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SPOILER: Metal Gear Solid V Spoiler Thread | Such a lust for conclusion, T-WHHOOOO
- Thread starter MMarston
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Don't mind that guy.
I'm not shitting on the game though, or KojiPro though, that's just my opinion, I obviously love the MG series, I trying to make a few people see that they are FULL of cliché'd plots and characters.
Anyway, my point was, we are in an MGS thread, why are people shitting on other games?
Proceed with caution.
Ghostmaster
Member
I mean I think at this point it's just a difference of opinion.
You think that going through Rose's dialogue is worth it for the punchline and the twist, and that her bad writing makes it better. I don't, I think she could have been written better and still remain annoying and stilted and the end still wouldn't lose any of its punch. Granted I may be conflating all of this with her VA as well. It's ok.
And I don't think that MGS 2 is a shit game, I think it's a great game, just that the writing could have been better.
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
Presumably you would have to make it relatd to mgsv spoilers and not insult other posters but yea sure we are all diamond dawgs here m I rite guys
The Broken Ska Record
Member
Big Shell was a real place, everything prior to it was a simulation for Raiden.
Except his past as a child soldier. That was very, very real.
Ether_Snake
å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®
In this thread, a good video game is "a serious gruffy piece worthy of an oscar!".
Screw that, MGS2 had an awesome story, because even if the length of the codec talks were often getting in the way, at least this game did something with the medium itself.
There's nothing worst than stories that can't fit themselves into their own medium. MGSV is trying to correct that, and while it's not perfect I'll take that over a follow-the-crumbs-to-see-more-story game.
Fallout has a more fun story than Uncharted. That's what makes a story useful in a game: if it's fun.
Screw that, MGS2 had an awesome story, because even if the length of the codec talks were often getting in the way, at least this game did something with the medium itself.
There's nothing worst than stories that can't fit themselves into their own medium. MGSV is trying to correct that, and while it's not perfect I'll take that over a follow-the-crumbs-to-see-more-story game.
Fallout has a more fun story than Uncharted. That's what makes a story useful in a game: if it's fun.
Zabant
Member
What sort of armchair psychologist's question is this?
Are you trying to suggest that anyone who enjoys MGS has some sort of mental issues regarding their father?
What? lol.
It's up to you, I'm not trying to stop anyone, I'm just trying to say that it's not exactly fair to call out other games when the series we are supposed to be talking about has the same problems.
lol. I hope no one goes all out SpainKiller.
BotchPoppaPump
Member
But this means we're taking 51 as canon. Which we cant surely, because it was cut.
Ghostmaster
Member
You're all the Bioschock protagonist. Jack?
51 would have added an ending to some kids flying away with a huge mech and a parasite able to kill everyone and their moms. without that you even have more questions, which are not answered by knowing what happens canonically 30 years later.
also it wasn't cut, it just wasn't finished because of reasons. probably lack of time and konami greed. it totally makes sense that it should have been in the game and that they wanted it to be.
The Big Shell was real, it was only a "simulation" in the sense that it was orchestrated by the Patriots to see if their AI could manage it
Chapter 51 being cut is a shame, but it is not game ruining.
We all know that in the future Liquid has no Sahelanthropus and that Psycho Mantis is still around so there's like no tension there.
Only weird part is that Liquid gets cured of the English strain at some point but whatevs.
Wonder if Liquid knows the Big Boss he met was the Phantom one.
We all know that in the future Liquid has no Sahelanthropus and that Psycho Mantis is still around so there's like no tension there.
Only weird part is that Liquid gets cured of the English strain at some point but whatevs.
Wonder if Liquid knows the Big Boss he met was the Phantom one.
Lmao, no, I'm saying that every game your calling out, you've called them out for having Father/Son relationships central to their story. MGS has the same problem. If you look at it simply things happen in MGS because BB fucked up and the sons are either paying the price or are mopping up his fucked view of the Boss's will.
Basically a father/son's relationship.
WrenchNinja
Member
Saying something is not the same thing as doing something. He built the pmc so he wouldn't be tied to governments and be their stooge, Miller is the one who brought up the nuke from the river and convinced him to keep it. Does he do anything evil or villainous with these things? Nope.
Who are you trying to kid here? They took Sahelanthropus because Cipher agents were still around and other people might use it as a weapon. What more do we want? How about actually doing something evil that warrants being called a demon instead of saving children and teaching them to read and write, or saving animals and putting them up for a rescue and preservation, or y'know saving the fucking world from nuclear holocaust and a parasitic outbreak. Y'know, stuff that's not heroic.
SuperStiltzkin
Member
That work involves listening to all the tapes he's included in the game. Learning how to do visual storytelling is great. And Kojima could definitely learn a lot from it. But he's still learning because I don't think he's done a good job of deciding what information should be left to subtle visual communication and how it is communicated.
This guy does.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
I can imagine Kojima considering that BB "doing what needs to be done" and killing the infected children (even indirectly via air-strike) as a really powerful crossing of the rubicon for his character, in fact that would make ep43 an important foreshadowing.
But realistically, it would also open him up to a helluva lot of flak for ending the game on what many people would see as a lazy and tasteless cheap-shot. And I'm sorry but that's what it is. Its not brave or edgy, its just the cheapest of cheap manipulations.
As it stands the 2 BB's twist is risky enough, as every writer knows some audiences really react badly to any variant of the old "it was all a dream" rug-pull.
Personally I think he gets away with it here because the heavy emphasis on player agency in the mechanics really lends itself to the "this is YOUR story" angle in the fiction.
