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[LeleSocho]

You said he was a waste of a slot, which is disrespectful to anyone that does like him. All these comments are being done in a dogpile type situation, which is not very friendly IMO.

I'm not saying Abel is topping the charts, but he's not scrapping the bottom of the barrel either, and trying to pass off your opinion as a generally held fact when there are actual numbers that refute seems to me that you're just trying to tear the character due to your personal feelings.

Or people are just acting petty because they don't like a character.

There's a difference between saying you don't like a character and wishing they never get a slot "wasted" on them again right after someone else was stating they liked said character.

You seem to think of it like it was a personal attack or something, it really isn't.
I don't really care if you like it or not i just see discussions on Abel's bad design brought up a lot in roster discussions and i just agree with that sentiment.
And yes for me it's a wasted character slot just like for you Ken, which is a character that i adore, could be a wasted character slot.

It's ok if other people do to not like things you like.

 

[Mizerman]

You know what I meant. ^_^;

 

[Hours Left]

Yeah, I feel kinda responsible for this now: the tone of my initial posts on the matter probably didn't help much. Sorry -.-

It's not your fault. I just don't understand why people would rather focus on negative opinions as opposed to positive.

Fighting game rosters are very contentious. Even the lowliest character has fans, so I'm trying hard not to disparage other characters I don't care for and just focus on ones I do like, but even I fall prey to that too, and I'm trying to rectify that.

You seem to think of it like it was a personal attack or something, it really isn't.
I don't really care if you like it or not i just see discussions on Abel's bad design brought up a lot in roster discussions and i just agree with that sentiment.
And yes for me it's a wasted character slot just like for you Ken, which is a character that i adore, could be a wasted character slot.

It's ok if other people do to not like things you like.

That much is clear. And that's fine. I just think there's a better way of expressing this opinion so it doesn't come off confrontational.

And I never said Ken was a waste of slot, you may be confusing me with someone else. The only thing I said about Ken is that I could foresee them saving him for the first expansion. (Unless this is just a general statement, in which case I'd say as I mentioned above, I try not to classify anyone as a waste despite my personal feelings.)

 

[LeleSocho]

And I never said Ken was a waste of slot, you may be confusing me with someone else. The only thing I said about Ken is that I could foresee them saving him for the first expansion. (Unless this is just a general statement, in which case I'd say as I mentioned above, I try not to classify anyone as a waste despite my personal feelings.)

Yeah it was a general statement/example.

 

[Inuhanyou]

Ew. These DLC costumes are getting worse and worse, why doesn't she have pants on!?

 

[DigiMish]

All I know that if Ken doesn't get announced at SDCC or EVO, it's pretty much GG for him until after the game comes out.

 

[Vice]

Ew. These DLC costumes are getting worse and worse, why doesn't she have pants on!?

She does, they're just very short and the jacket is long.

 

[Americanmushroom]

Havent really been following, but why wouldnt Ken not be in the game? Has there ever been a SF without Ken?

 

[Spinosaurus]

I dabbled a bit with Abel just to see what his moveset was like and it clicked with me pretty well, but like a lot of people his character design does absolutely nothing for me whatsoever. It just makes me seethe that they took this interesting playstyle and decided to attach it to mr forgettable over the original design: a design that doesn't have too much representation in the cast compared to the hulking gi boyz. I honestly feel it would've been much more popular than what we got.

Gah... sorry... I can't help but rant about it when people bring it up. It just aggrivates me so much more than it should XD

That wouldn't fit with the moveset at all. They don't look like they have anywhere near the muscle mass nor physical strength to actually carry and grapple people around.

Abel's design is perfectly fine imo. It works.

 

[Geminosity]

That wouldn't fit with the moveset at all. They don't look like they have anywhere near the muscle mass nor physical strength to actually carry and grapple people around.

Abel's design is perfectly fine imo. It works.

Hmmm I dunno. I'm just not convinced that Ryu has the kind of hands that can throw flaming balls of ki, it's just not realistic. Now Blanka and Dhalsim though, I see people like that all the time
edit: when are they patching in an instant KO for hakan if he gets hit by fire attacks while oiled up?

 

[Spinosaurus]

Hmmm I dunno. I'm just not convinced that Ryu has the kind of hands that can throw flaming balls of ki, it's just not realistic. Now Blanka and Dhalsim though, I see people like that all the time

That's not even comparable though. There's an actual, fictional explanation as to why Ryu can throw out fireballs. If I see that character throwing people around effortlessly Capcom better be telling me they got Link's power gloves.

