CyberPunked
Member
They must have made the LOD distance about 2m radius or something
Witcher 3 downgrade arguments in here and nowhere else
- Thread starter Jigolo
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They must have made the LOD distance about 2m radius or something
there were plenty of YouTubers that were flown to Poland to try out the game, so...
Their credibility is not measured exclusively on the graphics of their games. I'd say that how they play and how good they are is way more important to their credibility than graphics.
And I'm not saying that there was not a downgrade, I'm just saying that this is not a Dark Souls 2 situation were everyone thought the game was going to have that cool lighting tech days before the release.
It was pretty clear the game was not going to look like the premiere video for awhile.
The fact that we have been discussing the downgrade for a long time now, before even the release of the game shows to me that CDPR is at least being more transparent than most devs out there.
Considering how many new fans they are going to make with the game, and how good the game seems to be I feel pretty safe to say that their cred is going to be fine, except maybe with the hardest of the hardcore.
Hopefully this will teach people a lesson to keep their expectations in check in the future...
lol
Who am I'm kidding right?
Yep. Just that + quick save key will make PC gameplay on hardest sooo smooth.
jacksepticeye
Member
This was shown off in some of the released footage by CDPR themselves too. I believe it was in the official PS4 gameplay vid by them
viveks86
Member
I hope it works with pinnacle. I'm gonna need shift mode so bad with the 360 controller.
Dictator93
Member
It was never volumetric (it doesn't even remotely look volumetric in that footage). It was just shaded by light sources.
The new particles are most likely still forward shaded as well, otherwise, they would completely stick out from their environment.
So cool. Reminds me of Crysis 1 where you could throw barrels far with max strength.
Back on topic though, there is no more blood in the water...worst game ever confirmed.
UnrealEck
Member
You're being a little imaginative there. That's why you find it strange.
I have no grudge with CD Projekt. We've already went over in this thread so many times now, the reasons why it's graphically inferior as well as what the reasons for it might be. I've also made it clear on several occasions that I understand the feasability of building the game for PC and then porting it, both in terms of how the console versions would end up looking (worse than they already are) and in terms of things like funding.
I have been realistic in my expectations of them and have given no indication I've got some predisposed grudge against them.
I've also mentioned several times that I think the game looks good too. With that said, it seems you're still unaware of the thread's subject and topic.
If you're unable to understand why I'm 'fixated' on media from years ago, you're not trying hard enough.
Yeah he totally physicsed a grenade.
Just on their game offical YT channel, there are over 3 million views for that video labeled as gameplay video (and half a million for the teaser) that turned to be bullshit vertical slice.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZ_G6XiHoUA
www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqQ3LeBgGDM
and they didn't bother to even change the text or anything to this date,so how this isn't a false marketing?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZ_G6XiHoUA
www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqQ3LeBgGDM
and they didn't bother to even change the text or anything to this date,so how this isn't a false marketing?
viveks86
Member
Let's move the discussion here while the rest continue reposting the VGX trailer
http://neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=164276698
http://neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=164276698
Just on their game offical YT channel, there are over 3 million views for that video labeled as gameplay video (and half a million for the teaser) that turned to be bullshit vertical slice.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZ_G6XiHoUA
www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqQ3LeBgGDM
and they didn't bother to even change the text or anything to this date,so how this isn't a false marketing?
Yep.
Not only did they have In-Game footage at the start of the VGX trailer, they told people it wasn't downgraded afterwards.
Then they told people PC version and PS4 are separate, we're not removing things for the PS4.
What's left in their defense?
"Changes happen and have to be lied about for their livelihoods?"
Really? That was on the list of stuff taken out that we weren't sure about iirc.
Yes, looked like that drowner was bleeding out while in the water with no dispersing blood effect.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
When I think false advertising, I would think of something like intentionally using an older build (before being fit to consoles), because it looks better for current advertisements. Those videos are what the small vertical build they had then looked like.
Yeah, foliage on the PC version is clearly dialed back to console levels, hopefully it'll be patched/modded back in later. There are some amazing mods for Skyrim that add a ton of foliage to the PC version, hopefully we'll see some of that here as well.
Overall, despite scaling back some things from initial footage, I'm super impressed by what CDPR has pulled off on current gen systems, given what they have to work with from a hardware perspective.
