get is that the majority will continue to perceive the minority as something "different" then themselves.

Nobody is telling anyone to treat them better (in fact, see above, I'm saying to treat them the same). What I'm saying that if you conveniently ignore the parts of a person's personality that you don't like, you're not really accepting them.

 

[RM8]

yes it is..and your point is??

If you agree with me that this is a big deal because he's the first one, then I'm not sure how you can say exposure doesn't lead to acceptance. As I just said in other post, if for some reason they introduce another gay character in the series, it won't be such a big impact because we have already been exposed to one before.

 

[Messofanego]

spin.gif

I seriously don't think that's what was implied.
The flashback was just about Theft and Raiden trying to help him and set him on the right path.

“They care about only what is in your heart; not whom your heart desires.”

In context of the Game and Story.
Why spin this to something unrelated to the subject at hand.

smh, seems weird either way.

You missed the part where the developer confirmed it.
https://twitter.com/domcianciolo/status/588059135759020033

https://twitter.com/domcianciolo/status/588050845763301376

 

[TheSpoiler]

and the other character-specific pre-match quotes that more explicitly indicate he's gay?

What quotes?

And I wouldn't be taking potshots at Japan when it's more of a developer case-by-case basis. Eagle and Venom aren't huge stereotypes that are treated as jokes. It really all depends on the developer, western or eastern.

 

[TheChillyAcademic]

I think there is a good chance they'll introduce another gay character in the future at some point, probably a woman. Frost, Sareena, I'm not familiar with the franchise that much, or it could be a new character like Kung Jin.

This is what surprises me more. I would've assumed given how fantastically attractive lesbians are to certain heterosexual men

Spoiler

and homosexual women...

that they would have thrown the "gay" label on some Tits McGee character and call it a day.

Impressed they did not.

Not what I implied at all :[ But if for some reason we do get a second gay character, it would be less of a big deal automatically.

I'm teasing I understand your meaning.

 

[Miles X]

So they came out, and said that.

Or were they just be observant of how their fan base can relate to things?

They flat out said YES when asked if Kung Jin is gay, give it up.

 

[SolicitorPirate]

I think there is a good chance they'll introduce another gay character in the future at some point, probably a woman. Frost, Sareena, I'm not familiar with the franchise that much, or it could be a new character like Kung Jin.

I could totally see Frost being gay. I also just want to play as Frost again.

 

[RM8]

I mean, "gay" used to be "happy", didn't it? You're reading far too much into this!

 

[Shizuka]

This is what surprises me more. I would've assumed given how fantastically attractive lesbians are to certain heterosexual men

Spoiler

and homosexual women...

that they would have thrown the "gay" label on some Tits McGee character and call it a day.

Impressed they did not.

Which, for me, is a positive point. Or if they decided to be subtle with a lesbian character and not just make her jump on another female character and eat her face like Mileena.

 

[IvorB]

I could totally see Frost being gay. I also just want to play as Frost again.

Maybe Sub Zero can be gay... *sigh* a man can dream...

 

[SolicitorPirate]

Maybe Sub Zero can be gay... *sigh* a man can dream...

I'll give you gay Sub Zero if you give me playable Frost

Spoiler

and an ending where she doesn't stupidly kill herself for once.

Actually, has Sub Zero ever shown any sexual or romantic interest in anything?

 

[Majukun]

You crack me up. How do you plan to make people see gay people as normal by pretending they don't exist? Your entire post is a textbook example of what I was referring to.

being subtle about it is not like pretending they don't exist,not one bit

But sexuality (or rather, romantic inclination) IS important. That is the entire point. You don't reach harmony by saying "I don't care that you are gay, keep it to yourself". You reach it by saying "tell me about you, including what it means to be gay". And crucially, this includes stories in every media. I don't see you complaining about the 99% of explicitly heterosexual romances in media, so why do you otherwise expect gay romance to be invisible?

it may be important,to you,it's not for me and i don't think it should be.i don't care to know what it means to being gay,because i think it's probably much like it is being straight.At the same time,i think that a gay doesn't want to know what it means to be straight..mainly because he/she already knows, since it is no different from what being homosexual means.
That's the main point..you see straight people and homosexuals as two different kinds of people that need to understand each other...i see them just as people...on of them like people of the opposite gender,the other people of the same..what i like and what you like doesn't make us different

also,I never (ever) said in any of the posts that i complain about the present of a gay character,nor that i expect gay romance to be invisible.

if you wanna quote me,at least quote me about what i say,not about what you want me to say.

Nobody is telling anyone to treat them better (in fact, see above, I'm saying to treat them the same). What I'm saying that if you conveniently ignore the parts of a person's personality that you don't like, you're not really accepting them.

who said I not like him ,what the hell are you even talking about??

 

[Replicant]

Maybe Sub Zero can be gay... *sigh* a man can dream...

Same. Kung Jin is not really my type. But new Subby.....damn. Also, he and Scorpio has some chemistry now they are no longer enemies.

Actually, has Sub Zero ever shown any sexual or romantic interest in anything?

He goes above and beyond for Scorpion/Hatori in this game. Protecting him and all.

 

[Linconan]

And what could whom your heart desires possibly be referencing in terms of theft?

I mean I read the scene as he was resorting to theft as a way to lash out at the fact he thought he was being shunned because of his homosexuality.

gee, i dunno maybe a general reference of a Heart.
What drives a person, to loving a person.
Seeking Vengeance
I seriously don't see the Gay reference.

..Random..
So if a Man tells another Man, I love you. Everyone's instant reaction of trained thought would be, Fag! Gay!, Homosexual!
?
Instead of thinking, maybe Father and Son. Brothers.. etc

No?
Then why is this spun, for nothing in context from the game referring to this "directly" over one line.

and the other character-specific pre-match quotes that more explicitly indicate he's gay?

Like what?
If there's (like i said) "other" references to the subject, then fair enough. And/or IF the developers came out and said Yes, yes his is.

It just seems strange to me, just because of this one line people are claiming such.

But Hey, if he is. Fine. Whatever.
The people who think that, and if turns out so, should be on CSI.
lol

EDIT:
Just saw the updated post.
Fair enough then, if the came out (devs) and said "yes".
I just thought people where running it that why "because" of that one line.
lol