 

[Geminosity]

That's not even comparable though. There's an actual, fictional explanation as to why Ryu can throw out fireballs. If I see that character throwing people around effortlessly Capcom better be telling me they got Link's power gloves.

Apparently it's judo. Explanation provided. Character is now 100% believable, just like Dhalsim can stretch because 'yoga'

 

[SolidSnakex]

Havent really been following, but why wouldnt Ken not be in the game? Has there ever been a SF without Ken?

It's just speculation based on the fact that Capcom have said that they want to move away from clones with SFV.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Apparently it's judo. Explanation provided. Character is now 100% believable, just like Dhalsim can stretch because 'yoga'

But Abel doesn't do Judo, his moveset is more a combination of MMA and Commando Sambo. (Admiteddly, both do take from Judo, but it's more complex than that) The only thing resembling a judo throw is his forward regular throw.

Judo basically involves using your opponent's force against them, so you don't necessarily need all the muscles Abel has. But Abel doesn't do that, he grabs them and swings them around with his own strength. You're asking for a completely different moveset.

 

[Inuhanyou]

She does, they're just very short and the jacket is long.

I can't see pants under there. Maybe they are bloomers like her normal wear.

I like her adult outfit because it actually goes down to her knees

 

[Geminosity]

But Abel doesn't do Judo, his moveset is more a combination of MMA and Commando Sambo. The only thing resembling a judo throw is his forward regular throw.

Judo basically involves using your opponent's force against them, so you don't necessarily need all the muscles Abel has. But Abel doesn't do that, he grabs them and swings them around with his own strength. You're asking for a completely different moveset.

I'm not asking for anything, I just accepted that the character works because they said it did in a world where apparently you can say 'its special karate' to justify throwing fireballs and hovering through the air with your leg stuck out. You're the one looking for a 'logical' reason to reject the character in a world with a man with blood red skin who fighting fire-chucking enemies by covering himself in combustible substances and apparently a green-skinned person who can electrify themselves is a-ok because lightning struck a plane they were on Oh, and again, 'yoga' is all we need for dhalsim being able to do impossible feats of body morphing, teleporting and breathing fire without the aid of any apparent flammable substance or anything to ignite it with.

edit: I'm sorry if I'm coming off as a bit rude here but from my viewpoint it's like you're complaining about how cloud shouldn't be able to realistically use his sword in FF7 or how there are dragons in a fantasy setting.

 

[mollipen]

I really hope the SFII cast is given a break this time... Especially Dhalsim, Blanka and Zangief. Just hate their designs.

I love you, and everyone who thinks like you.

Ew. These DLC costumes are getting worse and worse, why doesn't she have pants on!?

Except that's Sakura's best alt costume. *confused look*

On second thought, remove Cody and Guy, and replace them with El Gado and Roxy.

Uhhhh, NO. It took forever to get Poison in a proper game, and she's way, way more important in terms of diversity than Roxy would be, even with Capcom's unfortunate backing off of her canon.

Who likes strawberry or fluffy cake, tho?

It's all about that chocolate.

vomit-chan.gif

 

[Spinosaurus]

The difference with Dhalsim and Blanka is that nothing about their design contradicts their moveset. Nothing about their design tells me that they shouldn't be doing that.

I'd be completely bugged by seeing a skinny dude or girl not having any issues carrying people triple their weight, and I doubt I'm the only one. If Dhalsim started piledriving people around everyone would question that.

 

[mollipen]

The difference with Dhalsim and Blanka is that nothing about their design contradicts their moveset. Nothing about their design tells me that they shouldn't be doing that.

I'd be completely bugged by seeing a skinny dude or girl not having any issues carrying people triple their weight, and I doubt I'm the only one. If Dhalsim started piledriving people around everyone would question that.

Sooooo... you can believe that a green mutant guy can shoot electricity out of his body, or that an Indian man can stretch his limbs way beyond humanly possible because of "yoga", but you can't believe a girl can piledrive someone.

Okay.

 

[Geminosity]

The difference with Dhalsim and Blanka is that nothing about their design contradicts their moveset. Nothing about their design tells me that they shouldn't be doing that.

I'd be completely bugged by seeing a skinny dude or girl not having any issues carrying people triple their weight, and I doubt I'm the only one. If Dhalsim started piledriving people around everyone would question that.