I love how the game's so memorable that it makes me love these songs I would never listen to on my own otherwise.
I guess that's the difference between an amazing soundtrack an just amazing music. It doesn't matter that it's not my kind of music, it fits the game so well that it becomes my kind of music.
VIIIIIIIIIOLENCE BREEDS VIIIIIIIIOLENCE.
A toast to MGR, a game robbed of its sequel.
though even with a different translator, I still like Snake's portrayal in MGS2 a lot. More "wise soldier and mentor" than "smooth badass" but still really good.
Zabant
Member
What the hell are you even talking about, and why would it in any way apply to me or the discussion at hand?
Besides, your point isn't even correct as I was pointing to the fact that father/daughter relationships go over well with gaming audiences today, not father/son relationships.
If you need me to tell you how they're different then I can't help you.
I'll join in on that toast. Fantastic game. I honestly hope Konami farms out the MGS licenses to everyone just so Platinum can make a sequel. I want more Raiden shenanigans
Hero_of_the_Day
Member
So, where did the video of Chapter 51 come from? I would expect that Konami just intends to expand it and sell it as DLC. But, you wouldn't think they would have let that footage out if that was the case, either.
SuperStiltzkin
Member
I don't know why we're comparing MGS2 and TLoU. Yeah they're both videogames with strong emphasis on story. But the story and the themes they try to convey could not be more different. I love TLoU, my GOTY for 2013. And I love MGS2. I love em both equally but for different reasons. TLoU is a more conventional story and MGS2 is unconventional. What both games are trying to accomplish are vastly different.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Say hello to the man who teaches war orphans to read and write
Raises a stray puppy and makes it his pet
Stops a horrible parasitic outbreak and saves the world
Shows mercy to people who try to assassinate him (Twice)
Shows mercy to a man responsible for nine years of suffering
Gives a poetic tribute to his fallen soldiers in word and in deed
Collectors edition bluray, so I doubt they will invest money to finish this up with Kojipro out the door.
Ghostmaster
Member
The best Metal Gear game of the past ten years.
Say hello to the man who teaches war orphans to read and write
Raises a stray puppy and makes it his pet
Stops a horrible parasitic outbreak and saves the world
Shows mercy to people who try to assassinate him (Twice)
Shows mercy to a man responsible for nine years of suffering
Gives a poetic tribute to his fallen soldiers in word and deed
This. Venom is just a good guy all around. Truly a man worthy of following. Move over BB, V has come to.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Hands of Stone
Member
"Anime was mistake. It's nothing but trash".
swearing-circle
Member
The game is really ambiguous in regards to whether any of the events even happened. Solid Snake's monologue at the end is very fourth wall breaking and basically says "this is a game and whether what you experienced is important or not is up to you." In regards to the surface level plot though, I guess it's safe to say that Big Shell was real.
The Broken Ska Record
Member
To be fair, Ocelot was the one who taught the puppy until it was an adult.Say hello to the man who teaches war orphans to read and write
Raises a stray puppy and makes it his pet
Stops a horrible parasitic outbreak and saves the world
Shows mercy to people who try to assassinate him (Twice)
Shows mercy to a man responsible for nine years of suffering
Gives a poetic tribute to his fallen soldiers in word and in deed
I need to get back to the game. I got to the part with the three gorillas and stopped.
Say hello to the man who teaches war orphans to read and write
Raises a stray puppy and makes it his pet
Stops a horrible parasitic outbreak and saves the world
Shows mercy to people who try to assassinate him (Twice)
Shows mercy to a man responsible for nine years of suffering
Gives a poetic tribute to his fallen soldiers in word and in deed
SolVanderlyn, I'm already an angel.
hey I've linked that specific Red Riding Hood book, I never mentioned the "Red Riding Hood millennial story".
and it sure is fair, there is writing, you compare, there you go, comparison.
it's not even true that stories were seen as tertiary elements in videogames during that time, surely not true for all the videogames. that could be true during the time when pong came out, if you may.
Zabant
Member
For the same reason TLoU is always brought up in any discussion where one person claims the story of a certain game is bad.
So it can be pointed to as 'something to strive for' and as a meaningless counterpoint to try and prove why the story of the game they don't like is bad.
It's a dead end discussion that goes nowhere, and as always I have fallen for it.
If we're going to compare gaming stories we should focus on MGSV vs A previous entry in the series, or games with a similar theme.
Anyone can point to say.. Macbeth and say it has a better story than X video game, it accomplishes nothing
By that logic we could literally compare apples to oranges because they're both fruit.
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
Say hello to the man who teaches war orphans to read and write
Raises a stray puppy and makes it his pet
Stops a horrible parasitic outbreak and saves the world
Shows mercy to people who try to assassinate him (Twice)
Shows mercy to a man responsible for nine years of suffering
Gives a poetic tribute to his fallen soldiers in word and in deed
I think at one point they even talk about giving the kids education so they can get gainful employment and reintegrate them into society lmao
MGSV does not show any shades of grey with respect to the mercenary business. They generally only help people out
Say hello to the man who teaches war orphans to read and write
Raises a stray puppy and makes it his pet
Stops a horrible parasitic outbreak and saves the world
Shows mercy to people who try to assassinate him (Twice)
Shows mercy to a man responsible for nine years of suffering
Gives a poetic tribute to his fallen soldiers in word and in deed
The one defining thing before he was venom snake is that he was a medic. Do No Harm and such. Maybe somewhere he's not a psycho lunatic like Jack/BB.
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