I know people want something to go after them on, but this seems pretty common from a development standpoint, and it's not like we went from early footage of a game like Aliens Colonial Marines to the launch product that was almost a completely different game, the differences here are within acceptable standards IMO, given the amount of detail in the world everywhere you look.
Raven77
Member
People might think that it's a "vocal minority" that care about stuff like this but I think that is an mentality that is no longer valid. I talk with lots of gamers, people who play more casual, etc. and this topic has already come up multiple times from every group i've spoken with. People hit forums, they hit youtube, even if they only game every few days. Things like this kill consumer trust. I believe that CDPR will pull this same thing with CYBERPUNK and show something mind blowing this year or next and the final game probably wont look as good. I think pre-order numbers will be lower for that due in part to it being a new IP but also because they've lost a lot of trust.
As someone who isn't that much of a graphics whore, this is pretty disappointing.
The old image lacks any sort of PBR though and everything looks very "gamey" (the unnatural green hue doesn't help either) because of that since nothing really fits. The release build has other issues but Lighting is better in this compared to that old build in this particular gif.
Lactose_Intolerant
Member
Where is this idea coming from?
Problem is, they are still using clips from those old videos on the recently revamped official Witcher 3 website. As soon as you hit the page there is a massive video in the background of stuff that just doesn't reflect the final game as it stands now.
PHOENIXZERO
Member
I find the blaming of the XBox One and PS4 (probably more the XBO) being unexpectedly week kind of odd, granted they might not have had access but at the very least the specs minus the PS4's late RAM bump were out there for quite some time before they showed off the game. I remember talking about how disappointed I was by the supposed specs back in 2012, the Durango dev kit leaked in January of that year.
Raven77
Member
Which is essentially illegal. It is called a bait and switch. You show one thing claiming thats what a potential customer gets, then you deliver something else.
I wouldn't be shocked if their was a lawsuit, and it also wouldn't upset me either. Having big plans for your game but having to dial it back is one thing, showing people a game that no longer exists on your MAIN SITE in order to help sell copies is a completely different thing.
Good one. That made me laugh for a minute.
Kurt Russell
Member
As someone who isn't that much of a graphics whore, this is pretty disappointing.
It's funny, but to me the "downgraded" graphics look better than the 2013 reveal. The lighting in the release version is a lot better (though I'll agree that fire effects looked better in 2013)
Q
Queen of Hunting
Unconfirmed Member
basically whatever ever videos of games i see shows now ill basically take with a grain of salt. they really arent helping anything by doing fake slice demos to public espeically close to release.
this doesnt just apply to cd
this doesnt just apply to cd
Kurt you're a great actor but please....
Raven77
Member
I suggest you do some reading:
Advertising one thing and providing something that is different (when the seller knows it can't deliver what it is advertising) can open the company (seller) up to lawsuits. Their page has the 2013 trailer with the really rough sea waves, etc. etc. looping in the background...that is not the game they are delivering and they are still choosing to leave that up to try and sell copies of their game. It's pretty despicable.
CrichtonKicks
Member
So people should sue Disney because the Age of Ultron trailers had scenes that weren't in the movie?
KCroxtonJr
Member
lol. this thread man
Like I said before, it lacks any PBR in that particular instance and the green hue only goes on to make it even more unnatural. PBR > No PBR.
The less complex alpha and water simulation in the release version is worse of course, but that's what vertical slice and other development hurdles (manpower, time, consoles etc) result into.
UnrealEck
Member
What makes you think it wasn't gameplay?
It's entirely possible that was the game as it looked at that point in development, before they had to change it. I've not seen any reason to believe it wasn't. They had loads of content from the game that looked like that back a while ago.
I really hate that term 'verticle slice'. It's like 'optimisation'. I remember seeing it used all the time during the Watch Dogs discussions. Verticle slice doesn't necessarily mean it's not gameplay.
I'm not sure if that's what you were implying.
Cave Johnson
Member
I know nothing about graphics, I just know that it looked dark and grimy like a modern Morrowind or Gothic. Kinda like Pillars of Eternity looks like a modern Baldur's Gate. That was very exciting to me.
The new look is fine, but I like it less. Oh well.
Omotesando
Member
As someone who isn't that much of a graphics whore, this is pretty disappointing.