Wow, in that case I guess May in guilty gear hauling that massive anchor around must've blown your mind. Cloud in FF7 must've been a real conundrum too. Heck, let's just keep it to streetfighter: Makoto breaks people's necks with her bare hands.
If we want to talk about appearance belaying moveset, I'm absolutely certain that when you saw E.Honda your first thought was "oh yeah, that's the kind of character who launches himself full-screen as a projectile" He's got that aerodynamic shape that just screams 'flying across the screen without ever touching the ground' Guile making sonic boom projectiles with his arms is EXACTLY how I pictured someone from the american armed forces fighting as well. It was so clearly defined by how he looked ¬.¬
Also, if Dhalsim did piledrivers on people I doubt anyone would lift an eyebrow.

You're not the first person to have this argument with me and I'm as thoroughly unconvinced as I was back then. Sorry, I don't know why you have this disconnect but it doesn't exist for me because in the face of everything else streetfighter happily hand-waves it seems utterly bizarre to have an issue with that.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Sooooo... you can believe that a green mutant guy can shoot electricity out of his body, or that an Indian man can stretch his limbs way beyond humanly possible because of "yoga", but you can't believe a girl can piledrive someone.

Okay.

If the girl has the strength sure. I don't have issues with R.Mika because she clearly looks like a female wrestler and has the physiques of one. That design clearly doesn't.

Again it's not even comparable. Dhalsim and Blanka are supposed to be out of this world, and they look out of this world, so I can excuse their moveset having extreme stuff like stretching and electricity generation. Piledriving is however a completely realistic and possible thing to do, provided you're built for it.

 

[Sayad]

Is there any lightweight character that do something like a piledriver?! Most of them just do side karate/judo throws that doesn't depend much on pure power, or just chock, slap, punch during their throws!

 

[jasminlovesyoux]

I'm absolutely certain that when you saw E.Honda your first thought was "oh yeah, that's the kind of character who launches himself full-screen as a projectile" He's got that aerodynamic shape that just screams 'flying across the screen without ever touching the ground'.

LMAO this is gold

 

[Fmal]

If the girl has the strength sure. I don't have issues with R.Mika because she clearly looks like a female wrestler and has the physiques of one. That design clearly doesn't.

Again it's not even comparable. Dhalsim and Blanka are supposed to be out of this world, and they look out of this world, so I can excuse their moveset having extreme stuff like stretching and electricity generation. Piledriving is however a completely realistic and possible thing to do, provided you're built for it.

You know that Karate dudes can't throw fireballs in real life right?

 

[Spinosaurus]

You know that Karate dudes can't throw fireballs in real life right?

...I never said they did? Fire balls aren't real. Give it to anyone in the cast and it wouldn't bother me.

Dhalsim and Blanka were just more extreme examples, since nothing about them even resembles anything realistic.

 

[Geminosity]

If the girl has the strength sure. I don't have issues with R.Mika because she clearly looks like a female wrestler and has the physiques of one. That design clearly doesn't.

Again it's not even comparable. Dhalsim and Blanka are supposed to be out of this world, and they look out of this world, so I can excuse their moveset having extreme stuff like stretching and electricity generation. Piledriving is however a completely realistic and possible thing to do, provided you're built for it.

Ok, I get it. Let me explain how I'm perceiving your logic and why I'm having trouble with it:
"Dhalsim can do impossible things" - that's fine because they're impossible
"This girl can piledrive people" - that's not fine because it's impossible

For me the next logical step is "This girl can piledrive people which is impossible" - that's fine because they're impossible.
For you it is not. Perhaps we can get to the root of the problem by discovering why one set of impossible is ok and other is not?

Is there any lightweight character that do something like a piledriver?! Most of them just do side karate/judo throws that doesn't depend much on pure power, or just chock, slap, punch during their throws!

Lightweight? I dunno, what kind of throws does Rufus do? I mean his physique is clearly an indicator of his agile yun-like moveset so he must be considered light-weight.
Sarcasm aside, Makoto breaks people's necks with her bare hands. I don't know if you've ever tried something along those lines but it's not exactly an option for your average strength person :s

 

[Vice]

...I never said they did? Fire balls aren't real. Give it to anyone in the cast and it wouldn't bother me.

Dhalsim and Blanka were just more extreme examples, since nothing about them even resembles anything realistic.

