Zomba13
Member
MGSV wasn't about Big Boss Snake Jack becoming a demon and his downfall, it was about Big Boss Hideo Kojima and his downfall.
He became a demon for such little conclusion as this?
Such a lust for cut content!
WHOOOOOOOOOOO!?
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SPOILER: Metal Gear Solid V Spoiler Thread | Such a lust for conclusion, T-WHHOOOO
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MGSV wasn't about Big Boss Snake Jack becoming a demon and his downfall, it was about Big Boss Hideo Kojima and his downfall.
He became a demon for such little conclusion as this?
Such a lust for cut content!
WHOOOOOOOOOOO!?
ArchedThunder
Banned
Do you really think that after 80 million dollars and the split between Kojima and Konami that they would let him delay the game to finish it?
ShockingAlberto
Member
To me, the weirdest part of the game is how you spend so much time in Africa in the exact time frame that some of the biggest things in Metal Gear history are happening and none of it ever comes up.
Moon_frogger
Member
I only realized that the teeth and bone talked about in the prologue is from paz. No wonder venom snake has been having PTSD about her death. Fucking insane. Sorry everybody, the story in MGSV, what is there anyway, is amazing.
All I wanted was a Metal Gear Solid game. And while the better-than-expected gameplay makes up for the lack of story, I would rather have a closer balance between the two.
The open world has quite a few advantages, but I'm not completely sold on its use. It feels like something they've put a lot of work in, but it's severely underused between outposts. And don't even get me started on Mother Base, which is basically a ghost town where you can CQC and interrogate your own soldiers. But beyond that, I don't see the use of going there considering I can do everything via iDroid.
X
Xpike
Unconfirmed Member
To me the weirdest part is that they decided to only have Africa and Afganistan in the game. They should've prioritized to have at least 2 varied locations instead of 2 brown enviroments.
She'll always be inside him.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
In a way Venom Snake still becomes a demon, even if it's an implied demon a la MGS3 Boss ending.
When he says "I'm already a demon" at the very beginning of the game it might be him reacting to possessing Big Boss's memories. He was always the gentle medic, a trusted and capable officer in MSF but a man who preferred to help others. He becomes a demon due to his loyalty to Boss.
BB becomes a demon too, but that already happened in PW. He pulls tons of jerkbag moves in TPP; leaving Venom to take his flak, dismissing Eli and David nonchalantly, not caring that Eli is probably dead, riding away smoking his cigar on a badass motorcycle while everyone else does important things, etc.
When he says "I'm already a demon" at the very beginning of the game it might be him reacting to possessing Big Boss's memories. He was always the gentle medic, a trusted and capable officer in MSF but a man who preferred to help others. He becomes a demon due to his loyalty to Boss.
BB becomes a demon too, but that already happened in PW. He pulls tons of jerkbag moves in TPP; leaving Venom to take his flak, dismissing Eli and David nonchalantly, not caring that Eli is probably dead, riding away smoking his cigar on a badass motorcycle while everyone else does important things, etc.
Zomba13
Member
To be fair one is more green and brown and the other is more off white and light brown.
Man, this just reminds me of how boring he was in the game.
ShockingAlberto
Member
Seems like there was supposed to be one more area that was cut.
South America was likely going to be a combination of greenery and city judging by the boxes and camo that you get offered but have no practical applications in the game.
SJRB
Gold Member
At first I thought the Paz "quest" was beyond retarded, but it's actually pretty damn good/clever.
I'm almost positive that scrapping the open world would have given us more locations. And I would have been fine that, to be honest.
I feel like Kojima is very good with linear environments. I'm sure he has the right ambition for an open world, but the execution could have gone better. Or perhaps his ambition was simply too big for his own good.
I honestly feel like Kojima would need another few years if he wanted to finish MGSV completely. Back when he used to say he was worried people wouldn't be able to finish this game, god knows how many chapters he had planned.
ZeroMaverick
Member
Lol bingo
Well, it was rushed, some things (notably the end twist) were poorly handled, and some characters and plot points could have been emphasised a bit more (Skull Face could have been amazing), but yeah, what was there was good. I loved the whole message about language, culture, identity, "Englishisation" and colonisation, and how crudely some things were shown.
NinjamicWZ
Banned
100% ... hmm
Such a lust for 200%
Mantis is the key. Someone figure out how to capture him in the early game. DO IT!
Have fully complete MGS1, SotN, Lords of Shadow, Ground Zeroes saves on a PS3 to access MGS5-notV
We've talked a lot about the twist and how garbage that was, but can we take a second and talk about how utterly stupid and unsatisfying it is knowing that Kojima tried to once again take a dump all over MGS3? I could maybe get behind BB being a dick and letting someone else build his legend for him had it been done better (maybe), but one thing I absolutely cannot stand is how Kojima went back and tried to trivialize Naked Snake's mission in Snake Eater. First, he decides to ruin The Boss in Peace Walker, and now we get to find out that in Kojima's ridiculous version of things, Naked Snake wasn't even all that great since he only managed to get anything done due to XOF and skull face backing him up from the shadows. And don't even get me started on the Cobra unit being a bunch of parasite soldiers...