I know I'm in the minority for this, but I prefer the 2015 graphics. Technical stuff aside, I think the more colorful atmosphere is just a lot more pleasant for my eyes. Can see why people would have a problem with it, but personally I'm happy we are getting that.
-tetsuo-
Unlimited Capacity
Stahsky
A passionate embrace, a beautiful memory lingers.
Ok, you go first.
Lying about what your selling is illegal here in UK, dunno about where you're from.
Imagine what 2013 footage would have looked like with the colour grading and PBR.
Imagine it because even if you dished out for 4 titans for this game, unlucky.
Imagine what 2013 footage would have looked like with the colour grading and PBR.
Imagine it because even if you dished out for 4 titans for this game, unlucky.
How do i embedded Tweets ? Miles Tost gave an answer on the different vegetation in the Tutorial and other areas.
https://twitter.com/MilezZx/status/599998511493586944
https://twitter.com/MilezZx/status/599998188079185920
The Question was, if there are different gras assets for the Tutorial because they look finer/better
His Answer: Yes and No. Explanation would be too long for twitter. So in Short. The Lightning and Conditions are different on every area and thus the Gras looks different, because of the lighting.
But basically every region has the same grass assets. Bigger vegetation and trees depend on the location and climate.
https://twitter.com/MilezZx/status/599998511493586944
https://twitter.com/MilezZx/status/599998188079185920
The Question was, if there are different gras assets for the Tutorial because they look finer/better
His Answer: Yes and No. Explanation would be too long for twitter. So in Short. The Lightning and Conditions are different on every area and thus the Gras looks different, because of the lighting.
But basically every region has the same grass assets. Bigger vegetation and trees depend on the location and climate.
I'm a game designer (other development studio). I know how this happens. And believe me, everyone on the dev team wants the game to look super pretty. But guess what: development happen during development.
Usually the game gets build super pretty for a vertical slice. Framerates aren't important because the code isn't optimised yet. There will be tons of improvements so hopefully we'll keep these shiny graphics. Than 1 year before release there is a meeting: "So the game has this audio system now. It allows for actual sounds in the game, it's pretty important but heavy on the system. So we'll have to cut some of the graphics.". Particles are heavy, cut those. Draw distance, texture quality, shaders, they all need to be turned down.
The devs make these changed not because they suck, or they're evil. They make these changed to make the best product possible for everyone. Vertical slices are almost always prettier than the final product. It's a tool to convince you, the consumer, the publisher and to inspire the development team.
Usually the game gets build super pretty for a vertical slice. Framerates aren't important because the code isn't optimised yet. There will be tons of improvements so hopefully we'll keep these shiny graphics. Than 1 year before release there is a meeting: "So the game has this audio system now. It allows for actual sounds in the game, it's pretty important but heavy on the system. So we'll have to cut some of the graphics.". Particles are heavy, cut those. Draw distance, texture quality, shaders, they all need to be turned down.
The devs make these changed not because they suck, or they're evil. They make these changed to make the best product possible for everyone. Vertical slices are almost always prettier than the final product. It's a tool to convince you, the consumer, the publisher and to inspire the development team.
I take it we'll have news regarding the lawsuits on Ubisoft and FROM soon
Can any of you all actually address him factually?
Belittling, deflectng and dismissing him kinda makes you all look worse then you perceive him as.
I mean is he wrong? Is CDPR not doing that? And haven't we all read at least a competent portion of this thread and know now that it is factually confirmed the early trailers are not achievable in the marketing that has been presented in the release version?
So you have to grab 4 titans at the start of development and put out a video called gameplay to build hype?
Do you lot also have to lie about the changes?
We should be okay with that though because games.
Raven77
Member
I'm not saying they should be sued. I'm just saying that what they are doing legally opens them up for class action lawsuits.
How any of you would be okay with them still showing the 2013 trailer on their page right now is kind of beyond me though. As both a gamer and consumer it does make me mad.
How any of you would be okay with them still showing the 2013 trailer on their page right now is kind of beyond me though. As both a gamer and consumer it does make me mad.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
I think it's difficult to say a work in progress is advertising. Games are iterative and so naturally they will change from their announcement to their release. Should Blizzard be sued because Diablo 3 was massively changed from what was shown in the announcement?
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