Think of the female Abel as like a Ronda Rousey type fighter. She can grapple and throw blows with the best of them. Seeing stuff like like a grown man being thrown around like nothing by a kid is inevitable in Street Fighter. Makoto picks up guys like Hugo and T. hawk constantly even though she wouldn't be able to in real life.

 

[alstein]

Sooooo... you can believe that a green mutant guy can shoot electricity out of his body, or that an Indian man can stretch his limbs way beyond humanly possible because of "yoga", but you can't believe a girl can piledrive someone.

Okay.

It's not that a girl can't do it, it's that a 90lb girl can't piledrive a 180lb man.

I don't think the poster would have an issue, if the char looked like say VF4 Vanessa or Jane from FV.

Personally I can suspend disbelief because of chars like Blanka and Dhalsim, SF chars are supposed to have freakish physical abilities.

 

[Geminosity]

It's not that a girl can't do it, it's that a 90lb girl can't piledrive a 180lb man.

I don't think the poster would have an issue, if the char looked like say VF4 Vanessa or Jane from FV.

...but people learning karate can throw fireballs, yoga fitness classes are full of women breathing fire and teleporting and Rufus doing literally any of his moves is... possible?

 

[Karsticles]

...but people learning karate can throw fireballs, yoga fitness classes are full of women breathing fire and teleporting and Rufus doing literally any of his moves is... possible?

Belly Jiggle Momentum.

 

[Fmal]

...I never said they did? Fire balls aren't real. Give it to anyone in the cast and I wouldn't question it.

Okay, I don't get it.

Ryu (a normal looking dude) doing something outlandish = okay
Blanka (a weird looking character) doing something outlandish = okay
A small female character (presumably normal looking) doing something outlandish = please don't shatter my suspension of disbelief

There's literally nothing realistic at all in these games. If you can handle people teleporting and shooting fireballs but the idea of a character piledriving a bigger character shocks and confuses you, your brain is broken.

It's not that a girl can't do it, it's that a 90lb girl can't piledrive a 180lb man.

I don't think the poster would have an issue, if the char looked like say VF4 Vanessa or Jane from FV.

Personally I can suspend disbelief because of chars like Blanka and Dhalsim, SF chars are supposed to have freakish physical abilities.

You're right, in real life a 90lb girl cannot piledrive a 180lb man. In real life, you also cannot form and shoot literal balls of flame from your hands. Street Fighter isn't a realistic game series. Stop the presses.

 

[alstein]

...but people learning karate can throw fireballs, yoga fitness classes are full of women breathing fire and teleporting and Rufus doing literally any of his moves is... possible?

Bam Bam Bigelow could do cartwheels easily at 400 lbs early in his career.

Fat doesn't mean unathletic.

 

[Dremark]

Damn what are the chances of guile getting in? He is always been my main ever since sf2.

I'd say pretty high. They drastically changed Nash's play style so I don't believe he'll be his replacement. I suppose they could put Remy instead though.

We need Sakura in V so that she can not be wearing a school uniform, and actually go out with a little dignity.

She was like 23 in SF4 and still wearing a school uniform. She has no dignity.

In all seriousness though, would people even want a Sakura who wasn't a school girl? It seems like that's her entire character.

 

[Geminosity]

Belly Jiggle Momentum.

ewwww ~shudder~

Bam Bam Bigelow could do cartwheels easily at 400 lbs early in his career.

Fat doesn't mean unathletic.

Wow, ok, I stand corrected on that point :3
It was less 'atheletisim' and more just physical mass I figured would stop it (if you're a heavy type I'd imagine you'd probably have decent leg strength alone just from supporting your own weight)

 

[Fmal]

I'd say pretty high. They drastically changed Nash's play style so I don't believe he'll be his replacement. I suppose they could put Remy instead though.



She was like 23 in SF4 and still wearing a school uniform. She has no dignity.

In all seriousness though, would people even want a Sakura who wasn't a school girl? It seems like that's her entire character.

Please Capcom, I don't even care if it's Remy, but put a character with Remy's fireballs into a game where projectiles are allowed to be good.

And yeah, I'd be down with seeing an older Sakura. I like seeing new takes on old characters.

 

[alstein]

If Sakura comes back, she's been around long enough that she should get a visual redesign like Kyo did in KOF99.

Doesn't have to be the gym teacher outfit, but she should be going to college at least. Then again, this is what alt costumes are for, and I'm certain Capcom will provide the seifuku and a more adult design.