Seriously, the more I think about this garbage plot, the more I get upset that Kojima has to continuously undermine my favorite plot/characters in the MGS universe. The man has absolutely no respect for his own fiction, and that annoys me to no end.
Seriously, the more I think about this garbage plot, the more I get upset that Kojima has to continuously undermine my favorite plot/characters in the MGS universe. The man has absolutely no respect for his own fiction, and that annoys me to no end.
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
Yes, that's what I feel. There is no "complete" game since stuff gets cut all the time, whether it was because that content sucked, they could not do it with the hardware or because of time constraints.
But with MGS V I don't think I have ever seen such a game that was not trying to hide the blatant unfinished nature. The obvious stretching of the content in Mission 2 by trying to excuse challenge runs, which are fine on their own but not in place of actual content. The Battle Gear stuff which was cut from the game, probably very, very late since dialogue in the game still implies you can use it on the field. The fact that the Venom Snake twist is at the very, very end of the game and is given no room to breathe or grow. And most obviously the Eli/Mantis/Sahalanthropus stuff which would have led into chapter 3 but was cut...except they didn't cut the lead up to it. It's just pretty sad.
akidnamededdy
Banned
It's probably the most well-done bit of story in the game so naturally they put it in a place where 95% of people will never bother to look.
Great summary. I mean yeah. Gameplay is one thing, but it's not why I play MGS on day one. I do it to experience the amazing nonsense in the story that only Kojima provides, and it felt...quite shallow this time around?
NinjamicWZ
Banned
Maybe the real MGS5 is the Japanese xboxOne version, and only a few hundred people have played it.
The open world lacked variety and flow for me. It feels superfluous. At first I loved it and the base level is design is amazing. But I think open world design itself requires a subtlety in both offering freedom but also corralling the player into interesting places. Metal Gear felt like an open world game by someone who has never made one before. It's a valid first attempt but makes mistakes that have long since been fixed within the genre.
Right now I would trade the open world for a variety of semi-open areas (like the ones we get on missions anyway) than a vast open world that is not consistently designed.
FTFY
They really needed to cut out a lot of the fat in main missions and instead of 50 main missions there should have been 20-25 and had them all be story focused like missions 28,29,30,31,43,45.
They should have treated the main missions as your traditional ~15 hour Metal Gear story campaign and focused everything else into side ops. At the very least every mission needed at least an introductory cutscene if not an intro, middle and outro scene. You could easily pad out the game to the 50+ hours with side ops (the way they're structured you could make 500 side ops in less than a day seriously...). That would at least allow you to maintain the pacing of a proper Metal Gear story if you just focused on it and saved the side ops for later.
They should have treated the main missions as your traditional ~15 hour Metal Gear story campaign and focused everything else into side ops. At the very least every mission needed at least an introductory cutscene if not an intro, middle and outro scene. You could easily pad out the game to the 50+ hours with side ops (the way they're structured you could make 500 side ops in less than a day seriously...). That would at least allow you to maintain the pacing of a proper Metal Gear story if you just focused on it and saved the side ops for later.
Love Deterrence
Member
Yeah, unbelievable. Yet, the rest of Mother Base is a big ol' tin can - which it what makes it even more bizarre.
Just one last plug for my remixing of MGSV. I think the story would have been a lot better this way, and it's mostly a re-jigging.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=178941527&postcount=5398
I posted it before but nobody read it...
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=178941527&postcount=5398
I posted it before but nobody read it...
NinjamicWZ
Banned
True.
We're playing the Venom Snake's Revenge on NES. They're playing the MSX game on X1.
Love Deterrence
Member
Yes, this is the most shallow entry in the series by far. The deeper you dive, the more apparent this becomes.
I used to dig the feeling you'd get in older MGS areas because you were always playing in semi-open areas. You could backtrack a lot and choose different paths, but it wasn't open world. It was something in between, even though it was much smaller and different than a regular open world game. But I liked that. They always put a ton of detail in every environment.
Going open world makes the game feel a little more generic in that regard. The fact that it is completely empty outside of guarded areas doesn't help. There's nothing to do outside of side-ops that specifically place enemies in empty areas.
Jangowuzhere
Banned
I think people are pondering too much on the idea of there being cut content. Even if you don't like the story, everything does have a conclusion (except Eli.)
Is it satisfying and well done? Heck no, but everything does wrap up, it's just very messy and poorly paced.
Is it satisfying and well done? Heck no, but everything does wrap up, it's just very messy and poorly paced.
ShockingAlberto
Member
I liked the open world a lot because it reminded me of how much I loved MGS3's "Approach this however you want" style, which MGS4 mostly boiled down to "I don't know, sneak or shoot, pick one."