Is Sakura's appeal the panty shots or the fact she's a pretty easy character to do damage with and get big numbers of hits on the combo counter?

 

[Fmal]

If Sakura comes back, she's been around long enough that she should get a visual redesign like Kyo did in KOF99.

Doesn't have to be the gym teacher outfit, but she should be going to college at least. Then again, this is what alt costumes are for, and I'm certain Capcom will provide the seifuku and a more adult design.

Is Sakura's appeal the panty shots or the fact she's a pretty easy character to do damage with and get big numbers of hits on the combo counter?

I'm no expert, but I'd imagine the vast majority her fanbase cares less about her play style and more about her being easy to jack off to.

 

[Skilletor]

It's strange to me that a person's physique in SF does have a lot to do with the attacks they're doing, but people are throwing those specific decisions out because of fireballs.

Rufus' throws are similar to a lightweight character's throws. one is a headbut, the other is like ip man punches where he jumps on your chest and punches you a bunch. Makoto doesn't snap anybody's neck. She has a martial art's takedown with a strike at the end and another gut punch.

It makes perfect sense to me, and if we take fireballs and the like out of the equation, most of the moves the people do fit their physiques really well.

 

[Fmal]

It's strange to me that a person's physique in SF does have a lot to do with the attacks they're doing, but people are throwing those specific decisions out because of fireballs.

Rufus' throws are similar to a lightweight character's throws. one is a headbut, the other is like ip man punches where he jumps on your chest and punches you a bunch. Makoto doesn't snap anybody's neck. She has a martial art's takedown with a strike at the end and another gut punch.

It makes perfect sense to me, and if we take fireballs and the like out of the equation, most of the moves the people do fit their physiques really well.

Yeah dude you're right if you remove literally all of the outlandish crazy shit from a game and keep only the boring realistic stuff, you're left with a boring realistic game.

 

[Skilletor]

Yeah you're right if you do remove literally all of the outlandish crazy shit from a game and keep only the boring realistic stuff, you're left with a boring realistic game.

Yeah, that's what I said. I don't...what? lol

 

[Geminosity]

It's strange to me that a person's physique in SF does have a lot to do with the attacks they're doing, but people are throwing those specific decisions out because of fireballs.

Rufus' throws are similar to a lightweight character's throws. one is a headbut, the other is like ip man punches where he jumps on your chest and punches you a bunch. Makoto doesn't snap anybody's neck. She has a martial art's takedown with a strike at the end and another gut punch.

It makes perfect sense to me, and if we take fireballs and the like out of the equation, most of the moves the people do fit their physiques really well.

In terms of Makoto we're talking about her half circle back kick command throw in which she lifts them full-bodily off the ground and appears to break their neck before putting them down again. A move which she can do any cast member including T-Hawk or Hugo. I wasn't aware this was realistic or in line with her physique considering she's one of the shortest characters and isn't a walking mountain of muscle

 

[Spinosaurus]

Okay, I don't get it.

Ryu (a normal looking dude) doing something outlandish = okay
Blanka (a weird looking character) doing something outlandish = okay
A small female character (presumably normal looking) doing something outlandish = please don't shatter my suspension of disbelief

There's literally nothing realistic at all in these games. If you can handle people teleporting and shooting fireballs but the idea of a character piledriving a bigger character shocks and confuses you, your brain is broken.

Sigh

Alright let me just make myself a little more clear here since I don't feel like I made my points across properly.

To begin with, my issue with Abel's old design has to do with their physique, and that's only assuming he was gonna have his current moveset with that. Nothing more to it.

Abel's current design however makes complete sense to me with it.

That's it. The difference here is that there's an alternative that DOES make sense. A big guy like Abel doing that? Yeah, I'd never question it. There's no possible alternative designs for Ryu that could explain fire balls, no matter what.

If I saw the old Abel doing that I'd think "why didn't they just make a character design that actually fits with the moveset". Street Fighter is a whole bunch of nonsense, so seeing a skinny person throwing people around effortlessly isn't any worse than someone throwing fire balls in the long run. What I'm trying to say that, however, why do that when you could go with a design that does make sense? THAT'S what would've bugged me.

Anyway, I'm derailing the thread with this, so I'm gonna drop. Hope I worded things better this time.

 

[Skilletor]

In terms of Makoto we're talking about her half circle back kick command throw in which she lifts them full-bodily off the ground and appears to break their neck before putting them down again. A move which she can do any cast member including T-Hawk or Hugo. I wasn't aware this was realistic or in line with her physique considering she's one of the shortest characters and isn't a walking mountain of muscle

I never said realistic. Obviously the game isn't realistic. But I think the way the characters look and the moves they do match up very well.