But I liked it best when it was combining that open style with designed infiltration missions. OKB-0, the oil field, the airport, the Killer Bee mission, the mansion, all of those felt like they were designed areas that you simply had to sneak through. But Kibiza Training Camp and a host of other missions simply felt like they were things that were out in the world that they stuck missions into.
But I liked it best when it was combining that open style with designed infiltration missions. OKB-0, the oil field, the airport, the Killer Bee mission, the mansion, all of those felt like they were designed areas that you simply had to sneak through. But Kibiza Training Camp and a host of other missions simply felt like they were things that were out in the world that they stuck missions into.
Mmmm they do you just got lazy and didn't even bother to explore that quest line and asked questions for the obvious lol..
Just one last plug for my remixing of MGSV. I think the story would have been a lot better this way, and it's mostly a re-jigging.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=178941527&postcount=5398
I posted it before but nobody read it...
I read it. Better than Kojima's version, for sure. It's a more streamlined and traditional MGS story which is more in line with what I think most of the fans would have wanted.
Yeah, I was actually surprised at how much I enjoyed the end to that story. The music during the big Paz revelation was also very reminiscent of Silent Hill 2 for me, which made it that much better. Probably one of my favorite tracks of the game.
Honestly, the game could have used a lot more well thought out hallucination segments.
a very cute dog
Member
So what are everyone's favorite end-game weapons? Looking for things to develop.
That's why I think you could easily scrap a lot of empty space and make missions like OKB-0 or the airport mission semi-open. Instead of creating a big ass Afghanistan, make a few seperate semi-open areas where you can land with your chopper. You'll still have that "open feeling" but at least now you'll only have space you will actually use. Making one large Afghanistan with all of that bases in it is cool, but I don't think it is needed.
How many missions did you go from one point of Afghanistan to the furthest other point? I don't think I've ever done that, actually. Because Afghanistan is a big place and it takes too long. You usually get to safety/call a chopper not far outside of a guard camp anyway. Give the player some freedom, but don't go open world. I don't feel like MGS needed it;
you should read my ideas Dawg. They are in line with this.
X
Xpike
Unconfirmed Member
i got the impression that the only thing Skullface and XOF did were things like piloting the plane, giving satellite images, keeping the radio up, and cleaning up Snake's poop. Nothing too important but still useful for the operation.
ShockingAlberto
Member
"Incomplete" does not necessarily mean the plot threads do not resolve (though that happens fairly often, too). It also means that, even though this skeleton has all 206 bones, there's no flesh around it to make it move. 43 -> 45 -> 46 is an illogical, jumbled mess of three cool moments that have no connective tissue. And that's the end of the game, when all the themes are supposed to coalesce to something greater.
MGS3's end game built on theme after theme and then finally ended with a huge climactic moment. This game had a lot of the same pieces but didn't bring them together in any meaningful way.
To put it another way, either it was incomplete or incompetent.
Reference to the now infamous Skull Face line where he freaks out over Metal Gear/Mantis turning on him.
Brennan and that other high penetration sniper are fun.
It's not end game but the stun shotguns are fun to mess around with after beating the game as well.
Also D Walker's fulton launcher.
NinjamicWZ
Banned
Just one last plug for my remixing of MGSV. I think the story would have been a lot better this way, and it's mostly a re-jigging.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=178941527&postcount=5398
I posted it before but nobody read it...
I read it, just don't have much to say other than remixing my own too. It's sad that MGS5 is such a combination of joy and pain that it makes me want to write fanfic... just to suffer.
I need like a comic book series or novels to keep this train going. I wish Konami was more like Disney so I could go to a Metal Gear theme park and ride a chase scene roller coaster like:
I beat TPP last night, the truth itself is nothing rather ground breaking, I just wish there was more story. I really wish that the third chapter was involved, get a bit more closure out of this game. The reveal at the end should've been a midgame surprise, and then continue the story with that knowledge.
The Silver
Member
that's one thing I actually liked.
Tearing down the cult of personality around Big Boss, he aint some superhuman that solo'd the mission that saved the world, he had help, he was set up to win from the start. It just continues on with how it's said many stories about him are exaggerated or outright lies for propaganda purporses, there's the legend of Big Boss(ultimate super soldier who can do anything) and then there's the man Big Boss.
Deckard Chapel
Banned
MGS2.
He did the same thing already with MGS2. Your name and date of birth are on Raiden's dog tags - signifying that you are actually a crucial part of the story - an active participant trained to walk in the boots of the legendary Solid Snake.
To see the same twist done identically a second time, was amateur and inane to say the least.
akidnamededdy
Banned
I got the same vibe, and it just made me depressed about Silent Hills all over again.
I think they may have had some more planned (evidenced by the alternate Paz skin with The Boss's scar on it found hidden in the game files). It's actually really disappointing that they go out of their way to say that the brain damage may cause hallucinations and this Paz line is the only time they actually use it.
Haha, you asked for a straw, Ozium, and you received one.
Deckard Chapel
Banned
Kojima is the king - no, the emperor of ret-cons.
Almost nothing he does in his sequels matches up 100% to older entries in the Metal Gear saga.
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