I never thought she broke their neck. Looks like she's just clenching to me.

https://youtu.be/hUqyPRK4450?t=170

And it looks like she's super struggling to do it. I know in 3rd strike, it doesn't look like she gets Hugo off the ground(https://youtu.be/bs6qy_oSSO4?t=15), but I know SF4 doesn't have that kind of attention to detail. Still, makes sense for gameplay, and visual cues are more important than realism.

 

[Geminosity]

Sigh

Alright let me just make myself a little more clear here since I don't feel like I made my points across properly.

To begin with, my issue with Abel's old design has to with their physique, and that's only assuming he was gonna have his current moveset with that. Nothing more to it.

Abel's current design however makes complete sense to me with it.

That's it. The difference here is that there's an alternative that DOES make sense. A big guy like Abel doing that? Yeah, I'd never question it. There's no possible alternative designs for Ryu that could explain fire balls, no matter what.

If I saw the old Abel doing that I'd think "why didn't they just make a character design that actually fits with the moveset". Street Fighter is a whole bunch of nonsense, so seeing a skinny person throwing people around effortlessly isn't any worse than someone throwing fire balls in the long run. What I'm trying to say that, however, why do that when you could go with a design that does make sense? THAT'S what would've bugged me.

Anyway, I'm derailing the thread with this, so I'm gonna drop. Hope I worded things better this time.

Makes more sense but ultimately you could apply it to any move including fireballs. For those you just need some kind of gadget gloves or something (basically how they excuse the entire of C.Viper's moveset) or they could've given him some kind of shinto (or other mystical religon) relic to create the fireballs from.
Point is, they'd be tying their hands design wise with that if they wanted to use the moveset with other characters, which is why physical strength being tied to physical attributes is an issue: it's why all the grappler characters in the SF games are stuck with a fairly set bunch of requirements that hurts their diversity, unlike shotos where they can just add fireballs to anyone or anything :3

Sorry for giving you a hard time over it but with the way you explained it before I was kinda bewildered XD

I never said realistic. Obviously the game isn't realistic. But I think the way the characters look and the moves they do match up very well.

I never thought she broke their neck. Looks like she's just clenching to me.

https://youtu.be/hUqyPRK4450?t=170

And it looks like she's super struggling to do it. I know in 3rd strike, it doesn't look like she gets Hugo off the ground(https://youtu.be/bs6qy_oSSO4?t=15), but I know SF4 doesn't have that kind of attention to detail. Still, makes sense for gameplay, and visual cues are more important than realism.

Ah sorry, you're right you didn't say realistic. I'm not sure it's really 'appropriate for her physique' either though: watching her haul Dudley so high off the ground like that is kind of hilarious XD

edit: Not long until SDCC now

 

[Sayad]

Lightweight? I dunno, what kind of throws does Rufus do? I mean his physique is clearly an indicator of his agile yun-like moveset so he must be considered light-weight.
Sarcasm aside, Makoto breaks people's necks with her bare hands. I don't know if you've ever tried something along those lines but it's not exactly an option for your average strength person :s

You can definitely break people's necks with ease if you had guerrilla hands.

In terms of Makoto we're talking about her half circle back kick command throw in which she lifts them full-bodily off the ground and appears to break their neck before putting them down again. A move which she can do any cast member including T-Hawk or Hugo. I wasn't aware this was realistic or in line with her physique considering she's one of the shortest characters and isn't a walking mountain of muscle

I'd get this argument if it was about Sakura, but Makoto is a walking mountain of muscles... For a 14 years old girl at least:

And it looks like she's super struggling to do it. I know in 3rd strike, it doesn't look like she gets Hugo off the ground(https://youtu.be/bs6qy_oSSO4?t=15), but I know SF4 doesn't have that kind of attention to detail. Still, makes sense for gameplay, and visual cues are more important than realism.

Hugo is on his knees when you Karakusa him in SFIV, she doesn't get him off the ground. Makoto's "trying really hard to do what she does" is there in SFIV too, though not as pronounced as it is in SF3 due to the animation quality. In 3s, she make up for her size by butting her whole body weight behind her more powerful attacks, her animation never made me think "how does this little girl hit so hard?", you really get to see where the power behind her attacks is coming from.

 

[ZdkDzk]

I don't agree with him, but the difference between a character like Dhalsim and Abel's original design is that Dhalsim is a weirdo doing weird things: it's impossible, but his design works with his play style.

A skiny, young girl throwing 200+ guys around is still imposible, but it's also super counter-intuitive. Like, imagine Dudley with Blanka's moveset. The moveset clashes with the design.

 

[McNum]

If Sakura comes back, she's been around long enough that she should get a visual redesign like Kyo did in KOF99.

Doesn't have to be the gym teacher outfit, but she should be going to college at least. Then again, this is what alt costumes are for, and I'm certain Capcom will provide the seifuku and a more adult design.

Is Sakura's appeal the panty shots or the fact she's a pretty easy character to do damage with and get big numbers of hits on the combo counter?

I can only speak for myself, of course, but to me I chose to focus on Sakura because after learning the basics with Ryu, she was familiar, but odd. A Shoryuken with a runup, a fireball that only works in close range, and Tatsu that goes airborne. And of course she's a bit quicker than Ryu.

She's also fairly easy to do something that looks flashy with. Get an EX Tatsu and you have plenty of time to prepare for a followup, usually to the tune of that three hit air combo or a heavy uppercut. Or an ultra, if available, of course. It doesn't hurt that her uppercuts do a pretty good amount of damage if hit raw either.

I kind of want to see her in SFV to see how she'll work there. Since everyone is getting flashier, I'd like to see V-Trigger Sakura and what that would even do. I can only imagine it'd be something like a custom combo or a shadow Sakura that mimics her like Zero in MvC3.

 

[Village]

funfact, makoto isn't that musclar at all, the only reason she kind of looks that way is street fighter 4's model style. And even then her build is actually a great deal smaller than a lot of the women and espically the men in that game.

Actually she's lean and small. And has to put her all in her attacks, its in her bio and many characters comment on this themselves.

Its why her theme is " spunky"

Nother fun fact, Viper's build has little to no muscle mass, no seriously her model has like no muscles, she's super skinny actually compared to everyone else

 

[Geminosity]

You can definitely break people's necks with ease if you had guerrilla hands.

I'd get this argument if it was about Sakura, but Makoto is a walking mountain of muscles... For a 14 years old girl at least:

Ew, thanks for reminding me how much I dislike SF4's character art. Everyone looks like they've been on steroids for their entire lives :s

I don't agree with him, but the difference between a character like Dhalsim and Abel's original design is that Dhalsim is a weirdo doing weird things: it's impossible, but his design works with his play style.

A skiny, young girl throwing 200+ guys around is still imposible, but it's also super counter-intuitive. Like, imagine Dudley with Blanka's moveset. The moveset clashes with the design.

I don't know, I feel like it's just people giving a free pass to whatever they like personally. I don't really think Guile's look is intuitive... I don't imagine most remember their first impressions of characters because it's been so long but I still remember when I was little that I was baffled at guile's moveset: with all the army stuff I was expecting guns and knifes yet here we was making weird swirls and bizarre kicking laser arcs yet he's not considered a 'wacky' character. E.Honda might be more on the comic side but I certainly didn't expect him to fly across the screen as a human torpedo or have a surprisingly fast jump attack where he FLIES upwards then buttslams back down.

Anyhoo, to be a bit more relevant to the thread topic I figure I should point out that some peeps have been equating Bison's new white hair to Ingrid (also known for her white hair) and his adoption of her psycho drive. I don't really expect Ingrid to be in SFV but an interesting connection (albeit tenuous)

 

[enzo_gt]

Luckily, Sakura already has a costume that she uses in her 20s when she graduates and becomes a teacher

They even showed it at the very end of USF4

If she shows up in this game, she's most likely going to be wearing this outfit and and having longer hair

I'm all for a Sakura redesign, but this isn't it. Just flat and boring.

Also, in media they've said that they've tried to still keep what made returning characters who they are and Sak being a schoolgirl is a big part of that. I'd put more stock in that than expect a redesign.

Sak as a teacher would be dope, and I'd love to see how they'd manipulate her move set to differentiate her. One thing I always liked about the character was that she embodied untapped potential and had canonical reasoning for being a clone, but one that diverged significantly more than almost all the others. It would be awesome to see how she manifested that and continued to develop her powers independently. I'm thinking really fast, small fireballs as well as chargeable but fast and cancelable shoto specials would be a cool progression.